Don't Knock It...

[DaCuBaN]

Punk rock is a word, used by dilitants and heartless manipulators, about music that takes up the energies; and the bodies; and the hearts; and the souls; and the time; and minds of young men, who give what they have to it. They give everything they have to it. It's a term that's based on contempt, it's a term that's based on fashion, style, elitism, satinism, and everything that's rotten about rock 'n'roll. I don't know Jonny Rotten, but I'm sure he puts as much blood and sweat into what he does, as Sigmund Froyd. You see what sounds to you like a big load of trashy old noise, is in fact the brilliant music of a genious. -Iggy Pop

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

WTF are you asking?

[The Forum Idiot]

He's asking if we agree with the wuote...I agree with most of it.

[Funky Monk]

Don't agree with most of the spelling.

[Pawn Power]

i am confused :huh:

[gaf]

punk before the punx
or, more punk than etiquet you die

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Sorry Iggy Pop, just like you it's nothing but a stifling bore, a trashy commodity, and intellectual ghetto.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Originally posted by Virgin Molotov [email protected] 17 2004, 01:38 PM
Sorry Iggy Pop, just like you it's nothing but a stifling bore, a trashy commodity, and intellectual ghetto.
So, you're saying that just like Iggy Pop, punk rock is a "stifling bore", a "trashy comodity", and an "intellectual ghetto"?

I tend to agree that it lacks musical value, but a lot of punk is much more "intellectualy stimulating" than most other genres of popular music.

And Iggy Pop's a bit over rated, if you ask me. Bowie is infinitely better.

[gaf]

he never say he was good he only say punk was a fashion
and btw a lot of things in this world tend to be over rated

[Urban Rubble]

stifling bore

Ha. You may not like punk rock, but it has been anything but boring. Johnny Rotten saying "fuck" on live TV in the U.K caused more of a stir than just about any other single word ever.


trashy comodity

What does that even mean ? Was that an attempt to sound intelligent ?

Name one form of semi popular music that hasn't become a comodity. It's called Capitalism genius.


intellectual ghetto

Again, what are you talking about ? Punk rock is basically the only form of music (besides underground hip hop) with an actual message.

Despite your liberal use of shitty adjectives, you have not managed to show how brainy you are. Try again.

[Palmares]

Mr Pop ( :lol: ) is missing two words: destruction and anarchy.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Punk rock is basically the only form of music (besides underground hip hop) with an actual message.

Now, Urban, that's just silly.
I agree that a lot of punk does have a message, but punk and hip hop are by no means the only genres of music that convey a message. The genre, by the way, has nothing to do with having "an actual message".

[Anti-Capitalist1]

Guide to making punk rock:
have one dude bang on a guitar
have another dude bang on a bass
have another dude bang of some drums
have another dude scream l.yrics, that, though meaningful, are drowned out by the crap coming from the first three guys..

Point= As a bassist, i like to play challenging bass lines. punk rock is very easy to play, so fuck the lyrics, if the playing isn't satisfactory, I don't care what you say.

[The Forum Idiot]

the WHOLE POINT of punk is that anyone can play it. That's what makes it punk, freedom of expression, not confinement to those with technical ability. Punk is basically about getting a point across, that's why there are very few punk balads (the clash had a couple but they still have a message). And Iggy Pop rules.

[Urban Rubble]

Now, Urban, that's just silly.
I agree that a lot of punk does have a message, but punk and hip hop are by no means the only genres of music that convey a message.

Well please, tell me how I'm wrong. I think the vast majority of legitimate punk bands do convey a message and therefore I think punk rock as a whole generally makes an attempt to be intellectually stimulating. What other kinds of music, for the most part, do this ? Folk maybe ? Reggae ?

I didn't mean they were the "only" ones, but they are the primary ones.


The genre, by the way, has nothing to do with having "an actual message".

I completely disagree. The message of punk rock is non conformity, it always has been and as long as there is still legitimate punk rock it always will be.


Guide to making punk rock:
have one dude bang on a guitar
have another dude bang on a bass
have another dude bang of some drums
have another dude scream l.yrics, that, though meaningful, are drowned out by the crap coming from the first three guys..

