act right know

[Anonymous]

liberalism and capitalism have the world in their power.
while the gap between rich and the poor is getting bigger and bigger.
life is long enough to take one great risc, but too short to take that risc, calculated first.
What are we revolutionairies waiting for?
TAKE POWER, THE TIME IS NOW, the war against capitalism should begin.
so why dont we unite and begin to 'fight' for one specific goal?????

[Comrade Daniel]

We have the ideas, but not the funds needed.

[ComradeJunichi]

...

[the_envoy]

did che have the funds?
lame excuse i guess
the only thing you need is (complete) devotion from people
and for exemple on this forum there must be some
why dont we gather and go for it?
i dont want to spend my life living in a world where capitalism rules it all
this forum/community is called che lives
but if we only speak words and dont come to action, i can tell you that che is dead
LET HIM LIVE


(Edited by the_envoy at 2:51 pm on Dec. 26, 2002)

[Corvus Corax]

Easier said than done...

Where would we meet?

How would we get there?

How would we get weapons needed?

Where would people train?

Where would we get enough man power?

[the_envoy]

well, first of all, where would the revolution take place
thats pretty important to start with
it would be a mission for life, the one thing you make your lifework out of, your only goal
if it is the next thing and also the last thing you'll ever do, it wouldn't be a problem to get 'there', because you woudnt have the intention to leave
so get there by plane or boat ;)
we can meet online

weapons arent the first concerns; first goal is to gather people
and where we get the weapons and where we train depends on where you plan a revolution
i dont know how many people here would coöperate
but there are more websites like this, there are enough revolutionairy youngsters over the world
and che didnt have thousands of people... they were sometimes only with 50 to fight a whole army
and a revolution isnt planned from today until tomorrow
it takes planning
i want a revolution, and i participate
the solution on your answers can be given when we have a solid group of people who join

(Edited by the_envoy at 3:14 pm on Dec. 26, 2002)

[Corvus Corax]

It seems to me that you are a bit premature, no offense. The fact is, as both and idealist and a realist, the chances of us having exactly the same chance as che's army are slim to nil. We are fighting on a much grander scale. And Che's army had strategy, something which i think you lack, and they were properly trained soldiers, something which the majority of us are not.
And what about the people who don't have the money to get a plane of boat?

Oh, and when we get where the revolution will take place, we still need funds for weapons and supplies, because we can't fight without weapons.

I admire your determination and willingness, but this is not something which will happen in this year, or many years to come. When the capitalist horror becomes known to the rest of the world, we will have the support needed. That is why on Che-lives, with out limited numbers, we seek to win a mind and propaganda warfare first. This is just as valuable as armed insurrection, and will make it much easier.

The revolution will happen, but the majority just isn't as ready for it as we are yet.

One day the time will come, when gathering people shall be easier.

C.C

[Anonymous]

k, premature
may seem like that, because i wrote that text in 2-3 minutes
that means, its the 'great line' in the story
ive been thinking about the idea for some months now, and the things ive been thinking of all that time cant be written in 10-20 lines
it may seem like this: 'the world is a bad place, cummon, lets kill some peoples, take their money and give it to the poor, we leave tomorrow'
mmh, that would be idiotic
of course i dont plan to go fight a battle now or within 2-3 years
and what do you say; they are to powerful?
yuo think i want to take over washington dc or the pentagon?
im talking about countries that are lead wrong, counntries in south-america, afrika
where there is a huge gap between the rich('leaders') and all the regular people
they HAVE an army, but does that army support the presidents ideas?

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

Hmmm..

We can't meet online(CIA and other fuck agency's). And we need full devoted persons. People who are willing to give their entire life for the sake of the world.

[the_envoy]

they cant check voice-over-ip
and if the goal is clear i want to risc my life for the sake of the world because if i dont take initiative perhaps no-one will have the guts

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

I would give my life for my beliefs.

[Anonymous]

what else would i live for
im not here to be like all the rest i hope
in dont want to stay a 'regular consumer' with a regular job, house, car
so are we already with 2?
wow :P

[ComradeJunichi]

I agree with Corvus Corax.

[Corvus Corax]

I would be willing to risk my life if i knew that we actually might get somewhere, and know that it wouldn't be wasted. I'm thinking Argentina and Brazil are pretty unstable. But this isn't realistic enough yet. come back in a while The_envoy with finalised details.

