2pac

[Redmau5]

What do people here think of 2pac and his music ?

[Hampton]

Both are fabolous and often misunderstood.

[Eastside Revolt]

I love talking to dumb white yankees about 2pac. It always forces them to take the condition of africans in america into context.

I had a recent conversation with this kid from Arizona, and after a long while I managed to get him to admit the positives of 2pac's influence on black youth. This, after he was spouting on and on about how I couldn't possibly understand how dangerous black americans are.

[bunk]

I think he was just a thug to make him popular and then he also did social issues. I think his music is way overrated. None of his music is better than Illmatic, enter the wu tang ... 36 chambers, Ready to die, Only built 4 Cuban Linx, and Lifestylez ov da poor and dangerous..
I think he had just as bad an influence as a good one.

[Motorcycle_diAries]

I ain't really into Hip Hop and rap stuff. But coming to 2 pac, i think his lyrics are cool.

[Spartacus2002]

i love tupac, he's so damn real, i dont agree with everything that he ever said or did but i understand where he's coming from..

[Redmau5]

THUG LIFE is equal if not better than illmatic. I know the West is somewhat silent now but in the early-to-mid 90's the West coast ruled over the East. Don't get me wrong, i like Nas but he isn't as connected to the streets as 2pac was.

[RedLenin]

2 Pac is probably my favorite rapper. Songs like "revolution", "I just dont give a fuck", "changes", "if i die tonight", etc. are just incredible. He really had some deep lyrics about life in an oppressed class, social issues, and death. Some of my all time favorite music.

[robob8706]

While he did rap about black oppression he still also rapped like all the others. I don't have any respect for someone who devotes a whole song to raping Biggie's wife.

[Invader Zim]

I think that RAp is auful tuneless noise, and 2pac is no exception.

But then again, I imagine that most people would think a lot of my music is tuneless noise...

[Hampton]

I don't have any respect for someone who devotes a whole song to raping Biggie's wife.

It wasn't about raping his wife, the gimmick was that he allegedly had relations with Faith when she and Biggie had a falling out. It was extra insult to have her on one of his songs on All Eyez on Me singing about how tough Death Row was. Hit em Up is still one of the nastiest songs as far as rap beefs go, I mean it was not this lyrical masterpiece but the first line is a killer.

"That's why I fucked your ***** you fat motherfucker"

Ouch.

[robob8706]

Still no respect.

[Aurora(inactive)]

I love Tupac.

Not only did he rap about sex (which I'm a fan of!)
but he rapped about social issues in his community and real stuff...not just getting booty and money like today's rappers.

[bunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2005, 09:49 PM
THUG LIFE is equal if not better than illmatic. I know the West is somewhat silent now but in the early-to-mid 90's the West coast ruled over the East. Don't get me wrong, i like Nas but he isn't as connected to the streets as 2pac was.
What no way, listen again. I'm talking quality of music not how connected to the streets they are. Nas was still in the project with Illmatic.
Ever listened to live at the BBQ?
Tupac has no better than Illmatic or any of the albums i mentioned. You picked one of his worst albums also. 2Pacalypse now is 2pac 's height of lyrical skill from the on it was all about his image.

[Black Dagger]

I like socially/class/race-conscious tupac A LOT, i hate homophobic/sexist/anti-semetic tupac A LOT, which seems to be a running theme for a lot of early 90's rappers from the west-coast, which is unfortunate, cut the prejudiced crap out of your lyrics and they'd be a great tool to radicalise black youth in the US (and beyond).

[seraphim]

He was a fake sellout pawn in Suge Knights game. Don't like his music or his attitude. His lyrics were ok, read substandard and as for him as a person don't get me started. Yes he may have empowered some black youth's, but any more than, Public Enemy, 2 Live Crew, N.W.A, uh................ No. I could name 20 rap artist and groups better than the late fake one.

[Redmau5]

Fake ? How the fuck was he fake ?

[Cokane]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2005, 09:49 PM
THUG LIFE is equal if not better than illmatic. I know the West is somewhat silent now but in the early-to-mid 90's the West coast ruled over the East. Don't get me wrong, i like Nas but he isn't as connected to the streets as 2pac was.
While I consider Thug Life to be a great album and a great listen, I consider Illmatic to be better, and as far as the West ruling over the East goes, what about Biggie, Nas, Wu-Tang, Mobb Deep and others who were out at the time? Might not have sold as much, but certainly not 'ruled over'. And for these guys who think he raped Biggies wife, who even are ye? Go away with all that negative shit, we hear it too often about 2pac and thats a part of his legacy that has been focused on far too much, nobody's perfect.

And Nas not being as connected to the streets? After Illmatic dropped NY was going crazy, it must be one of the most bootlegged rap albums ever, NY loved him, even though the West did not.

And that 'Fake' comment, who are ye anyway? Get your own avatar you punk, that one's h&s'

[Palmares]

Nas was (not anymore) as much connected to the streets as Tupac was. Illmatic, as has been mentioned, was a masterpiece of the experiences he went through growing up in "the hood".

Unsurprisingly though, both went to the shit once the money came rolling in. That isn't to say they weren't still lyrical able, etc, but the message became questionable. Only glimpses of what they were remained.

Hampton, that is one of the fucking most harshest, and impressive diss verses I've ever heard!

[seraphim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 20 2005, 03:55 PM
Fake ? How the fuck was he fake ?
Because he was created by Suge Knight his image everything was manufactured to sell records he's no better than the winner of pop idol. Some people might not agree it's just my personal opinion.

[Hampton]

Yes he may have empowered some black youth's, but any more than, Public Enemy, 2 Live Crew, N.W.A,

2 Live Crew empowered black youth? With some asses on an album cover?

Pac's image was around before he met Suge Knight, look at 94 when he got shot and when he was in jail. Even before when he released his first two albums, possibly his most political when looked at his later music. Watch the documentary and see how much of a connection that he had with the countries youth, n o one has been able to do that, and that is partly because of his roots and becuase of his actions, shooting two cops, and music.

[Cokane]

Exactly Hampton, 2pac was around for years before Suge Knight came into the equation, so he was hardly manufactured!

[Redmau5]

What you expect ? It was seraphim who called him a fake, and he thinks any one that fights imperialist rule is a terrorist.

:ph34r:

[Cokane]

lol very true, he's introduced his head to his arse alright.

[bunk]

His image was somewhat fake. I don't really care how real he is just that his music is generally overated.

[RABBIT - THE - CUBAN - MILITANT]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 19 2005, 08:00 AM
I think he was just a thug to make him popular and then he also did social issues. I think his music is way overrated. None of his music is better than Illmatic, enter the wu tang ... 36 chambers, Ready to die, Only built 4 Cuban Linx, and Lifestylez ov da poor and dangerous..
I think he had just as bad an influence as a good one.
u cant compar tupac to Nas or the WU .. first of all thier to differ genras of music one rap one hip hop and they have complety differnt styles .. lyrical content are even remotly the same

[bunk]

There not different genres. They are always compared.
Music in hip hop is rap. The rest of hip hop is the five elements. You could call Tupac Hip hop.
If your in the same genre Lyrical content doesn't have to be the same????

:blink:

[seraphim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2005, 04:10 PM
What you expect ? It was seraphim who called him a fake, and he thinks any one that fights imperialist rule is a terrorist.

:ph34r:
No I believe anyone who kills innocent civilians is a terrorist, including occupying forces I make no distinction

[seraphim]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 21 2005, 06:50 PM
His image was somewhat fake. I don't really care how real he is just that his music is generally overated.
Exactly massively overrated.

[Cokane]

Maybe one day I might think the same, but i doubt it very much, I just can't agree with someone who thought that Roland the Rat shit was actually funny (sorry, hysterical) - Thats what I call massively overrated.

