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Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 00:07
10 things you may not have known about Cuba .....

1. Fidel Castro has reportedly survived over 600 assassination attempts.

2. Having been in power since 1959, Fidel Castro is the world's longest serving political leader.

3. The Cubans refer to their island as 'El Cocodrilo' - viewed from above Cuba is believed to resemble a crocodile.

4. Since 1959, Castro has refused to cash the cheques that America pays in rent for the base at Guantanamo Bay.

5. When Christopher Columbus first stumbled upon Cuba in 1492 he thought he had landed in China.

6. Despite being a world apart politically, Cuba is only 90 miles away from the US.

7. US law does not forbid US citizens to travel to Cuba - they're just not allowed to spend any money there! - effectively meaning a travel ban.

8. As well as producing some of the world's finest cigars - Cuba also has a knack of producing great sports stars, particularly in boxing, athletics and baseball.

9. In something of a paradox Cuba has one of the best health care systems in the world. The average life expectancy of around 76 years is comparable with that of the UK and US and one of its most successful exports is that of medical technology. Cuban scientists have developed vaccines for hepatitis-B and meningitis-B.

10. Approaching the age of 80, Castro has survived the Cold War, 9 US presidents and innumerable assassination attempts and no one is quite sure what will happen to Cuba when he eventually dies.

not such a bad country afterall

MKS
17th May 2005, 00:36
A great country that could be better if it werent for the northern Imperialists.

Its scary to think of what will happen when Fidel dies.

Konqwest
17th May 2005, 00:37
1. Fidel Castro has reportedly survived over 600 assassination attempts.

That is just an insane number

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 00:57
Why would anyone want to assinate him, he has done nothing wrong in my books. They will get one hell of a shock when he dies

Matthew The Great
17th May 2005, 02:20
I forget what I was talking about with one of my friends the other day but Cuba was mentioned somehow. When I mentioned Cuba he said something like "I wonder if that actually is Castro".

I was curious. "What?" I asked him.

"Some people think that it is not really Castro. Some people think it is just one of his look-a-likes or imersinators because we've (US) tried to kill him so many times."

"When do they think they supposedly killed him?"

"I don't know. I've heard different things everytime."

When and how did this rumor start? That was the first i've heard of it. I know enemys of the US are prone to do this (Hussein, bin Laden, etc.) so I guess the theory is believeable.

Anyone else heard that crazy story?

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 02:23
i have never heard that or maybe castro is just lucky

logicdms
17th May 2005, 02:41
Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 11:07 PM
4. Since 1959, Castro has refused to cash the cheques that America pays in rent for the base at Guantanamo Bay.
if those checks were cashed at one point or another, itd proly take a chuck of the US tax money out of the system. money would proly be taken from mandatory spendin. that would definitly spark some kind of response out of the enslaved zombies here in the US.

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 02:46
Good Point

Phalanx
17th May 2005, 03:03
Originally posted by Anarcho-[email protected] 16 2005, 11:57 PM
Why would anyone want to assinate him, he has done nothing wrong in my books. They will get one hell of a shock when he dies
How does he treat his prisoners and are the civil rights ok? I honestly don't know because the Western media is bullshit and i can't trust them.

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 03:05
I wouldn't know actually

getfreedropout
17th May 2005, 03:34
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 03:55
Lets start another revolution!

Antijingo
17th May 2005, 04:51
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 02:34 AM
Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.
Cuba is a dictatorship but not over the people; for the people, against imperialism (=USA).

Poverty in Cuba is only material; the standard of living, at least as reflected by statistical indicators, is quite good.

From CIA World Factbook (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/cu.html)
Infant Mortality: 6.33/1000 live births
Life Expectancy: 77.23 years
Aids Prevalence: 200 cases in 12000000 citizens
Literacy: 97%
Unemployment: 2.5%

Why would Cubans strike? True, the average Cuban is paid less than $150US/year but lives practically expense free. They have decent working conditions and no real need for additional earnings as all the necessities are provided by the government. There hasn't been a verified tortured prisoner in Cuba since 1959.

Cuba may be state capitalist but at least Cubans have economic equality (for the most part) and additionally religious/literary controls are gradually lessoning (anecdotally). Cuba is doing quite well considering their economic and geographic isolation as well as their limited natural resources (compared to the US or Canada). I believe that the world would be a much better place if we had a few more Fidels and Ches.

Artkill
17th May 2005, 05:18
i just hope that whoever suceeds him isn't a maniac, a lot of times great leaders are followed by lunatics with too much power

Artkill
17th May 2005, 05:20
Originally posted by Anarcho-[email protected] 17 2005, 02:55 AM
Lets start another revolution!
i would love to join a revolution, unfortunately i live in the us and in a dominately conservative state.

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 05:36
And not many of us would live through one

Artkill
17th May 2005, 05:39
i would sacrifice my life to help the downfall of bourgeois america, believe me.

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 05:41
Population Growth Rate 0.39% (2000 est.)

Birth Rate 12.68 births/1,000 population
(2000 est.)

Death Rate 7.31 deaths/1,000 population
(2000 est.)

Life Expectancy total population: 76.21 years
male: 73.84 years
female: 78.73 years (2000 est.)

Population Density 101 per sq km (1999 est)

Infant Mortality Rate 7.51 deaths/1,000 live births (2000 est.)

Language Spanish

Nationality noun: Cuban(s), adjective: Cuban

Ethnic Groups Mulatto (Mixed Race) 51%, White 37%, Black 11%, Chinese 1%

Religion Roman Catholic also Episcopalians and Methodists
Education (compulsory years) 6

Literacy Rate 97% men, 97% women (2000 est)

Labour Force 15.3% Agriculture, 23.0% Industry, 61.7% Services (1997 est)

Physicians 1 per 172 people (1998 est)

Hospital Beds 1 per 165 people (1993 est)

Television Sets 239 per 1,000 people (1997)

Radios 352 per 1,000 people (1997)

Internet Users 44.8 per 10,000 people (1999)

Internet Domain .cu

Personal Computer Users 0.7 per 100 people (1999)

viva le revolution
17th May 2005, 11:06
Not to mention the lowest crime rate in the northern hemisphere. A stark contradiction to the packed prisons in the U.S.

Bugalu Shrimp
17th May 2005, 13:08
There is a fly in the ointment - Cuba has an abnormally high suicide rate.

MKS
17th May 2005, 20:22
There is a fly in the ointment - Cuba has an abnormally high suicide rate.

So does Sweden.

Seriously though, Cuba does have many problems with poverty, however we can attribute most of these problems to American embargos and constant terrorist attacks on the Cuban people and government.

It is hypocritical that the US openly trades with China (another "communist" nation) whose human rights violations are much worse than Cuba, not to mention Vietnam, and Laos. (other "communist" nations)

America's distortion of the Monroe Doctrine has turned into an outright war to control all of Latin America. A practice that is childish and some would say 'evil'.

bunk
17th May 2005, 20:27
Is there some insurrection happening in Cuba? I heard it from a reporter late last night on the radio, can't remember anything else....

Anarcho-Communist
17th May 2005, 21:23
I wouldn't have a clue if that was happening can you find out?

MKS
17th May 2005, 23:33
Is there some insurrection happening in Cuba? I heard it from a reporter late last night on the radio, can't remember anything else....

I think youre talking about the mass protest held in Havana to return the hijacker/murderer of '76 to Cuba for trial. The hijacker fled to the US, who have refused to send him back. Massive protests against another one of the Americas acts of hypocrisy were held in the Cuban capital.

Orange Juche
18th May 2005, 01:49
Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 10:34 PM
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.
Exactly.

Thank you.

