Paedophilia

[Subversive Pessimist]

I didn't find any better place to post this, so I posted it here.

I've discussed many issues that are filled with taboo recently, like cannibalism. I agree that it's okay if those who eat another person do so, as long as it is with the "victims" consent. HOWEVER, I do not feel comfortable with the thought. The same goes with paedophilia, at least to a certain extent (although it is "immoral", nobody is going to be killed by this sexual act). It is by many thought of as an act of rape, but what if the man or the woman has the child's consent?

What if the paedophile watches a video of kids naked, or perhaps a sexual act (if it was taken with the childs consent, of course)? Should this be allowed? I know this is a taboo, but I'm still curious regarding the various opinions.

Discuss.

[Guerrilla22]

I don't like the word immoral, so I'll use the word wrong. Pedophilia is wrong on a social level and a humantitarian level. It is wrong to manipulate kids, or take advantage of kids to engage in intercourse with them and that's what would have to happen in order to engage in sexual activity with a child, a child does not know what sex is and therefore cannot consent to it, nor is a child ready physically or emotionally for sexual activity.

I guess if someone wants to sit at home and fantasize about kids thats okay, just so long as that person doesn't act on it.

[Subversive Pessimist]

It is wrong to manipulate kids, or take advantage of kids to engage in intercourse with them and that's what would have to happen in order to engage in sexual activity with a child, a child does not know what sex is and therefore cannot consent to it, nor is a child ready physically or emotionally for sexual activity.

I experimented with sex and all that since I was a little kid (kindergarten). A friend of mine masturbated since she was three or four years old. She always had an orgasm. I wasn't really thinking of 2-4 years old, but more in the lines of 6-12 years old, when they often are curious and like to explore.


I guess if someone wants to sit at home and fantasize about kids thats okay, just so long as that person doesn't act on it.

Does that include pornography, or pictures of naked kids?

[Guerrilla22]

There's a difference between exploring yourself and engaging in actual sexual contact. Kids 10-12 are still way too young to be having sex. And no that doesn't include child porn, once again child porn is exploitive and wrong.

[Subversive Pessimist]

Kids 10-12 are still way too young to be having sex. And no that doesn't include child porn, once again child porn is exploitive and wrong.



Actually, a 5 year old in Peru became pregnant, in 1932.

Another case was just a couple of days ago. A 9 year old became pregnant. There are obviously some who like to explore with sexual activity at that age. I don't think that is wrong, but I am sceptical of 50 year olds going doggy styles on 7 year olds...

On the other hand, Let's say a kid (say, 6-12 year old) wants sex, and she flirts with him or whatever, and they both know what they are doing. If there is no regrets, only hapiness, what's the big deal?

And where is the limit?

If a 12 year old is physically attracted to a 7 year old, is she a paedophile? What if it is a 13 year old? 14 year old? 16 year old? Where does the limit go?

Is a 6 year old who is attracted to an 8 year old a paedophile?

[Ziggy]

even if a child that young was able to have sex, it would be wrong because their minds and bodies are still developing and thus are naive and able to be manipulated.. They may "give consent" but they would not truely understand the implications that they are agreeing to. once kids are 13-15 i think its ok for them to do stuff, but not with someone who is much much older than them. i had a friend who dated an 18 year old when she was 15, they had an ok relationship but she was mature for her age.

it is really difficult to say whats a good age and all because people develop at different paces, i hit puberty in 4th grade while some of my friends didnt till 6 or 7. in 6th and 5th grade when kids say they went out with someone they just said it but did they really get it? they didnt go out on dates they occasionally held hands around the playground and then went off and did their own thing with their circle of friends, probably said they "went out" for a few weeks then say they went out with someone else. kids in elementary school are too young, kids are too young in middle school, maybe a few kids in 8th grade are ready, but for the most part it isnt till 9th grade that kids are mature enough to have sex.

[Dré Kutvocht]

You should also know that not every paedophile is a raper and that most paedophiles are also sexually attracted to adults.

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

Peadophillia refers to attraction to pre-pubescant children so the hints in the title. Children that age are not physically ready for sex.

Thats the point, their bodies are not able to have sex with men aged 18 or 50 whatever.

