Labour

[Palmares]

I know this is a strange thing to ask on a socialist site, but in the late few months I really have questioned why I have to work at all.

I look at my life and it all appears to be conditioned for one thing: a job. Life appears to revolved around work. You always hear people ask, "What do you want to be when you grow up?" or "What do plan on doing after school (secondary school/university)?" Having an education is all about enabling you to have a 'career'. Some people hate school. Why do they go? For an education? To some degree, but the prospect of a job from having an 'education' is much more influential. Not many people go to school for education for it's own sake.

It wasn't that longer ago really that I thought people were stupid if they didn't know "what they were gonna do" after school. But my conditions have changed, and my 'clear path' is no longer so clear.

Perhaps I will end up working, but I do not want to work in the way this world attempts to condition me to. Work on my own terms.

My question is, why should I have to work anyway? I can only see two things that could influence me: to help others, and for some sort of loose fulfilment. Perhaps they are linked together. What do you guys think?

[Essential Insignificance]

Interesting to say the least and a little out of reality to say the more. :lol:

From what I understand you are from the exceedingly prosperous, capitalist nation of Australia. Which for that reason alone brings up some "major" problems of your livelihood and how you would sustain it once independent.

Sure, in an capitalist society "you are what you do"; "you are what your occupation is", and that alone defines your character.

As much as I fear the prospect of working full time, sooner or latter, it's going to have to happen, to support my existence above all else.

I just hope, for you, that you find a job that is socially satisfying for yourself and the others that you facilitate.


Is working compulsory

If you want to eat.

[Pawn Power]

i know where you are comming from. I am going to college in the fall and have all this pressure from family, teachers, gidence counslers ex. to pick a major or to make a decision on what to study. Everything in your life seems to direct you to a job. It is your only goal in life. You should be working towards a career. It seems no one goes to school for an education, it is just to prepare you for a job and that is the only reason you are reciving this information. This is how a capitalist society works though. You are brought up to obey the rules and get a job and worry about yourself.
I think the key is to dedacate your life to something worthwhile, like communism, and your job is the capitalist world can be second.

[blank_frackis]

In a supposedly Welfare State you should be allowed to live off benefits, and what's more benefits should be liveable on not merely some safety net.

[Purple]

Where my girlfriend used to live(Iran) an education was vital, as if you didnt have an education you didnt have a job, and if you didnt have a job, then you didnt have a "life", and if you didnt make money you would more or less starve....

I suppose that to "work" has alot to do with status, and how others perceive you... Not in all situations, but in many...

[cubist]

if beniftis were livable off and you didn't have to work would you work? no, thats the problem with the UK at the moment, alot of homeowners who got lucky with money bought a house and then wasted the rest of the money away, on things, can and do live on the dole.

[Monty Cantsin]

Originally posted by [email protected] 20 2004, 01:33 AM
In a supposedly Welfare State you should be allowed to live off benefits, and what's more benefits should be liveable on not merely some safety net.
are you saying the government, the tax payers should have to pay for someone who will not work at all? fine if the person is going from one job to a different one, or is just haveing a hard time trying to find one in the frist place. but not i dont want to work ever give me money thats not on.

[Sammi87]

in my school all any careers person or teacher (in general) ever cared about were the people who were going to go on to college and then university and acted is if the other people didnt matter, that always used to upset me how they didnt care about the others. sorry i think thats a little off topic but i just thought id throw in my 2 cents.

[rebelgames]

Don't you think that this is partially why you are here? The idea that you are going to have to waste away the better part of your life worrying about this education that is so biased and unfulfilling just so you can get this job that is even more unfulfilling. You will spin this web, so filled with these obviously fallacious rules on how to conduct your life. This is not what you want. This is not how you can stand to live your life. This is why you are a socialist is it not? Because the web of capitalism is wrong. So work in capitalism as your disguise. Be a super hero trying to save the world with the disguise of the working class man.

[Cheech06]

Dont fall in the trap!! I will be damned if i have to live off of every pay check. That is the situation right now. I dont have any plans on goin to college just to get a career and live happily ever after. You cant think like that. You have to die fighting for a revolution or in it! Well i think i might go to school to be an engineer, but only to help in the revolution. i know these goals might seem a little far fetched, but it can happen, dont give up.

[CubanFox]

Originally posted by [email protected] 29 2004, 03:21 PM
Dont fall in the trap!! I will be damned if i have to live off of every pay check. That is the situation right now. I dont have any plans on goin to college just to get a career and live happily ever after. You cant think like that. You have to die fighting for a revolution or in it! Well i think i might go to school to be an engineer, but only to help in the revolution. i know these goals might seem a little far fetched, but it can happen, dont give up.
Go to university. Please! You'll regret it later if you don't.

[The Feral Underclass]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 04:28 AM
I know this is a strange thing to ask on a socialist site, but in the late few months I really have questioned why I have to work at all.
When you say work what do you actually mean? If you mean for the man, then there is absolutly no reason for you to do it. There are many collectives or communities around the world which would be more than happy to take you in. Of course you'd have to work some there to make the place run, but at least it would be for yourself and your community rather than for someone else.

Alternativly you could just go on the dole. It's free money after all.


I look at my life and it all appears to be conditioned for one thing: a job. Life appears to revolved around work.

It does. If your not actually working then your recovering from it, travelling to and from it, preparing for it or trying to forget about it while waiting to back to it.


Having an education is all about enabling you to have a 'career'. Some people hate school. Why do they go? For an education?

The trick is to find a subject you enjoy. I know many people who are at university studying degrees which they enjoy. You might find that doing a degree in philosophy or politics is actually extremly fun, and learning about a subject you love can't be all bad. Especially if you get to live the student life at the same time.


It wasn't that longer ago really that I thought people were stupid if they didn't know "what they were gonna do" after school. But my conditions have changed, and my 'clear path' is no longer so clear.

Then find comfort in that. You can be liberated in knowing that nothing is clear. Living in the present is probably the most difficult thing human beings have to do, because we have the rediculous ability of percieving our future. Finding happiness in meaninglessness is actually extremly liberating.


Perhaps I will end up working, but I do not want to work in the way this world attempts to condition me to. Work on my own terms.

But be prepared for a life of having nothing. If you dont work, then you cant buy stuff. Sometimes the desire to have belongings is greater than the desire to not work. Working on your own terms can sometimes be very unrewarding in regards to material possessions or even money in general, especially if you have no trained skill...I have no degree, or skill, necessarily, and when i'm not working in this organisation I am usually on the dole...For me that's fine. I have a good strong group of friends who look out for each other, and we find liberation in having very little..We never seem to go without though! ;)


My question is, why should I have to work anyway? I can only see two things that could influence me: to help others, and for some sort of loose fulfilment. Perhaps they are linked together. What do you guys think?

You have to work in order to get stuff...Of course there are ways around that, but you have to be prepared to take the consequences. Find something that makes you happy and stick to it and when it doesnt make you happy anymore, find something else.

[Hate Is Art]

Don't get an office job!! I'm hoping to be a paper boy for 50 years and retire on a nice cushy pension after inheriting my parents house once they die and the mortgage is paid off.

[apathy maybe]

If I answer seriously to the question "what do you want to do when ..." I always say I want to be a bum. No worries about paying off debts or loans, don't have to go to work everyday (or even at a set time), easy living.

I just realised why I love Uni so much! No money worries (I get money from the Govt. which is enough to live off (and save)), no worry about getting up everyday, or a set time to get up, easy living. This is so much better then last year! (I know people who are working on their third degree, I don't think I'll do that, but it would be fun.)

And why should anyone have to work? Enough people will always work that it doesn't matter if a few don't.

[DaCuBaN]

Don't get an office job!!

I guess it depends... I chose not to go to university (for various reasons I won't divulge) but instead to 'test the water' of the working community with the thought of going back into education before I'm 25 (so far, so good).

In that time (approximately 4 years so far), I've been a clerk, garden labourer, trade plumbing salesman, IT callout technician, inhouse IT technician, data entry operator, potwasher, commis chef and probably some more I've forgotten to mention.

The point I'm getting at is out of all these jobs, the only one that actually pissed me off was the clerk - nothing is worse than having to deal with assholes and money. Even being a salesman was better than that.


why should anyone have to work? Enough people will always work that it doesn't matter if a few don't

It's not about 'working' of course, but about giving something back. If you could prove to me that you were actually learning something at University, I'd be quite happy for you to never do a proper days work as you would be furthering the society at least intellectually.

The problem of course is this becomes a loophole for the lazy...

[Essential Insignificance]

What a completely contemptible attitude to have; let alone proclaim! I can only hope for your loathsome sake that this is a joke. If you would even consider remotely, to go to university just because it’s an "easy ride", is of a great foolishness on your part!

Sure its granted that your might want to undertake three degrees, for your self and to better your knowledge; but to do so for the sake of it, is abominable.

[DaCuBaN]

I don't know... but any 'free education' system... I'd have it as mandatory that if you wish to do some form of further education that you give back directly to the system - Perhaps a year of teaching for every four years of study?

[Essential Insignificance]

I don't know... but any 'free education' system... I'd have it as mandatory that if you wish to do some form of further education that you give back directly to the system - Perhaps a year of teaching for every four years of study?

That’s actually not a bad idea.

[Guerrilla22]

Originally posted by [email protected] 30 2004, 04:39 AM
I don't know... but any 'free education' system... I'd have it as mandatory that if you wish to do some form of further education that you give back directly to the system - Perhaps a year of teaching for every four years of study?
They have a system similar to this at the grad school level. Basically, you teach undergrads as a grad assistant and in return you get free schooling, or at least a fairly large chunk of the cost to get your master's.

That's all fine and dandy if you are a grad student, however if you are an under grad (such as myself) you find yourself mounting a growing sum of loans to cover the cost of going to school. I'm a political science major at the University of Colorado. In the one year that I've been there I've racked up $20,000 in debt. by the time I graduate it will be more like $40,000. True the interest rates for student loans are low, but that may change in the near future and also the amount of debt I have would be considered low by some people.

I feel like you don't go to a university to get a job, you get a job to pay for your time at a university.

[pedro san pedro]

i'm personally quite disgusted by how many people on this board seem to be comfortable with the concept of being on the dole.

you people are no better than the capitalists.

you ***** and moan about how the capitalist makes his money by having others d the work for him - never lifting a finger himself. yet you seem quite content to live off the fruits of my labour.

the dole is there for people that desperately need it - not for people to bludge off the system. in doing so, you are only mking it harder for those that are there because of desperation.

stop moaning about the fact that you cant find decent work nd grow up and realise that neither can anyone else.

then follow TAT's advice and give up your petty materilism and you wont need the 40 hour week any more.