Orange Juche
18th May 2005, 01:52
Originally posted by viva le [email protected] 17 2005, 06:06 AM
Not to mention the lowest crime rate in the northern hemisphere. A stark contradiction to the packed prisons in the U.S.
Well, when you get rid of extreme poverty, you also get rid of lots of criminal acts. poverty, you also get rid of lots of criminal acts.

Guerrilla22
18th May 2005, 02:24
Cuba also has a much higher literacy rate than the US, UK and Canada.

Anarcho-Communist
18th May 2005, 04:24
For what the country is, where it is located and the resources it has it is doing bloody well, MeetingPeopleIsEasy I like your RAAN avatar!

Severian
18th May 2005, 10:47
Originally posted by Anarcho-[email protected] 16 2005, 05:07 PM
5. When Christopher Columbus first stumbled upon Cuba in 1492 he thought he had landed in China.
Really? Thought he was looking for the Indies, nowadays called Indonesia?

Severian
18th May 2005, 10:49
Originally posted by logicdms+May 16 2005, 07:41 PM--> (logicdms @ May 16 2005, 07:41 PM)
[email protected] 16 2005, 11:07 PM
4. Since 1959, Castro has refused to cash the cheques that America pays in rent for the base at Guantanamo Bay.
if those checks were cashed at one point or another, itd proly take a chuck of the US tax money out of the system. money would proly be taken from mandatory spendin. that would definitly spark some kind of response out of the enslaved zombies here in the US. [/b]
The amount is pretty token. The base was extorted from Cuba coming out of the Spanish-American War...the had to agree in order to end the U.S. occupation. So no way Uncle Sam was gonna pay a lot of rent, and inflation's made it totally token.

It's more important to make the point that the base is there against Cuba's will.

Guerrilla22
18th May 2005, 11:03
Originally posted by Severian+May 18 2005, 09:47 AM--> (Severian @ May 18 2005, 09:47 AM)
Anarcho-[email protected] 16 2005, 05:07 PM
5. When Christopher Columbus first stumbled upon Cuba in 1492 he thought he had landed in China.
Really? Thought he was looking for the Indies, nowadays called Indonesia? [/b]
Yeah, he was trying to find China. He knew he was of course, but mistakenly thought that he was indeed in the Indies.

Unfortunately Columbus and the Conquistadors absolutely anhililated Cuba's indigeneous population which numbered around a million. Within like 5 years they were all dead.

Severian
18th May 2005, 11:08
Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 08:34 PM
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution
Name one.

Severian
18th May 2005, 11:16
Originally posted by Guerrilla22+May 18 2005, 04:03 AM--> (Guerrilla22 @ May 18 2005, 04:03 AM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 09:47 AM

Anarcho-[email protected] 16 2005, 05:07 PM
5. When Christopher Columbus first stumbled upon Cuba in 1492 he thought he had landed in China.
Really? Thought he was looking for the Indies, nowadays called Indonesia?
Yeah, he was trying to find China. He knew he was of course, but mistakenly thought that he was indeed in the Indies.

Unfortunately Columbus and the Conquistadors absolutely anhililated Cuba's indigeneous population which numbered around a million. Within like 5 years they were all dead. [/b]
Right...there is no indigenous population in Cuba, or some other Caribbean countries. Maybe some mestizos with part Indian descent. Those who didn't die of the initial epidemics, got enslaved and worked to death.

OK, right, aimed for China and thought he hit the Indies. And wait, maybe the original post was right, that he thought he'd finally found the mainland when he got to Cuba.

Columbus' problem was, he thought the world was smaller than it actually is. There's this myth that everyone before Columbus thought the world was flat. Actually, they had a pretty accurate idea of its shape and size, going back to some ancient Greek who measured shadows and did some trig.

So they said: you'll die of thirst long before you get to China. No way you can carry enough fresh water.

But then Columbus came along, said the world was a lot smaller, I can get to China no prob. Lucky for him there was another continent in the way. History's funny like that.

lvialviaquez
18th May 2005, 12:48
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.

