why did cuba fail?

[Freidenker]

Fail at what? Castro's still in power. I think Cuba's not doing to bad of a job either.

[NovelGentry]

I'm not so sure I would say it failed. At least not yet. Cuba has progressed and regressed throughout the years as it has tried to deal with a multitude of problems, the one persisting one being scarcity in their own agricultural production -- which has been caused by a NUMBER of problems over time.

The nation has gone back and fourth through periods of strictness and tolerance. Overall, I would say socially speaking, however, Cuba has progressed in large amounts. Equality between men and women is said to be excellent (this is coming from primary sources). Racism, although denounced from the start, has not had as many official strides to destroy it. Overall, minority races are treated better than they were under Batista, but the question is has the government done enough?

There is a general equality given to the people, and the government does try and appeal to their demands. Democracy -- particularly on the local level is far greater and far more important to the people than it is in the US.

For an excellent book that includes essays on both the positive and the negative developments in Cuba since the revolution, pick up The Cuba Reader.

Overall I think Castro and the Cuban people have done an amazing job at a task that I would normally consider fairly impossible. What remains to be seen is if Cuba can progress towards a higher level, actually obtaining fully socialized means of produciton, and watching the local democracy build up to actually contribute towards the full national coordination.

If it does this... I would say that Cuba has actually done the impossible. What I think is more likely though is that the nation still suffers greatly from reactionary viewpoints, there is still strong opposition from US exiled or housed Cubans, and overall the nation has many threats in it's current form, as well as ANY more socialist form it takes. For this reason alone I see Castro -- or at least someone in his position as a leader, as a necessity of sustaining socialist reform. I have little doubt that when Castro dies much of this opposition will manifest in to an outright attack against the current Cuban system, as well as against the idea that Cuba actually progress towards a more truthful socialism.

I do believe there will be a fight for actual independence among the people with such forces, if external, expect something similar to Iraqi resistence to the US multiplied by 1,000 (or there abouts). If it is completely internal (not likely). I'd say they are likely to pull back towards a very regulated capitalism. Not state capitalism, just a tightly regulated private form.

[SpeCtrE]

Did it fail, when?

[Redmau5]

Not to mention it has the best health service and lowest crime rate in the western hemispheare :D .

Just had to get that in.

[RedAnarchist]

Its no workers paradise, but thank Marx its no America! :D

[RedLenin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2005, 04:19 PM
Its no workers paradise, but thank Marx its no America! :D
Nicely put AF.

Cuba is not perfect. Few can deny this. It is not a real democracy because the people do not actively run the economy or government. Did it fail at acheiving socialism? Yes. Cuba is state capitalist. But did it fail in it's goal, the overthrough of Batista and a better life for it's people? No. I am not a big fan of Castro but I feel he does some good for his people. So overall, considering the goals of the revolution, Cuba did not fail. Right now, for me anyway, Cuba is a lesser evil.

[extreme_left_ak]

Eagle,

Your not right because maoism and stalinism was really good for the people
so you bettter shut the fuck up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JustinG]

It's impossible to say that the cuban revolution failed or didn't fail, because both statements are not true. Castro has make huge strides since the days for Batista, for instance. Meanwhile, the economy of cuba isnt good at all, but is it because of Castros system or because of the embargo? It's obvious that the embargo has fucked up cubas economy, as it has plenty of precious sugar cane that could be used for export. Cuba, on the other hand, did fail in bringing democratic means to its people-unfortunatly cuba (like everyone else) evolved from a soviet-like structure...very unfortunate.

In conclusion, cuba still has time to go one way or the other...if just the right things happen, cuba can become the workers paradise which many want and need.

[Forward Union]

Originally posted by [email protected] 30 2005, 08:57 AM
Eagle,

Your not right because maoism and stalinism was really good for the people
so you bettter shut the fuck up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tell that to the "Enemies of the State" <_<

[viva le revolution]

Cuba, in my opinion did not fail. In fact just after the revolutionary government took office after overthrowig the imperialist puppet Batista, Imperialist America predicted it would fail and return to becoming a subversive puppet regime grovelling at the feet of the oligarch.
The Cuban revolution survived and instead failing, was actually moving forward, the imperialist could not see this and imposed an embargo(a common weapon used by the imperialist jackal when he cannot fight, Bay of Pigs anyone?)
Despite the embargo that has negatively affected the Cuban economy Cuba still has the best health system and lowest crime rate of western hemisphere.
Under Batista, it had neither of these and a worse off economy where the worker was prostituted off to the imperialist Capitalist monster.
Cuba has come a great deal forward since the overthrow of the imperial lackeys and actually does something for the people, no matter how the imperialist media demonises Cuba and Castro, they have my complete confidence&#33;

[BigMik]

They failed because they&#39;re communist, maybe you people should look at how many things Cuban citizens use westernized "captialist" stuff illegaly there.

