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View Full Version : which socialist are you?



Nas
2nd September 2004, 03:59
There are a few questions that point up some of the big differences among socialisms:

-Do advocates of this ideology say that socialism should come about through revolution (e.g. Maoism, Leninism, Trotskyism, revolutionary Marxism) or through reform (e.g. Fabianism, reformist Marxism), or do they view both as possible (e.g. syndicalism, various Marxisms) or do they fail to address the question of how a socialist society would be achieved (e.g. utopian socialisms)?

-Do they advocate centralized state control of the socialized sectors of the economy (e.g. Leninism), or control of that sector by worker councils (e.g. syndicalism, left and council communism, anarcho-communism)? This is usually cast by socialists in terms of "ownership of the means of production." None of the social democratic parties of Europe advocate total state ownership of the means of production in their contemporary demands and popular press, but most contain language and ideas in their platform which state that in the event the capitalists fail to meet up to their end of the social contract, that the workers have the legitimate historical basis to assume or seize total control of the means of production, should those conditions ever arise in the future. Almost all Social-Democratic parties hold that state control of certain sectors of the economy is vital for the general public interest.

- Do they advocate that the power of the worker's councils should itself constitute a state form as socialism in the form of a direct democracy and the use of the referendum and the proposition, or do they state that socialism entails that there should be a legislative body administered by people who would be elected as a representative or republican form of government? In other words, through what legal and political apparatus will the workers maintain and further develop this socialization of the means of production?

-Do they advocate total or near-total socialization of the economy (e.g. revolutionary Marxism, Stalinism, Leninism, Trotskyism, Left and Council Communism, anarcho-syndicalism and syndicalism), or a mixed market economy (e.g Bernsteinism, reformism, reformist Marxism)? Mixed economies, in turn, can range anywhere from those developed by the social democratic governments that have periodically governed Northern and Western European countries to the inclusion of small cooperatives in the economy of Yugoslavia under Josip Broz Tito. In a related, but not identical, question, do they advocate a fairer society within the bounds of capitalism (e.g. most social democrats) or the total overthrow of the capitalist system (most Marxists).

-Did the ideology arise largely as a philosophical construct (e.g. libertarian socialism), or in the heat of a revolution (e.g. early Marxism, Leninism), or as the product of a ruling party (e.g. Castroism, Stalinism), or as the product of a party or other group contending for political power in a democratic society (e.g. social democracy).

-Does the ideology systematically say that the "bourgeois liberties" (such as those guaranteed by the U.S. First Amendment or the Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union) are to be preserved (or even enhanced) in a socialist society (e.g. social democracy), or are undesirable (e.g. Maoism), or have they said different things at different times (e.g. Marx and Engels), or is this a dividing point within the ideology (e.g. different strains of Trotskyism)?

-Does their critique of the existing system center on the ownership of the means of production (e.g. Marxism), on the nature of mass and equitable distribution (e.g. most forms of utopian socialism), or on opposition to industrialism as well as capitalism (common where socialism intersects green politics)? Utopian Socialists, like Robert Owen and Saint-Simon argued, though not from exactly the same perspective, that the injustices and poverty of the societies they lived in was a problem of distribution of the goods created. Marxian Socialists, on the other hand, determined that the root of the injustices is based not in the function of distribution of goods already created, but rather that the ownership of the means of production was in private hands. Also, Marxian Socialists maintain, in contrast to the Utopian Socialists, that the root of injustice is not in how goods (commodities) are distributed, but for whose economic benefit are they produced and sold.

-Which governments does the ideology regard as practicing or moving toward socialism and which does the ideology not regard as doing so? For example, in the era of the Soviet Union, western socialists were bitterly divided as to whether the Soviet Union was basically socialist, moving toward socialism, or inherently un-socialist and, in fact, inimical to true socialism. Similarly, today the government of the People's Republic of China claims to be socialist and refers to its own approach as "Socialism with Chinese characteristics," but most other self-identified socialists consider China to be essentially capitalist, albeit with a strong state sector. The Chinese leadership concurs with most of the usual critiques against a command economy, and many of their actions to manage what they call a socialist economy support this.

Note also that while many would say that socialism is defined by state ownership and state planning of the means of production and economic life, a certain degree of such state ownership and planning is common in economies that would almost universally be considered capitalist. In Canada, Crown Corporations are responsible for various sectors of the economy deemed to be of strategic importance to the people (for example power generation). In the U.S., a semi-private central bank with close ties to the federal government, the Federal Reserve, regulates lending rates, serving as a "bank of banks." Also, governments in capitalist nations typically run the post office, libraries, national parks, highways, and (in the case of the US) NASA. Interestingly, though, the federal government's monopoly on space travel from U.S. take-off sites is itself a thing of the past -- as of 2004 private capital is entering even that field.

State, provincial, and local governments operate and own power companies and other utilities, parks, mass transit including rail and airports, and schools including universities. Capitalist governments also frequently subsidize or otherwise influence (though do not own) various sectors of the economy, such as automotive, weapons, oil (petrol), aerospace, and agriculture.

In the post WWII political (lexicon), this sort of economic state planning (if not even ownership) became integral to stabilization of the global economy, and has come to be known as Keynesian after John Maynard Keynes.

Conversely, Chinese economic reform under Deng Xiaoping has been characterized by decreasing state ownership of the economy, the replacement of central planning mechanisms with market based ones used in Western capitalist nations, and a marked lack of governmental social welfare services found in capitalist nations. However, because the legitimacy of the Communist Party of China is based on the premise that China has already made a transition to socialism, the government insists that it is a socialist government.

(taken from Wikipedia.com)

Conghaileach
2nd September 2004, 13:56
What the hell is a reform Marxist? It sounds like a contradiction in terms, as Marxism is essentially a conflict theory.

__ca va?
2nd September 2004, 14:38
What the hell is a reform Marxist? It sounds like a contradiction in terms, as Marxism is essentially a conflict theory.

The keyword is theory and not conflict. You can always reform a theory.

Which socialist am I?
I found these suitable for me:

through reform (e.g. Fabianism, reformist Marxism)


they state that socialism entails that there should be a legislative body administered by people who would be elected as a representative or republican form of government If this one means it's like a parliamental democracy. I couldn't comprehend it well :unsure:


a mixed market economy (e.g Bernsteinism, reformism, reformist Marxism)


as the product of a party or other group contending for political power in a democratic society (e.g. social democracy).

The government moving the society towards socialism must be a democratically elected one. (This option is maybe even harder than a revolution :lol: )
I, myself consider China to be China to be essentially capitalist, albeit with a strong state sector


on the nature of mass and equitable distribution (e.g. most forms of utopian socialism

Agree with this too:

Also, Marxian Socialists maintain, in contrast to the Utopian Socialists, that the root of injustice is not in how goods (commodities) are distributed, but for whose economic benefit are they produced and sold.


I don't think that the two are in a contradiction. :huh:

So I turned out to be a social democrat (which I have always considered myself) or a reformist Marxist. But I don't really know anything about reformist Marxism, so could someone tell me something about it?