You're so godamned ignorant that it's literally painful to read you posts.

I duplicate your retarted formula for any type of music. Hip Hop: Have one dude bang on drums, have one dude bang on some turntables and have one dude ramble into a mic which drowns out the other two. Or how about reggae: Have one dude aimlessly strum a guitar, have one dude play simple bass lines, have one dude tap on the drums and have one dude moan into the mike.

You're fucking ridiculous. Just because you don't enjoy punk does not give you the go ahead to simplify it the way you did. Nothing is that simple, nothing is that easy to pigeonhole. There are punk bands where the singet doesn't scream, there are punk bands that play slow. There are punk bands that are very musically talented. But the thing is, you've never heard them because you don't know the first thing about punk rock. So why do you comment on something you know absolutely dick about ?


Point= As a bassist, i like to play challenging bass lines. punk rock is very easy to play, so fuck the lyrics, if the playing isn't satisfactory, I don't care what you say.

Go download the Rancid song "Maxwell Murder". I will bet you 100 dollars that the bass solo on that song is way over your head.

And by the way, just because something is complicated to play doesn't mean it SOUNDS good. You have missed the entire point of MUSIC.

[The Forum Idiot]

And punk. He did almost get teh formula though, He only forgot the following:

Play what you want, how you want
Don't give a shit what people say
Don't give a shit how you play, its what you play

If you show emotion you'll pull through.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

I know what punk is, but if I didn't know better, I would be really confused by you two. (Urban and the idiot)


And by the way, just because something is complicated to play doesn't mean it SOUNDS good. You have missed the entire point of MUSIC.


Play what you want, how you want
Don't give a shit what people say
Don't give a shit how you play, its what you play

I would say that the purpose of music is to entertain. Idiot clearly has no idea what he's talking about. But he's an idiot, so that's understandable.


Well please, tell me how I'm wrong.

I think you just proved yourself wrong by saying that both folk and reggae often convey a message.

I agree with you that punk tends to say something meaningful, but to say that punk and hip-hop are the only genres that do so is just wrong.


I completely disagree. The message of punk rock is non conformity, it always has been and as long as there is still legitimate punk rock it always will be.

Now there you certainly have a point. In respect to the given conditions, all music, regardless of lyrics, conveys a message. Punk and hip-hop are the most revolutionary and subversive today, you are right. But that does not mean that they’re the only ones that contain a meaningful message.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by The Forum [email protected] 18 2004, 02:08 PM
the WHOLE POINT of punk is that anyone can play it. That's what makes it punk, freedom of expression, not confinement to those with technical ability.
This resonates with me more than Mr Pop's over-intellectualisation. Ditto that guy who wrote The Philosophy of Punk.

To me, hardcore is punk rock. Hardcore is about using your instruments as tools, as a means to an end of capturing a feeling, an emotion, a passion and thrashing it out as furiously and violently as you can onstage and on record. Hardcore is about countering the blandness, mundanity and dishonest smiles of everyday life with something aggressively honest and sincere, something limitlessly violent and uncontrolled (although in practise there are certain customs that usually prevent this getting outta hand) and predictable.

More importantly, hardcore is about taking responsibility for your situation and changing it for the better. Hardcore is about making your own music, putting it out yourself, putting on your own show and drawing your own artwork. Hardcore says fuck the corporations, fuck the major labels, Do It Yourfuckingself.

Hardcore is life to me.

[guerrillaradio]

Originally posted by The Forum [email protected] 18 2004, 05:14 PM
Play what you want, how you want
Don't give a shit what people say
Don't give a shit how you play, its what you play

If you show emotion you'll pull through.
Precisely.

Punk is not a meritocracy. Anyone is welcome to give it a go. If they suck, it doesn't make them any worse than me. If they're good, it doesn't impose some kinda barrier between me and them. Punk says that the guy/girls in the band are not special. Anyone can do it.

[refuse_resist]

Guide to making punk rock:
have one dude bang on a guitar
have another dude bang on a bass
have another dude bang of some drums
have another dude scream l.yrics, that, though meaningful, are drowned out by the crap coming from the first three guys..
I take it you don't listen to punk music.

[The Forum Idiot]

I admit my previous post is kinda hard to understand...However this isn't:

Punk was one of the first type sof music to have girls in the ranks (The Slits) there were some others, abut not many, and the only other one that comes to mind for me is The Velvet Underground but they're proto-punk.

Punk isn't about being raw and violent, it just comes with the thing. If you're trying to push and express your feelings through music you are MUCH more likely to shout and scream a lot. All musical genres tend to have a purpose.

Metal is about being heavy and violent
Blues is about describing and singing about your situation
Punk is about expressing yourself and getting your feelings out there, and saying "fuck off" to the world.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Punk was one of the first type sof music to have girls in the ranks

That's one of the single most ignorant thing I've ever heard in my entire lifetime.

Only taking popular music into account, Billie Holliday, Sarah Vaughan, Ella Fitzgerald, Nina Simone, Dinah Washington, Carmen McRae, Etta Jones, Betty Carter, and Diana Krall were all making great jazz music long, long before the punk movement and The Velvet Underground.

I could list another bunch of blues women, but I think you get my point.

And even if you're only referring to rock music, Fleetwood Mac, The Mamas and The Papas, and Jefferson Airplane also all featured female musicians and were all around before The Velvet Underground.


If you're trying to push and express your feelings through music you are MUCH more likely to shout and scream a lot.

That's just absurd.
All music is obviously a result of peoples' emotions and a large majority does not involve shouting and screaming.


Metal is about being heavy and violent

That's just as ignorant as when folks accuse punk of being only the banging of a guitar and incoherent shouting vocals.

And don't try to simplify the meaning of the blues. Isn't all music just describing and singing about your situation? If singing is involved at all. I could list several blues albums where there is no singing involved, so your description falls short right there.

[celtopunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 08:04 PM

Punk was one of the first type sof music to have girls in the ranks

That's one of the single most ignorant thing I've ever heard in my entire lifetime.

Only taking popular music into account, Billie Holliday, Sarah Vaughan, Ella Fitzgerald, Nina Simone, Dinah Washington, Carmen McRae, Etta Jones, Betty Carter, and Diana Krall were all making great jazz music long, long before the punk movement and The Velvet Underground.


With the exception of Diana Krall anyway, hell she looks to be 40 at the most.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Yeah, I have no idea why I mentioned Diana Krall. She's like the odd one out in that list. I guess I just listed all the female jazz singers I know. But there are plenty of female musicians not attributed to punk.

[Palmares]

Originally posted by The Forum Idiot
Metal is about being heavy and violent

Huh? Do you actually listen to metal?

It's about anger and aggression.

This by no means whatsover necessitates violence. :rolleyes:

There are posers, but essentially this anger comes from a dissatifation, a dissatifaction of society. This can be both right-wing and left-wing.

Now that actually sounds somewhat (obviously not absolutely) like punk? Just punk is prodominantly more left-wing.

[The Forum Idiot]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 08:04 PM
That's one of the single most ignorant thing I've ever heard in my entire lifetime.

Only taking popular music into account, Billie Holliday, Sarah Vaughan, Ella Fitzgerald, Nina Simone, Dinah Washington, Carmen McRae, Etta Jones, Betty Carter, and Diana Krall were all making great jazz music long, long before the punk movement and The Velvet Underground.

I could list another bunch of blues women, but I think you get my point.

And even if you're only referring to rock music, Fleetwood Mac, The Mamas and The Papas, and Jefferson Airplane also all featured female musicians and were all around before The Velvet Underground.



That's just absurd.
All music is obviously a result of peoples' emotions and a large majority does not involve shouting and screaming.



That's just as ignorant as when folks accuse punk of being only the banging of a guitar and incoherent shouting vocals.

And don't try to simplify the meaning of the blues. Isn't all music just describing and singing about your situation? If singing is involved at all. I could list several blues albums where there is no singing involved, so your description falls short right there.
I was reffering to the founding and most basic ideas. People started playingblues 'cause they were poor and stuff...mainly poor black guys in like the 20s and 30s singing and playing about their situation...and who the fuck says you need to sing to describe your situation? I've described plenty of stuff with my guitar.

I was kinda reffering to rock music...either way I've never heard of any of your Jazz musicians before and only 2 of the 3 rock bands you named. I didn't say the VU were THE FIRST AND ONLY to have a girl in them, but ONE of the first and even so the bands you listed must have been pretty damn close in terms of formation since the VU formed in like 63 or 64...I somehow doubt that ANY of the rock bands you listed are much older than that.

Punk is much more emotional than say...psychadelia mainly because punk is ALL about releasing your emotions, nothing else except musical freedomr really.

Don't get me wrong I love Hendrix other people I've mentioned but they are rarely quite as emotional as say...The Buzzcocks Ever Fallen In Love.

And Leadbelly's been described as the first person with the real punk attitude. Kinda/

[EneME]

I definently agree....but for some reason I just can't listen to punk. I like the message in the lyrics and the scene, but I usually can't stand listening to it. It's the only genre that I WISH I liked it lol but I just can't take it. Punk, country, and Mexican country music make my head hurt...

[Urban Rubble]

I've described plenty of stuff with my guitar.

Save the abstract, artsy bullshit for someone with fewer braincells. I don't care how "good" you are, a note on a guitar cannot convey a feeling. Now, something like the national anthem played by Hendrix can be emotional, but that is combining the meaning of the song with creative guitar sounds. A guitar noise on it's own does not desribe anything, no matter how much you want to believe it does.

Victor:

When I say that punk and hip hop are the only genre's that convey a message I mean that they're the only genre's based on conveying a message. More specifically, a positive message. Christian rock coneys a message, but I don't really count that as it isn't what I was talking about. I meant a relevant message.

You keep telling me I'm wrong without telling me why. Please, prove me wrong, don't just tell me I'm wrong. I mentioned reggae. Now, reggae has alot of concious lyrics that convey a message, HOWEVER, reggae itself is not based on that message. I think punk rock is, and always has been based on a message of non conformity and social change.

Edit: EnemE, what kind of music do you like ? Punk is a very diverse genre, I bet there are punk bands you could stand. You just need some guidance ! What are you into ?

[EneME]

Originally posted by Urban [email protected] 20 2004, 04:59 PM
Edit: EnemE, what kind of music do you like ? Punk is a very diverse genre, I bet there are punk bands you could stand. You just need some guidance ! What are you into ?
:lol: Well, thats my problem....I like EVERYTHING...that I can't categorize music at all. Whats ironic is that my boyf. is a punk :lol: I told him "figures I'd get with a punk, the only freakin genre that gives me a headache." I dunno...I like just about everything though. Is AFI punk? cuz I like them. I listen to trance, trip hop, hip hop, metal, salsa, spanish rock, jazz, r&b, old school rap....everything...thats why its so weird that I dont like it! Could be cause I really really love sad songs...and punk is so not sad. lmao

[The Forum Idiot]

You can convey a feeling and describe something easy on guitar, you can be bollocks at guitar and write a beautiful riff. In the same way you can convey a message...Doning it effectively so people can understand you clearly is different. But, if you're feeling sad for example, you can write an easy tune so when you ask people "what kind of mood do you think this song is about?" they'll know the answer's "sad." A couple days I described what I think an orgasm would be like on guitar...It sounded kinda rubbish but hey.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

I was reffering to the founding and most basic ideas. People started playingblues 'cause they were poor and stuff...mainly poor black guys in like the 20s and 30s singing and playing about their situation.

Okay...
But all music is an expression of one's situation.


and who the fuck says you need to sing to describe your situation? I've described plenty of stuff with my guitar.

You said that blues is about singing about your situation. That isn't true because a lot of blues does not involve singing.


I was kinda reffering to rock music...either way I've never heard of any of your Jazz musicians before and only 2 of the 3 rock bands you named. I didn't say the VU were THE FIRST AND ONLY to have a girl in them, but ONE of the first and even so the bands you listed must have been pretty damn close in terms of formation since the VU formed in like 63 or 64...I somehow doubt that ANY of the rock bands you listed are much older than that.

