Cuba is falling???? - Journals and magazines

[Maaja]

For 2 weeks there have been a lot of articles in Estonian press about the end of Fidel's time in Cuba, about the new 'democratic revolution' which will come from Cuban exilers in USA etc. I would like to know are there also same kind of articles in other countries or is the only reason that our ex-prime minister Mart Laar went some weeks ago to a conference of Cuban exilers and promised 'to help them to get free from the evil communist by sharing with them the Estonian experience'.

[Marxman]

Look. Cuba is not and was never a communist country. Never, nor were other countries. Cuba is a typical Stalinist country with a bueracratic elite with Castro at its throne. Cuba's revolution that freed the people from the clutches of that Batista was a revolution, but not a socialist one. I don't know where did they get the idea that Cuba had a socialist revolution. The only thing that's communistic about Cuba is planned economy, which is unfortunately planned by the bueracracy. Cuba is a STALINIST country from the start. The proletariat or the peasantry had no role in the Cuban revolution, only some guerilla fighters and that is a pure coup d'etat thus makes a Cuban revolution nothing more than October revolution at an end, where Stalinism started to morph. And this topic says that Cuba is falling. Well, I am not at least surprised, I am only surprised that it hasn't fallen earlier. Subsequent event of Cuba will be the fall of it, but not the fall of communism, but the fall of Stalinism. Soon N. Korea and China will dissolve into chaos and that is exactly what will be in Cuba, unless there is a world-wide socialist revolution. But let me tell you something evem more horrible, the misery and despair that's thriving in Russia is a result of a capitalist restoration and that will be the same shit in Cuba. So, the role of the Cuban people is not to be mislead by the evil USA to have capitalism there because then people of Cuba will never see a plate of food on their table ever. From a marxist point of view, if a Stalinist falling country accepts the restoration of capitalism, the results are evident in Russia in practice. Please, Cuban people, start a Socialist revolution! Know the role of the proletariat!

[PunkRawker677]

I dont know where the hell you came from Marxman, but that was one of the best damn posts i have ever read regarding cuba's present and future political status.

[Maaja]

Quote: from Marxman on 10:07 pm on Aug. 10, 2002
Look. Cuba is not and was never a communist country. Never, nor were other countries. Cuba is a typical Stalinist country with a bueracratic elite with Castro at its throne. Cuba's revolution that freed the people from the clutches of that Batista was a revolution, but not a socialist one. I don't know where did they get the idea that Cuba had a socialist revolution. The only thing that's communistic about Cuba is planned economy, which is unfortunately planned by the bueracracy. Cuba is a STALINIST country from the start. The proletariat or the peasantry had no role in the Cuban revolution, only some guerilla fighters and that is a pure coup d'etat thus makes a Cuban revolution nothing more than October revolution at an end, where Stalinism started to morph. And this topic says that Cuba is falling. Well, I am not at least surprised, I am only surprised that it hasn't fallen earlier. Subsequent event of Cuba will be the fall of it, but not the fall of communism, but the fall of Stalinism. Soon N. Korea and China will dissolve into chaos and that is exactly what will be in Cuba, unless there is a world-wide socialist revolution. But let me tell you something evem more horrible, the misery and despair that's thriving in Russia is a result of a capitalist restoration and that will be the same shit in Cuba. So, the role of the Cuban people is not to be mislead by the evil USA to have capitalism there because then people of Cuba will never see a plate of food on their table ever. From a marxist point of view, if a Stalinist falling country accepts the restoration of capitalism, the results are evident in Russia in practice. Please, Cuban people, start a Socialist revolution! Know the role of the proletariat!


I didn't call Cuba a communist country. I just quoted that what our ex-prime minister said. I don't support Castro's regime in Cuba but I am quite sure that the exilers don't want to start 'a socialist revolution', probabaly after 'their revolution' USA will take as soon as it can advantage of everything that Cuba has. And there will always be no freedom.

[Marxman]

Thank you Maaja.