[Anonymous]

well, if that's your vision, i can BET on it that you will stay passive for the rest of your life
the most powerful people are rich people and the rest is PASSIVE just like you
the visions are perfect, but someone must take the lead
if you, the revolutionairy ones dont even do that, who will
marx has been telling decennia ago that capitalism woudnt hold, well, it wont
i guarantee
BUT it wont completely KILL itself
if we act 'now' millions of lives can be rescued
equality will come sooner
and the sooner the better
when your talking about 'when the time is right, when capitalism is falling, you seem to be talking like the christians, who are waiting for the new messiah for almost 2000 years now
maybe you are one of those messiahs for communism or at least equality in the world
everybody waits for 'something'
but if everybody waits, nothing CAN happen
capitalism wont destruct its own, it is being destructed all the time
it WILL be destructed if EVERYBODY considers capitalism as wrong
and WE must make that clear to people
not everybody thinks about politics, so make them think

[Anonymous]

:)
so i must write down all the details
and why do you think that we shoud communicate and find people?
to write down the details
one person overlooks so many things
you need more people who get a clear vision on the matter together
decisions should be made by the group, not one person

[Corvus Corax]

Hehe, so i'm 'passive' because i don't share your gung-ho 'lets go out and get shot before we can make a difference' views.

I'm sorry, but you have got it all wrong.
I don't intend to stay passive, but i don't intend to waste my life now, when we are not ready.

I think you should think a little more carefully about what you are proposing, and think of the realism of it.

I like to use my brain, and hypothesise the outcome of things, not just jump in.

[ComradeJunichi]

How long have you guys been studying? You guys know nothing. You need to know so many things, to be a strong communist. You may think you know, but you don't.

How much do you know about this? You're willing to risk your life for an ideology you've only been studying for less than half of your life.

Tell me, what is this revolution going for? Explain to me. I'd like to hear your words.

[Corvus Corax]

The_Envoy, I think your main ambition in life is to be Blacklisted by the FBI, and to be a FAMOUS revolutionary.

I don't think you understand the cause very well.

[Panamarisen]

the envoy,

I´m sure most of us here want Cappitalism die forever and right now. It got to do with our sense of justice, and that´s the reason why I know we are right.

But an overall fall down of the system is technically impossible at the present. A different thing would be to point at specifical and limited territories (one or more of these at the time could be possible). And even so, first of all we would need things to be under certain conditions in those territories: it´s needed a deep disconformity of the oppressed people, and a critical situation among the powerful (which certainly we could force to happen). If we don´t consider this, the poor people themselves would think we are just a bunch of crazy people trying to get some kind of power for ourselves; they wouldn´t understand why we actually care for them, and they wouldn´t understand that we think they are living a miserable life that could be changed for better through a revolution.

So it´s imperative to work consciousness among the people -which we are already doing for sure in our everyday life, joining different associations, teaching people to think more critically, etc. This kind of previous work may not seem strong enough, but I think it is, even if we are not totally aware of it. In this sense, internet has been a real good help, not only for intercommunication, but to spread true views and info about news/events not biased as the system media does. The average person is able now to know about events from a lot different and more confident sources; he will not be cheated as easy as he has been for too many years now. And this means he will have a much greater possibility for worry and concern innerly, indeed the first step towards the aim to change the system.

Funds and weaponry is something else, generally not a big problem...


HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

It's a deal. We discuss and work out our details here;)

[the_envoy]

wellwell
and now im an infant...
you ask me WHY I would do it
because:
-no-one else does something
-capitalism and greed from some millions of people causes next problems:
-poverty, famine, lack of drinking water,war for oil and against races, monarchy-institutions spending money on things that should be spended for help in countries with previous problems, people earning way more then they deserve or need,...
the world isnt well devided
people are dying of hunger and lack of water, while other people are just enjoying theirselves
EVERYBODY should have the same opportunity's in life
and I see many people who keep on saying what is wrong and how it should be done
but there are few people who actually do something
you guys for exemple take me down immediately
if you can do it better, then whuy dont you
i wouldnt do it for power, fame or whatever
im an altruist!!! dammit
what do you think...
if someone else does something like a big revolution, the better!
and i dont want to be on the fbi's blacklist
then i would do something NOW without even thinking about it
i would never do something without decent planning
i wouldnt do something now or the forthcoming years
and if you say in advance 'it wont work' then why do you even bother and come to discuss here
if it all didnt or couldnt matter you wouldnt think about it
being on this forum talking about politics is fine, but passive
going to demonstrations and so on is fine, but still to passive to REALLY make a change
i know you understand what i mean
and dont think that im a stupid fool who would risk his life for something he wasnt the least sure of that it would even matter

