Law 88

[Karl Marx's Camel]

What is your opinion on Cuba's Law 88?

Does anyone have any background information on Law 88?

[Andy Bowden]

Law 88 is a legitimate response by the Cuban govt against Cuban "dissidents" who support the economic strangling of Cuba. It was a direct response to the Helms-Burton act, and is entirely justified against those "dissidents" who cooperate with the US to reestablish control over Cuba.

[Colombia]

It would help if you give us the details of Law 88.

[Organic Revolution]

can i get more info on it.

[Andy Bowden]

Law 88 is a law that basically supports the arrest of anyone who works with the USA, or supports the embargo.

[Colombia]

I've heard of that before, just didn't know it was called Law 88.

It is a good response to US terrorism on Cuba's government.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

It's fundamentally no different from the laws of any other country. If you got funding from Cuba to overthrow the U.S. government you would be imprissoned.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

I have heard the Cuban police can arrest people who are against the Communist Party through Law 88, and through this law, opinions opposing the government are illegal. Is it true?

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

I have "heard" that communism was responsible for the deaths of 300,000,000 people.

I have also "heard" that America is the greatest country on earth.

What's your point?

[Karl Marx's Camel]

So hostile.


Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 09:10 PM
Is it true?

^

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

No.

[YoUnG192]

It is a good response to US terrorism on Cuba's government.

What US terrorism?

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Your opinion on this?


Article 9: Sets prison terms of seven to 15 years to "anyone who...carries out any action aimed at hindering or hurting economic relations of the Cuban state."

Target: Could be applied against any Cuban who complains to a foreigner about the state of the economy, since such information can lead a potential foreign business partner not to invest on the island.

http://www.autentico.org/oa09465.php

The author has a point, I think.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

What US terrorism?

Normally I wouldn't use Wikipedia as a source, but I add this because this is mostly my contribution:

United States plans against Castro

* After Kennedy's election, the President's close advisers set up their own covert structure to eliminate Castro. Launched in November 1961, it was code named Operation Mongoose. [10]

According to James Bamford in Body of Secrets:

Operation Northwoods, which had the written approval of the Chairman and every member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, called for innocent people to be shot on American streets; for boats carrying refugees fleeing Cuba to be sunk on the high seas; for a wave of violent terrorism to be launched in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington, D.C. People would be framed for bombings they did not commit; planes would be hijacked. Using phony evidence, all of it would be blamed on Castro, thus giving Lemnitzer and his cabal the excuse, as well as the public and international backing, they needed to launch their war.

However closer reading of the Northwoods documents will show that the Joint Chiefs forwarded the document as a preliminary submission for planning purposes.

* "Then there was Operation Good Times. That involved sowing Cuba with faked photos of "an obese Castro" with two voluptuous women in a lavishly furnished room "and a table brimming over with the most delectable Cuban food." The faked photo would be captioned "my ration is different." [11]

* 1969-1970: A U.S. officer passed a vial of african swine fever virus to a terrorist group. Six weeks later Cuba suffered the first outbreak of swine fever in the western hemisphere.

* 1971: Anti-Castro terrorist group releases anti-swine virus in Cuba and Cuban government forced to kill 500,000 pigs. CIA agents delivered sealed container that contained virus to Cuban group in ft. gurlick, panama canal zone. CIA paramilitary center helped train members in para-military ops.

* In 1981, the CIA released a dengue fever in Cuba, resulting in 340,000 people being infected and 116,000 hospitalized. 158 people, including 101 children, die. Cuba had never before experienced a single case of the disease.

