Idealism and God

[Hiero]

Im currently reading V.I.Lenin's Materialism and Emprico - Critiscism.

Lenin quotes alot form the Idealist camp and agnostic camp, and in the chapter 2 L. Feuerbach and J.Dietzgen on thing-in-itself Lenin summarys the theory of the Machist's on the thing-in-itself.


We know only sensations, we cannot know of the existance of anything beyond the bounds of sensation

Then Lenin does not go on to show that there is a contradiction of the Idealist and the belief in god. I have come to believe the magority of Idealists are theist, if so is this quote then a proof that the whole idealist philosophy is a conradiction of the Idealist and how they cant possibly theist, since God is believed to be beyond our senses. That would hence mean there are no Idealist and they are all agnost.

[Monty Cantsin]

it does seem to be a big contridiction, if the idealist in question is a theist. but what i want to ask, did you get that book from the SA?

[Hiero]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12 2004, 04:26 AM
it does seem to be a big contridiction, if the idealist in question is a theist. but what i want to ask, did you get that book from the SA?
No Ghoulds book store in sydney, huge collection ask for the address on MSN.

[Monty Cantsin]

sick i will.

[Pedro Alonso Lopez]

We know only sensations, we cannot know of the existance of anything beyond the bounds of sensation

This is the basic premise of empiricism here, like say in the work of Hume. It is not exactly materialisy as such, just a recognition of the restrictions imposed upon man by the limitations of mind and body.



Then Lenin does not go on to show that there is a contradiction of the Idealist and the belief in god.

Why would he?


I have come to believe the magority of Idealists are theist, if so is this quote then a proof that the whole idealist philosophy is a conradiction of the Idealist and how they cant possibly theist, since God is believed to be beyond our senses.

God cannot be proved even by those who believe we can understand the world outside our senses, why should we distinguish between either of these camps?

You seem to be confusing empiricism with idealism.


That would hence mean there are no Idealist and they are all agnost.

Your conclusion is based on a misunderstanding or perhaps a need to look more into the background of what you are reading. I havent read this book but it seems to be becoming popular.

I must have a look...

[Hiero]

We know only sensations, we cannot know of the existance of anything beyond the bounds of sensation

Doesnt that quote mean for example that if a meterite was to hit earth but not damaged it so we can view it that we can not know if it exist before any human being had coming into our sensations.

But anyway i have read the paragragh again using www.marxist.org to quick find the passage and this is how he wrote.


The “doctrine” of Machism that since we know only sensations, we cannot know of the existence of anything beyond the bounds of sensation, is an old sophistry of idealist and agnostic philosophy served up with a new sauce.


Now when i read that i jump up and was glad that i had made my first observation in a philosophical text that i didnt really check the passage again. I wondered why Lenin didnt mention that this quote was agnostic, but he does.

Man i love this Philosophy stuff :D

[Daymare17]

If anyone is interested in a more modern take on dialectical materialism (nothing against Lenin) then feel free to check out Reason In Revolt: Marxist Philosophy And Modern Science (http://www.marxist.com/rircontents.asp). You can also order it at www.marxist.com/wellred

[rahul]

cappies will have great advantage from concept of GOD


so that people cant question them back.

by the concept of GOD people forget that


liberators dont exist, people are the liberators themself