It however is not evil, there cannot be anything evil aboput natural attraction. However the problem lies in coercion.

By coercing somebody we are taking away their freedom. This is the fundamental problem with peadophillia. I'll add more, I cant put into words what I mean on this one.

[Take the Power back]

If kids want to have sex, fine. As long as it's with other kids, and not a fully developed adult who completely understands the situation better than the child.

[Subversive Pessimist]

I sometimes walk around, and I see girls that are 7-10 year old, and they look like they are 15-19. They are wearing clothes that are.. What should I say, were dearing... And some of them use a lot of make up etc. I think that's one thing we should take into consideration. A month ago, I saw a male and a woman/girl... I did not honestly know if she was his daughter or his wife.

Where does the limit go? Can a 11 year old have sex or experiment with a 7 year old?

[Guerrilla22]

The chances of that happening are pretty much nill, again kids at that age are not ready for sex physically or mentally.

[Lardlad95]

......ALl I can say is if I catch some 30 year old muthafucka having "sex" with my 7 year old daughter I'ma put him in a fucking coma.


Children are easily manipulated, teenagers not so much, I wouldn't advise it but I wouldn't object as much to people having sex with teenagers.

But seriously do you know how easy it is to manipulate a child? It's to easy to have something go wrong there.

[The Sloth]

Pro-pedophilia doesn't seem to take into account the fact that these children aren't mature enough to make the decision.

[Raisa]

What attracts an adult to people that are so small?

[Ziggy]

i'm just guessing on this, i could be wrong for all i know, but i think paedophiles see children as innocent and pure and they wish they could get back to that, in a way paedophilia is a regression to being closer to a child, of sorts.

[Vinny Rafarino]

Actually, a 5 year old in Peru became pregnant, in 1932.


Lina Medina was a medical anomoly, not just "someone who discovered sex at an early age".

She suffered from a condition called "precocious puberty"; a condition that affects one out of every 15-20,000 children. It is a neurological disorder that causes the pituitary gland to begin secreting gonadotropins (the hormone that controls puberty) several years early, the degrees of which will vary in the individual.

Lina for instance begun menstrating at the age of three and had already developed breasts by four years old.

She was then raped and subsequently became pregnant.



You need to research this stuff before you post it.

It amazes and sickens me that these threads still pop up once in a while.

[Fabi]

If n****rs and *****es have in the past been disregarded as not being much more - if at all - capable than kids and almost everybody agrees on that, why is it that no one cares to acknowledge that kids are STILL (not saying that others aren't anymore) being treated like n****r-*****-slaves?

'Of course women are stupid, just look at them!' - gee, how smart, looking at a crippled individual to justify the innateness of their limitations...

'kids are not mature till the age of xx.' - gee, i wonder why that could be? maybe, maybe because they are not being taken seriously?
Children know very much what they want and what kind of treatment they can accept and they know their desires. Fact is that we live in a world that is pure torture for children, so really, i think discussing paedophilia can only be neccesary in a culture that doesn't respect children to begin with.

9th graders are not mature enough for sex or beyond manipulation - quite the contrary is true: coercion/conditioning/consensus trance is almost complete at that point in time for the person to never fully recover.

[Fabi]

Just a short addition to be clear: I am against forcing children into sex as I am against forcing them into schools or armies or pants or skirts or McDonald's. This does not, however, mean that sex with kids (or among them) is wrong in any way. Saying that children are too young to consent to anything is precisely what is wrong with the way children are being treated. If you tell a kid what to draw and what to think, when to eat and when to cry, you are no better than any fucking paedophile.

[DaCuBaN]

Indeed - unsolicited actions irregardless of intent don't go down well with humans of any age.


why is it that no one cares to acknowledge that kids are STILL (not saying that others aren't anymore) being treated like nigger-*****-slaves?


Colourfully put :rolleyes: Most cultures accept the dominance of an adult over a child for both physical and mental reasons. I certianly remember when I was 8-9 years old being thoroughly exasperated at the lack of respect I commanded; at the way I was ordered around. The psychological attachment a parent has to their child can quite easily explain this - they think they are doing the best thing for their child.