* "1984 Eduardo Arocena, a counter-revolutionary of Cuban origin and head of the Omega-7 terrorist organisation, stands trial in the US accused of the murder of Felix Garcia Rodriguez, a Cuban diplomat to the UN. Arocena confesses to having introduced 'germs' into Cuba as part of the US biological war against Cuba. He affirms that the dengue outbreak was introduced by terrorist groups into the island." [12] [13] Eduardo Arocena has also held a position as Task Force Chief in the CIA. (ibid)

* In 2000, four Cuban exiles with ties to the Cuban-American National Foundation (url) were convicted in a Panamanian court of plotting to assassinate Castro during a regional summit. The four were pardoned in 2004 and all but Luis Posada Carriles entered the United States. Posada appeared in the U.S in May 2005, but was arrested and faces extradition to Venezuela. (url) All four men have been accused of working for the CIA at one time or another. [14]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fidel_Castro#..._against_Castro (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fidel_Castro#United_States_plans_against_Castro)

[YoUnG192]

Wikipedia is a bad source. Anyone can literally edit out any articles, change stats and all, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Most seem very old, yes it occured but old. What year was Operation Northwoods, and goodtimes?


* In 2000, four Cuban exiles with ties to the Cuban-American National Foundation (url) were convicted in a Panamanian court of plotting to assassinate Castro during a regional summit. The four were pardoned in 2004 and all but Luis Posada Carriles entered the United States. Posada appeared in the U.S in May 2005, but was arrested and faces extradition to Venezuela. (url) All four men have been accused of working for the CIA at one time or another.

Cubans born in Cuba. What does that group have to with the US gov't? Yes exiles wanted Castro dead, so because they wanted him dead the U.S was pursuing this as well in year 2000?

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

What US terrorism?

Is this a fucking joke??

The U.S. has been terrorizing Cuba for 46 years..

The bombings, mercenary invasions, threat of nuclear annihilation, biogical warfare, naval blockade, illegal economic blockade, NUMEROUS assination attempts of leaders, etc. etc. etc.

Are all well known & documented.. the U.S. itself doesn't even deny it!

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

Cubans born in Cuba. What does that group have to with the US gov't?

:huh:

THEY FUND THEM

[YoUnG192]

Funny how you quote that sentence but not the rest after. Do you really think the United States is actively pursuing the assasination of Fidel Castro in the year 2000? Let alone now?! Sure.


The bombings

What bombings? You mean the cubans who bombed the hotels and planes themsevles and the salvadorians they hired.


mercenary invasions

Bay of pigs, yeah I'll give you that.


threat of nuclear annihilation

Whens the last time we threatened them with nuclear annihilation? I remember at a time Cuba had nuclear weapons as well and tried to keep it a secret.


biogical warfare

Do you really believe those stories of a CIA agent giving a canadian a ton of money to create a sea turtle disease so it can land ashore at Cuba. Come on.


naval blockade, illegal economic blockade,

Naval blockade, I don't how this is considered terrorism. Illegal economic blockade? Whats illegal about it? Most countries agree with it, hence their still a economic blockade. There wouldn't even be a blockade of any sort if it wasn't for former cubans who insist, they lived in Cuba before take it from them. You guys think communism is this jolly old thing it's not.


NUMEROUS assination attempts of leaders, etc. etc. etc.

On who? Name them. Name sources.

[left-nut]

I see this no different than the US arresting people who have connections with al-Qaeda.

[left-nut]

"[/QUOTE]mercenary invasions[QUOTE]

Bay of pigs, yeah I'll give you that."


I am half Cuban and I live in Miami, dude. There are many terrorist and mercenary gusano groups who are not ashamed of it and are treated like heroes here.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

All of this has been admitted by the U.S.

Operation Northwoods:
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/northwoods.pdf

Operation Mongoose:
http://www.marxists.org/history/cuba/subje...e/c-project.htm (http://www.marxists.org/history/cuba/subject/cia/mongoose/c-project.htm)
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/nsa/cuba_mis_...f%20Special.pdf (http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/nsa/cuba_mis_cri/621004%20Minutes%20of%20Meeting%20of%20Special.pdf )

Their justification:
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/doc1.pdf


Funny how you quote that sentence but not the rest after. Do you really think the United States is actively pursuing the assasination of Fidel Castro in the year 2000? Let alone now?! Sure.

Nooo, they gave up on the 412th attempt. :lol:


What bombings? You mean the cubans who bombed the hotels and planes themsevles and the salvadorians they hired.

Sure you can use those, since they were funded and sponsered by the U.S.

