The Judaeo-Christian relationship

[Trissy]

I could have put this topic in Opposing Ideologies or in Politics but I chose to play it safe and place it here. I was flicking through Pascal's 'Pensées' (as you do) and I came across the following passage which got me thinking:


'Either Jews or Christians must be wicked'

Now I'm wishing to leave the usual religious debates aside (i.e 'it's all rubbish and you're wrong'/'it's great and you're wrong') and focus instead realtionship between these two 'very close' monotheistic religions. We're led to believe that a lot of Western morality and culture depend on the historical relationship of these two religions and indeed we are even told that that they are close and desire the same ends ('i.e. humans loving one another and living peaceful land sinless lives).

My question is how can these two religions pretend to be so close when they disagree on one fundamental issue (i.e. Jesus)? Many Christians believe that Jews are going to hell for not believing in the coming of Christ and having him executed, whereas many Jews think that Christians are evil for having the nerve to believe in a fraud who was passing himself of as Christ. How can we possibley believe that these religions are close when in fact they are rivals who are wishing each other to hell?

Added to this we have George Bush and Ariel Sharon (and the respective leaders before them) acting all pally over the Israeli-Palestine issue. Is it because they are close ideologically or is it because they fear the Palestinians and the Muslims more then they fear each other? Is this relationship really a sham? Your thoughts will be much appreciated...

[redstar2000]

According to a conservative Jewish rabbi that I read once, Judaism is a "practical", "down to earth" religion most concerned with how humans should "properly" relate to each other; whereas Christianity is fundamentally a "mystical" religion concerned with how humans should relate to "God".

He had a low opinion of mysticism. :lol:

:redstar2000:

The Redstar2000 Papers (http://www.redstar2000papers.fightcapitalism.net)
A site about communist ideas

[BuyOurEverything]

From my experience, that is generally true redstar. As for the relationship between the two, it is only a modern thing. Historically, christians have hated jews, jews have hated christians, muslims have allied with jews, etc, etc. The current alliance between jews and christians is just a political alliance and has nothing to do with their fundamental beliefs.

edit: Has anyone head the story about some christians baptising jews who died during the holocast? Funny shit, that...

[Trissy]

He had a low opinion of mysticism :lol:

Mmm...a very interesting stance coming from a religion that believes in burning bushes that talk to people and give them very important laws to follow. That said I can see the advantage in burning Bush :P


Historically, christians have hated jews, jews have hated christians, muslims have allied with jews, etc, etc

Indeed that is what I thought. We only need to take a look at how easily a nice Catholic country like France took little persuation to hand all there Jews over to Hitler (although I realise there are other historical reasons for this as well).


Has anyone head the story about some christians baptising jews who died during the holocast? Funny shit, that...

I hadn&#39;t heard that but my experience with Christians means that I can easily believe that...they&#39;ll baptise and bless everything if it isn&#39;t nailed down and covered up. Their optimism amazes me at times <_<

[percept¡on]

Evangelical Xtians believe that the Jews are God&#39;s chosen people, and that the second coming of Jesus is going to take place in Israel, hence their support for the Jewish state. Some nutbags even believe that the apocalypse is going to start in Israel with some Jew/Muslim conflict.

[Trissy]

Evangelical Xtians believe that the Jews are God&#39;s chosen people, and that the second coming of Jesus is going to take place in Israel, hence their support for the Jewish state

Which makes us ask the question why the heck aren&#39;t they Jewish then? Do they seem to forget that they had Jesus put to death? If he was the son of God (I hate having to utter those words&#33; <_< ) then I doubt he&#39;ll be too pleased with them when he does return.

[Wenty]

Tristan - I know you like to think of yourself as a latter day Nietzsche, throwing off the shackles of organised religion. Please&#33; Help us see the light&#33;

[Trissy]

Adam, you know very little about me although I &#39;know&#39; you like to think you do. I&#39;m not vain enough to think myself anything like the great man when I&#39;m clearly not. All I try to do is highlight what I see as problems, even if I have nothing close to the philosophical and writing skills that he had in his possession. Plus I agree with much of what he said...what would you prefer me to do? Live a lie and deny my thoughts? Well you may do what you want with your life, but please spare your concern for mine...

oh and do stop being a sarcastic little twerp, you&#39;re beginning to get on my nerves&#33;

I also notice you didn&#39;t pass any comment on the topic I raised...care to share your views or do merely wish to try and assassinate my character?

[Wenty]

lol, classic overexaggerated response&#33; by the way, i reckon the word &#39;twerp&#39; should be brought back into circulation, keep it alive.

[Trissy]

lol, classic overexaggerated response&#33;
lol, classical avoidance of the points I raised&#33;


by the way, i reckon the word &#39;twerp&#39; should be brought back into circulation, keep it alive.
Don&#39;t worry, I shall.