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Rage
17th May 2005, 01:40
He is authoritarian right-wing (Just like Hitler), he is abolishing Gay rights, Womens rights, he was not elected by Majority of votes, he invaded Iraq for its oil, and he gives the people no rights.


All the things a fascist dictator would do.


Anymore ideas? There are tons more but I am too tired to right them.


Edit: You know it ment Bush <_<

/,,/
Rock on&#33;

bed_of_nails
17th May 2005, 01:52
Let us look at some more aspects of Fascism.

Combination of State and Business: It could be seen as true, due to the large amounts of money parties recieve from corporations.

Nationalism: Quite true of the United States.



I dont really see America as a fascist state, I see it as more of a theocracy.

The Garbage Disposal Unit
17th May 2005, 03:11
The United States is neither a fascist state nor a theocracy - and we should be careful how we throw those terms around.

Rather than ranting, I&#39;m going to suggest reading Trotsky&#39;s work on fascism.
In breif, fascism represents a specific development in class society, and comes out a crisis in capital in which the working class is unable to . . . well, read Trotsky.

As to theocracy - heck no. We&#39;re still ruled by capitalists. When the religious hold more power then the capitalists, we can be scared . . . (scared of sliding backwards into feudalism?)

A Free Mind
17th May 2005, 05:00
I thought Bush won the elections with a majority this time. Oh and I dont belive that america is a fascist state it may becombe one when the economy collapses compleatly in the next few years (it seems to be heading in that direction any way)

Professor Moneybags
17th May 2005, 14:44
he was not elected by Majority of votes,

Hitler was elected by popular vote, so was Bush.

t_wolves_fan
17th May 2005, 15:08
You&#39;re arguments are simple-minded and sophmoric.


He is authoritarian right-wing (Just like Hitler)

Compared to you, 95% of the American population is right-wing.


, he is abolishing Gay rights,

No he isn&#39;t. At worst he&#39;s proposing a Constitutional amendment that he doesn&#39;t believe in and which will never pass. He&#39;s done nothing (probably because he doesn&#39;t have the power) to prevent states from recognizing gay marriages and all the other civil rights.


Womens rights,

Aside from abortion, which he has not abolished (again because he doesn&#39;t have the power), women have no rights that men don&#39;t have.

He signed a bill to ban partial-birth abortion, but that was passed by a democratically-elected Congress.


he was not elected by Majority of votes

We don&#39;t elect Presidents by the majority of votes.


, he invaded Iraq for its oil,

No he didn&#39;t.


and he gives the people no rights.

Yah, we&#39;re all in chains here.

:rolleyes:



All the things a fascist dictator would do.

Your problem is that you know nothing about being oppressed, and so have to find something to complain about. Since you have nothing real, you have to make it up. Therefore, you&#39;re suggesting that even differences of opinion are oppressive to you.

Pathetic.



Anymore ideas? There are tons more but I am too tired to right them.

It&#39;d be better for us if you&#39;d WRITE them instead.




/,,/
Rock on&#33;

Jersey Devil
17th May 2005, 20:14
Indeed. No substance in any of the points addressed. Anyone can scream "Fascist" to the top of their lungs.

Rage
17th May 2005, 21:11
Originally posted by A Free [email protected] 17 2005, 04:00 AM
I thought Bush won the elections with a majority this time. Oh and I dont belive that america is a fascist state it may becombe one when the economy collapses compleatly in the next few years (it seems to be heading in that direction any way)
This time he did win by popular vote. America is more Fascist then, lets say Cuba.

Most Americans are lead to belive Communism is Evil, America will not even engage in trade with Cuba or let Citizens go there without a permit.



Maybe I am just ranting because I live in the Heart land of the KKK members who all support Bush, but I really think that America is very close to becoming a Nationalist Fascist country.


/,,/
Rock on&#33;

Publius
17th May 2005, 21:31
He is authoritarian right-wing (Just like Hitler), he is abolishing Gay rights, Womens rights, he was not elected by Majority of votes, he invaded Iraq for its oil, and he gives the people no rights.


All the things a fascist dictator would do.


Anymore ideas? There are tons more but I am too tired to right them.


Edit: You know it ment Bush <_<

/,,/
Rock on&#33;

Well, let&#39;s compare his platform to that of a real Fascist, say Hitler. First, Nazi boy. The older one.

1. We demand the unification of all Germans in the Greater Germany on the basis of the right of self-determination of peoples.