It wasn't until I was near on 18 that I realised something - at that age I really didn't have a fucking clue. Two years later, and I've relased something else - at 18 I still didn't have a clue. There are many things my parents tried to stop me doing, and y'know oddly enough they were almost always right, despite my protestations.

Hinesight is a dreadful thing ;)

[dark fairy]

i just don't understand what and how can adults be attracted to little kids but damn...it is quite sick. i am pretty open minded but this is one of those things that i don't understand...

[Fabi]

Originally posted by dark [email protected] 28 2004, 11:02 PM
i just don't understand what and how can adults be attracted to little kids but damn...it is quite sick. i am pretty open minded but this is one of those things that i don't understand...
Aren't all parents attracted to their kids? Regardless of how you love somebody, you must never force yourself upon someone. Keeping any prejudice against children at the side for a second, I really cannot see anything wrong with two people of any age falling in love with one another, when they are considerate, regarding the other person's freedom to decide what happens to their body and mind.

Parents who beat their kids for not eating the food they told them to and not wasting their time studying bullshit for school or depriving them of their right to decide whom to befriend, what movies to watch, what clothes to wear, what music to listen to, are as bad as any torture. Parents who make their kids psychologically dependable on their love and coerce them into submission by depriving them of said love, are far more dangerous than any respectful stranger could ever be.

If children were ever listened to, and their fears and needs ever seriously put into consideration, then their decision in what activities to get engaged, could also be taken seriously. Since, however, we live in a society that belittles children and rapes them into submission, of course we can have none of that.
As long as children are nothing but possessions, of course their consent in any matter will never be taken seriously, however serious they may be.

[Raisa]

Children usually need more affection then adults do, if thats the right way to put it, and pedophilia exploits this situation no matter how much it means well.

Exploitive and unaceptable.

[bunk]

i don't see what is wrong with child porn if they are older than 13.

[Lacrimi de Chiciură]

I find it to be disgusting... little kids are not meant to be having sex, even MORE so with F***ed up 50 year old men. Kids who are molested have major problems as adults. Fabi, I think its rather sick that you would advocate paedophilia. For a person to be having sex with a grown man, before they have even reached puberty is just SICK. A kid (1-12 years old) cant make that decision for themselves.

[Guest1]

Relax, no one said anything about 4 year old kids. Despite what has been said in this thread, paedophelia does not mean pre-pubescent.

By the time someone reaches the age of sexual maturity, they can decide who to have sex with.

The problem you speak of, one of inability to decide is a problem with puritanical society that refuses to teach children about sex and fucks them up psychologically by "shielding" them from knowing that barbie is supposed to have a vagina and nipples.

Once someone can have sexual desires, they can make decisions as to when to act on them so long as we equip them properly with all the knowledge they need.

As to pre-pubescent children, no. That is wrong.

[Djehuti]

Originally posted by [email protected] 15 2004, 07:46 PM
I didn't find any better place to post this, so I posted it here.

I've discussed many issues that are filled with taboo recently, like cannibalism. I agree that it's okay if those who eat another person do so, as long as it is with the "victims" consent. HOWEVER, I do not feel comfortable with the thought. The same goes with paedophilia, at least to a certain extent (although it is "immoral", nobody is going to be killed by this sexual act). It is by many thought of as an act of rape, but what if the man or the woman has the child's consent?

What if the paedophile watches a video of kids naked, or perhaps a sexual act (if it was taken with the childs consent, of course)? Should this be allowed? I know this is a taboo, but I'm still curious regarding the various opinions.

Discuss.
I have nothing against pedofiles (or zoofiles, or heterosexuals, or homosexuals, etc), but iam against rape, if it is on children, animals, women, men, etc doesnt mather.

[The Sloth]

Originally posted by [email protected] 13 2004, 01:57 PM
I have nothing against pedofiles
What the fuck?

A child does not understand the consequences of his decisions. What if a ten-year old female is promised a toy pony if she let's Uncle Roger take her virginity, and she, not understanding what will happen, agrees?

You're sick, man.

[Eastside Revolt]

My stance on pedophilia, is that sex is to be enjoyed. 9 year olds can't possibly have the mentality to actually find enjoyment in that kind of sensation.

