2012

[Organic Revolution]

"In just 12 years we face another apocalyptic test: the Classic Maya millennium, on December 23, 2012 (based on our Western Gregorian calendar). That's when the Maya calendar will turn over to all zeros — 13.0.0.0.0 by the long count. (By the way, the Maya use of the zero by at least A.D. 200 is one of their key claims to fame, since the zero was not introduced to the West until the insights of Aryabhata, a fifth-century Indian mathematician, reached Europe.) The Maya millennium comes 5,126 years after the creation, which, by their reckoning, occurred precisely on August 11, 3114 B.C. But we probably shouldn't worry too much about this, since Pacal, the most famous ruler of Palenque, confidently predicted that his accession would be commemorated on October 15 in A.D. 4772 (Gregorian time).
We, like the Maya and probably everyone else, are always trying to predict critical turning points in the future so we will have time to prepare for them. Unfortunately, we're not very good at it. "(W.L. RATHJE, a Senior Editor of Scientific American Discovering Archaeology)


i believe that this means that it will be a major shift in govermental control... not the end of the world..

discuss.

[LSD]

i believe that this means that it will be a major shift in govermental control

You do?

Why?

I believe that it means nothing at all.


discuss.

There isn't much to discuss. There have been "end of the world" theories since civilization began. It's simply expected that "prophets" will make "apocalyptic" predictions -- unfailingly for well after their death! :lol:

[RedAnarchist]

They belive the world started around 3000 BCE. The world is not 5000, it is over 4 million years old!

No offence to the Mayas, but its a load of superstitious rubbish.

[Clarksist]

Well, we actually have nothing to worry about.

The Mayan calender is not linear, its circular, meaning that it means nothing but the calender will just start back around.

[Seeker]

5,126 years as counted by our base 10 system would be 12,006 years as counted by the Mayan base 8 system.

Where do the extra 6 years come from?

If we begin at August 11, 3114 B.C., the 13th Mayan Century starts next year. It is likely there will be political changes in the Americas because of the 2006 Congressional elections.

[Pawn Power]

They belive the world started around 3000 BCE. The world is not 5000, it is over 4 million years old!

The world was formed 4.5 billion years ago.


i believe that this means that it will be a major shift in govermental control...

why would you belive that? how could they have predicted something so far in the furtur to an exact year?

I would like to see a major shift in governmental control though :lol:

[Clarksist]

Originally posted by Revolution is the [email protected] 26 2005, 06:50 PM

They belive the world started around 3000 BCE. The world is not 5000, it is over 4 million years old!

The world was formed 4.5 billion years ago.
Well its a LOT older than 4 million years. :lol:

Why does everyone think something major will happen? It was a bunch of authoritarian clergymen getting together and making a calender.

And as I've stated before, and 2012 it restarts. Just like our calender restarts. Its not a major fucken deal.

[Ownthink]

Coming from people who worshipped stars and thought that the Sun was a God, I think it's safe to say this is just more mindless attempts at explaining life as we know it, how it became this way, and when/how it will end. Nobody knows. Period. No.Body.Knows. Nobody will ever know.

[Xvall]

Well, the Sun technically was a god, in a way; at least far more of a good than the fabricated judeo-christian phantom. The sun, at least, can actually be proven to be essential to life on the planet and actually is real.

[Hefer]

I think many people misinterprated the meaning. I think the mayans just stop making calenders. Never the less, we can admire how brilliant the mayans where in astronomy and mathematics. Predicting solar eclipse and other events are quite impressive; which is how the clergy fooled the people into believeing they had the power of the gods :P

[Pawn Power]

Well, the Sun technically was a good, in a way; at least far more of a good than the fabricated judeo-christian phantom. The sun, at least, can actually be proven to be essential to life on the planet and actually is real.

a 'god' you mean, right?


think many people misinterprated the meaning. I think the mayans just stop making calenders. Never the less, we can admire how brilliant the mayans where in astronomy and mathematics. Predicting solar eclipse and other events are quite impressive; which is how the clergy fooled the people into believeing they had the power of the gods
Indeed

[Xvall]

a 'god' you mean, right?

