Why DON'T you revolt?

[Y2A]

I always hear people here talk about revolution this and revolution that. My question is, why don't you revolt?

[Capitalist Imperial]

Because they'd get their asses kicked.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 06:58 PM
I always hear people here talk about revolution this and revolution that. My question is, why don't you revolt?
do you know what war is (excepted from games an tv)?

[Spartacus2002]

because we dont really believe it that much apparently or we would, but remember its not something you just pull out of your ass and go hey lets revolt it takes time.

[DaCuBaN]

Actually, revolt is something you just 'pull out your ass' - but I'll assume you intended to intone that the conditions for such revolt are not present.

The question then must be asked: If revolt is the way forward, why do so many waste their time with 'democracy'?

[gaf]

Originally posted by Capitalist [email protected] 25 2004, 07:12 PM
Because they'd get their asses kicked.
try to kick mine i'll get milk out of your nose
but it won't be revolution .would it be?

[gaf]

i have to ad something...with a quote



from capitalist imperial
"Without the initiative, invention, and innovation inherent to the individual within free competition, and the resulting benefit to everyone, the entire collective of mankind ceases to progress." Capitalist Imperial



you're ignorant and arrogant but i'd like to kick your arse in a fair fight were the progress of man kind could get a boost.if you come alone that is :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[YKTMX]

This is a stupid thread even by the usual standards of OI.

"We" will revolt but only when the working class of the world are ready and willing to make the revolution themselves. It's not about "individuals", but I suppose you would struggle to comprehend that.

[Individual]

I think Y2A's on about seventy-five percent of this board, give or take, that tramp around screaming revolution like it is some form of game..

It certainly is a valid question when hearing all of this talk about how degrading the conditions that most of you claim you live in.

The point is to throw it back in the faces of those that are ignorant.

Revolution, let's revolt against the US! I only have one computer, I'm ready to kill those bastards!

All of you real Marxists should be questioning the same thing, go figure.

[YKTMX]

I think Y2A's on about seventy-five percent of this board, give or take, that tramp around screaming revolution like it is some form of game..

I think you are attributing too much intelligence to Y2A.

There is a lot of naivety on this board but that is to be expected - it's not as if this board represents the worldwide "left".

[DaCuBaN]

I think you are attributing too much intelligence to Y2A.


I think you're selling Y2A short, and jumping on the bandwagon of popular opinion. That or you can't hold a discussion with someone who differs on fundamental viewpoints from yourself...

[YKTMX]

I think you're selling Y2A short, and jumping on the bandwagon of popular opinion

What the hell are you talking about? What popular opinion?

If I'm selling Y2A short then he can say so for himself. Maybe you are right and this thread is aimed in particular at the "naive" section of the board; or maybe he was referring to all of us because he doesn't understand the basic tenets of revolutionary Marxism.


or you can't hold a discussion with someone who differs on fundamental viewpoints from yourself...

Oh, just shut up. I spend all my time on this board debating with people with "a diffirent viewpoint".

I think you should maybe take a breath before your next bout of rubbish.

[Individual]

This isn't about Y2A, so settle it.

You are now resorting to attacking intelligence instead of defending a point.

Why don't you revolt? Honestly?

[YKTMX]

I've already the addressed the point, it's not about "us" revolting, it's about the workers of the world "revolting"

[DaCuBaN]

Not to further derail this thread, but I think you should really step back and take a look at what you just said. I apologise if my post came across as an 'attack', but it was not. You merely perceived it as such.

Anyway, inspect:


I spend all my time on this board debating with people with "a diffirent viewpoint".

I think you should maybe take a breath before your next bout of rubbish.


it's not about "us" revolting, it's about the workers of the world "revolting"

If we do not agitate, who the hell will?

[YKTMX]

That or you can't hold a discussion with someone who differs on fundamental viewpoints from yourself...

What would you call that?


If we do not agitate, who the hell will?