[rice349]

They failed because they&#39;re communist, maybe you people should look at how many things Cuban citizens use westernized "captialist" stuff illegaly there.

You fail at life because you&#39;re ignorant, they&#39;re not even in a communism yet dumbass. But we won&#39;t worry about you, you&#39;ll be restricted soon anyways. Have fun.

[BigMik]

Aw you don&#39;t like what a say so you silence me, how open-minded. Hypocritical ass.

[Thomas]

You don&#39;t contribute very well do you?

Cuba&#39;s a far better social country than most others, rivalling America and soaring past England. I&#39;ll pull some stats up tonight when I&#39;ve got time, but they have a great life expectancy, top literacy rate and low teenage pregnancys etc.

Also they&#39;ve successfully resisted all capitalist and imperialist means to destroy them, embargoes, invasions and propoganda have all failed. If Cuba was that bad then how would it survive so much thrown against it?

[rice349]

Aw you don&#39;t like what a say so you silence me, how open-minded. Hypocritical ass.

Lol i&#39;ve never stated tolerance for reactionaries and capitalists, or anyone who disagrees with me. I&#39;m not hypocritical, i&#39;m quite open about what i would do towards those who disagree with me... :D

[Thomas]

Your gulags would be packed to the brim.

[Ell Carino]

I don&#39;t think it has failed at all. I wish England had the low level of crime that Cuba has.

Fight on Castro&#33;

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

I think its probably the most successful, actually it is the most successful people&#39;s/workers revolution we can look to as a model.

[KuliNeMeL]

umm i got a question,
i dont understand the term state Capitalist&#39; that much...

can somone tell me what makes Cuba &#39;State Capitalist&#39;?
10x

[RedLenin]

State capitalist is basically another term for stalinism. Yeah its sad, but unfortunately Cuba has become a stalinist state.

[Jersey Devil]

I would say that Cuba "failed" after the Soviet Union collapsed and in effect ended it&#39;s subsidies that came from the trade of sugar and oil between the two respective countries. The oil given to Cuba was partially consumed by Cuba with the rest sold to further fuel the Cuban economy. However, it should also be noted that the recent Cuban-Venezuelan alliance has been helping the Cuban economy, though not nearly at the same capacity as with the Soviet-Cuban partnership.

[communistfuture]

Communism is not meant to be yet in the world. People have to overcome their capitalist state of mind. That is why we are here - to educate, to show the way.

Cuba hasn&#39;t failed, just like Soviet Union, they just couldn&#39;t survive being closed out from the rest of the world. The problem is that communist society is very unlikely to develop if there are dominating capitalist powers in the world that resist communism and socialism.

Greed and ignorance are the main evils.

[Bolshevist]

Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 08:03 PM
State capitalist is basically another term for stalinism. Yeah its sad, but unfortunately Cuba has become a stalinist state.
Huh?

How do you manage to equate state capitalism with Marxism-Leninism? How is it Stalinist?

[Guerrilla22]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2005, 11:36 AM
Did it fail, when?
Exactly. Last time I checked Cuba is still socialist and Castro is still in power. By the way, did you know that Cuba actually has a higher literacy rate than the US?

[communistfuture]

Originally posted by Guerrilla22+May 3 2005, 06:48 PM--> (Guerrilla22 @ May 3 2005, 06:48 PM)
[email protected] 26 2005, 11:36 AM
Did it fail, when?
By the way, did you know that Cuba actually has a higher literacy rate than the US?




[/b]
So did the Soviet Union.

[codyvo]

Originally posted by [email protected] 16 2005, 08:03 PM
State capitalist is basically another term for stalinism. Yeah its sad, but unfortunately Cuba has become a stalinist state.
I think you are wrong.
Cuba lately has only made more reforms to put distance between itself and any forms of Capitalism. Also I don&#39;t think that Cuba is failing at all for a country with a douzen million people they have done excellent. Their economy has actually been doing better lately and their social policies are (or should be) the envy of the world. They recently more than doubled the minimum wage of all government employees. They have excellent education (particularly literacy), healthcare, and prison treatment. Also their excellent healthcare and education are free along with rent.
All of this is excellent considering Castro&#39;s main concern originally was just to overthrow Batista.

[viva le revolution]

Originally posted by [email protected] 2 2005, 09:52 AM
maybe you people should look at how many things Cuban citizens use westernized "captialist" stuff illegaly there.
Have you ever heard of the cuban cigar? One of the best in the world. tell all those americans are smoking those, how many are using "communist stuff" illegally. in the &#39;states (to use your own expression.) How about tourists that flock to Cuba? would that qualify as "communist stuff"?

[Comrade Ryan]

The tourism sector should not be used as an arguement for Cuban success. That sector is given special breaks that make it very capitalistic. Cuba has plenty to be proud of, that was acheived through social meaures. Economic growth of late through tourism is not one of them, and should not be muddled with the social success.