USA government has already a plan for the capitalist restoration in Cuba. The results will lack of humanity, the results will be MAFIA, drugs, crime, alcoholness, poverty, hunger and so on. But one way or another, Cuba has two options: to start a genuine socialist revolution or to fall under the clutches of the USA. Which one is better, I think you all know now. And the future regarding Castro's clique is a sudden change of politics. Trust me, even Castro will suddenly become pro-American. The same transformation happened in my country Slovenia too, all of a sudden the Yugoslavia (Stalinism) had fallen and all of a sudden the Slovenian politicians who were once waving around red flags accepted capitalism and even embraced it. The same thing will happen in Cuba. The crisis for Cuba's isolation are evident more and more and the people have a right to be tired of those Stalinist crises. Now they seek other politics, now they seek the chance to get out of the crisis and USA is offering them the "ticket out of the crisis." But little do they know, USA only wants to denationalise Cuba and provatise everything. Cuban citizens must resist the expansion of imperialism because USA's invasion of Cuba might strengthen the world capitalism! Cuban people, make a socialist revolution. Know the role of the proletariat!

[Borincano]

Nothing I hate more the Cuban-exile bourgeoisie. They infest Puerto Rico with their right-wing politics, and radicalism. Their political assassinations and monopolies. I want the best for my sister nation, Cuba, but the only way that Puerto Rico could start it's own path towards independence and socialism is to have the Cuban-exiles leave. They only way they would leave, is to go back to Cuba and conquer again. "One's mans loss is another mans gain." :biggrin:

[antieverything]

The problem with Cuba is that anything that causes instability (a real socialist revolution, a regime change) would be bad news as the US would jump on the chance to get in control there. For now, Castro being in charge is probably best for the people.

[Valkyrie]

Maaja, it's probably because his birthday is on Tuesday and he will be 76 years old. They are anticipating his death, like they've done for the last 42 years.

[Sherief]

Indeed, how many US presidents has he outlasted? He seems to be quite the thorn in the US's side, regardless of his actions in his country.

[Conghaileach]

He's outlasted eight or nine US presidents.

There's been..
Kennedy
Johnson
Nixon
Carter
Reagan
Bush
Clinton
Bush II

Who am I missing?

[Conghaileach]

Actually, it's probably wrong there that I mention him as outlasting Dubya, seeing as he's still hijacking the oval office.

[Borincano]

CiaranB ,

You forgot Eisenhower. Fidel's revolution ended on January 1st, 1959. Eisenhower was still in power until January 20th (I think that's the date,) 1961 when Kennedy was sworn in.

[Conghaileach]

Oh well, I was close anyway.

I actually find it a little scary that I know more about US presidents than I do about Irish ones. Of course, Irish uachtarán's are basically little more than figureheads whereas US ones can dictate world policy.

[j]

Anyone know what Castro's plan for exchanging power is? I mean, the guy is 76 years old, he must have a plan.

While Castro is not the same as Stalin, I do think that Cuba is better with him then they were under Batista. I agree with Marxman's statement about the Cuban Revolution not being a Socialist revolution. Even Castro denied communist ties until all power was seized. Many people who fought in the revolution were capitalists or promoters of a capitalist/socialist mix.

j

[mujer revolucionaria]

Talk in the grapevine is that Fidel's younger brother Raul will take his place after his death. There are also a number of people in high positions in the Cuban government who have been named as possibilities.

Castro's first mention of a "socialist" revolution and being a "Marxist/Leninist" was in a speech on April 16th, 1961 after raids on Cuban airfields by US backed bombers. It was also a call to arms for the people to stand strong against US Imperialist threat. (The invasion at Playa Giron/Bay of Pigs happened the next day) This is a wonderful speech, and can be found in many books and sources.

Castro was not a communist in his University years. He was a member of the Orthodox Party, until not long after the death of Eduardo Chibas. He ran for congress under the Orthodox banner, and then obviously the elections were never held due to the Batista cout d'etat.

Also, to claim that the peasants had no part in the Cuban revolution is a gross error. If it weren't for the peasants and the July 26th underground movement, the revolution would never have suceeded. The rural population benefitted the most from the revolution as well.

Also, it is interesting that in Cuba the revolution is not considered a period in history that ended on Jan 1, 1959 but an ongoing struggle that still exists today.

[Conghaileach]

You only talk about a revolution in the past tense if it failed, mujer revolucionaria. The Cuban Revolution fights on.

[mujer revolucionaria]

isnt that what I said?

If it isnt, it is surely what I meant......

[Conghaileach]

Sorry, I was just elaborating a little on what you said.

[mujer revolucionaria]

oh okay :)

Sometimes I am not the most eloquent at getting my thoughts out......haha

Peace

[perception]

I wouldn't call Cuba a communist state, but I wouldn't equate it with Stalinism. As far as 20th century communist revolutions, I'd say it has fared the best and accomplished the most. I'd give Castro bout 10 more years before he croaks tho.

[vodun]

Quote: from Sherief on 8:32 pm on Aug. 12, 2002
Indeed, how many US presidents has he outlasted?
Like all dictators, Castro doesn't have to bother with elections. "Outlasting" a democratically elected leader is no admirable feat. Except maybe to you smart folks.

[Mazdak]

Shut up you Cappie slug. You shouldn even be posting in here.

Fidel is a great leader, and if only he could have stopped the exiles from cmonignto America, his country would have been better off.

[vodun]

Quote: from Mazdak on 8:56 pm on Aug. 16, 2002
Shut up you Cappie slug. You shouldn even be posting in here.

Fidel is a great leader, and if only he could have stopped the exiles from cmonignto America, his country would have been better off.Idiots like you would be fuming if a "capitalist" leader did not allow elections, but it's not so important when a "revolutionary" asshole takes the helm. He stands against freedom - freedom of the press, freedom of speech (unless favorable to him), and freedom for the people to ELECT their leader. Deal with it.

[Mazdak]

Hey dumabss. I am anti freedom of speech to. I see no problem with it.

[Nateddi]

vodun,

you have a legitimate argument, i understand your point. the reason why many are fed up about right-wing dictators not allowing freedoms and being moreover complete tyrants is exactly for the reason that they are always supported by the US in the name of freedom, fighting communism, keeping peace, or another bullshit scapegoat. The shah in iran, pinochet in chile, king fahd of saudi arabia, somoza in nicaragua, diem of south vietnam, syngman rhee of south korea, etc etc.

now than, i personally support fidel for improving the country immensely throughout his rule. i support policies of internal party democracy and greater worker self management at the local level. free elections are easy to corrupt from the outside, and right wing candidates will be obviously financed from above by capitalist nations. this is precisely why marxism is opposed to free elections between parties of all ideologies. history has proven this with events such as italy in 1948 where the socialist/communist coalition “people’s democratic front” was completely destroyed with a cia-led propaganda campaign against the coalition which was predicted to receive a majority of votes. examples in guatemala where a left-leaning non-communist was overthrown by cia-backed insurgents after winning an election, and of course the cia-let military coup of democratically elected salvador allende of chile in 73. it is obvious to me that a Cuban election will be completely hijacked as they have been in the past.

[Marxman]

Cuba is stalinistic since the beginning of Castro's coup d'etat. Why isn't it? Stalin and Castro can be easily compared. I wonder what Fidel would do if he had the power of Stalin? Castro lies to his people about the ideas of socialism and communism and that makes him bad as it is. No wonder people are tired of his regime and "communism" when leaders like Castro slander the name of Lenin and Trotsky and Marx and Engels with their lust for power. There is no freedom, no true democracy in Cuba and how can there be socialism in Cuba when there is no democracy? There is no bright future in Cuba, not even in Stalinism. If it accepts capitalism, people won't eat anymore. N Korea is facing with the same issue. My country Slovenia had in Yugoslavia Tito, a stalinist leader who was the best of Stalinism. But his charisma for socialism suddenly faded when he died and Yugoslavia was in collapse and our country accepted capitalism in the nick of time. Our country is the richest of the Balkan countries that were in Yugoslavia, all that accepted capitalism are in deep shit. We luckily pulled out of the Stalinist mess quickly and were saved but capitalism is fluorishing too much in our country now and the misery of it is worsening. So, my point is that both capitalism and stalinism have a no way out! The only, the only solution to all of the mankind is a genuine socialist revolution! Study the October revolution, ladies and gentlemen. Study it and you can know the true meaning of the bright future that's waiting for us.

