socialist vs communists - left wing versus each other.

[Hayduke]

While I have been reading many books, bout the fight against Germany in WW2 by the reds.

It seems that the socialist's and communist really didnt like each other and almost hated each other.

Myself as a socialist am still defending communism with everything I got, and I see them as cmrades in my fight against the right wing gonverment.

How about you ?

[Edelweiss]

All communists are socialists! Maybe you mean social democrats vs. communists? There indeed was a deep enmity beween the both, already during Weimar Germany. The KPD used to call the social democrats "social fascists". These enmity within the left-wing was one of the reasons for the rise of the Nazi's in Germany. If they would have stand together in a strong anti-fascist unity, Nazi Germany would never have happened.

[Conghaileach]

In the Spanish civil war, the Spanish communists betrayed the anarchists and socialists, to oversimplify the story.

[RGacky3]

Quote: from D DAY on 5:28 pm on Sep. 25, 2002
While I have been reading many books, bout the fight against Germany in WW2 by the reds.

It seems that the socialist's and communist really didnt like each other and almost hated each other.

Myself as a socialist am still defending communism with everything I got, and I see them as cmrades in my fight against the right wing gonverment.

How about you ?


I agree with you compleatly I will always defend all communists with ever thing I've got, even though I am a Utopian Socialist.

[antieverything]

Always? Even if they advocate purges and genocide?

[man in the red suit]

maybe not if they advocate purges. lol

[mentalbunny]

I don't know enough about communism, I'm sorry to say. When I have time I'll read up on it, the principles seem ok, but communists seem too ready to use violence in unacceptable ways to get hwat they want (eg genocide), and I don't agree with that, but yeah, all shades of red should work together.

[Stray]

The Comintern made a lot of bad judgements back in the day and it caused a lot of factioning and spliting among the left. Any Comintern affiliated party was generaly hostile to any other party who did not follow Moscow's orders and were name social fascists by the Comintern.

[redstar2000]

Some of the "socialist vs. communist" stuff has to do with the complexities of the development of the left in the last 150 years or so. But if I read the questioner's intent properly--what makes some of these folks dislike each other so much NOW?--I think we get into the realm of psychological identification with this or that historical tendency.

And that's kind of a shame. All the inter-left polemics, struggles, fist-fights and shootings have amounted, in the end, to a large ZERO. Yesterday I visited the Anti-capitalist Convergence website and read a scathing indictment of the "new world [capitalist] order"...without a single mention or even a hint of any kind of alternative. It was as if Marx had never lived!

The irony of the present antagonisms is that NONE of the folks involved are, in fact, guilty of the blunders, crimes, etc. of those with whom they identify. The folks at the Stalinist website never killed anybody. The folks at the social democrat websites never betrayed the international working class. And so on...they're just too damned young to have been part of any of that.

If I had a "magic wand" to wave, I would banish all romantic identifications with this or that historical figure or tendency. I would have people respect ALL of the historical figures/tendencies for their positive contributions to the struggle for communism, be critical of ALL of them for their mistakes, blunders, betrayals, crimes, etc., and move on to discuss what a 21st century revolutionary movement ought to be like. It is bad enough that the dead oppress the living in the relations of production; it is much worse when it happens in our own brains.

[Anonymous]

Its terrible to think that Leftist are shooting themselves in the foot when trying to make a meaningful change. Capitalists must be weeting themselves laughing to see Leftist too busy fighting amongst themselves to do anything serious

[Kez]

Social Democrats arent socialist (and obviously not fascist), but they did side with the capitalists, so in the event of a socialists (communist) revolution the social democrats would have fought AGAINST the communists.

Luxemborg and Freidrich were head of the CP of Germany werent they? so dont confuse them, with any stalinism

[Reuben]

Luxemburg and liebnecht

[antieverything]

Social Democrats run the scale from progressive to revolutionary. Some "social democracy" parties are about where the US Greens are while others are full fledged, radical socialists.

Why do social democrats and democratic socialists fight "against" the communists? Because the communists want to impose a just society in an undemocratic way, they claim complete monopoly on the truth. Social Democrats and Democratic Socialists believe in violence only when the capitalist authorities refuse to allow democracy.

[Kez]

SD fight against socialists AND communists, not just communists.

And to say that communists want socialism without democracy is an oxymoron.

And i will explain y, as obviously being politically bankrupt as you are, u wouldnt know.

Communists, (from bolsheviks to eurocommunists) want to establish a society without the upper class ruling the forces below. Therefor it cannot be undemocratic as all members of that society RUN the society
As lenin stated:
If everyone becomes a beurocrat, then there will be no such thing as beurocracy.

Anti, you need to distinguish between socialism and anti-socialist propaganda it seems you are used to listening to.

Semeno