New Jersey

[Colombia]

Any protests happening in New Jersey?

[SonofRage]

I think the Socialist Party of NJ does a weekly protest in front of the Army recruitment office. Email [email protected] for more info

[guerillablack]

I wonder what that accomplishes.

[Ele'ill]

:D

[SonofRage]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2005, 12:24 PM
I wonder what that accomplishes.
probably a lot more than just sitting at home posting on a forum...

[Stimulator]

Originally posted by SonofRage+Jan 17 2005, 06:23 AM--> (SonofRage @ Jan 17 2005, 06:23 AM)
[email protected] 14 2005, 12:24 PM
I wonder what that accomplishes.
probably a lot more than just sitting at home posting on a forum... [/b]
then count me in!

[guerillablack]

Originally posted by SonofRage+Jan 17 2005, 06:23 AM--> (SonofRage @ Jan 17 2005, 06:23 AM)
[email protected] 14 2005, 12:24 PM
I wonder what that accomplishes.
probably a lot more than just sitting at home posting on a forum... [/b]
And you really believe that? It's a weekly protest. Break that down. That mean its held every week. Meaning nothing has been accomplished. I'm better of sitting at home. I'll catch the next protest in March 2006. Since you'll probably still be having it.

[SonofRage]

I'm sure there were plenty of people who were going to sign up for the military who gave it a second thought, but you seem to miss the point.

I love these armchair revolutionaries who are quick to criticize others yet do nothing but sit on their asses. Pathetic.

[PRC-UTE]

Originally posted by guerillablack+Feb 13 2005, 11:30 PM--> (guerillablack @ Feb 13 2005, 11:30 PM)
Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2005, 06:23 AM

[email protected] 14 2005, 12:24 PM
I wonder what that accomplishes.
probably a lot more than just sitting at home posting on a forum...
And you really believe that? It's a weekly protest. Break that down. That mean its held every week. Meaning nothing has been accomplished. I'm better of sitting at home. I'll catch the next protest in March 2006. Since you'll probably still be having it. [/b]
That's the spirit! :rolleyes:

That's how you get a revolution on its feet: Stay off your feet?! :huh:

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

While I sympathise with the idea that symbolic demonstration is of liited value, it's not completely useless, and it's better than nothing.

Still, condemning symbolic demonstration in the US, where the left has been rather successfully systematicly disempowered, is akin to bashing the hungry man who settles for a hotdog instead of demanding a turkey dinner.

Sure, the turkey dinner is ideal, but the hotdog is better than nothing.

[guerillablack]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2005, 04:58 AM
I'm sure there were plenty of people who were going to sign up for the military who gave it a second thought, but you seem to miss the point.

I love these armchair revolutionaries who are quick to criticize others yet do nothing but sit on their asses. Pathetic.
You are quick to call me an armchair revolutionary because i think your tactics are pointless?

[YKTMX]

Perhaps you should have suggested diffirent tactics or given examples of the kind of political action you involve yourself in. You just seem slightly moronic when you say "oh, but that doesn't work...".

[Ele'ill]

We are all on this forum posting. All of us, when we post, are armchair activists. What we do in our own lives to benefit the community is for us to know. I highly doubt we would believe eachother if we started sharing some stories. Which is ok. This forum is for ideas. Not for suggestions that someone else is a whatever or they don't do this or that. You have no idea. Critical thought on what someone says they're doing is another story. If they say they are a weekend warrior down at the soup kitchen they should except criticism as a kick in the ass to do more. Those people doing the kicking may one day meet the person (theoretically) and think wow, you are an incredible person, and oogle at their life accomplisments.

[guerillablack]

I'm an open minded individual. If you can show me how rallying in front of military recruitment offices weekly can change anything on a grand scale. Please feel free. I'm not being sarcastic, either. If you can make some good arguments, will join the rally because i'm from Jersey also. But as of now, I don't feel that rallying there does you or the country or the movement any good.

