Fear

[ComradeChris]

I think essentially everything stems from fear. Fear is probably one of the most primitive "emotions" (if you want to coin it as such). It triggers our "Fight or Flight" response, which induces more epinephrine to induce faster bodily responses, and greater feats of physical strength. Fear is very much incorporated into our current societal rule as well. People are afraid of themselves being murdered, so everyone respects that and there's a law created against it. Of course there are outliers, psychopaths for instance. But I'd argue that they themselves aren't afraid of their own death. Capitalism feeds off this fear. They create popular culture, so people are afraid they will be deemed "uncool" and therefore go and buy the popular, almost always more expensive, clothing. Our fear of our own death inspires us to create better technology to give us longevity. Fear of the unknown triggers Religious and Scientific belief. There's probably other examples, but I can't think of any. Anyone else have an opinion on this matter?

[redtrigger]

I think what you are getting at is something called psycho-sematics. Maybe a little self-fullfilling prophecy as well.

In either case the body does as the mind says. If you are sick but in good spirits, you heal faster. If you are afraid, you make bad desicions which trigger the event you were afraid of. The concept of willpower is something most people don't account for, and in many cases do not understand.

[ComradeChris]

Originally posted by [email protected] 10 2004, 07:44 PM
I think what you are getting at is something called psycho-sematics. Maybe a little self-fullfilling prophecy as well.

In either case the body does as the mind says. If you are sick but in good spirits, you heal faster. If you are afraid, you make bad desicions which trigger the event you were afraid of. The concept of willpower is something most people don't account for, and in many cases do not understand.
What do you mean self-fulfilling prephecy?

I don't know a lot about psychology either, and about this 'mind over matter' as some would call it. I know people being in a constant state of stress usually feel ill. But usually that stress is fear induced as well. Fear you won't get your bills paid on time. Fear that you won't meet your deadline. Maybe you don't care about the deadline itself, but you're certainly afraid of the consequences.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

People don't heal faster by some force of will, and the mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit. The physical state of the brain influences the body - it is affected by various activity within itself and by the environment in which it exists. Dig physical reality, dude.

As to self-fufilling prophecy, he means that belief in the prophecy allows it to become true. I offer A simplistic comparison: Suppose a fortune-teller, philosopher, or someone else I might be kooky enough to believe tells me I'll never "get laid" again. As a result, I absolutely give up trying to "get laid", and, thus, go the rest of my life sans "lay". Pow.

[che's long lost daughter]

And where do you think fear stems from? Fear definitely is also controlled by the mind as with any other emotion. The part of the brain which is the hypothalamus speciafically controls emotions. Take those people with phobia as an example. To get rid of a phobia, there is this therapy called systematic disynthesisation where the person is exposed little by little to the object of fear. For instance, one is afraid to ride airplanes, to overcome the fear, all will start with him looking at a picture of a plane, then a visit to the airport until finally, ride a plane himself. This happens because fear is systematically erased from the mind. And only the person experiencing the fear is capable of it, of course with the help of outer forces. But it is the person himself who is in control of his emotions.

[ComradeChris]

People don't heal faster by some force of will, and the mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit. The physical state of the brain influences the body - it is affected by various activity within itself and by the environment in which it exists. Dig physical reality, dude.

How do you explain stress then? I mean I know people who lose hair when stressed. I think I've gotten a few gray hairs because of stress (thank god they disappeared). I think it's only one way though. I mean I try and get well soon sometimes, but it just never seems to have the opposite affect of feeling stressed.


As to self-fufilling prophecy, he means that belief in the prophecy allows it to become true. I offer A simplistic comparison: Suppose a fortune-teller, philosopher, or someone else I might be kooky enough to believe tells me I'll never "get laid" again. As a result, I absolutely give up trying to "get laid", and, thus, go the rest of my life sans "lay". Pow.

I'm not trying to prophesize. That's just my understanding of it. But I hope you get laid again :lol: .


And where do you think fear stems from? Fear definitely is also controlled by the mind as with any other emotion. The part of the brain which is the hypothalamus speciafically controls emotions. Take those people with phobia as an example. To get rid of a phobia, there is this therapy called systematic disynthesisation where the person is exposed little by little to the object of fear. For instance, one is afraid to ride airplanes, to overcome the fear, all will start with him looking at a picture of a plane, then a visit to the airport until finally, ride a plane himself. This happens because fear is systematically erased from the mind. And only the person experiencing the fear is capable of it, of course with the help of outer forces. But it is the person himself who is in control of his emotions.

