Leninism vs. Stalinism

[Orange Juche]

Being kind of a n00b to Marxism-Leninism.. I have a n00bish question.

Someone in another board claimed I cannot be opposed to Stalin and be a Marxist-Leninist. Is this true?

[Guest1]

Umm...

I'm not a leninist, but no, it's not really true. Not all leninists are stalinists. The term "Marxist-Leninist" however, is a term that seems to be more widely used amongst stalinists and maoists than amongst anti-stalinist leninists, who I've usually heard use the term leninist or marxist.

But there isn't any theoretical reason not to. And I have heard trotskyists calling themselves Marxist-Leninists. You can be a supporter of Lenin and not a supporter of Stalin.

Whether leninism eventually leads to stalinism is a whole other debate alot of people will probably want to get into :P

[Orange Juche]

Originally posted by Che y [email protected] 2 2004, 02:23 AM
Umm...

I'm not a leninist, but no, it's not really true. Not all leninists are stalinists. The term "Marxist-Leninist" however, is a term that seems to be more widely used amongst stalinists and maoists than amongst anti-stalinist leninists, who I've usually heard use the term leninist or marxist.

But there isn't any theoretical reason not to. And I have heard trotskyists calling themselves Marxist-Leninists. You can be a supporter of Lenin and not a supporter of Stalin.

Whether leninism eventually leads to stalinism is a whole other debate alot of people will probably want to get into :P
k thanks ;)

[Vladimir_Lenin]

Meetingpoepleiseasy which board are you reffering to?

[Wiesty]

i know nothing on the marxism, maoism and leninism scene, just socialism, communism etc.

but i do know that stalinism and leninism have some similar traits, but they also do not have similar traits.

[Vladimir_Lenin]

but i do know that stalinism and leninism have some similar traits, but they also do not have similar traits.

There is no such thing as stalinism.

[BuyOurEverything]

Just out of curiosity, to all those people who say there is a difference between Leninism and "Stalinism," would you mind listing them?

[RagsToRevolution]

From what I gather, there is no theoretical difference between Stalin and Lenin, only the execution, methods, and personality of the vanguard regime both have. Stalin seems to be more authoritarian and pro-centralization. Also, he seemed pro-isolationist over Lenin, who acknowledged that for socialism to survive the world must be taken, a solitary state will not survive. Stalin did some good things, he has done some questionable things, he has done atrocities. But, there really is little difference between theoretical Leninism and Stalinism, I only see differences in methods and execution.

[NovelGentry]

Just out of curiosity, to all those people who say there is a difference between Leninism and "Stalinism," would you mind listing them?

http://www.angloeuropean.essex.sch.uk/hist...bhist/Lenin.htm (http://www.angloeuropean.essex.sch.uk/histweb/6form/ibhist/Lenin.htm)

It is very difficult to draw strict differences between Leninism and Stalinism without taking a look at what was actually done, in similar fashion there are some differences that are tough to be drawn between Leninism and Marxism without looking at what was done.

Marx remains strictly theoretical (although he did critique many practical attempts at socialism)

Lenin remains both theoretical and practical, as his work laid down the theoretical principles and then he looked to implement them, in doing so (because material conditions dictated otherwise) his practical implementation did not always match exactly what he put forward in his work.

Stalinism remains completely practical since he did little to no theorizing of his own. However, it could be said that the practical implementation was in some way extended from what he theorized to be the right thing to do, but there is no way to really tell other than by looking at what he did.

[Wiesty]

Originally posted by [email protected] 9 2004, 07:50 PM
Meetingpoepleiseasy which board are you reffering to?
o.k. then
look it up

[Guest1]

Umm... what do you mean, "look it up"? He's not gonna find what forum he posts on by "looking it up" :lol:

[MiniOswald]

Lenin wanted the domino effect didnt he, more countries to follow, stalin wanted his economic reforms inside the country, to build up b4 expansion.

[vivalache22]

Che believed in Lenin's ideals, they both saw first hand the horror of impirialism. Che traveled through out South America and witnessed the the exploitation of the poor, by capitalist. Lenin's brother was killed because he was a socialist, Lenin as well saw first hand the horror of imperialism in Russia...
They both had great, rightous, revolutionary ideas...
However, Stalin was more "Imperalistic" he wanted to spread Soviet Power over Europe, he did not care about the poor, he wanted power, he wanted communism to spread and that didn't help the people.

[Abstrakt]

yes, but didn't Lenin end up exploiting the poor?

[Djehuti]

Often marxism-leninism is used as another term for stalinism, not only by stalinists but also by their enemies. I often use marxism-leninism as a term for stalinism to.
It might sound strange, but it is that way.

Marxism does not always have much to do with Marx.
Leninism does not always have much to do with Lenin.
Marxism-Leninism rarely have anything to do with Marx, and often not Lenin either.
At the same time there are those who state that they are anti-leninists but like Lenin,
and those who state that they are no marxists, but love Marx, etc.

Its quite a mess really. ;)

[Karl Marx's Camel]

It is very difficult to draw strict differences between Leninism and Stalinism


Maybe because there is no such thing as "Stalinism"?

Ernesto Guevara supported Stalin. Was he a "Stalinist"?



he did not care about the poor, he wanted power, he wanted communism to spread and that didn't help the people.

Proof?

[RevolutionarySocialist MadRedDog]

Originally posted by [email protected] 10 2004, 04:00 AM
From what I gather, there is no theoretical difference between Stalin and Lenin, only the execution, methods, and personality of the vanguard regime both have. Stalin seems to be more authoritarian and pro-centralization. Also, he seemed pro-isolationist over Lenin, who acknowledged that for socialism to survive the world must be taken, a solitary state will not survive. Stalin did some good things, he has done some questionable things, he has done atrocities. But, there really is little difference between theoretical Leninism and Stalinism, I only see differences in methods and execution.
I agree with RagsToRevolution that the difference between 'stalinism' and 'leninism' is mainly practice. Therefore stalinism should be considered as a certain practical approach to the theories of Marx (,Engels) & Lenin: hence the term marxists-leninists, which is often used while referring to stalinistst or by stalinistst themselves.

I call myself a trotskyst and not a marxist-leninist since Trotsky (to the contrary of Stalin) wrote publications that deepened and explained the theories of Marx, Engels & Lenin. But in essence you could call me a marxist-leninist, since my socialist analysis is also based upon the theories of Marx and Lenin.