The World is a Mess - I am a cynic

[canikickit]

I think the world is just a complete load of crap.

There is going to be conflict in Northern Ireland and Palestine from now until forever. I think there will never be a solution found.
Never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never.......never, never, never, never.....until there is some sort of meltdown on the planet, like a new ice age, or nuclear war, or a meteor landing on earth.....something like that.

never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never.........and that valley in Chechnya (sp.?), that is going to be the same sort of scene as the North.....

Who else is a cynic?
Which of you believe in an essential goodness in people that will eventually win through?

never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never...........

[Pinko]

Good will never out as long as the world is full of petty minded ignorant shites. It is possible, that with two or three generations of good education and a leadership with principles that it sticks to, we could produce an egalitarian society that is understanding to its fellow man. But what are the odds of achieving that? especially in a democracy.
Nope, humanity is screwed. The selfish gene has too tight a grip on us.

(Edited by Pinko at 1:11 am on Aug. 30, 2002)

[canikickit]

Of course I realise that people will probably claim that my attitudes are a large part of the problem, but I can't help it.

(Edited by canikickit at 2:19 am on Aug. 30, 2002)

[Pinko]

Just because you believe that the world cannot change, it doesn't mean that you should stop trying.
If everyone in the world tried to change it, then it would change in the blink of an eye.
It takes a rare sort of person to struggle on in the face of utter adversity. To refuse to give up when all seems lost is what more people need to do. It may take forever, but one person can change the world. Get two people to join you and it will take half the time, get each of them to get two to join in and before you know it, you will have a snowball movement that sweeps the world free of corruption and lies.
Never allow dispondency to get ontop of you. It will destroy you if you do.

(Edited by Pinko at 2:37 am on Aug. 30, 2002)

[queen of diamonds]

Yeah, the nihilistic thing takes over me sometimes too...it's important not to give up on it. The more you believe that something can change, the more people around you will believe, and eventually it will change, significantly

[Revolution Hero]

The world of capitalism always have been the mess. So, you haven't told anything new.

Only COMMUNISM can save the world, and that is why we are leftists.

[Marxman]

The only solution is a world of communism, and its first step is the vital one. The first step is creating and completing a genuine socialist revolution. Why do you all look up to the future and think horrible things of it? Look up to the past, the history of humanity and you will learn everything. Look up to the October revolution in details, the only genuine socialist revolution. Read historic marxist books and you shall see the vision of the future.

[ovrproofmentalz]

as long as there is one evil doing person on earth we will never be happy..... we will let the solitary actions of this person ruin our lives, and in turn we become just like the people we are trying to get rid of...

[Hayduke]

The world is crap, but Im trying to clean it.
Every step is one.

[canikickit]

ha, ha, ha



From ovrproofmentalz

we will never be happy

I must mention that I am happy.
It's grand.
Although I do believe the world to be in pieces I don't really care that much. As long as I've got my music collection and a bit of this and a bit of that, it's all good. Nobody can stop me.

[Revolution Hero]

Many people cry that the world is a mess, but not many of those people really do something important , in order to change it.
Other people care only for their selfish interests , forgetting that they have once said that THE WORLD WAS A MESS.
Some people don't believe that the change is possible, while others do everything to change the world, so those who cried wouldn' t cry anymore.

[canikickit]

hmmmmm....this seems to be an attack on me...

I do think the world is a mess, but I think my needs are more important than the needs of many.

Well I don't neccessarily think they are actually more important, but when it all comes down to it they are, really. ah I don't know.
I do know that I don't care for the condesending tone you are taking.

[Angie]

Just stepping in here to add a new clarity to Canikickit's comments (and the "attack" upon them, which may or may not be one, depending on how you look at it), as I am attempting to understand them, and feel that I can, while I can see how they can be misunderstood. Just bear with me a moment.

We have to strike a balance within ourselves to be able to reach out to others. Frankly, to use colourful New Age terminology, we need to be a tree - you've got to have your roots dug deep into the metaphoric ground, and they provide you with particular things you'll desperately need: a sense of security, stability, strength, hope, etc. Hence Canikickit's comment about the music collection.

Sometimes those qualities come from a scattering of materialistic things, such as a music collection (or a computer with internet connection, hint hint!), and there's very little wrong with that - music is a brilliant stabiliser, and if it comes in the form of a CD collection, then so be it. We're all different, so what provides each of us with those qualities is dependent upon the individual, and could be as simple as the fact that they woken up in the morning. [Trust me, when you've been Suicidal, you learn quickely just what it means to wake up in the morning and be grateful you're still alive.]