That's exactly what I said. What are you talking about?

[Pawn Power]

Originally posted by Drake [email protected] 27 2005, 01:19 PM

a 'god' you mean, right?

That's exactly what I said. What are you talking about?

This post has been edited by Drake Dracoli on Jul 27 2005, 01:19 PM

:lol:

I do it all the time

I have soo many spelling mistakes and typos, I am improving though, I think

[Clarksist]

Originally posted by Drake [email protected] 26 2005, 11:17 PM
Well, the Sun technically was a god, in a way; at least far more of a good than the fabricated judeo-christian phantom. The sun, at least, can actually be proven to be essential to life on the planet and actually is real.
Of course.

There is no faith involved in believing in the sun. Its pretty fucken easy to tell if its there or not.

And to argue that the Sun is all powerful while your sitting on the equator, you'll get followers sure as shit.

From that, your calenders can be misinterpreted and fouled up as a part of new-age mysticism.

[Xvall]

Do what all the time? I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.

[Commie Rat]

your scared of perdiction of people who belived that when there was a lunar eclipse that the god were angry and need more blood sacrefices?

[Sir Aunty Christ]

Back in the mid '90s I read that the world would end in June 1998. Well, I'm still here.

Seriously, I think in a lot of these things there is a lot of misinterpretation by archeaologists and historian. As Clarksist has said, it's probably just about the change of calender.

[Pawn Power]

Originally posted by Drake [email protected] 27 2005, 11:00 PM
Do what all the time? I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.
uh......talk to myself....thats what mean.....yeah.....umm

[Another]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2005, 12:49 AM
5,126 years as counted by our base 10 system would be 12,006 years as counted by the Mayan base 8 system.


I do believe that the Mayans employed a base system of twenty.

Not eight.

[encephalon]

The numerical base that the Mayans did their calculations with has nothing to do with the fact that it's a bunch of superstitious bullshit that we all should have abandoned by now.

[chaval]

okay this is what i have on 2012 so far

1) mayan calander ends december 21 2012

2) terrence mckenna predicts timewave zero at exact same date as end of novelty...? (thanks dracoli)

3) someone (mb nostradamus) predicted current pope second to last pope so it seems likely next pope will be pope by 2012

4) mauri predict 2012 as time when land of living and dead come together

5) sun will swich polars (as it does every so often) if it happens fast enough great earthquakes will occur

6) read somewhere about ancient civilization that saw a star go out (cause it turned into dark matter or sumthin) and they believed that it will explode and it will be as if the sun has a brother (around 2012)

probably just nonsense at least i sure hope so. please feel free to prove me terribly wrong!

[Another]

Superstitious perhaps.

But even superstitions can be based on rational observations and continuing trends.

I don't mean to suggest that the world as we know it will end.

BUT

Historically the people of the Yucatan peninsula underwent many vast migrations (notably from the southern Chiapas highlands to the north eastern Yucatan coastline)

Historians juggle between theories as to why these forced migrations took place but none of these theories have gained any real credence in recent years to my knowledge.

Drought was common and Mayans had to rely on natural cenotes in the limestone surface of the peninsula. Some historians even suggest that peasant farmers developped rudimentary class consciousness and rose up against the priesthood that had ruled them for countless generations.

Most interestingly though, there is reference to vicious storms that plagued the Yucatan in the few remaining Mayan texts that remain.

The Mayans were clearly interested in the passage of time and how it directly affected them as a people. It is quite possible that the Mayans had been able to predict certain weather cycles and reflect it in their calendrics system.

It's a shame I don't know enough about it, but if anyone does I'd encourage them to either back me up or point out my errors.

[Clarksist]

mayan calander ends december 21 2012

It doesn't "end", it simply restarts. Like our December goes to January.


terrence mckenna predicts timewave zero at exact same date as end of novelty...? (thanks dracoli)

Has been predicted numerous times.


someone (mb nostradamus) predicted current pope second to last pope so it seems likely next pope will be pope by 2012

Ronald Reagan predicted the apocalypse would happen in his lifetime. Saints of the Christian faith had been preaching judgement day was near since the beginning of Christianity.

