A question for commies...

[bdw]

I consider Kerry to be quite liberal, and Bush to be somewhere near the center of the political spectrum. But from the far, far, far, far left point of view held by communists, where is Kerry and Bush on the political spectrum? I am interested in hearing your opinions.

Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?

[CubanFox]

Originally posted by "bdw"+--> ("bdw")I consider Kerry to be quite liberal, and Bush to be somewhere near the center of the political spectrum. But from the far, far, far, far left point of view held by communists, where is Kerry and Bush on the political spectrum? I am interested in hearing your opinions.[/b]

To paraphrase Ralph Nader:

The difference between George W. Bush and John Kerry is the velocity with which their
knees hit the floor when corporations knock on their door.


"bdw"
Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?

Gay sex, drugs, vodka, it's all good.

Well, ask a bloody stupid question and get a bloody stupid answer. You do realise that people have lives separate from their ideologies?

[synthesis]

We don't consider them to be too different from each other. Both of them are servants (and members) of the ruling class.


Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?

Sex, drugs, and rock-n-roll, what else?

[bdw]

You do realise that people have lives separate from their ideologies?

I do. But from what I gather, communism defines who you are, hence my question.

By the way, Ralph Nader is a capitalist. He believes in government intervention, but is he a capitalist; he believes in free enterprise. Not only that, but he is a millionaire. I guess that means he is on your hit list, eh? ;)

[CubanFox]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 05:25 PM
By the way, Ralph Nader is a capitalist. He believes in government intervention, but is he a capitalist; he believes in free enterprise. Not only that, but he is a millionaire. I guess that means he is on your hit list, eh? ;)
Indeed. I never said I loved him, I merely quoted him.

[bdw]

You would "liquidate" Michael Moore as well, I assume? And Bill Clinton?

By the way, what is your opinion of Bernie Sanders?

[V.I.Lenin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 02:09 AM
I consider Kerry to be quite liberal, and Bush to be somewhere near the center of the political spectrum. But from the far, far, far, far left point of view held by communists, where is Kerry and Bush on the political spectrum? I am interested in hearing your opinions.

Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?
When are people going to awake to the realities of American corporate politics? All this left and right wing political jargon pertaining to the 'two-party' system is merely a rouse,its nothing more than hype and a gimic by which to keep the American people in the dark regarding what dark forces are at play in such matters.

There is no right and left,only corporate executives with their own version of 'American Idol', its the corporate overlords who select the candidates,the people merely vote for their favorite liar,either way,regardless which candidate gets elected,theyre still dancing at the end of the strings of their corporate puppeteers.

Since this is Che Lives Community then perhaps its best to simply post a quote by Che himself regarding all such politics - "Any communist party that participates in petty bourgeois elections cannot be accounted as truly revolutionary" - Ernesto 'Che' Guevara.

[Monty Cantsin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 09:06 AM


Since this is Che Lives Community then perhaps its best to simply post a quote by Che himself regarding all such politics - "Any communist party that participates in petty bourgeois elections cannot be accounted as truly revolutionary" - Ernesto 'Che' Guevara.
oh but V.I.Lenin you wrote a whole book on why we should, doing back flips i see.

[Misodoctakleidist]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 07:09 AM
Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?
We like send a couple of people to the gulag every now and then.

[CubanFox]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 08:57 PM
We like send a couple of people to the gulag every now and then.
And send our KGB goons to tear some babies from their mothers' arms, to be taken to State Nurseries. We love to do that, too.

[Fidelbrand]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 03:09 PM
Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?
For fun? :P
We toss the dicks of silly little selfish bastards or those decadent, system-entrenched cappies for their sub-human attitude & world views.

[V.I.Lenin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 04:29 AM
oh but V.I.Lenin you wrote a whole book on why we should, doing back flips i see.
[yes,lets play out this political farse as it were] .


The political system as it has now long existed in matters of parliamentary elections tends to favor only the dominant parties which in turn are in direct affiliation and control of the financial overlords of that nation,in considering these realities it only stands to reason that for a candidate to have any chance of being elected he must first and foremost assure these corporate leaders that he aims to safeguard their interests.

This indeed makes politicians to be second only to preachers when it comes to fraud in that they must secure the financial-backing of the rich and the votes of the poor while at the same time assuring both that they aim to protect the one from the other.