2. We demand equality of rights for the German people in respect to the other nations; abrogation of the peace treaties of Versailles and St. Germain.

3. We demand land and territory (colonies) for the sustenance of our people, and colonization for our surplus population.

4. Only a member of the race can be a citizen. A member of the race can only be one who is of German blood, without consideration of creed. Consequently no Jew can be a member of the race.

5. Whoever has no citizenship is to be able to live in Germany only as a guest, and must be under the authority of legislation for foreigners.

6. The right to determine matters concerning administration and law belongs only to the citizen. Therefore we demand that every public office, of any sort whatsoever, whether in the Reich, the county or municipality, be filled only by citizens. We combat the corrupting parliamentary economy, office-holding only according to party inclinations without consideration of character or abilities.

7. We demand that the state be charged first with providing the opportunity for a livelihood and way of life for the citizens. If it is impossible to sustain the total population of the State, then the members of foreign nations (non-citizens) are to be expelled from the Reich.

8. Any further immigration of non-citizens is to be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans, who have immigrated to Germany since the 2 August 1914, be forced immediately to leave the Reich.

9. All citizens must have equal rights and obligations.

10. The first obligation of every citizen must be to work both spiritually and physically. The activity of individuals is not to counteract the interests of the universality, but must have its result within the framework of the whole for the benefit of all Consequently we demand:

11. Abolition of unearned (work and labour) incomes. Breaking of rent-slavery.

12. In consideration of the monstrous sacrifice in property and blood that each war demands of the people personal enrichment through a war must be designated as a crime against the people. Therefore we demand the total confiscation of all war profits.

13. We demand the nationalization of all (previous) associated industries (trusts).

14. We demand a division of profits of all heavy industries.

15. We demand an expansion on a large scale of old age welfare.

16. We demand the creation of a healthy middle class and its conservation, immediate communalization of the great warehouses and their being leased at low cost to small firms, the utmost consideration of all small firms in contracts with the State, county or municipality.

17. We demand a land reform suitable to our needs, provision of a law for the free expropriation of land for the purposes of public utility, abolition of taxes on land and prevention of all speculation in land.

18. We demand struggle without consideration against those whose activity is injurious to the general interest. Common national criminals, usurers, Schieber and so forth are to be punished with death, without consideration of confession or race.

19. We demand substitution of a German common law in place of the Roman Law serving a materialistic world-order.

20. The state is to be responsible for a fundamental reconstruction of our whole national education program, to enable every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education and subsequently introduction into leading positions. The plans of instruction of all educational institutions are to conform with the experiences of practical life. The comprehension of the concept of the State must be striven for by the school [Staatsbuergerkunde] as early as the beginning of understanding. We demand the education at the expense of the State of outstanding intellectually gifted children of poor parents without consideration of position or profession.

21. The State is to care for the elevating national health by protecting the mother and child, by outlawing child-labor, by the encouragement of physical fitness, by means of the legal establishment of a gymnastic and sport obligation, by the utmost support of all organizations concerned with the physical instruction of the young.

22. We demand abolition of the mercenary troops and formation of a national army.

23. We demand legal opposition to known lies and their promulgation through the press. In order to enable the provision of a German press, we demand, that: a. All writers and employees of the newspapers appearing in the German language be members of the race: b. Non-German newspapers be required to have the express permission of the State to be published. They may not be printed in the German language: c. Non-Germans are forbidden by law any financial interest in German publications, or any influence on them, and as punishment for violations the closing of such a publication as well as the immediate expulsion from the Reich of the non-German concerned. Publications which are counter to the general good are to be forbidden. We demand legal prosecution of artistic and literary forms which exert a destructive influence on our national life, and the closure of organizations opposing the above made demands.

24. We demand freedom of religion for all religious denominations within the state so long as they do not endanger its existence or oppose the moral senses of the Germanic race. The Party as such advocates the standpoint of a positive Christianity without binding itself confessionally to any one denomination. It combats the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and around us, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our nation can only succeed from within on the framework: common utility precedes individual utility.

25. For the execution of all of this we demand the formation of a strong central power in the Reich. Unlimited authority of the central parliament over the whole Reich and its organizations in general. The forming of state and profession chambers for the execution of the laws made by the Reich within the various states of the confederation. The leaders of the Party promise, if necessary by sacrificing their own lives, to support by the execution of the points set forth above without consideration

to

http://www.gop.com/media/2004platform.pdf



I would say the differences are vast in some areas (Bush doesn&#39;t really want Austria) and similar in many others (Both Bush and Hitler are Socialists), but overall, I find them generally disimilar.

