The danger of the USA

[Che1990]

Now I'm sure many people wonder why socialism (especially communism) has such a bad reputation. Well obviously it's because of the USA's anti-communist stance (they see it as a threat). But the question is, how do we convince people its not bad when the USA are the biggest superpower in the world?

[OleMarxco]

That, and the fuck-ups of the Soviet Union, of course...it has OVERRATINGLY been lauded as Communism's grand example, both negatively and positevely. It wasn't. And when you ask that question, I hope you are joking, because that's not something I'd like to convince them, rather the totally opposite. Why the fuck should we learn kids to be passive? They already think "It's a good thing" that U.S. is "teh big nation!11!", but we should enlighten them why it's NOT. I'm sure any sensible person whould agree....it's a power-misbalance in the hands of money-greedy imperialists :angry:

[workersunity]

The primary and by far most important issue regarding communism is education, we must do all we can to educate the proletarait

[bed_of_nails]

I dont think we can start the education in America.

The American school system teachers children that Communists are either purely evil, or stupid idealists.

We need to find a nation with more of a Tabula Rasa stance to begin education.

[encephalon]

I dont think we can start the education in America.

I agree with you and disagree at the same time.

For one, America is by far the most important place right now regarding communism and leftist movements in general. Why? Because the instant there's a revolution somewhere, even in the most obscure place, if the capitalists have the slightest interest in it they will attack.

Of course they will, you say. The situation, however, isn't the same as it was before. The US does have the power to defeat most (if not all) nations out there right now, militarily and economically (thanks to the IMF and World Bank). The are no "powers" left comparable to the united states, and the somewhat formidible powers that could conceivably help are by and large on the side of US capitalists. There is china, but they have a vested interest in the US--if the US economy fails miserably right now, so too does the chinese.

It is imperative that a greater movement be once again brought to strength (in numbers and otherwise) in the US. Then coalition can be built inside the US. If that doesn't happen, the world will be largely at the mercy of US capitalists--and they know it. Thus far, they've virtually killed every leftist movement here. That can't continue to happen.

Re-education is important in the US precisely because, currently, the working class in this country thinks that the capitalists are working in their best interest; either that, or that they (the working class) are the ruling class. They are highly reactionary, and frankly hostile towards anything they're told to hate. You won't be killing capitalists if (or when, really) the US goes on the offensive. You'll kill proletarians, brainwashed as they are, and the more you kill the more reactionary the working class will get, even though the US is attacking, not you ("you" not being any particular person or country). It's imperative that change come to the US.

[OleMarxco]

That may be true, but....Unfortunately, things are only good in the U.S. because the have it bad in Africa, f.eg. Therefore they think "we don't need revolution"....As for that, it's also the center of Imperialism and the reason revolution should start instead in ANOTHER country, that is less in the center of reactionary anti-Communism mindset and it is easier to agitate them into taking action. The father you come from America...the more "open-minded" people are to the thought of revolution and radical thoughts...That could be sociologically proven, I'm sure. Perhaps in the Thirld World, were people are more unhappy with Capitalism and more inclined to agree. Then when we suceed and their life standards are improved, it will be harder and harder for the biased media of U.S. to cover that up, and workers will, to the ruling class' irritation, realize the truth about the world :D

[Colombia]

My best idea is to support the Democratic party and their goals to better the workers not only in the US, but in other countrys as well. There are plenty of them who do care.

[bolshevik butcher]

Yeh but the democrats wouldn't cope with us saying things like workers of the wrold unite and otherthow the beuogoirse.

[Black Dagger]

My best idea is to support the Democratic party and their goals to better the workers not only in the US, but in other countrys as well. There are plenty of them who do care.

I hope you're being sarcastic...

[RedAnarchist]

So do i. Theres no difference between Democrats and Republicans in the US - the Democrats are just Diet Republican. Plus, they are a bourgoisie party, who submit fully to the capitalist system.

[bezdomni]

The democrats are generally just as opposed to us as the republicans are. They exploit the people who would otherwise be socialists to support the capitalist party. John Kerry is perhaps the biggest slap in the face to the workers who depend on the democratic party's watered-down capitalism to survive. The democrats have lost their way since Kennedy, FDR was the last true democrat.