I kinda stand between this opinion and those of the people here who say that, given its situation with the United States, Cuba is doing remarkably well. Castro has done a lot of good for the people of Cuba. But at the same time, he has restricted freedoms and violated human rights in ways that are unacceptable. Also, though he has worked towards creating economic equality, Cuba's economic decision are not being made directly by the workers and it does not appear that they will be any time soon.

Also, I don't buy the whole argument that "everything reported in the mainstream U.S. media is false." American media is dominated by the pursuit of profit, yes. But that does not automatically invalidate everything it reports, such as human rights abuses in Cuba.

bunk
18th May 2005, 15:56
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 10:33 PM

I think youre talking about the mass protest held in Havana to return the hijacker/murderer of '76 to Cuba for trial. The hijacker fled to the US, who have refused to send him back. Massive protests against another one of the Americas acts of hypocrisy were held in the Cuban capital.
that would be it. My mum told me most of waht she heard and was adamant there was some anti-castro stuff. I told her it was probably to do with this terrorist the U.S have accepted.

h&s
18th May 2005, 16:25
One important question regarding Cuba:
Is it a workers state?
No. Castro and his dictorship may be doing a lot of good things for the people with their planned economy, much more than any capitalist would do, but that is not the be-all-end-all.
Castro is to be admired for standing up to the US, but standing up to imperialism is'nt everything.
Anyone who knows any Marx or anarchist theory knows that the road to communism comes from below. Cuba's revolution was run from above, and so is its state.
The state is to be admired and supported to a certain extent, but it is still an obstacle to working-class power.

SpeCtrE
18th May 2005, 19:29
Castro is to be admired for standing up to the US, but standing up to imperialism is'nt everything.

Atleast he is doing something.


Castro and his dictorship may be doing a lot of good things for the people with their planned economy, much more than any capitalist would do, but that is not the be-all-end-all.

Care to share with us what the be-all-end-all is, by being practical.


The state is to be admired and supported to a certain extent, but it is still an obstacle to working-class power

Well, I have never seen a total working class system so far... But since Castro is the closest to it, he got to be wowed.

SpeCtrE
18th May 2005, 19:32
One thing I forgot, Someone from Cuba once told me that ugly guys ( like you guys and me) have the greatest probability of getting laid. Cuban Women, as he put it are both Sexy and Sooooooo Horny.

Vive le Revolution.

Anarcho-Communist
19th May 2005, 00:05
That's great news' so why the ugly ones?

Intifada
19th May 2005, 02:58
In 2001 an attempt was made by Oswaldo Payá Sardiñas and others, operating as the Varela Project, to have a national plebiscite using provisions in the Constitution of Cuba which provided for citizen initiative. If accepted by the government and approved by public vote, the amendments would have established such things as freedom of association, freedom of speech, freedom of press, as well as the freedom to start private businesses. The Petition was however refused by the National Assembly, and a subsequent crackdown resulted in the imprisonment of 75 political prisoners for terms of up to 28 years on charges of collaborating with and receiving money from the US government.

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuba#Politics)

I would like to hear more about the politics of Cuba.

I want to keep an open mind about Castro.

SpeCtrE
19th May 2005, 07:13
What has got Politics to do with Cuba...

Politics of Cuba 101

System of Government; Fidelism
Ruling Party: Fidel
Head Of Government:Fidel
Head of State: Fidel
Head of the Army: Fidel
Economic System: Fidel,
Exports,: Tobbaco, Sugar and Fidelism
GNP/capita: 400 Million US Dollars, as estimated by the Forbes Magazine.

That is putting is simply...

bolshevik butcher
19th May 2005, 19:14
I think that cuba has 'sold out' a bit recently. They told venuzuela nbto to do anyhting to radical, when nationalising their factories. Certainley it's better than most other place in latin america.

Intifada
19th May 2005, 21:21
Cracking down on people because they handed in a petition asking for more freedom of association, freedom of speech and freedom of press?