In order to have a political voice at the ballot box one must then be a partisan of these corporate puppeteers who in fact determine which candidates are suitable to officiate in their market-house,do you seriously think for one moment that any 'Joe Average' from the street can waltz into a major corporation and sit on its executive board?

In the process of party politics too often concessions are made to gain campaign funds and votes,a practice which socialists should never fall prey to,for our integrity is and must always remain the very essence of our political ideology.

Therefore,how do we participate in petty bourgeois politics while at the same time drawing the proverbial line in the sand in order to assure the masses that our aim isnt to simply transfer power from one form of tyranny to another?

Were we to commit to a political party it must be one that promotes the socialist cause with unremitting determination and absolutely no compromise,in light of this it should be understood that to join such a party we must ourselves forge such a party,one which refuses to step into the mire and muck of bi-partisan deception and ineffectiveness and by this establish a true alternative for the common man.

Still,such a party would serve mainly as a means to educate the masses,to awaken their political conscience,as well as display an organized faction of resistence rather than thinking itself to be a hopeful contender at the ballot box.

It must be a radical protest against the present system by means of that system,for truly a little leaven will cause a bowl of flour to rise. What I have advocated in my writings is the idea of using bourgeois politics as a sounding board while never compromising our basic ideology,to always consider such means within the socialist context,for indeed its a difficult matter to engage the machine without at the same time becoming merely another cog in that machine.

[The Sloth]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 07:09 AM
Also, what do communists do for fun, besides planning for your silly little revolution?
What kind of question is that? Should communists have totally separate lives from other human beings?

1) The majority of my friends aren't communists; not even slightly political.

2) I do exactly what others love:

Listening to music (socially conscious hip-hop is my favorite genre), reading, writing, going out, being around friends and people.

Oh, and lots of immoral sex for which your Jesus is sending me to hell.

[bdw]

Ok, I have another question for communists. Let's say that your 0.005% of the population actually manages to take over America in, say, one million years. :D Would you shut down churches, denying the freedom of religion? Consider this part from the 1918 Soviet Constitution, which Lenin played a major role in forming.

"freedom of religious and anti- religious propaganda is acknowledged to be the right of all citizens."

Though clearly biased against religion with its use of the word "propaganda," the Soviet citizens were indeed guaranteed the freedom of religion, as supported by Lenin.

By the way, if your 0.005% of the population does indeed manage to take over, I'd rather die than live in your society.

[Misodoctakleidist]

Communism couldn't happen unless there was marjority support for it.

Who would shut down the churches exactly? What with there not being a state and all that seems like a rather illogical statement.

What is it that you find so repugnent about communism?

[Louis Pio]

What a bunch of retarded questions.

Ohh I better run, im off to worship satan and eat some babies.

[V.I.Lenin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 02:16 PM
Ok, I have another question for communists. Let's say that your 0.005% of the population actually manages to take over America in, say, one million years. :D Would you shut down churches, denying the freedom of religion? Consider this part from the 1918 Soviet Constitution, which Lenin played a major role in forming.

"freedom of religious and anti- religious propaganda is acknowledged to be the right of all citizens."

Though clearly biased against religion with its use of the word "propaganda," the Soviet citizens were indeed guaranteed the freedom of religion, as supported by Lenin.

By the way, if your 0.005% of the population does indeed manage to take over, I'd rather die than live in your society.
Should a state attempt to regulate matters such as religion and sexual orientation? These are the private concern of citizens and as such must remain out of the reach of legislation which havent the right to meddle in such affairs,oppressive regimes have often exercised their power to violate individual rights and freedoms,and though a state may have such power - they do not have such right.

Of course there must be reasonable boundaries set within a socialist state just as in any other state,however all such legislation must be the result of debate and discussion arising from the people themselves by means of community councils and appointed delegations.

In your post you mentioned the use of the word 'propaganda' in concerns of religion as though such a term is bias in connection with religion,however,the term well fits in that any form of indoctrination is itself propaganda,so again,the term defines religious teaching and preaching very well.

At the close of the post wherein you mention the idea of rather dying than to live in a socialist society,you need to understand that were such a day to come and you were to be numbered among those who oppose the will of the people then I assure you that you need not worry your head about having to live in such a society.

[bdw]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 07:38 PM
Communism couldn't happen unless there was marjority support for it.

Who would shut down the churches exactly? What with there not being a state and all that seems like a rather illogical statement.