That may be so, but it's very inaccurate of you to say that punk was one of the first musical movements to involve women.

And The Velvet Underground was formed in 1965 and released their first single in '66. Leslie Gore was releasing stuff long before that.

That's just one example of how popular (even non R & B) music has included women since before punk.


Punk is much more emotional than say...psychadelia mainly because punk is ALL about releasing your emotions, nothing else except musical freedomr really.

Don't get me wrong I love Hendrix other people I've mentioned but they are rarely quite as emotional as say...The Buzzcocks Ever Fallen In Love.

That's definitely a matter of opinion.

Urban,
Both jazz and rock 'n roll were quite subversive and revolutionary in their early days. I'd like to disagree with you and say that reggae is too, but I'm not very familiar with that genre, unfortunately.

I appreciate punk's general attitude and disregard for the status quo, but I just can't seem to get angry at anything enough to relate to most punk music. I enjoy musical minimalism, but punk is just too heavy for me. Call me shallow in that respect, but I like something a little more mellow.

[The Forum Idiot]

Originally posted by [email protected] 20 2004, 08:33 PM
Okay...
But all music is an expression of one's situation.



You said that blues is about singing about your situation. That isn't true because a lot of blues does not involve singing.



That may be so, but it's very inaccurate of you to say that punk was one of the first musical movements to involve women.

And The Velvet Underground was formed in 1965 and released their first single in '66. Leslie Gore was releasing stuff long before that.

That's just one example of how popular (even non R & B) music has included women since before punk.



That's definitely a matter of opinion.

Urban,
Both jazz and rock 'n roll were quite subversive and revolutionary in their early days. I'd like to disagree with you and say that reggae is too, but I'm not very familiar with that genre, unfortunately.

I appreciate punk's general attitude and disregard for the status quo, but I just can't seem to get angry at anything enough to relate to most punk music. I enjoy musical minimalism, but punk is just too heavy for me. Call me shallow in that respect, but I like something a little more mellow.
Not all music is about your situation. That comment's more ignorant than anything I've said and I'm only 13.
Take Led Zep's Immigrant Song, Sublime's Date Rape, most stuff by Iron Maiden, DragonForce, etc

And I never said blues was just about singing...I know a lot of its playing which is why I said "singing and playing."

Punk was one of the first musical movements which took pride and was about supporting having women with 'em. It had no limits or conformities to it. Which is why I love it.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Not all music is about your situation.

Directly or indirectly, yes it is.
It's about expressing one's feelings and attitudes. Feelings and attitudes are direct results of one's conditions.


That comment's more ignorant than anything I've said and I'm only 13.

That would explain a lot.


Take Led Zep's Immigrant Song, Sublime's Date Rape, most stuff by Iron Maiden, DragonForce, etc

Not to defend Sublime and Dragon Force, but I’m sure that there are plenty of vulgar, meaningless punk songs.


Punk was one of the first musical movements which took pride and was about supporting having women with 'em. It had no limits or conformities to it. Which is why I love it.

One of the first doesn't matter. Believe what you want, but punk was not the first form of music to be subversive and revolutionary in spirit. And like I said, there were countless female musicians prior to the punk movement.

[The Forum Idiot]

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2004, 08:50 PM
Directly or indirectly, yes it is.
It's about expressing one's feelings and attitudes. Feelings and attitudes are direct results of one's conditions.



That would explain a lot.



Not to defend Sublime and Dragon Force, but I’m sure that there are plenty of vulgar, meaningless punk songs.



One of the first doesn't matter. Believe what you want, but punk was not the first form of music to be subversive and revolutionary in spirit. And like I said, there were countless female musicians prior to the punk movement.
Were there any hard rock women?

Sublime's Date Rape IS a semi-punk song but I'm pretty sure the singer isn't a rapist and I doubt he ever actually saw a rape. I NEVER said they were MEAINGLESS. just that they don't represent someone's situation, ESPECIALLY not DragonForce, have you ever heard DragonForce? They sing about bloody dragons and everything. That may be the "situation of what they're interested in" or something but if you treat everything like that then you can knock down the boundaries which define a genre. You could say punk music is progressivebecuase it progresses through a verse to a chorus and back...You wouldn't but you could.

Yes there are probably plenty of meaningless punk songs, but according to you're "situation" thing they can't be totally meaningless can they? You've just contradicted yourself.

Also, Don't be one of those motherfuckers who judges me because I'm 13...I know plenty of people older than me who haven't a damn clue wh che was, and some probably haven't ever heard of communism. (I won'ttry to see because they're the kind of thugs who hit when confused).

[Urban Rubble]

Again, I have to say that I disagre with TheIdiot in neary every way.

I reply further tomorrow.

[dopediana]

Sublime's Date Rape IS a semi-punk song but I'm pretty sure the singer isn't a rapist and I doubt he ever actually saw a rape

firstly, the only sublime song that i hate more than "the wrong way" is "date rape." sublime has freakin´AWESOME music and you have to mention the worst song? please. try ´pool shark´, ´same in the end´, ´seed´, new thrash, ebin, hope, and all you need.

second of all, bradley nowell was a great guy. he was also a junkie. liked to fuck (one song called mary goes "fifteen years old plus one, hotter than a microwave oven"), and i hope to god he never raped anyone but trust me, he probably was around plenty of it.

thirdly, sublime is punk to the max. however, the thing about sublime is they had every style down-pat, they could dodge all over the board and do it with class, punk, reggae, acoustic, hiphop, you name it.

[Dr. Rosenpenis]

Were there any hard rock women?

Janis Joplin, Fleetwood Mac, Jefferson Airplane, etc.
They were all rock, whether it's hard rock or not doesn't really matter and it's often hard to distinguish.


Sublime's Date Rape IS a semi-punk song but I'm pretty sure the singer isn't a rapist and I doubt he ever actually saw a rape. I NEVER said they were MEAINGLESS. just that they don't represent someone's situation

When i said meaningless, I meant that it fails to send a meaningful message.

And like I said, all music is isnpired by one's situation and surrounding.


ESPECIALLY not DragonForce, have you ever heard DragonForce? They sing about bloody dragons and everything. That may be the "situation of what they're interested in" or something but if you treat everything like that then you can knock down the boundaries which define a genre.

Genre has nothing to do with what kind of message the music portrays or how it's influenced.


You could say punk music is progressivebecuase it progresses through a verse to a chorus and back...You wouldn't but you could.

No, you actually couldn't. Not rationally, anyway.

I realize that you may be trying to point out that it's as absurd to say that all music is inspired by one's situation as it is to call punk progressive. However, all music is inspired by one's situation and thus is a reflection of one's surroundings and environment. Punk, though, is by no means progressive. Progressive does not mean that the songs progress. It means that the genre itself is a progression of mainstream rock.

[The Forum Idiot]

That's my point. I'd just like to ask what in their situation inspired DragonForce?

Also, to the guy who flamed Date Rape I know he was a junkie and everything but that doesn't make him a rapist. "I can't take pity on men of this kind" he says on date rape. If its anything to do with him its he probably saw something on the news which can't count. Date Rape rules (so does Same In The End...some kinda bluesy moments...very nice). I'd say on the whole they're more ska though...ska-punky...But yes, pretty punky...however I bet most people here would disagree cause they reckon all punk is angry and shit.

Also my dad said Janis Joplin was like hard blues...I wouldn't know and I know there's not but difference but that's why I didn't mention her myself...

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

I will begin this post by offering a disclaimer:

Up until I moved to Montreal two months ago I played guitar and screamed backing vocals in an anti-authoritan "hardcore band". Prior to that I spent my entire high school career Listening to Marilyn's Vitamins, Dillinger Four, etc. and writing songs inspired by them. My favorite band is CRASS. I was actively involved in my "punk scene" and hope to start a band in Montreal. In other words, I am well accquainted with punk, and am not attacking it based on some narrow-minded dislike of some poorly informed conception of punk. I am attacking it from a grounds of, what I believe, is a better than average understanding of it . . .