Is it really fear of planes though? I think it's more a fear of planes crashing. Like I said, might not be the thing your afraid of directly, but some greater consequences. But you can erase fear to. Some people are brainwashed to not take fear in dying for one's country, or for one's cause. But then that kind of relates back to my outliers being unafraid of death.

[redtrigger]

and the mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit

At least you back up your arguments well. In any case how can you say that willpower has no effect on the physical state of the body. If you have will, or are under circumstances that are stressful or painful, then the mind produces excess adrenaline and endorphines allowing for physical feats not normally possible by the body, however if your mind is weaker, less will, you produce less of those chemicals. Psycho-sematics 101.

[refuse_resist]

To get rid of a phobia, there is this therapy called systematic disynthesisation where the person is exposed little by little to the object of fear. For instance, one is afraid to ride airplanes, to overcome the fear, all will start with him looking at a picture of a plane, then a visit to the airport until finally, ride a plane himself.
I've heard about this. That it's just a series of steps someone needs to take before someone finally rids thereselves of that certain particular fear. Hence, it's war mor


The physical state of the brain influences the body - it is affected by various activity within itself and by the environment in which it exists. Dig physical reality, dude.
That always plays a role. However, if someone does come to realize what exactly they're fearing, as well as why they fear it, it's only a matter of time until they snap out of it.

[gaf]

fear is an alarm system, it work like pain ,to tell you, it is not good.itís basic but very effective......1 fear........2 pain.........3 flee or fight ........so to controle it. is to understand it.......it is up to you.

[ComradeChris]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12 2004, 12:58 PM
fear is an alarm system, it work like pain ,to tell you, it is not good.itís basic but very effective......1 fear........2 pain.........3 flee or fight ........so to controle it. is to understand it.......it is up to you.
I agree you can brainwash people out of being afraid of things. I mean I really don't care if I die or not, I say I'll probably die young all the time. I would have no qualms with killing someone if I thought the reason was very just, or if it was in self-defence. I just think everything we do, in some way is affected by our fear of something else.

[Latifa]

Originally posted by Virgin Molotov [email protected] 10 2004, 11:47 PM
The mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit.
The mind CONTROLS the body for petes sake.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Originally posted by Latifa+Nov 20 2004, 07:49 AM--> (Latifa @ Nov 20 2004, 07:49 AM)
Virgin Molotov [email protected] 10 2004, 11:47 PM
The mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit.
The mind CONTROLS the body for petes sake. [/b]
The tail WAGS the dog for pete's sake!

No, seriously, what exactly is the mind? Is it some delightful metaphyiscal cloud floating above yr head that through the power of MAGIC influences yr physical brain (Despite evidence suggesting the opposite)?

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by Latifa+Nov 20 2004, 07:49 AM--> (Latifa @ Nov 20 2004, 07:49 AM)
Virgin Molotov [email protected] 10 2004, 11:47 PM
The mind does not influence the body - that's bullshit.
The mind CONTROLS the body for petes sake. [/b]
There is a whole load of things which control the body, for many different functions. The minds is not one of them. The mind is indeed metaphysical, but I wouldn't call it a cloud.

[Tondbert]

I think its an interesting theory to believe that capitalist society feeds off the human nature of fear. Suppose it feeds off the 'survival of the fittest' kinda thing as well. Though it stops us from naturally reproducing (coined 'sleeping-around') by saying its wrong to have sex outside of marriage though this attitude seems to be dying.
Could someone post a link for a good site on 'psychosomatics' please.

Its very true to say society works off human instincts and emotions - mainly because its humans who created our society. Would it be possible for society without instincts and emotions? All creatures have them, even plants have the instinct to reach for the light.
What would be interesting would be to compare how a capitalist society exploits some human qualities where as a communist society would exploit others.
The capitalist society uses our schools to make us conform and effectively create a future workforce from which employers can pick from, looking for the 'ideal' worker. Our need to fit in and fear of rejection is very much increased by a capitalist society, I would say. Hmm... :huh: