What’s the difference between a Jay-Z and Wayne Br

[Rodnegro]

http://www.rodrigo-ny.com/Culture/WanyeJay.jpg

Was interested in hearing what separates a Jay-Z (someone who “keeps real”) and a Wayne Brady (someone who people say is an uncle tom “sellout”)

http://www.rodrigo-ny.com

[Hasta Siempre Comandante]

There is no difference- Jay-Z is all about money and fame- I don't even understand how people can say he's keeping it real- his music is radio - he doesn't care about using his music to educate people, he just wants to be on Billboard's top 10. Artists like Jay-Z would change their lyrical content in a second, to please the corporate elite. I classify Immortal Technique as real, I classify Afu-Ra and Dead Prez as real. Getting a fat record deal insn't necessarily selling out- but when you change your music and your message juts to get that record deal- that's selling out!

[Hampton]

I moved this back to Politics because it's not about music only, it's about the way we perceive these two different men in society as a whole. Rod, as always, shows a good point in the way we view people, one is quick to classify Wayne Brady as a sellout because he sings and dances and has his own TV show in the morning...and he gets criticized for not being "black enough" what ever that means.

On the other hand you have Jay Z, famous rapper, clothing line and shitty night club owner and all around rich guy, is seen differently because he has a lot of money and he has created this image of himself in his music, saying he's the greatest rapper alive, a hustler, keeping it real for those in the hood, which in reality, he gives nothing back to the hood. He could care less about the hood our it's starving people when he's in his jet talking about big pimpin.

People need to start opening up this minds, most rappers live on this street credibility shit, being from the toughest project and all that shit, the streets need to start demanding something back from the people who use them.

[Urban Rubble]

one is quick to classify Wayne Brady as a sellout because he sings and dances and has his own TV show in the morning...and he gets criticized for not being "black enough" what ever that means.

That's exactly what I was going to say. Alot of this criticism of Wayne Brday is ridiculous, and you hit the nail on the head, it's because people don't feel he's "black enough".

Meanwhile, you have the walking stereotype Jay-Z doing more to set back the Civil Rights movement than Alfalfa by perpetuating everything racists want to say are characteristics of a young black male. And he is the one keeping it real ? The guy bragging about selling coke ? The guy that can't go a song without mentioning cars, jewlery or at the very least "Cristal" ?

[redstar2000]

People need to start opening up this minds, most rappers live on this street credibility shit, being from the toughest project and all that shit, the streets need to start demanding something back from the people who use them.

"Demand" all you like...why shouldn't they just laugh at you?

Can you imagine poor whites "demanding" that Britney Spears or Madonna "give something back"?

The idea that "pop culture" of any kind in some fashion "represents" the struggles of ordinary people is highly dubious, to say the least.

In fact, to even speak of social reality and pop culture in the same sentence is absurd. The whole point of pop culture is to distract you from social reality.

To argue about which pop icon is "real" is exactly what they want you to do.

None of them are "real"...how could they be? When you get rich, your reality changes. When you can spend more on one suit than most working people earn in a year, your "reality" is fundamentally different...and so is your consciousness.

You must be aware of the fact that there are whole floors of offices in the buildings of the major recording labels where people do nothing except plan the construction of the next "pop icon"...it's probably no different than the design department at General Motors or Intel. They research "trends" and "customer preferences" and put together a "package" that they hope will have mass appeal...they hope you will buy their product.

Indeed, they hope you will develop a powerful emotional identification with their product and keep on buying.

If you happen to like someone's music, go ahead and buy and enjoy your listening experience.

But don't kid yourself that any of it or the performer himself/herself is "real".

It's all for show.

(And I still think this thread belongs in Music, but I will defer to my co-moderator's judgment.)

:redstar2000:

The Redstar2000 Papers (http://www.redstar2000papers.vze.com)
A site about communist ideas

[Saint-Just]

I don't think many rappers recognise the problems in the ghettos and what is responsible for them. People like Immortal Technique do, but I doubt he makes much money at all.

What do people think of NAS?

[Hampton]

"Demand" all you like...why shouldn't they just laugh at you?