Agitation is diffrent from revolution.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 07:56 PM
i have to ad something...with a quote



from capitalist imperial
"Without the initiative, invention, and innovation inherent to the individual within free competition, and the resulting benefit to everyone, the entire collective of mankind ceases to progress." Capitalist Imperial



you're ignorant and arrogant but i'd like to kick your arse in a fair fight were the progress of man kind could get a boost.if you come alone that is :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Let's do this son...

...come get some, sucka!

And when you call someone ignorant, try to use proper English in conveying your opinion.

[DaCuBaN]

What would you call that [statement]?

Painfully accurate? ;)
Seriously though, it's a common trait for people to get on their 'high horse' in discussion, and that was the intent. I think however we should stop derailing the thread...


Agitation is diffrent from revolution.

I quite agree, it's the precursor. It's essentially the means to 'incite' rebellion and hence revolution. Hence the question still stands...

[YKTMX]

Painfully accurate?

Painfully innacurate.


Seriously though, it's a common trait for people to get on their 'high horse' in discussion, and that was the intent. I think however we should stop derailing the thread...

Stop posting silly posts attacking me then. I was getting on any "high horse", I questioned the intention of this thread. If I'm wrong then I'll happily retract it.


I quite agree, it's the precursor. It's essentially the means to 'incite' rebellion and hence revolution. Hence the question still stands...

No, it doesn't. I support agitation by revolutionaries but it's ordinary people that make revolutions.

[DaCuBaN]

Who are these mythical 'revolutionaries' that you speak of? Are we not all in the same boat together?

Again the question still stands: There is no such thing as 'ordinary people' - just more people. So who will start the ball rolling? Who will agitate to increase awareness?

Why DON'T you revolt?

[YKTMX]

Who are these mythical 'revolutionaries' that you speak of? Are we not all in the same boat together?

Again the question still stands: There is no such thing as 'ordinary people' - just more people. So who will start the ball rolling? Who will agitate to increase awareness?

Why DON'T you revolt?




Haha, this is absolute nonsense.

The mythical Revolutionaries are the thousands of people that are members of revolutionary socialist organizations like the SWP, SSP, Communist Party, whatever. You obviously haven't been involved in real struggle if you are wondering when the "ball will start rolling".

Stop repeating the question, it's silly. I do lots of agitating but I am not willing to take up arms against the British state quite yet.

[Individual]

I do lots of agitating but I am not willing to take up arms against the British state quite yet.

That is the answer I believe Y2A was looking for from the beginning.

So don't you think it's just as silly to tramp around screaming revolution? :)

[DaCuBaN]

I think I'll leave this for the cappies to point out the contradictions made in your last two posts. I don't want to 'sully' the good name of 'revolutionary socialist organisations' :lol:

I'll say this though: When you're right, you're right - I don't participate in such organisations - I consider them a complete waste of time and effort. It's sectarian nonsense if you ask me.

[YKTMX]

...this brick wall is beginning to hurt my head.


So don't you think it's just as silly to tramp around screaming revolution?

No, because revolution isn't about "me" taking up arms. It's about the mass of people changing the world for themselves.

[YKTMX]

I'll say this though: When you're right, you're right - I don't participate in such organisations - I consider them a complete waste of time and effort. It's sectarian nonsense if you ask me.

No one did.

[DaCuBaN]

Thoe three words speak volumes. You expect to emancipate the working class with that attitude?

'Do me a lemon'

[YKTMX]

The emancipation of the working class is the act of the working class.

Go read a book.

[Guest1]

DaCuBaN and AQ reach a position my cat wouldn't take after eating a full bush of catnip.

I love the ganja too boys, but seriously, there is such a thing as too much drugs.

[BOZG]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 10:23 PM
I'll say this though: When you're right, you're right - I don't participate in such organisations - I consider them a complete waste of time and effort. It's sectarian nonsense if you ask me.
Then what exactly do you plan on doing? Sit around and hope that the workers will rally themselves up. How exactly do you agitate?

[BOZG]

And before someone comes in with a vanguard jibes, I'm not talking about Leninism but about the revolutionary left in general, from Leninists to anarchists who recognise the need for revolutionary organisations.

[Kez]

why dont we revolt...we do...we are...its not one big bang boom event you muppet, it takes time, and those who do take the time in working with the workers know when the revolution will take place, those on the sidelines wont, simple as that.