All these have obviously been debunked, so let's just assume nostradamus (whose quatrains are barely legible and extremely broad) is full of shit too.


mauri predict 2012 as time when land of living and dead come together

The living and the dead "coming together"? What does that mean? Will they "rise again"? If so... dead beings would have nothing to control their frame if they had rotting out brains, spines, and muscles.


sun will swich polars (as it does every so often) if it happens fast enough great earthquakes will occur

Major scientific evidence has been gathered on this subject, and so far "so good". I say this because not a single person has issued a wide spread statement about any need to worry.


read somewhere about ancient civilization that saw a star go out (cause it turned into dark matter or sumthin) and they believed that it will explode and it will be as if the sun has a brother (around 2012)

Remember Y2K? And everyone was talking about the Egyptians thinking the world was gonna end in 2000?

I'm still hanging, I'd say there isn't much to worry about.

[Xanthor]

Coming from people who worshipped stars and thought that the Sun was a God, I think it's safe to say this is just more mindless attempts at explaining life as we know it, how it became this way, and when/how it will end. Nobody knows. Period. No.Body.Knows. Nobody will ever know.

we will know eventually but the irony of it is that it will be entirely too late.

well some people believe that whole ozone layer thing will kill us all off in about a 100 years

[Rasta Sapian]

The Mayan People were quite interesting, both in terms of there prosperous civilization and there unique cultural ways of worshipping.

They were related to the old Toltec Indians native to the Americas, The Mayan people seems to go to the stars as far a astrology and ancient mathematics, At the time of Christ they had a good thing going. It has been said that they were at one with the world and the universe for that matter.

The ancient city of Tikal still stands with its pyramids today as ruins in Guatamaula.
The funniest thing about the Mayan is that they disappeared from there city, why?
did they all leave the city and mingle in with the other local native less advanced tribes?

Or did they Go somewhere else? metapysically speaking, metatation and spirituality can sometimes leave me with no more words to speak but you can get the drift of what I am hypothinating about....................

[red_orchestra]

Well, supersticious BS or not, major astrophysical events are known to occur every 1500 yrs or so.

[Che NJ]

This place called Exodus2006.com was pretty weird, but highly religious (most predictions taken from bible code).

Also, has anyone heard about the yellowstone super volcano? It's something like 20,000 years overdue to erupt. It has the potential to blot out the sky for decades.

[Commie Rat]

The YellowStone Caldrea? apparently there are a bunch of scientists saying that is we slowly seep the gas out of it, it will not explode

[encephalon]

The ancient city of Tikal still stands with its pyramids today as ruins in Guatamaula.
The funniest thing about the Mayan is that they disappeared from there city, why?
did they all leave the city and mingle in with the other local native less advanced tribes?


The same thing happened to the Mayans that happened to the Romans: they merged with the local populations that they once conquered. The mayans were imperialists, as were the Aztecs. One difference is that they "disappeared" near the time that the conquistadors starting dissecting south america; my guess is that the introduction of a new element accelerated the desintegration of the old status quo.



Or did they Go somewhere else? metapysically speaking, metatation and spirituality can sometimes leave me with no more words to speak but you can get the drift of what I am hypothinating about....................


BAH.

[Xvall]

Lol.

[Mr Flibble]

the real question is should i buy any live insurence or take out any loans

[slim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28 2005, 09:14 PM
3) someone (mb nostradamus) predicted current pope second to last pope so it seems likely next pope will be pope by 2012

5) sun will swich polars (as it does every so often) if it happens fast enough great earthquakes will occur

6) read somewhere about ancient civilization that saw a star go out (cause it turned into dark matter or sumthin) and they believed that it will explode and it will be as if the sun has a brother (around 2012)

3. the prediction was made in the 9th century (or 11th) by an Irish bishop called Malachy. He made the list of the popes and information about them until the end of the Church.

