How many internationales have there been?

[ComradeRed]

How many internationales have there been? There was the socialist working man's internationale, the second internationale, the third "comintern" internationale, and the fourth? :huh:

[Monty Cantsin]

you got them all but the fourth international has suffered from splits.

[Subversive Pessimist]

So we don't have an international now?

[Louis Pio]

Yes several. But we don't have one big if that's what you mean. After the comintern was killed to suit the imperialists, there has been several small ones.
Trotskyist, anti-revisionist, hoxaist etc etc etc.

Take a look here at the different ones: http://www.broadleft.org/index.htm

[V.I.Lenin]

Leon Trotsky and others founded the forth International in 1938,of course Trotsky,being an ardent internationalist wish to see the worldwide spread of revolution,something Stalin sought to label as counter-revolutionary even though in reality it was Stalin himself,as an isolationist and revisionist that was counter-revolutionary.

Stalin was much like Adolph Hitler in this regard in that Hitler sold out the left-wing faction of the NSDAP in order to win over the bourgeois conservatives and thus secure his own bid for complete personal power.

Ernst Rohm and other leading left-wing national socialists were butchered during the night of the long knives under the facade that they were deranged homosexuals and as such deserving of death,when in reality this was but a sham used in order to eliminate anyone Hitler considered having a strong enough power-base to actually complete with the prestige he so arrogantly desired for himself.

One must remember that Hitler supposedly was drawn to the small party because he thought it to be a right-wing faction of German nationalists and there were indeed right-wingers in this group,however,the initial build-up of what became the NSDAP was composed of two camps - those of the conservative right-wing branch and those,such as Rohm and Gregor Strasser which were more socialist inclined in their thinking.

This too was the case within the Bolshevik party,one could imagine Trotsky standin to the left of Comrade Lenin while Stalin stood to the right,then of course there was Bukharin who seem to be at differences with Stalin then Trotsky and even at times opposed to Lenin,this depending upon the subject matter at hand,be it in regard to NEP or some other policy in the making.

It would appear that Trotsky wish to use the forth International as a means to carry through with initial policies of Comrade Lenin which Stalin himself had abandoned.

[Louis Pio]

For a look at the history of the different internationals and especially why the 4. never became any leading force read this
Programme of the International (May 1970) (http://www.socialistappeal.org/faq/program_of_the_international.html)
It's obviously one view on it. Alot of people would disagree, as always :)

[Djehuti]

Originally posted by [email protected] 6 2004, 05:32 AM
How many internationales have there been? There was the socialist working man's internationale, the second internationale, the third "comintern" internationale, and the fourth? :huh:
The forth is the trotskist international, and there is around two forth internationals for every trotskyite. ;)

Then there is something called: "League for the Fifth International", another trotskyist wannabe international.
http://www.workerspower.com

[Louis Pio]

Haha workerspower is quite fun. It is however not only among trotskyism that several internationals and groupings exist
Just look at the socalled "Anti-Revisionists" (http://www.broadleft.org/antirevi.htm)
Communist Parties (http://www.broadleft.org/communis.htm)
Leftist Socialists and Reform Communists (http://www.broadleft.org/leftsoc.htm)
Left Communist Parties (http://www.broadleft.org/leftcomm.htm)
Anarchist Organizations (http://www.broadleft.org/anarchis.htm)

Trotskyist organisations of most kinds are however more inclined to spread out since they don't believe in confining to one country.