[Anonymous]

by the way, if you think that i like violence and disorder or whatever, well stop thinking that
im just sick of it all like the most (all?) of you and want something to be done
not for me, but for the people who need it and against the people who exploit the ones who need our vision in practic

[Larissa]

The Envoy,

I agree with Panamarisen. I live in a "hot" Argentina and I AM doing something everyday. But it's the kind of battle you fight daily without weapons, working hard to make people aware of what a severe and devastating Capitalist policy (Menem) has caused over the past 10 years. One good thing is that he Fuc...ed the middle class also, and NOW they realize what it is to be what they would call "a nobody". Because they have no money, no USD savings. And a middle class with no money is limited to just being men and women themselves, just like everyone else. Today, they feel lost, they are angry and they don't know what to do, and have no one to turn to. I truly hope the International Monetary Fund will not give us any more credits, so that the only chance left for us is to grow up and stand all together as only one nation, nationalizing again all the "now-privatized" companies that once belonged to ourselves and were sold by the Menemists, and it is our duty to reconstruct our nation and teach ignorant middle class people in order to avoid a worse future for all of us. Today, many children are dying (starving) in our country and this middle class people are just starting to notice them, many of them might think that this could happen to them in the future too, I don't know. All I can tell is that it is very important to TEACH people, to make them aware, to wake them up and make them realize what the "benefits" of Capitalism can do to a whole nation, destroying it fully, while Socialism will always be constructive.

I'm not sleeping, neither are all those who interact through Internet or in everyday's life.

[the_envoy]

well then call me an idiot but i only see that capitalism has got more and more to say
and if you would take that for a fact, what should be done then

[ComradeJunichi]

TheEnvoy, you havn't answered my questions. How long have you been studying about...what are you, an anarchist? How much do you think you know, how much do you really know? It takes lots of studying to know just the smallest part about humans.

So tell me, what's your plan. Pick up some guns, rally, and take over the world? What would you do after. You've planned this for months, so what are the first steps you will take for society. How will you keep the people happy, how will you provide food, water, shelter, jobs for everyone. How will you get the support of the masses before, during, and after the revolution?

I'm not "taking you down". You said if anyone else can do better, then why don't they. So, what are you doing?

I'm not saying revolution is wrong, and I'm not telling you how it should be done. But I do think it should be more practical, isntead of waking up and walking out with an AK and taking over.

Why don't you fly, sail, etc, to Venezuela, Argentina, etc. Help change, and you'll know more. Then you can plan a bigger revolution in the time to come. How about, instead of jumping straight to revolution, helping them without blood and violence. Join the RedCross, feed the hungry, give shelter to the homeless. Donate food, money, clothes. Visit an orphanage and enjoy time with children, help reconstruct the ghettos and make them better.

[Larissa]

No one's calling you an idiot, Envoy. I was just supporting Panamerisen's idea of the importance of "preparing the groung" first. We all have tasks to do. Just like at an armed battle. Some people have to train others, some have to gather funds, some have to collect food & supplies, some to support from oustide-strategic points.

Your idea of gathering all together is just great, further more, it's what we all actually want to do. The old "Together we stand, divided we fall". That's how it works.

But, it will sure take some time before we can prepare the necessary conditions to make real noise!

[Anonymous]

well, that are my plans for the near future
indeed, going over there
seeing how everything is
practically
not theoretically
i want to help in those ways, no problem, but dont know if it would be enough
isnt it better to fight the disease and not the symptons
something like a more permanent solution

im no anarchist
(yeah, know about the avatar)

its not about knowing
its about understanding
i dont say i understand enough
but i want to understand

i may know more about people then you think, maybe less then you know, and surely less then i would want to

and you've misunderstood or i've expressed the part wrong about taking the ak and taking over power
i know its not done by that

its about years of planning, finding the right time,awaiting the right moment and having the right people by your side

[Anonymous]

and i didnt say anyone called me an idiot
i was saying that what is being done with redcross and so on isnt wrong(it is needed), but that i think that the power of liberalism and capitalism in increasing
and larissa, i agree completely on what you say

i just think action is needed, and yes, that takes time
i know

(Edited by the envoy at 7:45 pm on Dec. 26, 2002)

[ComradeJunichi]

TAKE POWER, THE TIME IS NOW

Hmm...



i may know more about people then you think, maybe less then you know, and surely less then i would want to

Wow, wasn't that useless.

its not about knowing
its about understanding
i dont say i understand enough
but i want to understand

Hm, cliche-ish. Sorry, it would have been good in a cheap movie, but it was irrelevant to what I said. Knowing, understanding, you know what I meant.