[DaCuBaN]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 09:38 PM
The emancipation of the working class is the act of the working class.
Then why join an orgnasation hell-bent on doing it for them? I've made my opinion of political parties well known on this board...


Then what exactly do you plan on doing? Sit around and hope that the workers will rally themselves up. How exactly do you agitate?

And before someone comes in with a vanguard jibes, I'm not talking about Leninism but about the revolutionary left in general, from Leninists to anarchists who recognise the need for revolutionary organisations.

You see this is it: I don't! I reject the idea of revolution, something I did think I'd made abundantly clear. Given that there have been numerous revolutions worldwide in the last two centuries - all of which failed or degenerated into pseudo-socialism let alone communism - I think there is a fair amount of evidence to substantiate the claim that revolt is a waste of time and effort.

As to agititation, again I don't! Unless you consider trying to discuss the topic with everyone who'll give me the time of day; To try and hear what people really want from life.

Your own experience will surely tell you that whilst people (in this country anyway) want change, revolt is not on the cards for them.


I love the ganja too boys, but seriously, there is such a thing as too much drugs.

Firstly, I only smoke pot and take shrooms. I cut everything else out of my life before I was even sixteen - including alcohol consumption (unless you count a beer after work on a friday) and in the case of shrooms I only get near them once a year.

Whilst we're on the subject, I haven't even so much as seen a joint in well over a week. Perhaps this is the source of my 'confusion'? :lol: ;)

[YKTMX]

What the hell are you doing here then, if it's all just a waste of time?

Don't even get me started on your CC membership.

[BOZG]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 11:15 PM
You see this is it: I don't! I reject the idea of revolution, something I did think I'd made abundantly clear. Given that there have been numerous revolutions worldwide in the last two centuries - all of which failed or degenerated into pseudo-socialism let alone communism - I think there is a fair amount of evidence to substantiate the claim that revolt is a waste of time and effort.

As to agititation, again I don't! Unless you consider trying to discuss the topic with everyone who'll give me the time of day; To try and hear what people really want from life.

Your own experience will surely tell you that whilst people (in this country anyway) want change, revolt is not on the cards for them.
Revolt is a waste of time because previous attempts have failed???? Great logic. I'm sure every single revolution in the past was successful on it's first attempt. Do you think every revolutionary development in history just happened overnight?

You cannot always base your opinions on what people want from life right now. We constantly go through periods of reaction, of racism, of an almost regressive consciousness. It is not enough to listen to what people want from life at this moment.

No, revolt is not on the cards right now, but what's your point? No one argues that Britain is a hotbed of revolution, this point is that we agitate so that it turns in that direction. Can we do that on our own? No, not really, material conditions must also develop in that direction. But regardless, we don't sit around waiting for the moment to happen, we work and prepare for it in the meantime.

[Raisa]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 06:58 PM
why don't you revolt?
Why dont you go eat a Big Mac?

[DaCuBaN]

You cannot always base your opinions on what people want from life right now. We constantly go through periods of reaction, of racism, of an almost regressive consciousness. It is not enough to listen to what people want from life at this moment.

I do agree - however In my own experience when people listen to you (really listen) it tends to make you stop and think. The next time you meet that person they've often spent some time in contemplation on the subject, and seldom will they have drawn any real conclusions...


No, revolt is not on the cards right now, but what's your point? No one argues that Britain is a hotbed of revolution, this point is that we agitate so that it turns in that direction. Can we do that on our own? No, not really, material conditions must also develop in that direction. But regardless, we don't sit around waiting for the moment to happen, we work and prepare for it in the meantime.


Prepare in what way? Stockpiling weapons and ammunition?

Seriously though, why must this be done from within political organisations such as the SWP? Why can we not just do it all on our own heads, without political affiliation?

It is that that I consider sectarian.

[Guest1]

Revolution does not involve stockpiling weapons and arms. It involves unions occupying factories and collectivizing them.

The government will, once it reaches the critical mass, bring out the army. It is at that point that the arms come into play. Stop thinking about it as a military campaign, because that's a superficial side-effect of revolution.