(1) Punk is a commodity, it represents the extreme of capitalism's ability to detooth a revolutionary idea and sell it. Because the "idea" of punk, the narratives, the aesthetic, etc. have been intigrated into the spectacle and made absolutely harmless, we, as revolutionaries, have an obligation to move past it. Only be introducing new radically challenging ideas can there be any progress - in 1977 "God Save The Queen" may have been frightening but it isn't now - it's a way to sell shitty records. We must not remain static! Punk is dead - we must move forward to a new "punk".

(2) Punk, as in the music, is valuable in its simplicity - absolutely anybody can write a punk song. Therefore, I believe this aspect is worth reclaiming - but we must take it out of its current context! We must make punk rock that is not punk, but challenging and revolutionary. Fuck Sublime, fuck Fleetwood Mac, fuck Janis Joplin, The Buzzcocks and everything in between, because they're all dead - they're products that we're passively consuming, and every we time buy in we lose. Once we accept that, we can start pillaging the corpses for anything worth stealing.

(3)
Mr Pop ( laugh.gif ) is missing two words: destruction and anarchy.
Mr. Pop isn't missing them, they're not there. When I was in junior high, I thought they were there - I learned better. Punk doesn't destroy anything worth destroying. It kicks over its mailboxes in the name of anarchy, but it doesn't go far enough to threaten anything. It's a safe way to vent our rage (Kicking over a mailbox) we can pretend we're threatening, and EMI/Epifat/etc. can take our cash, and after an hour in the mosh pit the system is alive and strong.

Ever feel as though you've been cheated?

[The Forum Idiot]

Err...so you're saying to be "punks" we have to not be "punks"? I'm awful confused but I get your drift....*writes something as controversial as God Save The Queen but very different*

[Vanilla Coke Kid]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2004, 12:20 PM

firstly, the only sublime song that i hate more than "the wrong way" is "date rape." sublime has freakin´AWESOME music and you have to mention the worst song? please. try ´pool shark´, ´same in the end´, ´seed´, new thrash, ebin, hope, and all you need.

second of all, bradley nowell was a great guy. he was also a junkie. liked to fuck (one song called mary goes "fifteen years old plus one, hotter than a microwave oven"), and i hope to god he never raped anyone but trust me, he probably was around plenty of it.

thirdly, sublime is punk to the max. however, the thing about sublime is they had every style down-pat, they could dodge all over the board and do it with class, punk, reggae, acoustic, hiphop, you name it.
1. You....HATE DATE RAPE!?!? It's one of the best songs by them. It was Sublime's answer to Rape Me by Nirvana. Same Meaning, different chords. Meh, you have your opinion, I have mine.

2. OK, that's all true until you said he probably raped someone. If listen, Date Rape is an ANTI-Rape song. ANTI-Rape. Ergo, if he Raped someone, that would make Brad a hypocrite, which he hated.

3. In terms of riffs, Sublime aren't Punk, as Punk is pretty Simple, whereas Sublime had complicated riffs for Guitar, Bass and Drums. But lyrically they are, as Punk's all about speaking what's on your mind and in your heart which Sublime did.

[The Forum Idiot]

1)There's NO similarity between Rape Me and Date Rape except in name.

2)He implied that Brad might have been around people who had been raped/were rapists. I doubt that though. I know a few addicts who aren't around rapists (admittedly they aren't exactly smack heads but same dif).

3)That's very ignorrant VCK - punk riffs can be complex or simple, that's the thing with punk. And, to be honest, Sublime are pretty simple in terms of beat and riff make up. The chords are tough sure but the riffs are easy.

[Vanilla Coke Kid]

1) OK, except they were like one of the band's most famous songs. It's like comparing What I Got to SLTS or Santeria to CAYA.

2) He did kinda say that he might've raped someone.

3) A lot of the Punk stuff I've heard is simple. MDC, The Descendents, some of The Sex Pistols and The Clash, Bad Religion, hell, even Nirvana if they count. And it pretty much gave me the impression Punk is simple. Meh, it's like saying Metal only sings about suicide.

[The Forum Idiot]

Yea!

The Offspring and Green Day have some not very simple riffs, MY band (which is punkpost-grunge) have some complex riffs. And there are more if you seek them out.