You were so anxious, and wanted to start a revolution right now, now you're a bit more relaxed. Riddlin?

isnt it better to fight the disease and not the symptons
something like a more permanent solution

Are you saying that during and after the revolution there will be no oppression and exploitation?

You still havn't answered any of my questions. I'll re-ask the ones I remember. So what are your plans before/during/after the revolution. Since you might know..no I mean understand more about people than I think, or maybe you might not. Or maybe you do, but want to know more. Or maybe you think you do but you don't. Or maybe you think you don't know but you do know. Maybe you want to know more and you know a lot too.

I think you should study more, instead of jumping to revolution. How long have you been studying about politics, economics, history, psychology, etc.?

(Edited by ComradeJunichi at 7:55 pm on Dec. 26, 2002)

[Anonymous]

i am anxious about a revolution
cooling down in sentences opens the debate
right?
NOW doesnt equal today or tomorrow
its 'near' future
within now and 10-15 years maybe
that sence wasnt useless, the last part could be derived, thats true
the first part is how i feel about you talking about me
maybe cliche-ish, but that doesnt matter
i meant that you asked for knowledge
but knowledge is nothing without understanding and imagining someone else's situations
reading books doenst make you smarter or better
if you think further about the given information you can conclude things and only then you get 'further'
only then the information has 'enriched your mind'

and you CANT completely stop oppression and exploitation
that's impossible
and your comments on 'isnt it better to fight the disease and not the symptons
something like a more permanent solution ' seems irrelevant to me...

-So what are your plans before/during/after the revolution: if i knew the answer, why would i sit here right know
as i said before, its not up to me to tell, it must be decided by the participating people

-im not jumping to revolution
i'll explain more clearly;
i've seen/read about dozens of people who had written out their ideals
they told what went wrong, some proposed solutions
most of those solutions woould be a push into the right direction.
but every one of those peoples didnt do something practically against the 'disease' that caused nearly all the problems in the world
they wrote a book or wrote some songs, grew old and died

what i want to do, is to find people, open the discussion, organise, and reaching a 'point of no return'
i dont know enough (duh) but thats why people are needed
like you for example
'someone' doesnt do a revolution, 'people' do a revolution
so, i just want to reach a 'point of no return' so that i HAVE to actually do something like a revolution
oblige myself not to 'forget my ideals' and live further in an inequal society

if i want to, i can just now, forget about the people in need, complete studies, find a job and get rich
it is even what society asks from me

my parents are in that pattern, my grandparents, my brother, my sister

i dont want to forget or neglect the problems and i want to fight the roots

yes, first i'll finish my studies
but after that, i dont want to become a slave of the community
i hope that i've answered your questions now

[ComradeJunichi]

Studying, I don't mean studying chemistry and algebra. I mean studying on politics, economics, history, psychology, etc. I never asked you to become a "slave to society".

"i meant that you asked for knowledge
but knowledge is nothing without understanding and imagining someone else's situations"

When I spoke of knowledge, the sense I used it in was quite obvious. Knowing is understanding, in the sense that I used it. I didn't think anyone would point out a useless distinction, irrelevant to what I was saying. The whole meaning of my point, not my grammer and words, was the you need to kn...understand people.

"Why don't you fly, sail, etc, to Venezuela, Argentina, etc. Help change, and you'll know more. Then you can plan a bigger revolution in the time to come. How about, instead of jumping straight to revolution, helping them without blood and violence. Join the RedCross, feed the hungry, give shelter to the homeless. Donate food, money, clothes. Visit an orphanage and enjoy time with children, help reconstruct the ghettos and make them better." comradejunichi

"i want to help in those ways, no problem, but dont know if it would be enough
isnt it better to fight the disease and not the symptons
something like a more permanent solution" theenvoy

"Are you saying that during and after the revolution there will be no oppression and exploitation?" comradejunichi

"and your comments on 'isnt it better to fight the disease and not the symptons
something like a more permanent solution ' seems irrelevant to me..." theenvoy

A "permanent solution", which means it would be a solution to all the poverty, exploitation, etc. forever/permanent.