[Ele'ill]

Rallying there every week is a bit trite. That is more an act of attention whoring than anything else. (they said they do this, there fore it's fair game for criticism) I suppose if the rally was large enough. 30,000 people. but why for one recruitment office. Just plan a larger event at a different location.

[bunk]

Why does it have to be on a grand - scale to be worthwile? If these events are well attended then it could catch on. Even if it doesn't it will make a little difference which is better than nothing.

[Ele'ill]

Why does it have to be on a grand - scale to be worthwile? If these events are well attended then it could catch on.


Even if it doesn't it will make a little difference which is better than nothing.


that first sentence slightly contradicts itself. grand scale vs well attended. Grand scale is well attended but well attended isn't always grand scale. I was being sarcastic in reguards to the 30,000 turn out.



Doing little acts of good are by nature of the phrase good however they can possibly be bad and counter productive in the sense that the time could have been used to do more productive acts

[rebelworker]

I've been an active revolutionary for almost 10 years now and I wish all it took was just "the right action" and everything changes. The sad fact is that North America and The USA in particular is politically in very bad shape. We gotta start just about from scratch and start building at the base. Now the socialist party might just be PR'ing or trying to recruit or whatever but revolutions start small.

A few years back I had the extreem privaledge of having a partially state subsidised trip to Nicaragua( in quebec there are more or less free collages that were set up in the 60's that most people attend after highschool). There I saw what organized communitieds really looked like. There were a few coops for jobs, cultural events and other small scale projects. Individually they could do very little in society, but when networked togeather they formed the backbone of a revolutionary movement reaching a huge percentage of the towns population (Ironically it was this trip to a so called Marxist town that turned me away from vanguardist Marxism to Anarchist Comunism, The Sandinistas Red and Black flag, yep you guessed it, Sandino was into anarchism, influenced by the Mexican Anarcho-syndicalist movement).

Having shootouts or demo's of 30,000 dose not equal revolutionary change .
We need to organise, at first small, actions and movments(like draft resistance) that will reach masses of people through issues that affect them personally(not abstract theorys).

If your lookin for somethin to do I would suggest going down to the picket and at least asking what they're up to. Or better, avoid the middle man of the socialist party and mabey look into GI hotlines or veterans for peace, the draft is gonna be one way working class people are gonna see in their dialy lives that they are just cannon fodder for the rich.

In solidarity,

One(of many) rebelworker :ph34r:

[Ele'ill]

Having shootouts or demo's of 30,000 dose not equal revolutionary change .
We need to organise, at first small, actions and movments(like draft resistance) that will reach masses of people through issues that affect them personally(not abstract theorys).


Nothing absolutley equals anything else. Large demonstration in mind being N30 which did equal organization of many different movements. Political ideology waving and forced views were not a part of that demo. It was the public putting down ideology and finally working as a community. So in a sense i'd say an organized demonstration of 30,000 would be more affective than a small group of weekly protesters (who for all I know are highly organized ;P) outside a recruitment center.

[rebelworker]

Sorry I didn`t mean to say these things are not good sometimes (though shootouts tend to end badly), The A20 against the FTAA actions in Quebec city a few years ago did wonders for the province.

But single issue demos quickly dissapear while small coalitions can grow for years and reach outside the "activist bubble" to more working class people.

[Ele'ill]

I have yet to see outreach groups changing anything. (I am seriously dissapointed. This is not sarcasm.) and single issue demonstrations are better than demonstrations that have 340930493094 affinity groups all 'working together'. I would rather have a 'forget your groups' theme for this upcoming April 16 IMF/WB semi annual meeting in Washington DC. Everyone there for one reason, they are opposed to these organizations. I don't care if you are a communist or an anarchist or pedophile with one leg. It would be nice to see groups get together and associate with eachother instead of isolating themselves by dressing differently and walking in mobs. (yeah, that's you black bloc). I guess I kind of got side tracked in this wishy type of post. I am far too lazy to delete all of this so i'm going to post it. ;)