[DaCuBaN]

And I am in no way opposed to a peaceful revolt, the stockpiling arms comment was tongue in cheek - I should have done more to emphasise that fact.


Seriously though, why must this be done from within political organisations such as the SWP? Why can we not just do it all on our own heads, without political affiliation?

This is the point that I was getting at.

[Vinny Rafarino]

It appears we have a more kids that are too stupid too keep their mouths shut.

The brilliance of you plan is breathtaking. :lol:


The question then must be asked: If revolt is the way forward, why do so many waste their time with 'democracy'?

This from the cat that thinks the "energy certificate" is a brilliant idea.

Are you saying that revolt angainst the ruling class is not a viable option?

Are you "comfortable" with the way things are?


Who are these mythical 'revolutionaries' that you speak of? Are we not all in the same boat together?

No my son, there are those of us that are "on the boat" and there are those of you, such as yourself and AQ, that are simply not worth saving.


So don't you think it's just as silly to tramp around screaming revolution?


:lol: why are you still even here?


I'll say this though: When you're right, you're right - I don't participate in such organisations - I consider them a complete waste of time and effort. It's sectarian nonsense if you ask me

Fortunately enough it's the opinions of people like yourself that we really don't care about.


Thoe three words speak volumes. You expect to emancipate the working class with that attitude?


Actually, we expect the emancipation of the working class after we rid ourselves of individuals like you.

Baby steps boy, baby steps.


You see this is it: I don't! I reject the idea of revolution, something I did think I'd made abundantly clear

And the hammer dropped.



Don't even get me started on your CC membership.


Why? It is now obvious that we should MOST DEFINITELY get started on his CC membership.


Prepare in what way? Stockpiling weapons and ammunition?

Taking out the trash is a good start.

[DaCuBaN]

Are you saying that revolt angainst the ruling class is not a viable option?

I'm saying I do not advocate it, not that I oppose it.


Are you "comfortable" with the way things are?


Not in the slightest - I've made it abundantly clear that I am an anti-capitalist as the system does not even reward people for their efforts monetarily, when that is the sole principal that holds it up.

I'd even take your brand of 'communism' over that, RAF.


Fortunately enough it's the opinions of people like yourself that we really don't care about.

If you can't beat 'em, crush 'em?


Actually, we expect the emancipation of the working class after we rid ourselves of individuals like you.

I really do think they should force you to wear that 'Pre-Established Bastard' title again :lol: Are you saying that you yourself have no plans as to how to assist us all in emancipating ourselves?


And the hammer dropped

:lol:
You're getting blind, old man. Search back to when I first joined the board: Myself and Redstar2000 had a lengthy discussion on revolt and reform: There was no doubt as to my leanings.

Do keep up!

[robob8706]

Because we lack support as of now.

[DaCuBaN]

Because we lack support as of now

You've just become my personal best friend, as the only person to succesfully answer the question. :)

[robob8706]

Why thank you best friend.

[Micah EL Layl]

peace....
revolt????
im working on it......
i mean my brothers in the UFO's could detroy the USA
government tonite if they wished.....
but for some reason they ain't doin shit....
but im workin on it......

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 08:58 PM
I always hear people here talk about revolution this and revolution that. My question is, why don't you revolt?
What does it mean to revolt? What do you think we should do? All band together, buy a gun and run around the streets shooting at policemen?

That's a sure fire way to getting yourelf killed or arrested and what, in terms of class struggle, will you have achieved.

Revolution is a scientific concept. It's a conclusion made after analysis of history and of capitalism. It is an inevitable consequence of class struggle. It isn't a bunch of teenagers running around playing at soldiers.

What is revolution? It is people, namly the workers, who want to re-organise society. That is, the majority of people in society understanding their role within it and having the desire to change it. At this point the bosses will use everything in their power to try and stop us. This is when violence happens. When it becomes necessary to defend outselves. That is what is meant by revolution.

Any class confrontation of this nature will arise out of a long period of antagonism between workers and their bosses. There will be decades of boiling up and boiling up before it becomes necessary to defend ourselves in such a militant way.