[bezdomni]

If you speak spanish, you should visit the party&#39;s website and some of the links.

www.pcc.cu

[GhostSoldier]

In response to someones question about State-Capitalism (http://www.dsp.org.au/ss/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=45&Itemid=45)

Stalinism could be termed State-Capitalist - I&#39;ve heard it argued this way:


This is not an insult or swear word but a reflection of their politics, specifically the ideology of "socialism in one country" (really, state capitalism) and the glorification of the one-party state led by an all-knowing, all-powerful Communist Party. This is most evident, of course, with Cuba, the regime that Resistance has uncritically worshipped for decades.


My response being...

Am I correct to assume you feel that Cuba is not internationalist and that it simply believes in "socialism in one country"&#33; – Perhaps it is necessary to "re hash" some of the internationalist things this tiny third-world country has done in its attempt to spread socialism around the world.

Cuba has more than 10,000 doctors, 8000 educators and 2000 sports trainers, agricultural experts, military advisers and technicians working in Venezuela alone&#33;&#33;&#33; Surely this is a just indication of the tiny and poor country’s internationalism and attempts to spread socialism.

Cuban doctors are also quietly saving lives in East Timor and healing the sick and wounded in tsunami-devastated Sri Lanka&#33;&#33;&#33; Surely this is a just indication of the tiny and poor country’s internationalism and attempts to spread socialism.

And what about the decisive role of 50,000 Cuban volunteer fighters who defeated South Africa’s imperialist aggression against Angola and Namibia between 1975 and 1990: Just the plain fact that soldiers from Cuba were able to beat back a South African invasion of Angola sent shock waves throughout the continent&#33;&#33;&#33; Surely this is a just indication of the tiny and poor country’s internationalism and attempts to spread socialism.

What about Cuba giving scholarships to hundreds of poor people from all around the globe to study and become doctors and technicians&#33;&#33;&#33; Surely this is a just indication of the tiny and poor country’s internationalism and attempts to spread socialism.

Not to mention the heroic deeds Che Guevara attempted to do in the Congo and Bolivia – wether he did it correctly or not – this was a just indication of the tiny and poor country’s internationalism and attempts to spread socialism.

With these things in mind – how are you able to justify your statement, by saying that Cuba has no interest in spreading socialism abroad – and as for it being "state-capitalist" … I think the fact we are still living in a Capitalist world should be explanation enough to your criticism.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I thought I did a fairly decent job of shutting that bafoon from Socialist Alternative down...

Anyways, to end it shorty...

Cuba neither failed nor succeeded... Its still in the process of trying to convince the rest of the world Socialism is the way forward...

Cuba was (and is) a milestone in history, it has achieved things that the rest of Latin America (and the world for that matter) are only just starting to catch up with. I 100% support the remarkable things this tiny third-world nation has managed to do...

[Rockfan]

Originally posted by viva le [email protected] 30 2005, 10:58 AM
Cuba, in my opinion did not fail. In fact just after the revolutionary government took office after overthrowig the imperialist puppet Batista, Imperialist America predicted it would fail and return to becoming a subversive puppet regime grovelling at the feet of the oligarch.
The Cuban revolution survived and instead failing, was actually moving forward, the imperialist could not see this and imposed an embargo(a common weapon used by the imperialist jackal when he cannot fight, Bay of Pigs anyone?)
Despite the embargo that has negatively affected the Cuban economy Cuba still has the best health system and lowest crime rate of western hemisphere.
Under Batista, it had neither of these and a worse off economy where the worker was prostituted off to the imperialist Capitalist monster.
Cuba has come a great deal forward since the overthrow of the imperial lackeys and actually does something for the people, no matter how the imperialist media demonises Cuba and Castro, they have my complete confidence&#33;
Spot the che freak

[Anarcho-Communist]

Cuba hasn&#39;t failed the Castro regime is still in power and has yet to die how can you think it&#39;s dead, it might be a thrid world country with poverty and other problems but it&#39;s still hanging on their...

Peace, Love, Empathy

[Rockfan]

Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2005, 07:30 AM
Cuba hasn&#39;t failed the Castro regime is still in power and has yet to die how can you think it&#39;s dead, it might be a thrid world country with poverty and other problems but it&#39;s still hanging on their...

Peace, Love, Empathy
yeah but it&#39;s probly heading for it like the other state capitalist countries

[Anarcho-Communist]

Fidel is soon to die hopefully another leader can make changes in the industry to bring it up to pace though

Peace, Love, Empathy

[Antijingo]

Cubans are healthy and educated. The Revolution is popular and its administrator is uncorrupt. I believe that Cuba is as much a success as an isolated socialist island can be.

Viva la revolution&#33;