This list went missing some time after his death and was found in the 15th century. The list up to this time was accurate so its not like the Cardinals chose popes in accordance with the list or that it was written as they went along. The next pope is believed to be the last. Peter the Roman. He is thought to be a devious and corrupting character who shows goodwill but is evil inside. When he is pope the Church as we know it will end and dark times will come. However, there is room to assume that there will be a new age of greatness and peace after this.

5. This change in magnetism is thought to be how mars lost its once rich atmosphere. The solar wind made it evaporate and there was no magnetic field to stop the atmosphere from falling apart over thousands of years. It is true that Earth is long overdue but it is highly unlikely.

6. Nemesis is thought to exist but before we all burn to death we would know it was coming by a massive storm of asteroids from the oort cloud.

Its all interesting. My best bet is with Malachy. It seems likely and a new age of peace will come.

[Decolonize The Left]

This is totally ridiculous. Any claims that the world will end on a specific date are bogus. The only way this would be possible is if a world wide nuclear war was launched on that exact day, then yes, the world would end. But that seems highly unlikely given the fact that human's primary instinct is the survival of one's self.

Anyone who even speculates as to whether this is true, or whether the apocolype is coming, or whether Jesus will return etc... is concentrating way too much on things that cannot be proven, and given the world today, other issues should be discussed.

-- August

[saint max]

Regardless of your exact opinions of radical ecology, primitivism and anti-civilization. This whole 2012 thing (and most ancient prophecie saying between 2005-2020*) has a lot of ecological evidence and warnings. A reading into the critiques of technology, industrialism, and civilization in general will elaborate.

I suppose I can go into it more later if it is'nt so apparent to yall.

Also, It's predicted that, when confonted with the insustainability of their culture, the Maya went back to gather-hunter. they obviously survived in southern mexico...

I don't think the earth will explode, or the dead will walk the earth (not anymore than we already do), but I do think it's quite probably that ecological crisis will grow too unmanagable, and the global north will colapse, and a large perentage of the population will die off. (do you know how to grow/hunt?...much less your bioregion, or if it can sustain a large amount of humyn life?)

But then again, the end of the world as we know it, is exactly what I am struggling for, and I have no illussions of a glorious, mass, or postitivist revolution.

cheers,
-t

ps: perhaps it would be clever to do it 2013, just to catch everyone off gard eh?

[encephalon]

look, people: these predictions about these "latter days" are no different from nor any more numerous than those predictions about the "latter days" of 100 AD, 500 AD, 1000 AD, 1800 AD, 1856 AD, and so on to infinity.

It's sad, here in the US we have a big history of asses thinking the world is going to end on a particular day, so they all dress in white and hop up on barn roofs waiting for their all loving god to come sodomize us all and the earth to boot. And does it happen? Of course not. What happens is that the white robed charlatans come down off their roof, set a new date, go back up then, come back down after failng again and then start another christian sect called the jehovas witnesses, mormons, latter day saints, so on.

Grow the hell up people.. think. bah.

I'm very tempted to move this to the religion forum.

[Latifa]

Originally posted by [email protected] 28 2005, 09:14 PM

4) mauri predict 2012 as time when land of living and dead come together

Do you Maori per chance?

I don't have a fantastically huge amount of paitience for doomsday predictions anyway. One way or another - we're all going to die.

[Gnosis]

if you believe in a major shift in mass conciousness or government control happening very soon you may very well be correct.
if the mayans predicted it when they were still around, good for them.
To believe the mass shift will happen because you were told the mayans predicted it while they were around is a bit irresponible, but understandable.

By the way, there is no "god", as in the fictional, eye-in-the-sky, judgement day, easter-egg hunt, jesus's sperm donar, fat old man who likes to watch you in the shower, symbolizing a fear which is wholly unnecessary and yet oh so entertaining to witness from afar.

But there is a sun, and it did play a major role in the creation and sustainment of life on this planet as we know it, and so it was not faulty of the mayans to worship it. They were extreme when it came to the sybolic sacrfices and all that other "primitive voo-doo bullshit", but then again, americans worship television and a false sense of security ammongst other ridiculously idiotic idols of mentle degredation and moral insanity, so whos to say the ritualistic slaying of virgins is really so bad after all? Maybe we should follow their lead, if you know what I mean. I know some people I'd like to "offer to the sun god"...