[Guest1]

sure, but that's not the only kind of paedophelia. What about a 14 year-old?

Or even a 16 year old if the other person is more than 4 years older?

No one is suggesting sex with pre-pubescent children, we are saying teenagers can make the choice. I'm sure you did when you were one, you knew what you wanted, did you not?

[T_SP]

I will note one thing here, Fabi clearly has no children of his/her own!


Anyone who condones this sick act is as disgusting as the paedophile themselves! There is NO excuse for it, no reasons these people just get kicks out of exploiting kids. Children have no idea what sex is and up to a certain age as far as they are concerned they pee out of it and that's it's only use. Yes they may rub themselves and yes it may feel nice but they have no idea why.
And to say that forcing a kid to do things like going to be or eating there dinner makes us as bad as paedophiles is bullshit and is the kinda thing only a spoilt kid would say who has no idea about bringing up children, just wait till you have your own then comment on it!

Finally Dacuban your right, almost everything my parents said to me and told me to do seemed unfair at the time but everyday I find myself regurgitating it to my own kids and God it makes sense now, hindsight eh! ;)

[DaCuBaN]

almost everything my parents said to me and told me to do seemed unfair at the time but everyday I find myself regurgitating it to my own kids and God it makes sense now

Does it not just make you fucking mad? :lol:


Parents who beat their kids for not eating the food they told them to and not wasting their time studying bullshit for school or depriving them of their right to decide whom to befriend, what movies to watch, what clothes to wear, what music to listen to, are as bad as any torture. Parents who make their kids psychologically dependable on their love and coerce them into submission by depriving them of said love, are far more dangerous than any respectful stranger could ever be.

Not really. They are simply teaching you how the world works. If you don't eat regularly, you will get ill, and you will eventually require treatment. It will also probably shorten your life expectancy. If you don't study your schoolwork, you will fail and academically you'll never amount to shit - in our world this is everything whether you agree with it or not, if you wish to get means, you have to play the game.

The only place I will agree with you is on the choice of acquiantance and entertainment - whilst it's acceptable for a parent to use emotional blackmail (in my eyes anyway) to dissaude a child from (for example) taking smack, using force in such a venture is not relevant.

However physical violence has a very valid place in proportion. Children must learn that life carries boundaries, and that to break them will result in serious repurcussions. It's not as if this would prevent them from breaking said boundaries later in life - it simply shows that actions have repurcussions in the simplest of terms.

Again, it's just another of life's lessons.

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

By the way sex with non pre-pubescent children is not defined as peadophilia at all, peadophilia is an attraction to pre-pubescant kids.

It's called pebophilia or something when you are attracted to teens.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2004, 07:13 PM

It's called pebophilia or something when you are attracted to teens.
imagine laws decide to put adult age up to 23 or down to 15
when are you a teenager? or a pedophile?

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

Good point, what constitutes a sex crime is usually based on public morality etc. often however with a good basis. This being teh most obvious (pre-pubescant teens that is)

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2004, 08:15 PM
Good point, what constitutes a sex crime is usually based on public morality etc. often however with a good basis. This being teh most obvious (pre-pubescant teens that is)
hence pre-pubescent teen please
is that from your own moral or this from the mob

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

The mob, the herd etc.

[gaf]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2004, 08:31 PM
The mob, the herd etc.
now we understand each other.etc..,

[commiecrusader]

whether paedophilia is wrong is an entirely subjective and situational question. for example, in the UK, the age at which sexual intercourse is permitted by law is 16 whereas in holland it is 14 (i think, or maybe even 12, correct me if im wrong). now in england or america if these 14 year old children were having sex many would regard that as wrong legally and morally but in holland it is not.

as Fabi said before, a large amount of how you view paedophilia is based upon the respect you have for the mental faculties of the young. now i have a 6 year old sister and by no means do i think she is ready for sex. but i do see girls around between the age of say 12-16 that i do think are ready for sex and understand the various connotations this involves. i know a girl who is nearly 16 and is 8 months pregnant and she was well aware of all the effects her actions could have, and is dealing with the situation much more responsibly than many of the adults seen on tv programmes such as Trisha in the UK and Jerry Springer for example in the US.

at the end of the day, non-consentual sex is wrong, at any age, any place, and for any reason. but consentual sex is a good thing. now i dont find young girls attractive, only over 16s for me, but if a 12 year old wants to have sex with someone around the same age, say at most, 6/7 years older, then i dont see anything wrong with that. now im not talking about uncle fester offering a toy for virginity since that is bribery not true consent. but i do fell that in most but not all cases, many people are ready mentally for sex by the age of 12, and can deal with it sensibly. i respect someone of that age enough not to expect them to have sex for a toy. i do however feel that younger than this age is wrong since they will not understand probably.

