British Black op gone horribly wrong?

[Andy Bowden]

British Soldiers, dressed in Civilian clothes were captured by the Iraqi police forces yesterday after shooting at them. This sparked ander in Basra with Iraqis attacking the British military.

However to add fuel to the fire, it seems the British army actually led an assault on the Iraqi Police Station where they were being held to release them - no question who has the real power in Iraq eh? :rolleyes:

The MOD now claims the soldiers were being held by a "millitia" - somehow they found themselves out of Iraqi govt forces and into the hands of insurgents :blink:

I find this all very suspicious because,

a) The Soldiers were wearing plain clothes - which means they are probably special forces of some kind.


b) They opened fire on people who are technically their allies


c) The British stormed the jails of what is supposedly a sovereign nation that is "inviting" the soldiers to stay.

[bolshevik butcher]

It's like monty python! This is a brilliant farce. Funniest thing to come outta iraq since the information minister.

[Anarchist Freedom]

What a farce.

[Intifada]

It shows that Iraq is not sovereign, quite frankly.


British Soldiers, dressed in Civilian clothes were captured by the Iraqi police forces yesterday after shooting at them.

That means, on the basis of the arguments employed by neo-Cons, that they do not have any human rights.

[Enragé]

brits in arab clothes shoot iraqi police!

hmm...i wonder if stuff like this happens more often, like yanqui special op fuckers blowing up shiite mosques to divide the people of iraq

[h&s]

Apparently the army broke into the prison as the police had handed the soldiers over to the Mehdi Army, who would have executed them.
The British press is saying that radicals have a large influence in the new police force in the Shia South, and that many of them sollude with radical clerics.
If that is true, its understandable why the army reacted in the way they did, though it is, of course, their faullt that this whole stupid Islamist thing has come about - if they hadn't of invaded the country there would be no problem.

[bolshevik butcher]

Yeh thats what i read. Apprently as mutch as a ruarter of the irawi police force is loyal to maqtadr al sadir.

[Ownthink]

Originally posted by h&[email protected] 21 2005, 11:43 AM
Apparently the army broke into the prison as the police had handed the soldiers over to the Mehdi Army, who would have executed them.
The British press is saying that radicals have a large influence in the new police force in the Shia South, and that many of them sollude with radical clerics.
If that is true, its understandable why the army reacted in the way they did, though it is, of course, their faullt that this whole stupid Islamist thing has come about - if they hadn't of invaded the country there would be no problem.
The Madhi Army kicks ass. They defend the population of Iraq and they don't kill civilians (or at least try not to... I haven't heard of MA killing any civilians.) and they ordered a cease-fire for a little while. They actually act like Soldiers.

[h&s]

Yeah, its just a shame that they kill gay people, intimidate women who dare to fraternise with men in public without wearing a veil, and promote sectarian conflict.
Oh yeah, they also want to set up a brutal theocratic dictatorship, like that in Iran.
:rolleyes:

[Intifada]

Originally posted by h&[email protected] 21 2005, 09:05 PM
Yeah, its just a shame that they kill gay people, intimidate women who dare to fraternise with men in public without wearing a veil, and promote sectarian conflict.
Evidence of this, please?

[h&s]

An article from the Independant / Guardian ( I can't remember which) a few months ago. I obviously don't have it to hand.

[Andy Bowden]

The Mahdi army is meant to have destroyed a gypsy camp in Iraq, and attacked students.

[dso79]

Originally posted by Intifada+Sep 21 2005, 09:08 PM--> (Intifada @ Sep 21 2005, 09:08 PM)
h&[email protected] 21 2005, 09:05 PM
Yeah, its just a shame that they kill gay people, intimidate women who dare to fraternise with men in public without wearing a veil, and promote sectarian conflict.
Evidence of this, please?[/b]
I think this is the incident he's referring to:

Picnic Is No Party In the New Basra (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8136-2005Mar28.html)

It’s true that As-Sadr is quite conservative (like most Iraqis), but I still admire him for standing up to the occupation forces. And he definitely doesn’t promote sectarian conflict; in fact he is one of the few clerics who are actually trying to unite Iraq’s Sunnis and Shiites.


Apparently the army broke into the prison as the police had handed the soldiers over to the Mehdi Army, who would have executed them.

They wouldn’t have executed them; they probably would have tried to exchange them for the militia members that the British army arrested last week.

[James]

They wouldn’t have executed them; they probably would have tried to exchange them for the militia members that the British army arrested last week.

That is indeed more likely than execution.

Ideally the brits desperatly need to get a political process going on in the area, which well then bring the different elements together. Politics and democracy can often teach (or rather demand) consensus.
Consensus tends to result in less suffering (incidently, the constitution demonstrates a great level of consensus, its just a damn shame that not all groups decided to be involved in the process from the start).
And of course, the brits need to dramatically reduce their presence (especially large scale presence).


HandS:
you raise an interesting point. Do we "hold these truths to be self evident": i.e. the "rights of men"?

If we hold them to be universal and true, then i suppose our concious demands that we try and spread and defend them.
If however we decide that they are not universal, and are cultural dependent etc, then we shouldn't give ourselves a "white mans burden". It would be wrong to be C21st missionaries, forcing others to adopts ourn values.

I suppose thats what it comes down to. If the ideals that were partly generated by the european englightenment (equality etc) are TRUTH, then we should defend them. In this case, it would mean combating the attempts of this militia to enforce its oppressive rule upon the people of southern iraq.

So in a way it is simply an issue of values and morality (which demonstrates that those who say morality is bunk, are totally wrong in my opinion).

[mo7amEd]

The things you obviously missed is that the brits first shot at a mass with people and killed a civilian and a police. Then they escaped the place and lately found in a car filled with "terrorist weapons" like RPG and homemade bombs. When they were questioned by the police they would say they had a secret operation and cannot reveal it.

[Commie Girl]

Source (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1577575,00.html)

1.45pm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iraqi judge issues arrest warrant for British troops

Press Association
Saturday September 24, 2005


An Iraqi judge has issued an arrest warrant for the two British soldiers freed by UK forces on Monday, it was reported today.

The judge said they were wanted in connection with the deaths of several Iraqis during a confrontation with British forces.

He told the BBC the two men could face a life sentence if found guilty of deliberately killing an Iraqi civilian during a disturbance on Monday.

The undercover SAS soldiers are thought to have been on a surveillance mission outside a police station in Basra when they were challenged by an Iraqi police patrol. Iraqi officials have accused the soldiers of opening fire as they tried to escape.

The soldiers were held for hours while British military authorities demanded their release.

The BBC said the judge was not convinced the two men were British, and therefore they would not be immune from arrest and possible prosecution in Iraq.

A British military spokesman said British soldiers in Iraq were subject to UK rather than Iraqi law. He said: "There is no legal basis for the issue of an arrest warrant. We will continue to work closely with the Iraqis on the inquiry which the Iraqi government has begun into the events on Monday.

"As prime minister Jaafari and defence secretary John Reid indicated on Thursday, our strong relationship with the Iraqis will continue."

The spokesman reiterated the backing given by Mr Reid to the operation.

Mr Reid had said: "We stand by the action of our forces on the ground. They did what they judged to be appropriate at the time and I commend them for their swift and decisive action in very difficult circumstances."

An MoD spokesman later added that British authorities had not received any arrest warrant for the soldiers.