What is it that you find so repugnent about communism?
I find it disgusting that you want to deprive me of economic choice. I am working into the coffee roasting business. Coffee is most fresh when it is sold direct and within a day of roasting. But in a communist state, I would not be allowed to sell coffee to anyone directly. That would be "evil" according to communist doctrine. So I would have to work under government rule and sell to government instead and it would eventually end up in government-run stores, far less fresh than if I could sell it directly. And coffee is only the beginning of the probem. Government does not work, as Harry Browne has said. How could you trust a government that can't deliver the mail on time to provide your healthcare, your paycheck, your house, your clothes, your food, your car, and everything else that involves your standard of living? That is what they tried to do in the USSR, Mosambique, Ukraine, and so on, and while many people had a good standard of living, millions of others suffered greatly. Finally, I believe a quote from the late and great Barry Goldwater is in order. "A government big enough to give you everything is big enough to take it all away."

[Louis Pio]

I find it disgusting that you want to deprive me of economic choice.

Then you should be against capitalism. Capitalism deprives the vast majority of the world any economic choice. But I take it that wasn't your point. Your point is you are ok and then the rest of the world can rot. No?

[Vinny Rafarino]

But in a communist state, I would not be allowed to sell coffee to anyone directly. That would be "evil" according to communist doctrine

To begin with son, there is no such thing as a "communist state". Communism represents the absence of a state.

What you are ignorantly referring to is a pedomorphic and fallicious interpretation of a socialist state.

Ignorant to the fact that you would not be able to sell goods to people directly as you most certainly would. You would sell coffee coffee to the public and share the surplus value of the coffee sold with all of the workers involved in the production and distribution of that product.

Will you "get rich" by doing this? Of course not but when greed and all other irrational and juvenile behaviours are removed from society, you won't wan't to.

You will pursue your work; your own intellectual and social development. You will find that you have more leisure time to vacation. In 95% of the cases, you will find you have even more money to spend on leisure than you had before.

Especially if you were one of the 33 million yanquis living below the poverty line.

Most importantly you will no longer think about such trite things as "those damn dirty queers and their satanic gay agenda" or "that nigger probably stole that mercedes".

I suggest you do some research on socialist economics boy; try one with lots of pictures so you have a chance at possibly grasping the concept.


So I would have to work under government rule and sell to government instead and it would eventually end up in government-run stores, far less fresh than if I could sell it directly

Are you trying to say that communists don't like fresh coffee? You must be as your assertation that "communism" guarantees "stale coffee" is simply juvenile.


How could you trust a government that can't deliver the mail on time to provide your healthcare, your paycheck, your house, your clothes, your food, your car, and everything else that involves your standard of living?

You are correct, we can't! This is why we must dispose of the perpetrator as soon as possible; the capitalist system! :lol:

Oh, silly kids!



That is what they tried to do in the USSR, Mosambique, Ukraine, and so on,.

With your childish and ignorant perception of socialist states and practises, I highly doubt you know at all what they "tried to do" in these places.


and while many people had a good standard of living, millions of others suffered greatly

You mean just like hundreds of million of people suffer throughout the capitalist world today? You would think that by 2004 these dolts would have figured out a way to increase the standard of living for everyone, without leaving millions in their wake.

At least other states had an excuse, they had to turn entire nations full of peasants into industrial, mechanised societies. What's the USA's excuse for it's 33 million starving residents in 2004?

Let me guess, they are all just "lazy niggers" right?

[Guerrilla22]

kerry is centrist, just as the whole Democratic Party is, with theexception of a couple members, Nader is further left, but accepts support from the right, great choices we have.

[Monty Cantsin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 11:53 AM
[yes,lets play out this political farse as it were] .


The political system as it has now long existed in matters of parliamentary elections tends to favor only the dominant parties which in turn are in direct affiliation and control of the financial overlords of that nation,in considering these realities it only stands to reason that for a candidate to have any chance of being elected he must first and foremost assure these corporate leaders that he aims to safeguard their interests.

This indeed makes politicians to be second only to preachers when it comes to fraud in that they must secure the financial-backing of the rich and the votes of the poor while at the same time assuring both that they aim to protect the one from the other.

In order to have a political voice at the ballot box one must then be a partisan of these corporate puppeteers who in fact determine which candidates are suitable to officiate in their market-house,do you seriously think for one moment that any 'Joe Average' from the street can waltz into a major corporation and sit on its executive board?