Your question is ridiculous and unfair, becase you first have no idea what revolution means, secondly you are attempting to make us all look like fools. Well, if you want to restart this thread, with a well thought out and formulated argument against the idea of a revolution, then please, we are all waiting for it. Otherwise shut the fuck up, because it is you who is looking like the fool. You talk as if you understand communism, when in fact, you dont!

[The New Yorker]

Good question

Probably because for the most part. these guys are pussy suburb kids whose parents are rich, and have had every thing handed to them in life(much like there founder Karl Marx). Then all of a sudden they have a hard on for the proletarian.

Give them the communism they seem to want so much and they will cry.


didn't Fidel lead the revolution with 14 guys and 12 rifles? quiet impressive.

Now you suburb kids just need to get your daddys to buy you some rifles. Then gather your friends together and hide up in the mountains and start the revolution. I know that revolution wont last more then 2 days when you gather around the camp fire and start telling ghost stories, get scared and run to mommy and daddy.

[gaf]

Originally posted by Capitalist [email protected] 25 2004, 08:50 PM
Let's do this son...

...come get some, sucka!

And when you call someone ignorant, try to use proper English in conveying your opinion.
you're are not the first one to use my bad english as an excuse but yeah this milk out of your nose will stay white :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[gaf]

Originally posted by The New [email protected] 26 2004, 07:35 AM
Good question

Probably because for the most part. these guys are pussy suburb kids whose parents are rich, and have had every thing handed to them in life(much like there founder Karl Marx). Then all of a sudden they have a hard on for the proletarian.

Give them the communism they seem to want so much and they will cry.


didn't Fidel lead the revolution with 14 guys and 12 rifles? quiet impressive.

Now you suburb kids just need to get your daddys to buy you some rifles. Then gather your friends together and hide up in the mountains and start the revolution. I know that revolution wont last more then 2 days when you gather around the camp fire and start telling ghost stories, get scared and run to mommy and daddy.
if you ever put once your own asse into a greassy life then you will surely be what you not are :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
and if not than pitty you will/are just become a fuckin faschist. :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:
quote again
didn't Fidel lead the revolution with 14 guys and 12 rifles? quiet impressive


yeah but it wasn't rambo :lol: :lol:

[Y2A]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 02:33 AM
Because we lack support as of now.
And why do you think this is so?

[Y2A]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 07:12 PM
do you know what war is (excepted from games an tv)?
No, I think I understand perfectly well. However, I do see people on this board that denounce any use of violence yet advocate revolution and revolutions around the world. They are the ones that think it is "bloodless" not me.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 03:37 PM
And why do you think this is so?
are you a revolutionaire shrink?
just relax sit down

BECAUSE OF ASSEHOLE LIKE YOU!
but you know that .(that you are an assehole)
only to stupid to realize it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[YKTMX]

No, I think I understand perfectly well. However, I do see people on this board that denounce any use of violence yet advocate revolution and revolutions around the world. They are the ones that think it is "bloodless" not me.

The problem for the apologists when it comes to denoucing revolution in a "anti-violence" way is that it seems to assume that todays world is without violence or death. This is clearly not the case - in fact the capitalist era has been the bloodiest in human history.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 03:40 PM
No, I think I understand perfectly well. However, I do see people on this board that denounce any use of violence yet advocate revolution and revolutions around the world. They are the ones that think it is "bloodless" not me.
that's why i'ts not working,and won't work but again don't push people agaisnt the wall
they will fight back.( or better do it quick then) may be bush is the best instrument for revolution.who knows?

[Y2A]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 03:43 PM
are you a revolutionaire shrink?
just relax sit down

BECAUSE OF ASSEHOLE LIKE YOU!
but you know that .(that you are an assehole)
only to stupid to realize it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Do you people see why I find it so difficult to find an actual logical debate on these boards?

[Y2A]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 03:46 PM

The problem for the apologists when it comes to denoucing revolution in a "anti-violence" way is that it seems to assume that todays world is without violence or death. This is clearly not the case - in fact the capitalist era has been the bloodiest in human history.
If by "The capitalism era" you mean the period between now and Adam Smith's publication of "The wealth of nations", then has been the "bloodiest" because of advances in technology of war, not because of "capitalism".