"-So what are your plans before/during/after the revolution: if i knew the answer, why would i sit here right know
as i said before, its not up to me to tell, it must be decided by the participating people "

You were talking about how we had to start a revolution now, but you don't have any plans. If it was a bunch of people in the masses telling what we should do it would be chaotic.

"what i want to do, is to find people, open the discussion, organise, and reaching a 'point of no return'
i dont know enough (duh) but thats why people are needed
like you for example
'someone' doesnt do a revolution, 'people' do a revolution
so, i just want to reach a 'point of no return' so that i HAVE to actually do something like a revolution
oblige myself not to 'forget my ideals' and live further in an inequal society"

Someones lead a revolution. Just reaching a point of no return in a revolution, is not a good plan.

if i want to, i can just now, forget about the people in need, complete studies, find a job and get rich
it is even what society asks from me

How old are you? Just because you study doesn't mean you forget about people. You will not be very important in a revolution if you don't know what you're talking about. How will you help the people in need, if you don't know people.

but after that, i dont want to become a slave of the community

You will have to give up some of yourself for the good of the community.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

How sweet join the red cross and that sort of shit. It's very annoying that no matter how many people you cure and no matter how many you feed the captalist exploiting machine is always faster than you.

Revolt!

[ComradeJunichi]

Red Cross isn't only curing people, I went a few times and it's helping children, feeding hungry, helping poor, etc. Revolution is to help people, what do you mean "how sweet". A 15 year old boy/girl, or however old he/she is, probably will not lead a revolution. Can, but probably not. I was saying he/she could help people, before jumping to revolution. My comrades and I did things like that when we were in South Korea.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

Ow you mean it by that way. I myself am planning to make a world trip to see the different problems and pluspoints in the world. But I mean that you can't go forever in the RedCross. It's great what they are doing but it's frustrating and anoying that how much you will work the exploiters are faster. Cure someone and he goes home, living next to a chemical plant..well you see my point. And we can't go one forever this way. There must be a drastic change.

[Ghadafi Al Amin]

Im all for the revolution. I agree we dont have to wait for the masses to finally understand what capitalism is doing to the world. The Revolution can start today if just a couple people got together and started planning. We have to plan and understand exactly what we are fighting for. Then there's extensive training. Training not only as soldiers but as political figures, doctors, ect.
We need committed people in all fields. Then we have to worry about spies of course the US of A and other allies will have sumthin to say. Right now as we speak Ghadafi is tryin to take over Afrika. Since the Muslims abandoned him. We have to make sure everything is in place before starting war. but like i said whenever your ready!

[CopperGoat]

Hey, read the book "Guerrilla Warfare" by Che Guevara. I have glanced through it. IT ACTUALLY TEACHES YOU HOW TO FORM YOUR OWN GUERRILLA FORCE AND HOW TO FIGHT A GUERRILLA WAR. It has the rankings and the strategy. Everything you wanted written by our favourite hero. So get it, and get started. By the way read "1984" by George Orwell. That is also another good book. Reading it right now...

[ComradeJunichi]

WOW! Mao ZeDong also wrote a book on Guerrilla Warfare. Yes, 1984 is a classic.

[the_envoy]

no, i aint 15
and yes, i want to give up a part of myself for the sake of the community, but not for the one im living in right now...

and its useless to keep on discussig about what ive said, and isnt completely clear to you, or doesnt please you

and have i ever said i wanted to lead a revolution???
i want to join one
thats completely something else

like CCCP said; 'How sweet join the red cross and that sort of shit. It's very annoying that no matter how many people you cure and no matter how many you feed the captalist exploiting machine is always faster than you.

Revolt! '

well thats the main thing
thats the point im trying to make

[Corvus Corax]

Yes, books will give you a little guidence, but you need the mind to begin with, to adapt the teachings to the environment you fight in. I think most people have read 1984 as well. You cannot just hope to mimic Che, he had extensive training, stuff that you might not even be able to go through. This revolution has to be through words first, I thought everyone knew that. It seems to me like you are all a bunch of kids who want to hold guns.

[ComradeJunichi]

Corvus Corax
Yes, books will give you a little guidence, but you need the mind to begin with, to adapt the teachings to the environment you fight in. I think most people have read 1984 as well. You cannot just hope to mimic Che, he had extensive training, stuff that you might not even be able to go through. This revolution has to be through words first, I thought everyone knew that. It seems to me like you are all a bunch of kids who want to hold guns.