Laugh all they want, does that mean we shouldn't demand?


Can you imagine poor whites "demanding" that Britney Spears or Madonna "give something back"?

When Brittany starts singing about being from Mississippi and how proud she is to be from there, and the poverty in the area, and what a hard knock life it was then it might make sense. Instead you have Jay Z mentioning Marcy Projects in every song, Nas throwing up Queensbridge, Krs-One in the Bronx, Biggie Smalls in Bed-Sty. If you're goin g to prostitute the name, give it something back besides recognition.

The idea is to use the music to unify the people, it's made so people can relate to what's going on in the streets, where they came from, but of course that changes over time and as they begin to rap about cars, millions of dollars, and expensive drinks, it gets more and more removed from that element.


The idea that "pop culture" of any kind in some fashion "represents" the struggles of ordinary people is highly dubious, to say the least.

I'd disagree, hip hop as a movement and an art was heavily based on socially conscience lyrics and brining awareness to a lot of people. Take Grandmaster Flash "The Message" (http://www.lyricsfreak.com/g/grandmaster-flash/62225.html) an early hip hop song, quite famous, was about living in the ghetto and the poverty all around. That's the way Public Enemy made a living, that's the way Mr. Lif (http://display.lyrics.astraweb.com:2000/display.cgi?mr_lif..emergency_rations..home_of_the _brave), Immortal Technique (http://www.getlyrics.com/lyrics.php/Immortal+Technique/SHOW+LYRICS/Cause+of+Death), and Ras Kass (http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Soul-on-Ice-lyrics-Ras-Kass/C575B8AC803C3E7C48256A38002430F4) make their living.

It's the tradition of the culure


And I still think this thread belongs in Music, but I will defer to my co-moderator's judgment.)

Thanks for the vote of confidence.

[Nas]

there are rappers that do give back to the community , just because Jay-Z doesnt give back , it doesnt mean Ludacris doesnt give back

if you think none of the rappers give back , then you are being prejudice
and i hate when people are prejudice
even though Nas (Nas's story is long i will make a post explaining it one day) made it commercial , he cant be compare to 50 cent

[Eastside Revolt]

I personally would not go as far as to call either of the "house negro's" ofcourse I AM white, however this wouldn't be the only reason. I'd like to point-out that some of the richest families in France are members of the French communist party. Aswell you have to realize that as much money as Jay-Z makes he is still an ant to be squashed by the fascist elite of America. If he just goes around frittering his money away to charity how is he actually supposed to get some real power. You don't just need money to gain power, yet great stinking heaps of it, and it takes money to make that money. If these are Jay-Z actuall plans? I think not, but just remember being rich is actually gonna be quite difficult when your in the lowest caste in a country that runs on a caste system.

The real "uncle toms" (to me) are people who hop in bed with the police, CIA, and other political powers that actively hurt the American people (and world-wide). People like Condeleeza Rice, and Colin Powell. :angry:

[celtopunk]

Who the hell is Wayne Brady and what's this about the Nets moving to Brooklyn?

[IPkurd]

50 cent is a total fuck-up, he isnt a sell out because he never had anything worth selling out to, in other words he is just a play toy for shady+aftamath records. he has good beats dow i gotta give him that.

Nas is on a better track, but he's bling bling because the industry wants him to be plus his own interest with money.

[Xvall]

Well Hampton, I hardly classify hip-hop as pop culture. That isn't what it was, thankfully that isn't what all of it is (which is probably why a lot of people hate it so much) and if things go alright (they won't) it probably won't be.

[Hampton]

Some portion of hip hop has been part of the pop culture for a long time, it's probally at it's apex now though, with rappers being able to come into mainstream society as a whole and not just in music, such as the clothing lines and movies.

Sugarhill Gang was pop culture when they rapped in that disco in their famous video, Run Dmc with Aerosmith is pop culture, but, the majority of hip hop elements are not, and never will be popular culture. The intelligance, empowerment, and most of the messages will never be popular becuase they are dangerous to the power structure.

Ideas of non comformity coming from the least wanted people in the country will never be popular, but they will always have an audience.