[seraphim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2005, 09:52 AM
Maybe one day I might think the same, but i doubt it very much, I just can't agree with someone who thought that Roland the Rat shit was actually funny (sorry, hysterical) - Thats what I call massively overrated.
Alright fair enough maybe it wasn't that funny, but Tu-pac is in my opinion over rated some of his music is OK but the theatre that comes with it :rolleyes:

[Redmau5]

His name isn't Tu-pac, it's Tupac. How would you like if i spelt your name Id-iot instead of Idiot ?

Sort your life out.

[bunk]

You fuKKKing idiot. No 1 care$ if someone mispelz aprt frum you.

[dreams are free mofo]

his lyrics were good but I've always been annoyed at how too many people have touted him as some revolutionary warrior. A lot of rappers do the whole slice-of-life bit where they talk about sex, life on the streets, problems with cops, or whatever. Seems like his getting killed elevated him to some messianic status he never deserved.

[AnFaRes]

generally i dont like hip hop but tupac is an exception...especially his new album...loyal to the game...good music,good lyrics!

[bunk]

loyal to the game sucks, you could at least choose one of his better albums. With beats not by Eminem??

[OleMarxco]

(If you present it in a really (being a) "conspiracy"-theory FOR FACT, then why do you conclude with it being "only your personal opinion, Seraphim?)

Perhaps we should move this to "Religion" now, considering how 2pac are now gettin' credibility to be sort of a long-dead "cult of personality", yes, among most african-american youth? ;)

[Redmau5]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 23 2005, 02:46 PM
You fuKKKing idiot. No 1 care$ if someone mispelz aprt frum you.
I dont care if he mispells it, it just demonstrates blatant ignorance.

Oh and Josh, do you wipe seraphim's ass for him as well ?

You prick.

[bunk]

Your such a fucking idiot, get out of this thread fucker. Your the only arrogant twat here.

[Redmau5]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 24 2005, 05:23 PM
get out of this thread fucker.
:lol:

Is someone annoyed ? You gonna make me leave this thread ? You're pretty pathetic, throwin' around your idle threats.

Get a life you loser.

[bunk]

You started it, only your insults seem to be taken from the position that you think you're better than me? We're all equal here.

[Redmau5]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 23 2005, 02:46 PM
You fuKKKing idiot. No 1 care$ if someone mispelz aprt frum you.
I started it ? You took it upon yourself to defend seraphim and you did it by calling me an "idiot". So i don't see how i started it.

And no i don't think im better than you, or seraphim, or anyone else on this board. I don't know where you got that notion from.

[bunk]

keep it coming...... :D what an idiot...

[Redmau5]

You love that word don't you. Maybe it's all you see when you look in the mirror. :P

[bunk]

when i look in the mirror i'm happy that i'm not an arrogant elitist bastard like you

[RABBIT - THE - CUBAN - MILITANT]

u both are being idiots ... and josh rap as a form of music evolved out of hip hop and kept on evolving through the years until it became a completely different genre of music .. like metal compared to rock

[bunk]

no you're wrong. Hip hop isn't a genre of music. Rap is the music in hip hop it's just sometimes called hip hop.

[Cokane]

''get out of this thread'' like? lol cyber hard man.

[bunk]

who has said that. What you tring to say. what you edit. I can't help it if you want to be an internet gangster...

[Cokane]

No no no, what are YOU trying to say? because that was the grammer of a 5 year old.

[bunk]

T 34? What you on. What you talk. Why you blaaa

[Redmau5]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 28 2005, 05:58 PM
who has said that. What you tring to say. what you edit. I can't help it if you want to be an internet gangster...
Internet gangster ? It was you that made the pathetic "get out of this thread" threat.

Making fake threats which you can't possibly back up. Cokane was right, you are a cyber hard man. But that's it.

[bunk]

Cokane or T 34? Makaveli and cokane?