Agreed.

the envoy
no, i aint 15
and yes, i want to give up a part of myself for the sake of the community, but not for the one im living in right now...

When I said 15, I was talking about myself. There are homeless, hungry, poor people in todays society. It's funny how you want to BE in a revolution, supposedly for the working class, but you don't want to the little things you can to help people. Are you going to go to school half of the week, and fight in the revolution half of the week?

and its useless to keep on discussig about what ive said, and isnt completely clear to you, or doesnt please you

Doesn't please me? What are you talking about? Why bother posting anything here? It is clear to me, but obviously what revolution is is not clear to you.

and have i ever said i wanted to lead a revolution???
i want to join one
thats completely something else

Sorry, I misunderstood. So, why bother studying? Just wait until the time comes, and when you see a bunch of people with AK's outside join them.

like CCCP said; 'How sweet join the red cross and that sort of shit. It's very annoying that no matter how many people you cure and no matter how many you feed the captalist exploiting machine is always faster than you.

Revolt! '

well thats the main thing
thats the point im trying to make

Are you saying you're just going to give up, or use violence, because of this? You're right, you won't lead a revolution. You claim to be fighting for the working class, but when it comes to ways of helping them without violence, you don't want to? Or if capitalist exploitation increases, you don't want to? It may be annoying, but is that going to stop you? Where's the determination to help the working class?

[Rebelde para Siempre]

The person who started this topic is really quite stupid, I'm sorry to say.

A revolution requires certain conditions. Just look at the revolutions in the past. Certain things need to be EXTREMELY prevelant in society -

Unemployment
Poverty
Civil unrest
Support from a majority of people.
Anger amongst the masses.

Certain things play important roles in revolution -
Propaganda
Weapons
Communication

I'm sorry but a revolution is not going to come soon. Radical leftists have a miniscule support group in the public, and the truth is that most people (in the western societies anyway) are fairly happy with the way things are right now.

Also if there was to be a revolution in the west (which I don't think will come for the next 200-300 years) we will be facing a much more powerful enemy that any revolutionary before us has ever faced.

[socialist ballistix]

ok first off, whats so bad about being a 15 year old revolutionary. You make it sound as if being my age would be a hindrance to our cause. I feel i m smart enough to join in your little discussions here and there, so please give respect. Anyway, i think that the evolution could start soon. The economy is in shambles and American big business has shown itself to be truly evil. No surprise there. The time could be ripe soon enough. We could at least start planning now. and hopefully stop arguing and start realizing we all fight for the same cause.

[ComradeJunichi]

ok first off, whats so bad about being a 15 year old revolutionary. You make it sound as if being my age would be a hindrance to our cause. I feel i m smart enough to join in your little discussions here and there, so please give respect.

What are you talking about? I am 15.

Anyway, i think that the evolution could start soon. The economy is in shambles and American big business has shown itself to be truly evil. No surprise there.

There will be no revolution in America, if there was it would be destroyed. Drake and I had an idea, but the feds are watching, our plan will be destroyed! Haha..

The time could be ripe soon enough. We could at least start planning now. and hopefully stop arguing and start realizing we all fight for the same cause.

Being realistic, you won't be able to start a revolution online. If you want, I say since most of us are young, we all run away to the country sides of the US (if everyone is living in the US). We meet, set up a HQ. We study collectively for 5 years, until we are older, built, and intelligent. We get cheap weapons from redneck states, move back to the HQ. Spread propaganda and in waves across the rural area. Using guerrilla tactics across the country side and the support of the farmers. Moving in to small towns and sweeping communist propaganda, we will have taken towns. And that is when the US police and military move in. I say we start off somewhere in the south/central of the US. If all fails, we will go to Mexico, or I will swim to Cuba. If it is large enough, we can ask Cuba for military support or just intimidation of a guarding army. As more and more support grows, more and more people grow, and popularity grows. Rebels, will move down south/central down to florida, people willl migrate to across our borders. Set up our temporary, but stable, form of government. With a representative democracy by the politburo, being populist and socialist. Things like that, that is a piece of my plan.