[deimos]

Our country is the richest of the Balkan countries that were in Yugoslavia, all that accepted capitalism are in deep shit. We luckily pulled out of the Stalinist mess quickly and were saved but capitalism is fluorishing too much in our country now and the misery of it is worsening.
you forget that slovenia never had problems because of different religious or ethnical groups like the other balcan countries.

[Marxman]

I'm aware of that. In Yugoslavia, my country had many ethnic groups although it cannot be compared to the south. Tito's charisma and his words of "co-existence" and "socialism" made it possible for 6 ethnic groups to be together happy. But when he died, the shit has hit the fan. And that's the kind of contradictory problem to stalinism and the national question. It keeps many nations together but it also keeps them apart with their corruptive bueracratic politics. Stalinism only makes things worse for the nations. I remember when all the stalinist politicians in Slovenia when Yugoslavia fell apart suddenly switched sides to capitalism. They switched sides to capitalism over-night. And that is my point of all when people consider stalinists loyal. Their loyalty is on money scale.

[Conghaileach]

They way you speak, Marxman, wou'd think that anyone who didn't follow Marx, Engels and Lenin dogmatically was automatically a Stalinist.

[deimos]

where does he say that?

[Conghaileach]

from Marxman
No wonder people are tired of his regime and "communism" when leaders like Castro slander the name of Lenin and Trotsky and Marx and Engels with their lust for power. There is no freedom, no true democracy in Cuba and how can there be socialism in Cuba when there is no democracy? There is no bright future in Cuba, not even in Stalinism.

[Conghaileach]

There are other sources in different threads.

[Marxman]

STALINIST RECIPE: You have to steal a RED uniform with a sickle and hammer on it and shout to the people that you are going to make a socialist revolution. But your agenda is taking power into an absolute and autocratic hands of your own made bueracracy. You then make a "communist" party and put Lenin pictures on the wall. And then you have big time speeches saying that the West is evil and you are an angel and that you'll make everything right. If your "socialist revolution" succeeds, people start to realise that wasn't any goddamn people's revolution but a coup d'etat by some assholes with AK-47s. And then you make purges between people and immediately you get rid of all your enemies and put them to the wall. Of course, you are still wearing a RED suit and have Lenin pictures on the wall and the whole world can see that and they can also see your purges, so the whole world kind of have doubts of this communism thing. And then your clique grows and grows with planned economy, you make sure workers don't strike and that arts & science are repressed. You make all books censored and edited, mostly communist books from writers like Marx, Engels, Trotsky, Lenin. Then you make other countries force to join your "crusade against capitalism." And of course, you make more and more purges in the process because enemies multiply like rabbits. And you still have speeches and your people still suffer from poverty and you still shout to them to work, to die for "communism," to build socialism and so forth. And time really flies when you are doing that, so your planned economy kind of rottens and your state is in collapse. Then Stalinism (just like capitalism) turns into fascism or it can transform to the devious capitalism by captialist restoration and you obviously transform yourself too in the process. That means you cannot have a red suit on but a tie and a business suit. You can get away clean if you're slick like my country's fucking politicians were or you can go to HAAG like Milosevic is.

[Conghaileach]

I agree entirely with what you said.

However, I usually think of a Stalinist as someone who follows the Stalin's theories, not someone who poisons socialist revolutions. They may be the same, but can you understand what I'm trying to say?