[Axel1917]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2005, 09:58 PM
They belive the world started around 3000 BCE. The world is not 5000, it is over 4 million years old!

No offence to the Mayas, but its a load of superstitious rubbish.
Agreed. People look for explanations and such, even when they have no understanding of what is going on. I believe that Sir James Frazer in his work, The Golden Bough: A Study in Magic in Religion (I have not read it. Is this work any good?), stated that earlier people disguised their lack of knowledge with religion and such.

[Camarada]

What will happen on December 21, 2012? Most likely nothing.

But it will be interesting nonetheless when that day comes. I will laugh at people on this board when nothing happens :P If something does happen, then I'll say "oh shit" :lol:

[Axel1917]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2005, 06:23 PM
What will happen on December 21, 2012? Most likely nothing.

But it will be interesting nonetheless when that day comes. I will laugh at people on this board when nothing happens :P If something does happen, then I'll say "oh shit" :lol:
Well, a lot can happen in a few years. Perhaps the Venezuelan Revolution will overthrow the Venzuelan Bourgeoisie by then. Venezuela seems a this point the key to the Latin American, and world, revolution.

[Enragé]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2005, 09:58 PM
They belive the world started around 3000 BCE. The world is not 5000, it is over 4 million years old!

No offence to the Mayas, but its a load of superstitious rubbish.
the 0 in the mayan calendar is not something which means that the world started then, just civilization, or that civilization started again.

And im not an expert on this, but wasnt 3000 BCE the beginning of civilization around the world (a civilization being a culture of settled people, in towns etc); around that time in Egypt (the cradle of western civilization) villages came to be etc.

Also, the setting of the fourth sun (2012 being the setting of fifth sun) coincided with the spanish invasion of south america (with the conquistadores who slaughtered like almost everyone).

Mayan calendars have divided time in 5 epochs, 1-5 suns.

So in this light the setting of the fifth sun could be a time of global upheaval or distress, which could mean revolution.

As a side note, in the song "People of the Sun" by Rage Against the machine, one line goes "The fifth sun sets, get back, reclaim, the spirit of Cuahtemoc alive and untamed"
Cuahtemoc was the leader of the group of people now known as the mexican indigenous during their last stand in their capital against the Conquistadores.

[Rasta Sapian]

Originally posted by encephal[email protected] 2 2005, 10:55 PM


The ancient city of Tikal still stands with its pyramids today as ruins in Guatamaula.
The funniest thing about the Mayan is that they disappeared from there city, why?
did they all leave the city and mingle in with the other local native less advanced tribes?


The same thing happened to the Mayans that happened to the Romans: they merged with the local populations that they once conquered. The mayans were imperialists, as were the Aztecs. One difference is that they "disappeared" near the time that the conquistadors starting dissecting south america; my guess is that the introduction of a new element accelerated the desintegration of the old status quo.



Or did they Go somewhere else? metapysically speaking, metatation and spirituality can sometimes leave me with no more words to speak but you can get the drift of what I am hypothinating about....................


BAH.
There is more to the Mayan people than what you think.

They abandonned their City of Tikal "the centre of the ancient Toltec empire"
approximately 500 years before the Conquistadors arrived with Cortes from Spain. The Mayan city and empire had already been rehabited to a minimal level in terms of municipal population and trade, agriculture and education. The people who lived and worshipped and written the calander had disapeared.

It were the Aztecs and other northern indigenous tribes; who's spiritual leader Montezuma was said to have been desended from the Toltec Empire.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

This is superstitious nonsense.

You know the Jehovah&#39;s Witnesses think the &#39;end days&#39; are coming.. maybe we should give up on this whole &#39;revolution&#39; thing <_<

Spirituality is for suckers.

[Subpar]

I believe Jesus is going to come back from the grave and take all of his wonderful children back to heaven where they will live eternally in bliss and happiness. :blink:

Not really, but I think it&#39;s the same line of superstition, the only difference is the Mayans seem more mystical than some European religion.