[Redmau5]

What the fuck are you talking about ?

With your incoherent bullshit, any chance of saying something with a bit of substance ?

You prick.

[Cokane]

I can assure you I am an individual lol, its just that I disagree with you're opinions on 2pac being over-rated, however i do agree that illmatic is untouchable at the top of the albums list along with Raekwon's only built for Cuban linx etc, but over-rated - NO.

[bunk]

When Tupac is portrayed as the best ever by mass culture only matched by Eminem :o i would say he was overated similar to Eminem. Especially when he has no classic albums..

[Redmau5]

All eyez on me.

[bunk]

Loads of filler, a pretty boring album. Forever and Life after death are much better

[Redmau5]

Boring ? Well that's would i would expect from a bore like you.

[RABBIT - THE - CUBAN - MILITANT]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 25 2005, 10:19 AM
no you're wrong. Hip hop isn't a genre of music. Rap is the music in hip hop it's just sometimes called hip hop.
obviously hip hop artistes rap ... but Rap music is different form hip hop …what Mos Def dose is completely different form what 50 cent dose because they are performing different styles of music .....



EMINEM SUCKSSSS......

[bunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29 2005, 03:42 PM
Boring ? Well that's would i would expect from a bore like you.
Can't think of any good albums Tupac's made? :D You must be regretting making your username after a mass media hyped up rapper...

[Redmau5]

Nope i don&#39;t. I bet you wish your ma never named you Josh. Such a name like. <_<

And your avatar ? What the fuck is it ?

[bunk]

Such a name like?

My avatar is of the greatest game ever made, Shenmue.
PS2 kiddies don&#39;t know about it usually.. :rolleyes:

[Redmau5]

Na sorry i&#39;ve never heard of it, im not that sad.

[bunk]

Whats sad about it? I&#39;m not suprised you&#39;ve never heard of it. It&#39;s not mainstream stuff like Tupac

[Redmau5]

Even if i had heard of it i wouldn&#39;t be sad enough to make it my avatar. Games can be good but not that good, unless you have no life and games are the only thing you can turn to :lol:

[Hampton]

Stop and get back to a discussion about Tupac or I will have to close this thread.

[bunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29 2005, 03:42 PM
Boring ? Well that&#39;s would i would expect from a bore like you.
hate people who ride on Pac&#39;s dick as much as u do, the only way you&#39;re going to believe it is to keep repeating "PAC WAS THE GREATEST RAPPER ALIVE&#33;&#33;" I for

[Redmau5]

Apologies Hampton, Josh just seemed a bit obsessed with trailing this thread completely off topic and turning it into a slanging match. Josh I accept that you don&#39;t like 2pac but there&#39;s no need to go into a hissy-fit because i like him.

[bunk]

I think you started it.. It&#39;s nice that you can apologise for yourself though just a shame you have to hide behind someone else.

[Redmau5]

I don&#39;t see how im hiding behind someone else, but then again i don&#39;t understand much of what you say.

[Palmares]

Hampton meant it when he said stop.

[bunk]

2pac has no album anywhere close to Ready to die.

[Redmau5]

Well that&#39;s your opinion and i disagree with it. But to call him fake was a bit extreme.

[Anti-establishment]

Thug Life pisses all over Ready to die. Both great albums tho.

[bunk]

what? another fanboy?

Thug life is rubbish compared to Ready to die, Cuban Linx, 36 chambers, Reasonable doubt, Illmatic, lifestylez ov da poor and dangerous, capitol punishment, and low end theory..

[Anti-establishment]

Well i didnt compare it to illmatic or cuban linx did I, but it is better than ready to die.

[Hampton]

I wouldn&#39;t compare Thug Life with Ready to Die because arguably that was Biggie&#39;s best album while most people who name Me Against the World or the 7 Day Theory as Tupacs best. Thug Life was more of a project and not just Tupac alone but the Outlawz, Mopreme Shakur and others like Rated-R and Macadoshis. Akin to it is Biggie if he did a album with himself, Junior Mafia and some other New York rappers.

