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The Garbage Disposal Unit
27th January 2005, 05:30
HERE FOLLOWS SOME PSYCHO-METAPHYSICS.
If you are not hot for philosophy, best just to skip it.
The Aneristic Principle is that of APPARENT ORDER; the Eristic Principle is that of APPARENT DISORDER. Both order and disorder are man made concepts and are artificial divisions of PURE CHAOS, which is a level deeper than is the level of distinction making.

With our concept making apparatus called "mind" we look at reality through the ideas-about-reality which our cultures give us.
The ideas-about-reality are mistakenly labeled "reality" and unenlightened people are forever perplexed by the fact that other people, especially other cultures, see "reality" differently.
It is only the ideas-about-reality which differ. Real (capital-T True) reality is a level deeper than is the level of concept.

We look at the world through windows on which have been drawn grids (concepts). Different philosophies use different grids. A culture is a group of people with rather similar grids. Through a window we view chaos, and relate it to the points on our grid, and thereby understand it. The ORDER is in the GRID. That is the Aneristic Principle.

Western philosophy is traditionally concerned with contrasting one grid with another grid, and amending grids in hopes of finding a perfect one that will account for all reality and will, hence, (say unenlightened westerners) be True. This is illusory; it is what we Erisians call the ANERISTIC ILLUSION. Some grids can be more useful than others, some more beautiful than others, some more pleasant than others, etc., but none can be more True than any other.

DISORDER is simply unrelated information viewed through some particular grid. But, like "relation", no-relation is a concept. Male, like female, is an idea about sex. To say that male-ness is "absence of female-ness", or vice versa, is a matter of definition and metaphysically arbitrary. The artificial concept of no-relation is the ERISTIC PRINCIPLE.

The belief that "order is true" and disorder is false or somehow wrong, is the Aneristic Illusion. To say the same of disorder, is the ERISTIC ILLUSION.

The point is that (little-t) truth is a matter of definition relative to the grid one is using at the moment, and that (capital-T) Truth, metaphysical reality, is irrelevant to grids entirely. Pick a grid, and through it some chaos appears ordered and some appears disordered. Pick another grid, and the same chaos will appear differently ordered and disordered.

Reality is the original Rorschach.
Verily! So much for all that.

Dyst
27th January 2005, 19:33
I fail to understand that 'grid' theory thing. However, I wish to comment on the statement that order is (to some degree?) non-existant, and disorder is somehow the truth. In my opinion this is a misconception which can simply be proven wrong by thinking about yourself. How come you exist? How come you are not floating around in a random ocean consisting of different particles? Why are you in time? Why do you consist of animated material?* What keeps you from flying up in the air? And, more enlightening, how come we can "do math"? You may say mathematics is a language created by man, and therefore works the way we want, but that is not true.
Mathematics is a philosophical theory, proven. It is the theory of universal order. Our mathematical language is just a tool to understand the universal code (or law.) The fact that it is possible to "do math" simply proves the universal order.


*Obiously, you would not be able to think if you were not of physical material... Anyways.

The Garbage Disposal Unit
27th January 2005, 21:48
Argh!!! The point that disorder is only defined in relation to disorder, and vice versa - subjectively and according to one's own understanding! Therefore to talk about either is bunk, hense ERISTIC ILLUSION to refer to the idea of inherent disorder!

*SMACK!!!*

amusing foibles
28th January 2005, 02:19
So, Virgin, are you finally willing to come over to the "reality is subjective" camp? Or are you going to latch on to the objective reality which is not provable and "doesn't matter"?

Or do you not agree with what you posted?

The Garbage Disposal Unit
28th January 2005, 03:39
Ala, I'm maintaining the stance I've had for the last year or so - there is an objective physical reality - it's just probable that we have no handle on it.

amusing foibles
28th January 2005, 04:17
Then what does it matter? If, for all intents and purposes the objective reality is unknowable, then belief it's existance is kind of an act of faith and really doesn't effect our daily, "through-the-grid" lives. So why hang on to the idea of an objective reality?

Dyst
28th January 2005, 13:52
Originally posted by Virgin Molotov [email protected] 28 2005, 03:48 AM
Argh!!! The point that disorder is only defined in relation to disorder, and vice versa - subjectively and according to one's own understanding! Therefore to talk about either is bunk, hense ERISTIC ILLUSION to refer to the idea of inherent disorder!

*SMACK!!!*
So what you are trying to say is that the way we all see things are subjective?

If so, I agree with you completely. However, I also believe there is some distinct reality, and while doing math we would realize that the chance for even one of us to know it objectivily is almost equal zero.