In the process of party politics too often concessions are made to gain campaign funds and votes,a practice which socialists should never fall prey to,for our integrity is and must always remain the very essence of our political ideology.

Therefore,how do we participate in petty bourgeois politics while at the same time drawing the proverbial line in the sand in order to assure the masses that our aim isnt to simply transfer power from one form of tyranny to another?

Were we to commit to a political party it must be one that promotes the socialist cause with unremitting determination and absolutely no compromise,in light of this it should be understood that to join such a party we must ourselves forge such a party,one which refuses to step into the mire and muck of bi-partisan deception and ineffectiveness and by this establish a true alternative for the common man.

Still,such a party would serve mainly as a means to educate the masses,to awaken their political conscience,as well as display an organized faction of resistence rather than thinking itself to be a hopeful contender at the ballot box.

It must be a radical protest against the present system by means of that system,for truly a little leaven will cause a bowl of flour to rise. What I have advocated in my writings is the idea of using bourgeois politics as a sounding board while never compromising our basic ideology,to always consider such means within the socialist context,for indeed its a difficult matter to engage the machine without at the same time becoming merely another cog in that machine.

Left-wing Communism: an Infantile Disorder (http://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1920/lwc/index.htm)

[apathy maybe]

Only in the USA can liberalism be associated with the left. Liberals want so-called "economic freedom". This "economic freedom" (which involves the exploitation of workers etc) is opposed by those on the left.


I think the problem is that Liberalism also promotes freedom in other areas. Something that many (but not all) leftists also promote. Examine the 2D graph of politics. Above we have the authoritarians, below the minimalists. On the right we have people who want capitalism and "economic freedom" (including fascists). On the left we have socialism.

(On a third axis are those who are only in it for themselves, and don't actually have an ideology; but will use whatever is easier for the time.)

[Y2A]

Kerry is a fascist nazi totalitarian of the likes of Hitler and Mussolini.

[Misodoctakleidist]

Originally posted by [email protected] 8 2004, 09:48 PM
I find it disgusting that you want to deprive me of economic choice. I am working into the coffee roasting business. Coffee is most fresh when it is sold direct and within a day of roasting. But in a communist state, I would not be allowed to sell coffee to anyone directly. That would be "evil" according to communist doctrine. So I would have to work under government rule and sell to government instead and it would eventually end up in government-run stores, far less fresh than if I could sell it directly. And coffee is only the beginning of the probem. Government does not work, as Harry Browne has said. How could you trust a government that can't deliver the mail on time to provide your healthcare, your paycheck, your house, your clothes, your food, your car, and everything else that involves your standard of living? That is what they tried to do in the USSR, Mosambique, Ukraine, and so on, and while many people had a good standard of living, millions of others suffered greatly. Finally, I believe a quote from the late and great Barry Goldwater is in order. "A government big enough to give you everything is big enough to take it all away."
That quite an interesting response considering that you quotes a post in which I informed you that communism is stateless.

I'm also shocked that you'd rather die than live in a society where coffee isn't fresh.

[V.I.Lenin]

All this business of left and right in politics,as in all things,is quite a nonsensical and often dangerous expression of individual wills.

What should and must be sought is balance,and in order to gain and retain balance there of necessity must be a continual fluctuation between right and left,its as walking the high-wire without the assistance of a beam.

Am I a fervent leftist? - No,nor am I an ardent rightist,rather what I find is that on various issues my stance adjusts so as to accomodate what my own inner constitution determines in such matters.

By this line of reasoning one can be viewed as a rightist in one area while seen as a leftist in others,be it socio-politics,economics,etc.,regardless the topic and issues one will invarablly fluctuate in his inidividual approach to such matters.

The U.S. two-party system may be promoted as representing the left and right hemispheres of political thought and action but this is not at all the case,for the Democratic party is as much rightist as is the conservative Republican party,and anyone saying differently is no doubt tryung to sell something.

In this vein of reasoning Bush and Kerry are master and man,one and the same,the same greed for power,the same initiative to perpetuate American imperialism,the same hot-air baloon with a different color and markings.

I stand firm in my resolve not to cast a single vote in these grand ole popularity contests which are fraudulently cast as an exercise in democracy,for in truth there is no democracy in U.S. politics,merely an autocracy masking itself as democracy.

Perhaps one day citizens will at last grow wise to the political realities of U.S. politics and will cease to patronize the ballot box and by this cut the autocrats power out from beneath them,in such a manner the beast can be destroyed by neglect.