I would say that Me Aginst the World is just as good or as better than Cuban Linx, 36 Chambers, anything by Jay Z, Illmatic, or anything else.

[bunk]

Technically me against the world is poor in relation to those albums i listed. Some of you may prefer it because of whatever consciousness he decided to put into that while still talking about being a thug.

[Redmau5]

There is nothing "technical" about it. Me Against The World is a quality album. However good Ready 2 die maybe, Biggie doesn&#39;t match up to 2pac lyrically in most cases.

[Hampton]

Technically Cuban Linx is 36 Chambers without the rest of the Wu with RZA&#39;s cookie cutter beats and Reasonable Doubt, Illmatic, and Capital Punishment are possibly are the only 5 star albums out of those artists. But this is getting ridiclious to where it seems like this is Sophie&#39;s choice and you have to choose which hip hop albums are "the best", they all have their merit and it is spliting hairs to pick this elitiest list of 5-10 of the best albums when their are probally hundreds of classics to choose from.

[bunk]

cookie cutter beats?

[bunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 07:56 PM
There is nothing "technical" about it. Me Against The World is a quality album. However good Ready 2 die maybe, Biggie doesn&#39;t match up to 2pac lyrically in most cases.

Biggie is known as a much better lyricist than 2pac. 2pac is usually only known for his emotion. Tupac copied his whole style from Scarface.

[Anti-establishment]

If he copied his whole style from Scarface then surely he would be known for his amazing lyrics, Scarface is known to be a class lyricist.

[bunk]

Er no Scarface is known for his emotion and voice which Tupac copied and is the biggest thing 2pac had gooing for him.

[Hampton]

First I don&#39;t see the influence of Scarface on Tupac and secondly it should not be seen as something that is a bad thing. All rappers take something from those that came before them, it could be Biggie, Jay Z or Nas all have taken wordplay, emotion, or style from other rappers and developed it into their own.

[Anti-establishment]

Err no, Scarface is known to be a master lyricist.

[Big Boss]

Tupac was one of the best Hip-Hop artists in history if not the best. It was sad how he died at such a young age though and the reason upsets me even more.

[bunk]

More riders.

[bunk]

Originally posted by Anti&#045;[email protected] 3 2005, 08:52 PM
Err no, Scarface is known to be a master lyricist.
wrong

[4514]

hehehe this is best funniest tread ive ever read, its like the whole east/west coast battle all over again.sweet.
4514,
rank and file
oh and im a tupac fan.thuglife.

[bunk]

&#39;Fuck that east to west crap, it&#39;s no where you&#39;re from, it&#39;s where your at&#39;
Big Punisher

[Redmau5]

Originally posted by Josh of [email protected] 4 2005, 06:39 AM
More riders.
Seems you can&#39;t like anyone these days without being accused of that. If i didn&#39;t think he was good why would i "ride" so much ?

Face it. People like 2pac, so get over it.

[bunk]

I&#39;m fine with it i just like annoying you.

[Redmau5]

:D I don&#39;t get annoyed

[bunk]

why did you reply then? And engage in a debate?

[Redmau5]

Hmmmmm let me think. Perhaps because i started the thread ?

There is also the fact that this is a site for debate. And finally, i enjoy debating, which is why i registered on Revolutionary Left.

I dunno about you, but i don&#39;t get wound up by other people on the internet.

[bunk]

just don&#39;t bend over

[Anti-establishment]

Originally posted by Josh of Heavens+May 4 2005, 06:40 AM--> (Josh of Heavens @ May 4 2005, 06:40 AM)
Anti&#045;[email protected] 3 2005, 08:52 PM
Err no, Scarface is known to be a master lyricist.
wrong [/b]
like to explain how, instead of stickin to stupid points like a fundamentalist.