But carry on with the effigial defacing.

bed_of_nails
17th May 2005, 23:34
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 08:31 PM

He is authoritarian right-wing (Just like Hitler), he is abolishing Gay rights, Womens rights, he was not elected by Majority of votes, he invaded Iraq for its oil, and he gives the people no rights.


All the things a fascist dictator would do.


Anymore ideas? There are tons more but I am too tired to right them.


Edit: You know it ment Bush <_<

/,,/
Rock on&#33;

Well, let&#39;s compare his platform to that of a real Fascist, say Hitler. First, Nazi boy. The older one.

1. We demand the unification of all Germans in the Greater Germany on the basis of the right of self-determination of peoples.

2. We demand equality of rights for the German people in respect to the other nations; abrogation of the peace treaties of Versailles and St. Germain.

3. We demand land and territory (colonies) for the sustenance of our people, and colonization for our surplus population.

4. Only a member of the race can be a citizen. A member of the race can only be one who is of German blood, without consideration of creed. Consequently no Jew can be a member of the race.

5. Whoever has no citizenship is to be able to live in Germany only as a guest, and must be under the authority of legislation for foreigners.

6. The right to determine matters concerning administration and law belongs only to the citizen. Therefore we demand that every public office, of any sort whatsoever, whether in the Reich, the county or municipality, be filled only by citizens. We combat the corrupting parliamentary economy, office-holding only according to party inclinations without consideration of character or abilities.

7. We demand that the state be charged first with providing the opportunity for a livelihood and way of life for the citizens. If it is impossible to sustain the total population of the State, then the members of foreign nations (non-citizens) are to be expelled from the Reich.

8. Any further immigration of non-citizens is to be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans, who have immigrated to Germany since the 2 August 1914, be forced immediately to leave the Reich.

9. All citizens must have equal rights and obligations.

10. The first obligation of every citizen must be to work both spiritually and physically. The activity of individuals is not to counteract the interests of the universality, but must have its result within the framework of the whole for the benefit of all Consequently we demand:

11. Abolition of unearned (work and labour) incomes. Breaking of rent-slavery.

12. In consideration of the monstrous sacrifice in property and blood that each war demands of the people personal enrichment through a war must be designated as a crime against the people. Therefore we demand the total confiscation of all war profits.

13. We demand the nationalization of all (previous) associated industries (trusts).

14. We demand a division of profits of all heavy industries.

15. We demand an expansion on a large scale of old age welfare.

16. We demand the creation of a healthy middle class and its conservation, immediate communalization of the great warehouses and their being leased at low cost to small firms, the utmost consideration of all small firms in contracts with the State, county or municipality.

17. We demand a land reform suitable to our needs, provision of a law for the free expropriation of land for the purposes of public utility, abolition of taxes on land and prevention of all speculation in land.

18. We demand struggle without consideration against those whose activity is injurious to the general interest. Common national criminals, usurers, Schieber and so forth are to be punished with death, without consideration of confession or race.

19. We demand substitution of a German common law in place of the Roman Law serving a materialistic world-order.

20. The state is to be responsible for a fundamental reconstruction of our whole national education program, to enable every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education and subsequently introduction into leading positions. The plans of instruction of all educational institutions are to conform with the experiences of practical life. The comprehension of the concept of the State must be striven for by the school [Staatsbuergerkunde] as early as the beginning of understanding. We demand the education at the expense of the State of outstanding intellectually gifted children of poor parents without consideration of position or profession.

21. The State is to care for the elevating national health by protecting the mother and child, by outlawing child-labor, by the encouragement of physical fitness, by means of the legal establishment of a gymnastic and sport obligation, by the utmost support of all organizations concerned with the physical instruction of the young.

22. We demand abolition of the mercenary troops and formation of a national army.

23. We demand legal opposition to known lies and their promulgation through the press. In order to enable the provision of a German press, we demand, that: a. All writers and employees of the newspapers appearing in the German language be members of the race: b. Non-German newspapers be required to have the express permission of the State to be published. They may not be printed in the German language: c. Non-Germans are forbidden by law any financial interest in German publications, or any influence on them, and as punishment for violations the closing of such a publication as well as the immediate expulsion from the Reich of the non-German concerned. Publications which are counter to the general good are to be forbidden. We demand legal prosecution of artistic and literary forms which exert a destructive influence on our national life, and the closure of organizations opposing the above made demands.