That's a tad over the top.

Severian
20th May 2005, 08:48
Originally posted by Clenched [email protected] 19 2005, 12:14 PM
They told venuzuela nbto to do anyhting to radical, when nationalising their factories.
Source?

****

Contrary to Intifada's statement, Cuba has not "cracked down on" or arrested anyone for petitions or other peaceful political activity. They arrested a number of activists for being paid agents of the U.S. government. A lot of convincing evidence was made public about some of those convicted.

I might point out that the U.S. and most bourgeois democracies also have laws outlawing foreign money in their internal politics. The campaign finance laws, Foreign Agents Registration Act, etc.

The involvement of U.S. diplomats in Havana with these oppositon groups was so deep, that the U.S. head diplomat gave access to his computer, to one Cuban State Security agent infiltrating these groups.

Intifada
20th May 2005, 11:27
Contrary to Intifada's statement, Cuba has not "cracked down on" or arrested anyone for petitions or other peaceful political activity. They arrested a number of activists for being paid agents of the U.S. government. A lot of convincing evidence was made public about some of those convicted.


Thanks for that information Severian.

Do you have any links to some of that evidence?

ErikuSz -sXe-
20th May 2005, 12:54
Originally posted by MeetingPeopleIsEasy+May 18 2005, 12:49 AM--> (MeetingPeopleIsEasy @ May 18 2005, 12:49 AM)
[email protected] 16 2005, 10:34 PM
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.
Exactly.

Thank you. [/b]
I am also a Anarcho-Communist, but I am sceptical about your comments I quoted above. There is a considerable amount of anti-communist propaganda adopted by anarchists in the cold-war so I would like to get your source of the information.

break them chains!
20th May 2005, 15:55
QUOTE!
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

america murders people everyday for your "freedom". the thing is is that che and fidel were doing it to get rid of america not for the socalled freedom of there country. sometimes you have to use violence. it sucks but its true. and ya where are your sources coming from huh?

codyvo
20th May 2005, 16:16
I met an old man who was from Cuba and supported Castro, he told me that the people their love him and they think he is like a living god (especially those who lived under Batista). Cuba's economy is on the rise and they have great educational systems, medical care and free rent. To me it seems like an ideal place to live. Also I have heard that their literacy rate is closer to 99% but the US tries to make them look worse.

h&s
20th May 2005, 16:33
Originally posted by SpeCtrE+May 18 2005, 06:29 PM--> (SpeCtrE @ May 18 2005, 06:29 PM)
Castro is to be admired for standing up to the US, but standing up to imperialism is'nt everything.
Atleast he is doing something.[/b]
He's still not doing enough.



Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2005, 06:29 PM

Castro and his dictorship may be doing a lot of good things for the people with their planned economy, much more than any capitalist would do, but that is not the be-all-end-all.
Care to share with us what the be-all-end-all is, by being practical
The be-all-end-all? Workers socialism! (Well OK, communism, but socialism leads to that)


[email protected] 18 2005, 06:29 PM

The state is to be admired and supported to a certain extent, but it is still an obstacle to working-class power
Well, I have never seen a total working class system so far... But since Castro is the closest to it, he got to be wowed.
True, he has to be admired. Still the only way the working class is going to get into power is by seizing it. If Castro gives it away when the time comes and the workers demand it then he (or his successor) is good.

SpeCtrE
20th May 2005, 17:48
He's still not doing enough.

I would like to see you in his place.


True, he has to be admired. Still the only way the working class is going to get into power is by seizing it. If Castro gives it away when the time comes and the workers demand it then he (or his successor) is good.

What you don't know about Cuba, I heard this from a family friend who Got his MD in Cuba.

"...if you think that Cuba will be seized by workers and will be more communist( well, closer anyway ) you are so wrong. Just because Cuba has a high literacy index doesn't mean that they are aware of what communism is and almost all the population is not doctrinated except for very few portion of them.