[YKTMX]

bloodiest" because of advances in technology of war, not because of "capitalism".

So countries where just fighting to test their new weapons were they? (Maybe at Hiroshima and Nagasaki actually). It is because of capitalism because the profit motive and need for "new markets" compels nations to war with each other.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 04:11 PM
Do you people see why I find it so difficult to find an actual logical debate on these boards?
everything is relative

[revolutionindia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 09:10 PM
No, I think I understand perfectly well. However, I do see people on this board that denounce any use of violence yet advocate revolution and revolutions around the world. They are the ones that think it is "bloodless" not me.
Ever heard of Gandhi and martin luthre king? :)

[Eastside Revolt]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 04:49 PM
Ever heard of Gandhi and martin luthre king? :)
Well, don't make the mistake of thinking that ghandi didn't send millions to their death. And even Martin Luther King was starting to understand the need for physical resistance, near the end.

As for why "I" don't revolt, it is because you need a group.

It's obvious to anyone that there isn't popular support for a revolution, currently in the west. Personally I'm torn as to what will be the most effective way to sway the masses toward revolution, or revolt.

Do you chant in the streets and get your ass beaten by cops? Like the anti globalization protesters? Or do we kill businessmen, rob banks, shoot innocent people for having seen our faces, and spread propaganda? Like the red brigades, or the RAF?

[robob8706]

QUOTE (robob8706 @ Aug 26 2004, 02:33 AM)
Because we lack support as of now.


And why do you think this is so?


Communists lack support because in the last century there has been countless communist failures, so the world's populous has a bad conception of communism while at the same time, most people are apathetic and don't care to look into communism because they automatically dismiss it as a failure. If only the people knew how destructive and restrictive capitalism is they would most likely turn to socialism. I say that they would turn to socialism because not everyone is willing to give up their resources to other people as would be such in a communist system. But i believe that people would want socialism more because it preaches that the people get what they work for. So we lack support because the capitalist superpowers have convinced the public that communism fails and capitalism works, but they hide the fact that capitalist superpowers are superpowers because they exploited the rest of the world.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Originally posted by [email protected] 25 2004, 10:34 PM
Why dont you go eat a Big Mac?
I prefer the double quater-pounder with cheese (supersize).

The big mac just doesn't contain enough grease.

[The New Yorker]

Originally posted by [email protected] 26 2004, 02:26 PM
if you ever put once your own asse into a greassy life then you will surely be what you not are :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
and if not than pitty you will/are just become a fuckin faschist. :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:
quote again
didn't Fidel lead the revolution with 14 guys and 12 rifles? quiet impressive


yeah but it wasn't rambo :lol: :lol:

i dont understand any thing you wrote there except the fidel thing

[Palmares]

This is quite a strange thread... :blink:

What do we really mean by 'revolt'? Perhaps that should have infact been specified by Y2A, but this it wasn't, I shall try to answer it by my own definition.

By 'revolt', I mean to actively protest against the inequities that are placed upon the masses by those with power.

Does this entail violence? No.
Could it be violent? Yes.

Everyday people revolt. People protest on streets, argue in parliament, gather petitions, abstain from multi-nationals, and various other things. The scope of the question is so very large that an adequete answer is clearly quite difficult to amount.


Originally posted by Y2A+--> (Y2A)Why DON'T you revolt?[/b]

We do. As I have pointed out, in many ways we revolt against this system. We each do our part despite the system always trying to undermine our efforts.



Y2A
Why DON'T you revolt? [Meaning violent revolution]

That is a diferent question altogether. Clearly a revolution in our own head is not the solution (as that is both counter-revolutionary and escapist).

Quite bluntly, the necessary circumstances for revolution are not there. It is a revolution of the people, not of some the people. And just because certain revolutions were small (e.g. Cuba) does not necessatate that we must, or will undertake a revolution in the same way.

I hope is answers your question. :unsure:

[Guest1]

The revolution doesn't have to be violent, it will become violent when it is repressed by the government.