We need things that provide us with a sense of strength and hope, so that we can keep fighting. A music collection is one thing, a BMW Convertible is another. [The latter is a waste of money, frankly, when there are much cheaper cars that are as good if not better. The former could be also a waste of money, if you were to be frivolous and spend all your money on music you only half wish to listen to. Use your heads, make wise, sensible choices with your brains, not your heart. Question the relevency of EVERYTHING; If you've taken a liking to the look of something, ask yourself if you really need it, or if it's going to give you anything more than a quick thrill. If the answer is no to either of those questions, do you SERIOUSLY have to have it?]

Essentially what it comes down to is that we cannot perform at our best if we haven't something to turn back to for strength, etc. It's not about selfish interests, it's about that metaphoric tree - the branches can reach out to the sky and look as lovely as we wish them to, but if the trunk's rotting away from lack of personal care, the tree's dying and nothing we do to the branches is going to change that.

While we're looking after others we must never forget to look after ourselves. That's not a selfish act if it's done effectively (ie. not in the spirit of a Capitalist, so it must be on a 'need' basis as opposed to a 'want' basis), it's giving us the strength to help others in ways that we would not have been able to do otherwise. Take away someone's right to gather strength from music, or whatever, and you literally leave them in a silence that will kill their spirit. We need the balance.

Apologies for the essay.

[Dhul Fiqar]

Why be a cynic when you can be a nihilist AND a cynic? :biggrin:

Seriously, it's all meaningless bullshit, and that's what makes the world so great!

--- G. Raven

[carlmarx]

i think that to many people are caught up in the imperealistic vision of making money. The death of capitalism would be the birth of a better world.

[marxistdisciple]

Sometimes it's so hard to keep hope, and I stay up all night worrying. Some mornings I wake up and think that I am on the side of the just, and as such I will eventually prevail....

The only problem in caring about people, is it is so easy for them to cut you down...when they don't care as much.... It's like someone said; (I can't remember who) 'You must always love with an open heart, because although it leaves you vunerable to hurt, you will never never love as truely if you protect your self from it.' It was something like that anyway.
So what I am trying to say is that giving yourself an open mind in all you can do will help you feel better about about things. I know how hard it is to stay sain though :) Don't cut yourself up about the world, it's not your fault and you are doing more than most people are to help, and that's a great start :) You still got plenty of years of achieving left, and lots of comrades! :)

[canikickit]

There's nothing to worry about. What's the worst that could happen?

[KickMcCann]

A very disturbed individual once told me:

" Every night I hope and pray that this planet will
be completely destroyed, this is so that all my
enemies will be killed"

Our human civilization has always had problems, it always will have problems, these is for the simple reason that we live in a connected society. If you look out your window, and you see the birds or squirrels, they do not have all the problems we have. This is not because they are inferior, they are not inferior - all life is equal, this is because they live without society; and with the exception of their families, they are completely alone and free. They don't worry about political systems or wars or genocide, they worry about feeding themselves and their offspring, finding a mate to create a family with, and to build a nice home. This is not a critisism of society or an advocacy for anarchism, society has it's pluses, security and stength in numbers. We humans have the disadvantage of not having the specific abilities of other animals; birds can fly, fish can swim, moles can burrow, some animals have built-in armor or weapons. We have none of these, alone we are very defenseless, but we have very capable minds, and with these minds we have built the complete infastructure of civilization. And this is what we created for our protection.
Everything in human civilization is created by humans. That includes the good things and the bad. We are one with our enemies, we are one with our allies, no matter how much dislike or aversion we have for others, we are all linked together, we are all one.
The reason for all the ranting and raving is for this idea; we are all part of the problem, we are all part of the solution. All the problems in our world have been created by our society, and all the problems in our society can be solved by us. No matter how miniscule, no matter how daunting, all of our problems can be solved.

[Revolution Hero]

Quote: from canikickit on 11:54 am on Sep. 1, 2002
hmmmmm....this seems to be an attack on me...

I do think the world is a mess, but I think my needs are more important than the needs of many.

Well I don't neccessarily think they are actually more important, but when it all comes down to it they are, really. ah I don't know.
I do know that I don't care for the condesending tone you are taking.


It wasn't an attack, but it was a critic. If you think that critic is an attack, then I am sorry for you.
That's OK with me that you don't even care about my words, but it is YOUR problem , not mine. Besides, you have proved that my thoughts about you are correct. Thank you.....

[canikickit]

yeah right

[mentalbunny]

As I have said earlier today in a differnet thread, well said angie. I do believe we are on pretty much the same wavelength. I would also like to say that i don't think "communism" is the answer, look at the devastating effects it can have in the world, although I don't disagree with the principles I for one would not be happy to live in that kind of civilisation.