24. We demand freedom of religion for all religious denominations within the state so long as they do not endanger its existence or oppose the moral senses of the Germanic race. The Party as such advocates the standpoint of a positive Christianity without binding itself confessionally to any one denomination. It combats the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and around us, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our nation can only succeed from within on the framework: common utility precedes individual utility.

25. For the execution of all of this we demand the formation of a strong central power in the Reich. Unlimited authority of the central parliament over the whole Reich and its organizations in general. The forming of state and profession chambers for the execution of the laws made by the Reich within the various states of the confederation. The leaders of the Party promise, if necessary by sacrificing their own lives, to support by the execution of the points set forth above without consideration

to

http://www.gop.com/media/2004platform.pdf



I would say the differences are vast in some areas (Bush doesn&#39;t really want Austria) and similar in many others (Both Bush and Hitler are Socialists), but overall, I find them generally disimilar.

But carry on with the effigial defacing.
Nazis werent actually fascists.

I am not quite sure where you got Bush is a socialist, but Hitler only went with the name. Many of the people in concentration camps were unemployed Germans.

Publius
17th May 2005, 23:45
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 10:34 PM





Nazis werent actually fascists.

Close enough. Can you honestly tell them apart, once they&#39;re in action?


I am not quite sure where you got Bush is a socialist, but Hitler only went with the name. Many of the people in concentration camps were unemployed Germans.

No, they&#39;re both socialistic. Bush, supports medicare, social security, a massive military, government subsidies, high taxes, government control of certain industries, etc

Hitler cartelized major industries and controlled them, limited profits and production, insituted labor laws etc.

Hitler sort of straddled the fence between socialism and capitalism, one day he would be for one, one day he would make a quote for the other, but the facts are, Hitler used his power as dictator to run the economy for his war effort.

Government control of the economy? Socialism.

And obviously he had a problem with unemployemnt, he controlled the economy and they were undermining his efforts.

bed_of_nails
18th May 2005, 00:40
No, they&#39;re both socialistic. Bush, supports medicare, social security, a massive military, government subsidies, high taxes, government control of certain industries, etc

Socialism doesnt believe in having a massive military. Many socialists are also for the destruction of boarders.

Everything you brought up is extremely vague.

Bush is fucking with the Social Security so only the top 1% will really get much out of it. Thats a real Socialist action if I ever saw one.

The taxes Bush is raising are those of the lowest classes. He is raising the lower-class tax rates so he can lower the upper-class tax rates.

The government control of certain industries is not meant to benefit the common people. If you dont believe me, why dont you read some books that talk about what Bush has done to ergonomics laws.

Go back and read some more into the topic, and then try and tell me Bush is a socialist.


Hitler cartelized major industries and controlled them, limited profits and production, insituted labor laws etc.


Hitler did that only for the German people he liked.

If you were unemployed, your ass is gone.


Close enough. Can you honestly tell them apart, once they&#39;re in action?

I dont remember the last time Fascists went as far as working to death and gassing that many people. Maybe it is just my skewed view on this though, seeing as how I was raised by holocaust survivors an OBVIOUSLY have no clue what I am talking about.


No, they&#39;re both socialistic

That is the dumbest thing I have heard today. Socialism is extremely left-wing, believing in equality for all.

Look at how Bush has voted, and what Hitler did. If you cant figure this one out maybe someone should just ban you, because obviously you dont absorb information.

Publius
18th May 2005, 00:56
Ban me because I don&#39;t adhere to a belief of yours?

Let me back up my opinions, if you will. I doubt we&#39;ll reconcile, but I assure you, I know what I&#39;m talking about.

bed_of_nails
18th May 2005, 01:03
Then get to backing them up.

Publius
18th May 2005, 01:07
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 11:40 PM







Socialism doesnt believe in having a massive military. Many socialists are also for the destruction of boarders.

Everything you brought up is extremely vague.

Bush is fucking with the Social Security so only the top 1% will really get much out of it. Thats a real Socialist action if I ever saw one.

The taxes Bush is raising are those of the lowest classes. He is raising the lower-class tax rates so he can lower the upper-class tax rates.

The government control of certain industries is not meant to benefit the common people. If you dont believe me, why dont you read some books that talk about what Bush has done to ergonomics laws.