[Panamarisen]

Comrade Junichi, you can´t expect act as a guerrillero AT THE SAME TIME you´re trying to make peasants and average citizens know about your goals and its legitimate struggle. As I said in the first post of this thread, we need FIRST to make people really CONSCIOUS of the situation, of the astonishing lack of justice the actual system make people undergo, and thus the reason why we are fighting.
And don´t forget examples as the invasion of Panama by the U$ troops, using such sophisticated warfare that people -civilians among them (!!!)- just couldn´t hide anywhere, even by night, to avoid bombings from helicopters... These are not Che´s times. These are times which need having a great technology to conquer every single step further against oppression.

In the meantime, we must all keep up increasing dignity, consciousness and sense of justice among our neighbors...


HASTA LA VICTORIA SIEMPRE!

[ComradeJunichi]

Comrade Junichi, you can´t expect act as a guerrillero AT THE SAME TIME you´re trying to make peasants and average citizens know about your goals and its legitimate struggle.

Yes, you can. Obviously, you need somesort of support from the masses. Are you saying that in past guerrilla wars, there were not propaganda sections?

As I said in the first post of this thread, we need FIRST to make people really CONSCIOUS of the situation, of the astonishing lack of justice the actual system make people undergo, and thus the reason why we are fighting.

Agreed, but you can't send a wave of propaganda and have everyone converted.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

I said in another thread that WWIII is our chance to begin a revolution, if the Iraq-America war gets blown up then it could lead to a WWIII. Even the Iraqi-American war can lead to rumors in the US a sort of second Vietnam. That could also be our chance.

Comrade Junichi:
Like I said I am planning to make a worldtrip and in that trip I will go work at some places. But I will not tolerate that people are benefitting from some one else's labourary. And that the worker doesn't get a shit. If they don't change the system, I see myself forced using violence. However I would rather see slow changes instead of a revolution. But if they don't change it...

[socialist ballistix]

Comrade Junichi,
I realized this from your eatrlier posts and the statement about my age was meant for other contributors in this forum. I think if the plan you just showed was to work, we would definitly need to start in another country or Mexico, canada, cuba, somewhewere close to the U.S. I suggest Shri Lanka and/or hawaii. You said that we couldnt start a revolution online. I think we could if first we took out the homeland security cabinet thing, and those laws that make it so those bastards can watch everything we do. We should definelty do this anyway, even if we are not planning a revolution. We could do this through petitioning and civil disobedience. I will post more on this subject in the future on other forums on this site.
Thanx 4 your time

[Pavan Sohal]

What do you mean that Liberalism is something that we have to fight? I'm proudly Liberal, it's the best form of Socialism, and the only one that is working. It seems to me that all you really want is a cult to follow you.

[socialist ballistix]

I agree with CCCP. I think that the possiblilty of the iraqi-american war becoming a second vietnam and possibly a third world war are evident. Like I said in my last post a mere 2 mins ago, civil disobdience will be the start if we are looking for change. And like in the vietnam war, teens will begin rebelling against preset order and manufactured bliss. Hell, i already have. So we can count this as a source of "troops" or at least comrades, in the coming revolution.
Thanx 4 your time

[Pavan Sohal]

The only reason that Vietnam had such an effect at home was the vast press coverage that people had access to. Unless something changes drastically in media holdings, The Gulf War will be fought away from American eyes. During the first Gulf War (the Coalition-Iraq, not Iran-Iraq), no American mainstream journalist obtained, using his own equipment, a single photograph of a dead Iraqi or American soldier before burial ceremonies. All of the photographs that were obtained were by independent, or foreign news agencies and the U.S. military went to great efforts to hide enemy bodies, including using columns of bulldozers to cover Iraqi trenches after killing all the soldiers within. The skeletons are being dug up now, in the thousands, but are covered only lightly by news agencies that do not reach Americans. The war correspondant, the military-fatigue clad journalist that was so important in vietnam has little use the desert where the army can spot them quickly and hold them back. Even in the cities, if the war becomes a street battle (more chances to release effective gory photographs) American control of transportation to and from is so great that getting journalists in and out would be very difficult once the fighting has started. The devices that journalists would use to transmit footage to their newsrooms around the world would likely suffer from frequency jamming by the Americans.

[Non-Sectarian Bastard!]

We should start a leftist mediagroup behind "enemy" lines

[the_envoy]

you mean that we should organise ourselves to inform people so they would see what's going wrong?
well, that sounds like a great idea to me

[Pavan Sohal]

There are already media groups that don't attract enough attention, like http://www.guerrillanews.com/
they have more access to information than we could ever pull out. There are enough university students to protest etc. That doesn't have enough effect, we need to start blowing things up.