Can the power be handed back by June?

[New Tolerance]

Things aren't looking too good right now, do you think power can still be given back to Iraqis by June?

Discuss.

In my opinion, unless something really dramatic happens this month, which doesn't seems to be brewing up, the deadline will have to be extended. (although they seem determined to hand power back by then)

[lucid]

Originally posted by New [email protected] 3 2004, 11:03 PM
Things aren't looking too good right now, do you think power can still be given back to Iraqis by June?

Discuss.

In my opinion, unless something really dramatic happens this month, which doesn't seems to be brewing up, the deadline will have to be extended. (although they seem determined to hand power back by then)
I think its rediculous to even try and hand back power this soon. They are still fighting in city streets for crying out loud. I wish Bush would of never specified a dead line. Maybe he wouldn't have if people gave him a little more support.

[Osman Ghazi]

Well, it's only going to get worse from here. When the Iraqis figure out that Bush is trying to stick his cock up their collective ass again, they're only going to get more off. Already Najaf is rebelling against the U$. It's only a short time until the Battle for Baghdad II, IMO.

[lucid]

Originally posted by Osman [email protected] 4 2004, 02:12 AM
Well, it's only going to get worse from here. When the Iraqis figure out that Bush is trying to stick his cock up their collective ass again, they're only going to get more off. Already Najaf is rebelling against the U$. It's only a short time until the Battle for Baghdad II, IMO.
How is bush sticking "his cock" up their ass? It's my understanding that the US doesn't even get much oil from Iraq. Whats the reason?

[Commie Girl]

The whole idea is ridiculous considering the fact that the Iraqis will only have as much sovereignty and autonomy as the Bu$hies will let them.

[HankMorgan]

Yes, power can be handed back to the Iraqi people by June 30, 2004. Easily.

First, two simple ideas.

1. Everybody is capable of governing themselves. There doesn't have to be a huge government controlling every aspect of life.

2. A nation will remain free and stable as long as no person or group can get control of all of the levers of power. Stated differently power has to be diluted amongst the people.

On June 30th a message like the following is made clear:

How the Iraqi people govern themselves is the concern of the Iraqi people. The coalition will stay to make sure no one grabs all the power for themselves. When Iraqi governing institutions can insure this for the Iraqi people, the coalition will leave.

As of June 30th all foreign contractors in Iraq will be forced to leave. All construction will be done by Iraqi workers. The coalition will arrange for any materials needed that cannot be supplied by local sources.

Then on July 1, all the coalition forces just step into a few bases in the countryside.

There should be a large coalition base next to Najaf where Sadr is but the coalition should never enter Najaf. Once in the bases, the coalition troops don't go out or let Iraqis in. The troops just sit and wait.

The Iraqi people are smart just like everyone else. They can create their own democratic institutions just like everyone else. They can build a fine country with their own hands. All that has to happen is to keep another Saddam Hussein from grabbing all the power.

[Intifada]

:ph34r:

[Intifada]

wolfowitz admits iraq's sovereignty after june 30 would be limited (http://www.uruknet.info/?p=2053)

[Osman Ghazi]

How is bush sticking "his cock" up their ass? It's my understanding that the US doesn't even get much oil from Iraq. Whats the reason?

Well if someone told you they were going to give the power back on a certain date and then they didn't, you'd probably view as them trying to you over, no?

[cubist]

i think it is going ok,

people are dying tsill but until america takes aback seat that won't stop, it will go through on the 30th how ever america will be the police for some time after

[Severian]

Nothing is going to happen on June 30.

The "new Iraqi government" will not control the foreign troops in Iraq, or even the Iraqi sepoy troops. It will not have lawmaking power. It will be appointed by the U.S., with a UN envoy providing a bit of a fig-leaf. It will have no power or sovereignty.

So what will be handed over on June 30? Blame, mostly. When the hospitals have no medicine, when the power goes out, when raw sewage runs through the streets of Baghdad, the U.S. occupation can tell people to go complain to the "sovereign" Iraqi government.

And maybe the ability to sign contracts with U.S. companies, giving away even more of Iraq's economy and natural resources...

[Touchstone]

No. Even if we do had "power" back to the Iraqi people, how much power will it be? All I can do is laugh at you Hank. Now if we wanted to give them "power" we could hand them our Constitiution, our Bill of Rights, our Articles, and our national laws. Why don't we just do that? Because the U.S is a IMPERALIST NATION. Anyway, We need a strong point in the Middle East. The oil is a minor factor, but the major factor is a strong point in the Middle East. The Iraqi people will never be free. Not to our extent. NEVER. Bush won't allow it.

[lucid]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2004, 06:16 PM
No. Even if we do had "power" back to the Iraqi people, how much power will it be? All I can do is laugh at you Hank. Now if we wanted to give them "power" we could hand them our Constitiution, our Bill of Rights, our Articles, and our national laws. Why don't we just do that? Because the U.S is a IMPERALIST NATION. Anyway, We need a strong point in the Middle East. The oil is a minor factor, but the major factor is a strong point in the Middle East. The Iraqi people will never be free. Not to our extent. NEVER. Bush won't allow it.
Just wanted to remind you that Bush is not a dictator. So he will be in office for limited time. Therefore you shouldn't say that they will never be free because Bush will not allow it.