[Eddy66]

Id say the reason peadophilia is illegal and frowned upon is that for the most part, it IS non consentual and it IS wrong. Genuine cases where the kid actually understands whats going on or where the age differences are so small that it could be considered acceptable are there, definitely. But the only people who KNOW wether it was genuine consent are the 2 people involved, and this would be impossible to prove in court. So the law is to declare ALL paedophilia wrong.

Although a little more taboo, this pattern is consistent through many laws. Is killing a man that killed your daughter murder? Of course it is, but many would say it is justified.

So the question i think needs to be asked, what can be done?

The law stays, paedophiles are thrown in jail. Several innocent people included.

The law goes, several innocent people are free to have sexual relations with consenting children. Many, MANY other children are raped and abused, and all of these go un checked.




The law is there to protect as many people as possible, they know that innocent people will get caught in the definition of the law, but they believe it is worth it considering the consequences of what would hapen otherwise.




So to sum up my 2 cents, paedophilia CAN be ok, but it will ALWAYS be illegal. What can you do?

[commiecrusader]

i dont know. perhaps consent could be a defence to paedophilia? to a certain extent, in the UK at least it is a defence to some crimes. and in some european countries it is a defence to murder such as in euthanasia (for anyone who doesnt understand my poor grammar, the reason euthanasia is legal in some countries is because the murder is said to have been consented to).

also shouldnt the child/whatever you want to call it have the last say as to whether they consented to the act or not? even in the court of law. if as you say the law is there to protect the child and not merely to enforce the norms of 'society' i.e. the government, then the child's opinion should be the only one that matters.

[Djehuti]

Originally posted by Brooklyn-[email protected] 13 2004, 07:33 PM
What the fuck?

A child does not understand the consequences of his decisions. What if a ten-year old female is promised a toy pony if she let's Uncle Roger take her virginity, and she, not understanding what will happen, agrees?

You're sick, man.
A paedo doesnt have to have sex with children. I have nothing against people because they are sexually attracted by children. But that doesnt mean that I think it is ok for a paedo to have sex with children.

[The Feral Underclass]

The problem with this debate is that we no nothing about the effects social conditioning have on children. People very easily claim that children are mentally and physically capable of having sex but how do we actually know that?

When it comes to childrens physical ability it is a little easier than trying to determine whether they are mentally able. We can see whether or not someone is physically capable of enjoying sex (which is in the orgasm and feelings) or whether or not a girl or boy can actually peform the act. Young children of 8, 9, 10 etc etc are generally unable to orgasm, and for children that age it is generally uncomfortable and even damaging and painful to engage in the act in a submissive role. But, what if the child can orgasm and can practically do the act? Should they be restricted?

The other question is whether children are mentally capable of having sex. We, as adults, as church, school, state etc tell children what they are, how they are supposed to behave, what they are to think, eat, drink, how they are to engage with each other, what activities they are to do etc etc etc. If children were not conditioned in such a violent and aggressive way how are we to know that children arent capable of thinking about sex in a rational, reasonable way? We can't know that until we have broken down those sociatel barriers which oppress children into accepting their role in society.

As it is in the present system, I oppose sex with children. They really are not mentally prepared for it. But, I think that when society is changed and the rules and conditions for children to grow and be independent without being forced to be a certain way, the question should be asked again. When and if, and I say if, it is found that children both physically and mentally can engage in sex, then the choice should be theirs, and I would support it.

[T_SP]

Originally posted by [email protected] 14 2004, 04:16 PM
Does it not just make you fucking mad? :lol:




Oh yes!! Fucking Ironic ain't!!!!!!!!!!