I'm, a teenager so I experiance a fair bit of teenage nihilism which is kinda different form the real thng, but not much. I have been pretty down, I agree the world is a mess and it will be bloody difficult to turn it around, but there is this asteroid or something heading for the Earth in 17 years or whatever, maybe that will have an effect, I can only hope....

The real way for the world to change (in my opinion, at least) is for everyone to stop being selfish. If you end up earning alot of money by providing a service that consumers pay for, it's ok as long as you only keep the money you need. I can accept internet access as a "need", music, food, a warm house in winter and a cool-ish house in summer, clothes, education are needs that can be payed for, but Rolls Royces and designer labels just aren't essential and the money that buys them would be better used for medicine in a third world country. I hope you agree with me.

[marxistdisciple]

I wrotre this awhile back, I kow it's really depressing, but's that's kind of me at times;


Apocalypse

Insignificant

Puny

Inter-stellar cannon fodder

Earth trembles

And explodes

Into particles
Pieces of rock
Scattered

Into universal nothingness

I await the apocalypse
Sometimes longing, urging
For the slow but painful

Inevitability

I lust for it
Not today, or tomorrow

All of mankind
Will be punished

I hope we have time to repent.

And strangely
All I feel
Is righteous

[canikickit]

marxist disciple, this is a good reply.

Not the dogmatic criticisms.
Nice one. It might be depressing, but hey...

[Revolution Hero]

Criticism can't be dogmatic. LOL

[canikickit]

Laugh out loud all you want.
Criticism can be dogmatic. You obviously are confused about the meaning of certain words. (http://www.m-w.com/home.htm)

[Revolution Hero]

You are very ignorant.

Criticism is always something new, it is not a dead dogma. Also, criticism is always progressive, it changes everything.

[canikickit]

It is you who is ignorant. Dogma is not neccessarily dead.
And change is not always good, and criticism is not always progressive.

You speak in extremes, but you need to check yourself.

[marxistdisciple]

I understand depression, and lack of hope better than most people do after 25 pills and sharp knives....but from the other side of it, it isn't helpful. For a long time I thought it was me - that I was depressed, just because, that I had this problem, I was insane, everyone else was happy as normality. I don't know if anyone else has noticed, a sort of sickening alienation you get from people when you feel that way. I have taken all the usual zombie drugs (prozac, soma etc.)
And now I just think now I feel that I feel alienated and depressed because of how confusing and out of whack the world is. I wrote this in a darker moment, but it shows my feelings for humanity's greed and selfishness. We may or may not be that way naturally, but I still detest it. I would feel much better sometimes if mankind was punished for our sins to this planet. Other times, I think, at least there's hope. At least some people care, even if most people really, and never will, get it.

[KickMcCann]

Marxistdisciple,

You seem to need some hope, well just look to yourself and others like you; you want change for the better and so do many other people. You should feel good about wanting change and working towards change, more will be acomplished by doing something, and nothing will ever change if you do nothing. And the amount that you do accomplish, regardless of it being large or small, moves our world that much closer to a better existence. And that is something to feel good about. The world will not change in one day, but it will happen alot quicker if you work towards it.

[marxistdisciple]

Thanks KMC.....you are probably right, but isn't the first step getting people to listen to you? The only way I seem to be able to is by writing. How do you ever get a stubborn person to change his/her mind? I wil try to work as hard as I can....for my whole life. I once thought about shooting myself on the whitehouse lawn as a martyr, then realised I had to have an established following to be a movement after my death......It's just hard to get people to care, or listen.

[mentalbunny]

Quote: from marxistdisciple on 2:23 am on Sep. 8, 2002
I understand depression, and lack of hope better than most people do after 25 pills and sharp knives....but from the other side of it, it isn't helpful. For a long time I thought it was me - that I was depressed, just because, that I had this problem, I was insane, everyone else was happy as normality. I don't know if anyone else has noticed, a sort of sickening alienation you get from people when you feel that way. I have taken all the usual zombie drugs (prozac, soma etc.)
And now I just think now I feel that I feel alienated and depressed because of how confusing and out of whack the world is. I wrote this in a darker moment, but it shows my feelings for humanity's greed and selfishness. We may or may not be that way naturally, but I still detest it. I would feel much better sometimes if mankind was punished for our sins to this planet. Other times, I think, at least there's hope. At least some people care, even if most people really, and never will, get it.


There are loads of teenagers on anti-depressants at my school, although some have left, amoung these my colsest friend, another friend and my ex boy, formally best mate of my closest friend. It's a sign of the times, the world is fucked up, no one will fix it, you just gotta do the best for yuorself and help the world as much as you can.