[M.L]

I think its rediculous to even try and hand back power this soon. They are still fighting in city streets for crying out loud. I wish Bush would of never specified a dead line. Maybe he wouldn't have if people gave him a little more support.


A deadline is needed so the iraqi people can see a future. Maybe the deadline was a little to optimistic but there definetily have to be one. Allso it most be followed, if you push it up one time you can do it again.

[Touchstone]

Yes, Bush *ALMOST* fits the criteria for a dictator. If Bush gets re-elected, then we have four more years of a imperialist nation. Oh, wait, we are anyway.

[lucid]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2004, 07:50 PM
Yes, Bush *ALMOST* fits the criteria for a dictator. If Bush gets re-elected, then we have four more years of a imperialist nation. Oh, wait, we are anyway.
Maybe he is "almost" a dictator if you look it up in the lefty wacko dictionary where the definition is "anyone that doesn't believe what you believe". But, in the real world, the one we live in today, he is nothing like a dictator. Good job trying to demonize him though.

[Touchstone]

Umm.....correct me if i'm wrong but the Partriot Act, The Ivasion of Iraq, our activities in China, but all of these things have allowed him to come to the brink of dictatiorship. Leftist Dictionary? Anyone who is opposed to me has the right to be opposed to me, except Nazis

[lucid]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2004, 08:20 PM
Umm.....correct me if i'm wrong but the Partriot Act, The Ivasion of Iraq, our activities in China, but all of these things have allowed him to come to the brink of dictatiorship. Leftist Dictionary? Anyone who is opposed to me has the right to be opposed to me, except Nazis
You mean the patriot act that was passed by congress? So Bush is a dictator because congress passed the patriot act? He did support it, but he didn't just make it law. Are all the members of congress dictators also?

Invading Iraq does not make him a dictator. I'll just leave it at that.

What exactly is Bush doing in China that makes him a dictator?


Your digging big time. Want a shovel?

[M.L]

Maybe Bush as a person isn't a dictator but the whole american government is!

[New Tolerance]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2004, 10:48 PM
Maybe Bush as a person isn't a dictator but the whole american government is!
whoa come down.

[Touchstone]

Bush had to sign the bill. Dont be ignorant. No, ivading Iraq makes him an Imperialist.

[Severian]

Why? The fact is that nobody in Iraq elected Bremer, or the U.S. government, to rule them. It is an old-fashioned colonial situation.

Whether Bush gets reelected or not is irrelevant, as Kerry advocates continuing the same policies.

[Darkwing]

I say we partition Iraq into 2 or 3 sections. Shiites, Kurds, and Sunnis.
What? You say that will cause civil war?
Precisely! And they won't bother anyone else for another half-century.

But seriously, I don't think much more than a ceremony will take place on June 30th, if even that.

Is Bush a dictator? No. Heavens no. To quote the great Jon Stewart "In their heart of hearts they really think what they're doing is best for America and for everyone, no matter how obviously insane it is."

Is the Patriot Act a bad act? Yes. And like ANY law it is going to be abused, and like any bad act it will eventually be repealed.

And I'd note something - given the history of the world, isn't it awefully nice of the US to plan to turn over sovereignity to Iraqis at all? "We conquered their asses! Now they belong to us!" is what you would hear from any country a century ago, and most countries today (China, I'm looking at you!)

My magic pill for Iraq would be to leave nothing but a small force (to act as trainers, advisors, and bodyguards) and to do it soon. There will be chaos, but lets face it, there's gonna be chaos anyway. Might as well get it over with.

[Osman Ghazi]

(China, I'm looking at you!)

To be fair, Tibet was part of China until the chaos of the Chinese Revolution.

[Touchstone]

Darkwing, that's really selfish. Don't be ignorant, we are being an imperialist nation. You're blind if you can't see it. Why don't we just hand them our laws and our constition? BECAUSE WE NEED A STRONGBASE IN THE MIDDLE EAST. Besides Isreal. The oil is a plus.

[DaCuBaN]

'And Every City, The Whole World Round
Will Just Be Another American Town
Oh How Peaceful It'll Be, We'll Set Everybody Free'

-Randy Newman, Political Science

It always amazes me that despite the fact so much of this ground has been covered it gets dig up again. :rolleyes: <_<


given the history of the world, isn&#39;t it awefully nice of the US to plan to turn over sovereignity to Iraqis at all? "We conquered their asses&#33; Now they belong to us&#33;" is what you would hear from any country a century ago, and most countries today

The problem is that america somehow thinks it is being just when in fact they are merely going around bullying the less powerful nations of the world (ie all of them) into their way of thinking. I find it sickening.

Will power be returned? I think the actions promised will happen, but that Iraq will never be free.