Or how about the ones where the U.S. sent planes painted with the logo of the Cuban airforce to drop fire bombs on Cuba to make it appear that pilots had defected??
http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_154.shtml

Or how about when they funded Posada to blow up a Cuban airliner?
http://www.nlg.org/cuba/nlgextraditeposada.htm


Do you really believe those stories of a CIA agent giving a canadian a ton of money to create a sea turtle disease so it can land ashore at Cuba. Come on.

Right, the U.S. would never do something like that. :lol:

http://www.workers.org/ww/biowar.html
http://www.oneworld.org/ips2/aug/cuba.html
http://www.poptel.org.uk/cuba-solidarity/C...anuary/Bio.html (http://www.poptel.org.uk/cuba-solidarity/CubaSi-January/Bio.html)


Naval blockade, I don't how this is considered terrorism.

Terrorism - The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.


llegal economic blockade? Whats illegal about it? Most countries agree with it, hence their still a economic blockade.

You're an idiot. Every country but the U.S., Israel, & some obscure island nation in the south pacific has condemned the blockade in the UN.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/1114-06.htm


There wouldn't even be a blockade of any sort if it wasn't for former cubans who insist, they lived in Cuba before take it from them.

What? This doesn't make any sense. The gusanos in Miami were pimps, drugs dealers, capitalists, and agents of the U.S. and Batista. And who "took it from them??" The revolution had the support of the large majority of Cubans!


You guys think communism is this jolly old thing it's not.

So why are you here? And Cuba isn't communist, it's socialist. Try reading.

http://www.freepeoplesmovement.org/ry/faq.html


On who? Name them. Name sources.

Fidel Castro
http://www.parascope.com/mx/articles/castroreport.htm

Che Guevara
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB5/che1_1.htm
http://www.poptel.org.uk/cuba-solidarity/C...AkilledChe.html (http://www.poptel.org.uk/cuba-solidarity/CubaSi-Autumn/CIAkilledChe.html)

Camillo Cienfuegos, Raul Castro, etc. etc. etc.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

The U.S. has been terrorizing Cuba for 46 years..

It's actually longer than 46 years.

The United States occupied Cuba in 1898-1902, and a second time 1905-1909. Most of the occupying force left after The Platt Amendment was installed, which severely limited Cuba's independence. Cuba was de facto US-controlled until 1934, but even after that, the US had a very large influence in Cuba.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

Nooo, they gave up on the 412th attempt. laugh.gif

According to BBC, Castro has survived over 600 assassination attempts.

In 1999 a Cuban interior ministry official put the figure at 637.

But would you comment my last post regarding Law 88?

[bolshevik butcher]

Originally posted by left-[email protected] 17 2005, 05:05 PM
"mercenary invasions


Bay of pigs, yeah I'll give you that."


I am half Cuban and I live in Miami, dude. There are many terrorist and mercenary gusano groups who are not ashamed of it and are treated like heroes here.
What does your family think of you going socialsit?

And this seems fair enough. I dont see why cuab should amke it ewasy for the U$ to overthrow it and disrupt it';s interests.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 03:08 PM
Your opinion on this?


Article 9: Sets prison terms of seven to 15 years to "anyone who...carries out any action aimed at hindering or hurting economic relations of the Cuban state."

Target: Could be applied against any Cuban who complains to a foreigner about the state of the economy, since such information can lead a potential foreign business partner not to invest on the island.

http://www.autentico.org/oa09465.php

The author has a point, I think.
Autentico ?? :lol:

aka. Los Gusanos.

I know the law very well and, as I've said in my first post, support it strongly. It's neccessary to continue the rule of the working class in Cuba.

[KC]

Wikipedia is a bad source. Anyone can literally edit out any articles, change stats and all, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

So untrue.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

It isn't the greatest source though.. I have found some bullshit there.

[Karl Marx's Camel]

So untrue.

What is the purpose of all your inane comments?

[Latifa]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2005, 06:41 AM
It isn't the greatest source though.. I have found some bullshit there.
True but you have to say that for a resource anyone can edit its pretty watertight.