The way I see it, If Fidel dies and someone more radical doesn't come to power ( like Raul, the only true Communist).. an oppertunist will come and seize power and make concessions to the united states and totally abandon the avenue of Socialism Cuba is going through right now.

So, My friend Hammer and sickle, help me and pray so that Fidel may leave up to the age of total infinity.

ATTN: I am not a Fidelista.

Severian
21st May 2005, 08:39
Originally posted by [email protected] 20 2005, 04:27 AM

Contrary to Intifada's statement, Cuba has not "cracked down on" or arrested anyone for petitions or other peaceful political activity. They arrested a number of activists for being paid agents of the U.S. government. A lot of convincing evidence was made public about some of those convicted.


Thanks for that information Severian.

Do you have any links to some of that evidence?
Press Conference by Cuban Foreign Minister - (http://www.canadiannetworkoncuba.ca/Documents/Roque-Dissidents-Apr03.shtml) lays out a lot of details on the charges, trials, and evidence.

About one aspect of the opposition, the so-called independent libraries. (http://www.nowaroncuba.org/Commentary/Independent_Libraries_Project.htm)

About the Varela Project (http://www.nowaroncuba.org/Commentary/NWC_on_Varela.htm#_ednref9)

ErikuSz -sXe-
21st May 2005, 09:46
It would appear that Meetingpeopleiseasy & getfreedropout lost their sources... :rolleyes:

Che1990
21st May 2005, 19:10
Castro (and Che) murdered thousands of anarchist (and other radical) workers during the revolution and crushed all independent working class organizations.

Cuba is yet another dictatorship over the proletariat. It might be better than some of the other dictatorships in the world, but that isn't saying much.

For all those locked in Cuban prisons, those afraid to speak up, and those afraid to strike or take action against the poverty of so-called "socialism", let there be another Cuban revolution that wipes away the rotting corpse of state capitalism.


If Cuba is such a shit country why has there been no attempts at a revolution or any conspiracies to overthrow the government since Castro came to power? And I know two people who've been there and said the citizens are extremely proud of Castro and his government. I think if it was so shit there would have been an uprising by now (like in Argentina, Guatemala etc. etc. basically the whole of South America in the 50's and Romania in '89)

Intifada
21st May 2005, 22:32
Cheers for the links Severian.

I have also heard about an incident known as the "13 de Marzo" Massacre. I was wondering if you could provide me with some information about this.


In the early morning hours of July 13, 1994 the tugboat "13 de Marzo" was attacked by agents of the Cuban government. They repeatedly rammed the tug, used high pressure water hoses on the victims, and sank the ship killing at least 41 men, women, and children seven miles off the coast of Havana, Cuba.

Nearly two years later on October 16, 1996 the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights concluded that the Cuban government was responsible for the deaths of the 41 people shipwrecked on the tug "13 de Marzo", the emotional trauma of the relatives of the victims and survivors who lost loved ones. The Commission also noted that the Cuban government had refused to recover the bodies or allow others to recover them for proper burial by their families.



Putting the "13 de Marzo" Into Context:

The sinking of the "13 de Marzo" was not the first nor sadly will it be the last incident of agents of the Cuban government brutally killing Cubans trying to flee the island. More than a year before the July 13 massacre the US filed a complaint reported on July 7, 1993 in the Miami Herald:

The attacks on swimmers in Guantanamo Bay drew especially sharp criticism because the refugees might easily have been detained without violence, U.S. officials said. "The idea of blowing people up when they are vulnerable underwater is appalling," Gelbard said. A State Department aide called the use of gaffs, usually used to pull gamefish into boats, to pull bodies from the water an act of extreme cruelty." [continue]

The Call of the International Committee to Demand Justice for the Victims of the "13 de Marzo" Massacre (http://www.fiu.edu/~fcf/justice.html)

Severian
22nd May 2005, 04:08
The other side of that incident: "The Cuban Government has maintained that the tugboat was old and dilapidated and that it sank when a Cuban patrol boat accidentally bumped it." link (http://www.granma.cu/miami5/ingles/007.htm) I don't really know any way to definitely resolve these conflicting versions.