Go back and read some more into the topic, and then try and tell me Bush is a socialist.

Bush runs a state with massive entitlement programs, social security programs, government run schooling, government funded health care, government control of many industries, high taxes, stringent regulation on businesses, minimum wage laws, child labor laws, workplace safety laws, a gargantuan government, a massive beauracracy, and a total waste of money.

Bush, though lowering taxes some, still presises over a country with a leviathan state, a state wallowing in debt and hemmorhaging money into verious forms of social handouts.

And ergonomics laws? That&#39;s the best you have?

And tell me, how is Bush raising lower class tax rates and how is his social security plan going to help the richest 1% when they don&#39;t even pay into Social Security?

Check your facts.



Hitler did that only for the German people he liked.

If you were unemployed, your ass is gone.

He did what was best for the German people, or so he said. Obviously he was wrong, but aren&#39;t ya gonna give him some credit for trying?

:(

Socialism to me is a state like Nazi Germany, just look at every other socialist country, like Soviety Russia, Ghanda, Cuba and any other socialist hellhole.

What are the prime differences between those states and Nazi Germany?



I dont remember the last time Fascists went as far as working to death and gassing that many people. Maybe it is just my skewed view on this though, seeing as how I was raised by holocaust survivors an OBVIOUSLY have no clue what I am talking about.

What about Fascism makes this sort of thing an unreality? Just because Italy didn&#39;t do it?



That is the dumbest thing I have heard today. Socialism is extremely left-wing, believing in equality for all.

Look at how Bush has voted, and what Hitler did. If you cant figure this one out maybe someone should just ban you, because obviously you dont absorb information.

It is ironic how socialist states are often the most repressive and totalitarian.

bed_of_nails
18th May 2005, 01:44
You have just repeated the arguments I set out to refute, therefore getting yourself nowhere.

Good job.

You are using your own personal connotations to try and determine what Fascism is.

RedStarOverChina
18th May 2005, 04:19
In the west, the term "fascism" was never properly defined because they cant seem to tell the difference between capitalism and fascism&#33;

bed_of_nails
18th May 2005, 04:27
Socialism to me is a state like Nazi Germany, just look at every other socialist country, like Soviety Russia, Ghanda, Cuba and any other socialist hellhole.

Maybe you dont realize this, but those places were far worse before Socialism.

aztecklaw
18th May 2005, 04:34
Fuck Bushocracy&#33;

The Garbage Disposal Unit
18th May 2005, 05:47
Could everyone please come back and argue this after reading beyond a) Ayn Rand and b) Mikey Moore?

(Sorry, I don&#39;t mean to be that rightous - it&#39;s just late. Really though, I love and respect all of you. Sorta. I see the value in yr ideas. Sorta.)


Neither Bush nor Hitler are socialists. Was either running a pure-capitalist state? Certainly not - because such a thing would have decended into barbarism long ago. An unrestrained market would have concentrated and collapsed - learn to fucking deal with it, and try taking a real economics course.

Was Hitler a capitalist? Not exactly - his corporate state (The difference between corporatism and socialized-production might be covered in the above-suggested course) emerged to save capitalism when it was in a crisis. Capitalism just wasn&#39;t functioning, and the Fuhur saved the economy, and crushed a groing revolutionary socialist movement.

Has America reached that point yet? Nope - it&#39;s still an imperial power. Once it gets its ass kicked out of Iraq, Afganistan, etc. then we can worry about a real fascism emerging.

Does this mean "Bush ain&#39;t so bad&#33;" - heck no&#33; It means he represents a distinct strain of authoritarian warmongering that has to be meaningfully analysed in itself.



As to "socialist" hellholes, one might wonder as to Publius&#39; familiarity with Tsarist Russia (or post-Soviet, present day Russia, for that matter), Batista and the Mafia&#39;s Cuba, etc.

CommieBastard
18th May 2005, 08:06
Certainly, drawing comparisons to earlier and cruder systems debases the point, you couldn&#39;t be more right when you say

he represents a distinct strain of authoritarian warmongering that has to be meaningfully analysed in itself

Admittedly, we can analyse where particular strains of other systems have been taken up, developed and adapted, but to get bogged down in the moral connotations of any of these particulars obscures the overall view of the system, and detracts from any meaningful debate.