The revolution will begin with general strikes, sabotage, factory occupations, etc...

[Y2A]

Originally posted by Che y [email protected] 27 2004, 07:35 AM
The revolution doesn't have to be violent, it will become violent when it is repressed by the government.
Isn't the government repressing you right now?

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2004, 11:32 AM
Isn't the government repressing you right now?
What are you expecting him to say?

The question has been answered over and over again.

Yes, the government is oppressing us now, but what ever action is taken has to be in the interests of the struggle at the moment.

Attempting to "revolt" now is absurd. It will amount to nothing.

However, there are actions being taken. There are strikes at the moment, there are united front campaigns and direct action groups attempting to build the movement.

It's a process. What is it you are not understanding?

[Guest1]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2004, 05:32 AM
Isn't the government repressing you right now?
My point was, once the revolution begins, it will only become violent when the government begins to violently suppress it.

Now do you understand?

[Renaissance Man]

I get the jist. The plan is to disrupt things up to a point where the government will have no choice but to respond. When they do, you plan on counteracting them with political violence, and then blaming them for the whole encounter. Damn, I wonder if they ever thought of that.


I prefer KFC to McDonalds. Meat tastes better after its been pulverized. Vegetables are for sissies.

[dotcommie]

Because revolution takes more than one man/woman, to revolt when the majority of the working class are in a satisfactory state of living would be futile.

Economically a recession would have to be going on to have even the slightest chance of winning the majority over. Not to mention the war on terror is a definite issue that would hinder the chances of successful revolution, we would just be labelled terrorists and the government would have public support immediately to destroy us.

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by Renaissance [email protected] 27 2004, 12:56 PM
The plan is to disrupt things up to a point where the government will have no choice but to respond. When they do, you plan on counteracting them with political violence, and then blaming them for the whole encounter.
What's your point?

[EL CHICO ROJO]

in my opinion right now we have to focus on educating people then when they learn how they gettin screwed by capitialism they will be ready and THEY will revolt.so der no need 4 me to revolt on my own or as part of a vangaurd .....when the tym comes the people will
and you capitialists won't be able ta stop it .....

[The Sloth]

Originally posted by EL CHICO [email protected] 27 2004, 05:30 PM
in my opinion right now we have to focus on educating people then when they learn how they gettin screwed by capitialism they will be ready and THEY will revolt.so der no need 4 me to revolt on my own or as part of a vangaurd .....when the tym comes the people will
and you capitialists won't be able ta stop it .....
Exactly.



And hey, you still have the "choice" to resist the revolution at the cost of "attending" the gulags! :lol:

[socialistfuture]

I think the reason alot of people do not want to 'revolt' today is because we have had so many already, sometimes they are succesful and sometimes they are smashed (the easter rising- ireland, july 26-cuba etc, the paris comune etc) or at the other end revolutions and revolutionaries can become the new ruling class and eventually oppressive themselves.

We want a different kind of world - the anarchist slogan 'no gods no masters' applies to some so they dont want to take over. The global intifada is in process, the anti capitalist, anti facist, anti imperialist movement is growing. The old order of solviet communism collapsed but that doesnt mean people accept capitalism.

If it comes to martial law or imperialist occupation we will resist and revolt. But for those of us who live in the 'western' world, the 'first world' a revolt is not going to help a lot. The armed forces, and the full power of the state would be used against those doing the uprising.

Eventually people will become disillusioned with capitalist myths and lies and if the ballot doesnt work - if they will not allow it we will be left with no other choice. At the same time facists may take a shot at it and we will be ready to take them on if we must.

From where I am coming from maybe we dont want to be ruling, simply living our lives the way we want and if we are not allowed to do that we will demand our rights. I dont like excessive violence, i dont want to join no army.

Why have a revolution when one is slowly becoming reality? Well we'll see whats next.

[revolutionindia]

One should strike when the irons hot

As of of know we are still heating up the furnance

[Guest1]

revolutionindia made a well-worded, intelligent post...

:o

[revolutionindia]

Comrade don't be so shocked
Fill up the form in my signature ;)