Or to check the claims about swimmers near Guantanamo being shot, but if that one's based on Uncle Sam's unsupported word I'm not going to give it much more thought. That article also complains about Cuban forces shooting at boats entering its territorial waters from Florida; considering that such boats have been used to conduct terrorist attacks I got no sympathy for this complaint.

I do know that drownings and violent deaths are an inevitable - even deliberate - consequence of a U.S. government policy which seeks to encourage hijackings and rafting over legal immigration from Cuba. Any Cuban who sets foot on U.S. soil is granted automatic asylum under the 1962 Cuban Adjustment Act. In contrast, there's a waiting list to get visas from the U.S. diplomatic mission to migrate legally.

Cuba does not oppose emigration or maintain any kind of Berlin Wall-type policy, "building socialism is a task for free men and women" as Fidel once put it. Cuba does oppose having its boats and planes hijacked or stolen. OK, it does have some policy against, say, doctors emigrating immediately after getting their free education. But other than that, no.

Immediately after the "13 de Marzo" hijacking - in August of 1994 - the Cuban government said, OK, you want more Cubans, you can have all you want. And stopped trying to prevent illegal immigration by rafters. In less than a month, the U.S. Coast Guard picked up more than 30,000 rafters and imprisoned them on....the Guantanamo Bay naval base. There was already a prison camp for Haitian rafters there IIRC. Previously Cubans intercepted at sea had been taken to the U.S. and given residency.

By this means, Cuba succeeded in forcing the U.S. to sign an agreement to grant 20,000 visas for legal immigration every year. The U.S. also promised to return Cubans intercepted at sea. In return, Cuba agreed to stop rafters from leaving again.

In short, the U.S. government deliberately seeks to promote incidents like the 13 de Marzo, rather than legal migration, because it makes for good propaganda against the Cuban Revolution. "Look at all those people trying to flee tyranny, why doesn't Castro let 'em go, etc." But when the Cuban government does let anyone go, resulting in a raft flotilla, Uncle Sam demands Cuba stop 'em again. Threatens military action, even, since mass migrations are a threat to national security or something. It's a massively hypocritical Catch-22, Cuba's damned if they do and damned if they don't.

***

While searching for info on this incident, Google popped up This history of anarchism in Cuba. (http://www.ainfos.ca/04/feb/ainfos00387.html) While the author makes all kinds of dubious assertions about the Cuban revolution - including exaggerating the influence of the old Moscow-oriented party, inaccurately called the PCC when writing about a time when there was no party by that name. But there's no mention of thousands of anarchists executed. There is a claim of anarchist publications being shut down - a wrong action if true, which it may well be.

And a mention of anarchists who joined the armed counterrevolution being executed. The article mentions anarchists supporting two of the CIA-supported groups operating in the Escambray mountains, those headed by Pedro Celestino Sanchez and Francisco Robaina, aka "Machete" . These groups were notorious for their atrocities besides their U.S. connections, as detailed here. (http://www.granma.cu/cubademanda/ingles/demanda4-i.html)
The anarchist article lists four of these anarchist contras as executed.

Possibly failure to make any distinction between Batistianos and "anarchists and radical workers" is the cause of the "thousands executed" claim? In fact, thousands of Batistianos were executed for their crimes under the old regime, early in the revolution. There have been relatively few executions since.

It also mentions Cuban anarchists who chose to support the Revolution, one of whom reportedly said that most Cuban anarchists did so. Though the author of the article regards this as a lie, there's no evidence provided that would enable us to determine who's telling the truth.

Unfortunately the documents of Gaona and those Cuban anarchists who chose to support the Revolution do not seem to be available on the web.

Intifada
23rd May 2005, 18:39
Thank you very much indeed Severian!

:)