These days, a republican will say "I propose we cut worker wages by 20%!" and the democrat will respond "THAT'S RIDICULOUS! 10%!" They just run a few nothces to the left of the republican party as a mass movement and keep a small tail in the true left wing.

I have spoken with many people who vote for the democratic party, however, their ideas are more aligned with the socialist party. Democrats are disillusioned about their own party. We either need to get these people more power in the democratic party and turn the democratic party back to the true leftist ideas that it used to have, or get these people out of the democratic party and into a large leftist bloc with similar basic aims. We can no longer sacrifice unity for small things that we disagree on, that is why we don't have the power right now and that is why the United States crushes socialism!

[Clarksist]

I have a love/hate relation with the Democratic Party. In many ways they are very socialist (which is the best you could hope for right now in America). I mean the broadening of welfare and the limits on inheritance and the raising of minimum wage is great. And the fact that they can compete with the Republican Party is good. But they suck from the same money trough as the Republicans, and thus they would never use the term socialism.

The best thing would be to infiltrate the Democratic Party because they already have a strong base, and many people who vote on party lines with Dems, instead of taking the left to a new party, all you would do is split the left vote.

And in America, the education on Communism is the following:
Karl Marx = Satan
Communism = Any oppressive country ever
Capitalism = Perfect
Sometimes you get a teacher who will say, "Communism is a great plan, you know if we lived in a perfect world." Or teachers who are complete idiots and say things like, "The government shouldn't be as big as Communists want it to be."

I hate America...

[Abstrakt]

Originally posted by [email protected] 15 2005, 04:16 PM
The democrats have lost their way since Kennedy, FDR was the last true democrat.


I thought Kennedy was a Republican. I feel like an idiot now :( But anyways, I'd have to disagree with FDR. He did nothing towards civil rights, woman's rights, and his propaganda put wool over the Depression. If you look at the numbers, Hoover basically kept the economy in the same position as FDR did.

I don't know if you checked out the specials on FDR lately, but they are very interesting...And revealing.

On topic though, all you can do is the best you can. Lead by example, and educate. "Teach one, reach one". Or maybe it's the other way around, but I believe you get the point.

[Black Dagger]

In many ways they are very socialist (which is the best you could hope for right now in America).

Well except for their pro-capitalist, anti-communist/socialist orientation, yeah.



I mean the broadening of welfare and the limits on inheritance and the raising of minimum wage is great.

'Great', and reformist.



...and thus they would never use the term socialism.

Because they're not socialists, i'm pretty sure they're aware of this.



The best thing would be to infiltrate the Democratic Party because they already have a strong base,

Holllllllllllllllllld on, the 'best thing' is to join reactionary, pro-capitalist political parties because they have a 'strong base'? Of course the actual nature of the party is irrelevant right? This is the revolutionary left forum, there's nothing 'revolutionary' about joining bourgeois political parties and trying to hopelessly 'reform' capitalism.



...and many people who vote on party lines with Dems.

And the 'party line' they're voting for is anti-revolutionary, pro-capitalist, anti-communist one, why should a member of the revolutionary left support such an organisation? We're supposed to be fighting against the capitalists and the reformists remember?


... instead of taking the left to a new party, all you would do is split the left vote

Well the 'leftist' parties of bourgeois democracy are irrelevant to a revolutionary. Who cares if bourgeois liberals and pro-capitalists vote for one centre-right pro-capitalist party or another? They're both anti-revolutionary and anti-communism.

[Konqwest]

Yeah I go to school in America and believe me all they do is make Communism look like it was the worst thing ever, and all they do is show you the negative side of everything. The American school system basically just tries to make everything that they dont do look wrong, and it pretty much sucks

[Super Mario Conspiracy]

Why not just vote on the Socialist Party of America?

[bed_of_nails]

Its like voting for the green party:

It doesnt matter in the end because you are overwhelmed by the other two parties.

[ZeroPain]

The American school system teachers children that Communists are either purely evil, or stupid idealists.

Only when they have no competition from you (Unless teacher is a jackass who in that case will fail you)

I havent read most of the other posts in this thread because they seem to be the same thing but still: Most youth in america are neutral and just need a push, of corse some are consumer whores and all but still atleast 1/2 the population if informed by their freinds can be affected for the better since they have no ideology other then weak sort of personal "first glance" feelings.