Sorry if I&#39;m just repeating you VMC :/

t_wolves_fan
18th May 2005, 12:45
Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 03:19 AM
In the west, the term "fascism" was never properly defined because they cant seem to tell the difference between capitalism and fascism&#33;
That&#39;s stupid.

Mousolini defined fascism for us.

encephalon
18th May 2005, 13:13
http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/R...y/mussolini.htm (http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/Germany/mussolini.htm)

This is fascism, folks. The Bushites adhere to similar points in many areas. I wouldn&#39;t say he&#39;s entirely fascist, but over the past twenty years the US political lanscape has moved towards fascism more and more.

And bush a socialist? Give me a break. If you honestly believe he likes social security, you&#39;re seriously mistaken. His point is to destroy it, not fix it. He simply can&#39;t say that without 90% of the population having an uproar.

Socialistpenguin
18th May 2005, 20:08
Actually, this guy has a point: I remember that a person by the name of Dr. Lawrence Britt (I&#39;m not sure if I&#39;ve spelt this right) analysed fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany) ,Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each:
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism: Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.

3 . Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread
domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.

5. Rampant Sexism - The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution.

6. Controlled Mass Media - Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.

7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined - Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government&#39;s policies or actions.

9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed - Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment - Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.

14. Fraudulent Elections - Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

Hmm...sound familiar?

Publius
18th May 2005, 21:08
Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 03:27 AM




Maybe you dont realize this, but those places were far worse before Socialism.

Cuba was the third richest country in the Americas before Castro.

Tell me, how much has Cuba&#39;s per capita GDP gone up since Castro took over (Adding in inflation)?


Tell me, how much did Ghanda advance in the years it went over to a Socialist system, compared to the years before and after when it embraced a capitalistic system?


And yes, Socialist Russia still sucks.

Socialistpenguin
18th May 2005, 21:10
Originally posted by Publius+May 18 2005, 08:08 PM--> (Publius @ May 18 2005, 08:08 PM)
[email protected] 18 2005, 03:27 AM




Maybe you dont realize this, but those places were far worse before Socialism.

Cuba was the third richest country in the Americas before Castro.

Tell me, how much has Cuba&#39;s per capita GDP gone up since Castro took over (Adding in inflation)?


Tell me, how much did Ghanda advance in the years it went over to a Socialist system, compared to the years before and after when it embraced a capitalistic system?


And yes, Socialist Russia still sucks. [/b]
I don&#39;t think he was talking about it concerning wealth, I think he meant living conditions, health service, that sort of thing.

Publius
18th May 2005, 21:12
I don&#39;t think he was talking about it concerning wealth, I think he meant living conditions, health service, that sort of thing.

That&#39;s a harder comparision to make, but sure, compare Average Life spans (In relation to the rest of the world) and average infant mortality rates (Compared to the rest of the world).

Those are good indicators of health and well-being.

Professor Moneybags
18th May 2005, 22:28
Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 12:13 PM
He simply can&#39;t say that without 90% of the population having an uproar.
Are you implying that 90% of the country is living off welfare hand outs ? You didn&#39;t get that from Cormacobear by any chance did you ?

OleMarxco
18th May 2005, 22:44
SHUT UP&#33;
SHUT UP&#33;&#33;
SHUT UP&#33;&#33;&#33;
SHUT UP&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;
SHUT UP&#33;&#33;&#33;
SHUT UP&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;

BULLSHIT-ALARM&#33;
*thumbs author&#39;s head*

Bush is NOT A FASCIST.
He HAS NOT supreme control of the state;
He is NOT trying to control the whole nation
imposing morals on ANYONE, but waging a
stupid war on terror and having a bad economic policy.
He maybe is imposing morals on ANOTHER nation, but that&#39;s
ANOTHER case. Bush had to ELECT trough his "fascistic" policies
against gays. etc (which I TOTALLY disagree with) with the help of
Senators, or should I rather said, well-paid fuckers who sleep with
anyone with cash. Republicans and Democrats alike&#33; Only the Greens
opposed, and they can&#39;t SAY anythin&#39; foh&#39;shit&#33;

Get it trough thick-fuckin&#39; HEAD,
I&#39;m SICK of hearing all these idiots jammerin&#39; about it.
Don&#39;t even BOTHER of askin&#39; for a REASON this and that,
YOU KNOW IT WELL YOURSELF he ain&#39;t. Hes&#39; a NEO-CON FOOL
of a THOK, damnit, GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT, foo&#39;&#33; :angry: