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Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 00:05
Charlottesville, VA, A fascist drove their car into the counter protest killing 1 initially, now being reported as 3 dead with injuries at 26. A person involved either driving or in the car was arrested.


***fairly graphic pictures and videos at that link***
https://itsgoingdown.org/one-dead-charlottesville-right-can-kill-us-now/

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 00:10
Mainstream press picking up on a narrative

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/12/politics/trump-fails-to-condemn-the-alt-right-white-supremacists/index.html

Seven Hills antifa twitter, **Note** Solidarity actions being planned already in several major cities so check it out.

https://twitter.com/ash_antifa?lang=en

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 00:58
Seven Hills antifa page (twitter comment link) stating a comrade and iww member was killed when the car drove into the crowd.

willowtooth
13th August 2017, 01:37
2 of 3 dead so far are apparently police officers that were shot out of the sky by klansmen they were in a helicopter that was surveying the riot. Nothing officially confirmed yet, other than 2 dead in a helicopter crash 7 miles away from the riot. Police are not even confirming that it was a police helicopter for some reason, despite several witnesses saying they saw a police helicopter turn upside and fall out of the sky.

RSS News
13th August 2017, 01:40
via fightbacknews.org (http://www.fightbacknews.org/)

Freedom Road Socialist Organization condemns the racist right-wing attack that took place in Charlottesville, Virginia on August 12.
Protesters opposing a white supremacist ‘Unite the Right’ rally faced a vicious attack. As protesters gathered near a downtown mall in Charlottesville, a grey car drove at high speed into the crowd of activists, killing at least one and injuring at least 19 others.
This sickening crime is part of the rise in white supremacists since the election of Donald Trump. His presidency has emboldened forces like white nationalists, Neo-Nazis, and the KKK. The protesters in Charlottesville were correct to oppose these forces, and everyone who loves peace, freedom and equality should continue to oppose this racist and reactionary movement by whatever means fitting and necessary.
Across the country, organizers are calling for emergency actions to stand in solidarity with the people of Charlottesville, and Freedom Road Socialist Organization calls upon the entire movement to support those in Charlottesville anyway they can. Those of us fighting for a better world must continue to oppose right-wing bigots and oppose white supremacists in whatever guise they take. All of our thoughts and concerns turn towards the people of Charlottesville as we continue the fight for peace and justice in an unjust world. The racists and reactionaries will pay for their crimes.



More... (http://www.fightbacknews.org/2017/8/12/freedom-road-socialist-organization-condemns-white-supremacist-attack-charlottesville)

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 01:40
2 of 3 dead so far are apparently police officers that were shot out of the sky by klansmen they were in a helicopter that was surveying the riot. Nothing officially confirmed yet, other than 2 dead in a helicopter crash 7 miles away from the riot. Police are not even confirming that it was a police helicopter for some reason, despite several witnesses saying they saw a police helicopter turn upside and fall out of the sky.

There are local news sites over on the other coast that are picking up the helicopter crash as killing 2 which is being reported as separate from the 3 dead and 26 injured due to the car crash. I'm also seeing the 1 reported dead article as being an initial article that wasn't going to be updated.

willowtooth
13th August 2017, 02:02
There are local news sites over on the other coast that are picking up the helicopter crash as killing 2 which is being reported as separate from the 3 dead and 26 injured due to the car crash. I'm also seeing the 1 reported dead article as being an initial article that wasn't going to be updated.
Only 1 dead from the car crash so far, a few people confirming through social media they've been released already, a member of the DSA was released with a broken leg, another with head lacerations youcaring crowdfunding has already started for their medical bills. No word yet on the rest or how many are in critical condition

willowtooth
13th August 2017, 05:04
Victim has been identified as 31 year old Heather Heyer.

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia% 2FDHE-hDCXUAATd4E.jpg%3Alarge

The fascist has been identified as 20 year old James Fields, 9 people are still in serious to critical condition

http://jewishbreakingnews.com/2017/08/12/watch-white-supremacist-rams-crowd-virginia-kills-1-injures-19/

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 05:31
Victim has been identified as 31 year old Heather Heyer.


Copy and format the photo and put it up everywhere

GLF
13th August 2017, 06:38
Liberals are to blame for this.

Disgusting acts and a beautiful young life lost. Liberals from all over the country are condemning it but her blood is on their hands.

They're complicit, along with every disgusting fascist that took part in that demonstration. They write checks that actual leftists have to cash. But where are they when the shit goes down?

Remember...liberals defend fascists (http://nypost.com/2017/08/10/milo-yiannopoulos-gains-aclu-support-in-free-speech-lawsuit/). Always have. Always will.

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 19:51
I'm not sure I expected anything else but there seems to be a major black out in media coverage or media coverage on official responses.

Jimmie Higgins
13th August 2017, 20:20
Liberals are to blame for this.

Disgusting acts and a beautiful young life lost. Liberals from all over the country are condemning it but her blood is on their hands.

They're complicit, along with every disgusting fascist that took part in that demonstration. They write checks that actual leftists have to cash. But where are they when the shit goes down?

Remember...liberals defend fascists (http://nypost.com/2017/08/10/milo-yiannopoulos-gains-aclu-support-in-free-speech-lawsuit/). Always have. Always will.

It's great that the press and mainstream is giving trump a little shit for his "many sides" comment but, yeah, also hypocritical that the same republican and democratic politicians and pundits have been saying the same thing for months. Official liberalism burped up op-eds about "illiberal leftists," horse-shit horseshoe theories, and tailing the right's claims about "free speech".

But my hope is that we don't have to wait for more tragedies before the reality of the threat drives a wedge between the delusions of professional liberal political/media layer and average people who call or think of themselves as liberals.

Our organizing should be aimed at winning those folks to our side. We knew the threat and IWW, DSA, and ISO comrades were hit in the attack. This is what the liberal "let them speak and expose themselves" looks like. They exposed their "silly ideas" and fucking killed an IWW comrade, beat up black folks and attacked antifa marchers. Dylann Roof Golden Dawn and a mass shooting at a socialist youth camp (both pre-trump, contrary to the liberal's explanation of the attack) "exposed" the new fascists to be little different in their aims than those of the past.

Official liberalism has no solid explanation or solutions for this specifically right now. We need to organize and convince average liberals to move left and actively work to stop both Trump and the far-right rather than rely on Democrats or Russiagate-deliverance.

Ele'ill
13th August 2017, 23:12
Demo currently happening in Seattle

willowtooth
14th August 2017, 03:51
Demo currently happening in Seattle
already shutdown with teargas and flash grenades


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMGKeq_dCtg

Still no update on the cause of the helicopter crash

Ele'ill
14th August 2017, 04:32
Protest is dead

RSS News
14th August 2017, 06:10
via wsws.org (http://www.wsws.org)

One day after the Nazi rampage in Virginia—which left one dead and 19 injured—thousands of people participated in protests and vigils in opposition to fascist violence.

More... (http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/14/seat-a14.html)

RSS News
14th August 2017, 07:00
via socialistproject.ca (http://www.socialistproject.ca[/url)

http://socialistproject.ca/go3447.jpgI sat here listening to Trump’s remarks in connection with the violence carried out by neofascists in Charlottesville this afternoon, violence which has resulted in the death of at least one anti-fascist. He condemned bigotry on what he called all sides. Once again Trump obscures reality. He either ignores the violence and terrorism carried out against traditionally oppressed groups, e.g., attacks on mosques, or he uses evasive language in order to avoid pointing the finger at the real perpetrators of racist violence.

More... (http://socialistproject.ca/go.php?id=3447)

willowtooth
14th August 2017, 14:39
Anonymous hacktivists have been going a little crazy they shutdown the daily stormer website (it's still shutdown as of now). GOdaddy has agreed to stop providing them service as well. The killer was photographed with a vanguard america flag. People have been frantically tracing the identities of all the nazis that were attendance, a few of them have gotten fired from their jobs. There was an attempted copycat attack on solidarity protesters in Montreal, no injuries and the guy was arrested, so not alot of news coverage. 682 "solidarity with charlottesville" marches planned (or occurred) so far including one in vietnam

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia% 2FDHJetnqWAAAKpPY.jpg

http://www.salon.com/2017/08/14/daily-stormer-gets-booted-by-its-hosting-service-but-blames-an-anonymous-hack/



the organizer got beaten up by protesters at his press conference


https://vimeo.com/229495852

ckaihatsu
14th August 2017, 15:27
---





ben franklin [pre death] • an hour ago

I like seeing this gathering of people against fascism but I also express concern with the identity politics focus that many of these gatherings took on. What's also making me a little uneasy is the level of nationalism that can be measured from many of these statements from the counter-protesters. Most of these statements have some glorification of the US nation or make overtures to a sort of liberal nationalism.

Nationalism is the most underhanded psyop the world has ever seen. It is a secular religious devotion cloaked in "rationality" since it isn't based in the supernatural. It is based in tribalism and promotes fealty to an institution that only really exists on pieces of paper and in the hearts and minds of its devout followers. The people are only unified by some imaginary lines on maps and much less so by some vague idea of culture which has been nearly nullified by the post-modern blending of cultures within those imaginary map lines. Flags and other symbols (like the bald eagle) serve as iconography for the religion. The bent-truth histories that are taught about them serve as the mythos of the faith while the constitutions are the Holy Books. The cult-of-personality cast of historical characters act as the messiahs and prophets while the modern characters are the priests and clerics. There are the religious traditions of voting, celebrating the different birthdays of these characters, and solemnly remembering the pious days of "sacrifice" such as Sept 11 and Dec 7 in the US.

It is the most popular religion on the planet boasting upwards of 7 billion and it is so subversive and passive in its existence that barely anyone recognizes the danger in it. You'll even find overtures to nationalism in many faux-leftist groups. It is the sad devotion to this religion of nationalism that makes international collaboration along class lines so difficult. Even working class people who are starting to understand the contradictions of the capitalist system and grow more comfortable with socialism and working class action are suspicious of the idea of undermining the nation state system in any way. It is one of the bedrocks of the Alex Jones, Steven Bannon program and how they turn potential revolutionaries into fascist tools. It's also why so many potential leftists think that the Bernie Sanders program and other faux-leftism is the only "realistic" way forward.

I think talking about nationalism and the flaws of the nation state system are one of the most important things that socialists can do at this stage. It is especially important given the situation in North Korea which many potential leftists and working class are in support of because of nationalistic fervor! I believe it is apropos to bring it up in this article's comments because so many of these potential leftists and agitators are speaking the language of nationalists and are likely doing it unconsciously (which speaks volumes to the pervasiveness of the nationalist faith).




http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/14/seat-a14.html

Ele'ill
14th August 2017, 20:52
An unconfirmed report that I have no reason to disbelieve


One DC antifa medic responded by preparing to perform CPR on Heather Heyer, who died in Charlottesville, with the help of another antifa medic. Tragically, both medics were ordered by the police to stop CPR, supposedly so that police could secure the area. We were shaken. This was also an attack on us and everyone we marched with.

RSS News
15th August 2017, 05:52
via wsws.org (http://www.wsws.org)

The murder of Heather Heyer in Charlottesville, Virginia did not come out of the blue, but followed months of warnings about the likelihood of violence by white supremacist groups.

More... (http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/15/char-a15.html)

RSS News
15th August 2017, 05:52
via wsws.org (http://www.wsws.org)

Demonstrations involving thousands of people continued Monday in cities across the US to protest the deadly fascist riot in Charlottesville, Virginia and President Trump’s promotion of far-right forces.

More... (http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/15/prot-a15.html)

willowtooth
15th August 2017, 06:04
Alot of protests too many to mention, literally every major US city, some great support from overseas as well, from Germany, the UK, China even Iraq. Discord has begun purging white supremacists from its servers, somebody raised on antifa flag in front of a Minneapolis courthouse. We might want to start discouraging vigilantism. The alt-right is panicked and afraid its going to be labelled a terrorist group (I thought they already were). 3 CEO's from Underarmour, Intel, and Merck have resigned from Trumps advisory councils, so far the US media has been silent on Heather Heyer's affiliation with the IWW and the helicopter crash is going to take atleast 3 weeks before any answer is given.

We do know that it was flying at a low altitude, and there was no mayday call. Helicopters are very difficult to crash especially at low altitude, as long as the blades continue to rotate the engine can completely fail and you'll fall relatively safely to the ground. Something had to hit it to make it flip upside down and then crash the way it did. It seems like a huge coincidence that hundreds of heavily armed nazis show up with military grade weapons, and then a few minutes after being broken up by the police a helicopter mysteriously crashes.

Protesters also tore down a confederate statue in Durham

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia% 2FDHOqObWXgAIabka.jpg

BIXX
15th August 2017, 09:35
That's a pretty awesome picture.

ckaihatsu
15th August 2017, 14:22
[IMG]https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia% 2FDHOqObWXgAIabka.jpg[IMG]


It still looks like a fucking monument for the Confederacy, though. (Just saying.)

ckaihatsu
15th August 2017, 16:19
GregPalast.com (http://gregpalast.us4.list-manage.com/track/click?u=33e4ec877eed6a43863a4a92e&id=fd7a127a35&e=9dee5d6b03)

Does this email not look right?
View it in your browser. (http://mailchi.mp/gregpalast/v3tjxbfkb4-172661?e=9dee5d6b03)

GregPalast.com

Charlottesville:
A gun in his face, but he got the photo
By Greg Palast

https://gallery.mailchimp.com/33e4ec877eed6a43863a4a92e/_compresseds/4c2f25d4-7a35-44fb-9103-14de9e51f949.jpeg
(Charlottesville) Four neo-Nazis beat black school teacher Deandre Harris with iron bars and lumber. ©Zach D Roberts 2017

https://gallery.mailchimp.com/33e4ec877eed6a43863a4a92e/_compresseds/c24c8c01-23bc-403e-8314-e8d4df0b77ad.jpeg

ZombieMarx
15th August 2017, 16:52
Liberals are to blame for this.

Disgusting acts and a beautiful young life lost. Liberals from all over the country are condemning it but her blood is on their hands.

They're complicit, along with every disgusting fascist that took part in that demonstration. They write checks that actual leftists have to cash. But where are they when the shit goes down?

Remember...liberals defend fascists. Always have. Always will.

What a fatal point of view. Learn from history. The KPD's "social fascists" view in the 1920/30ies, which is an equivalent to your equation of liberals (in American political terminology, social democrats would be much more fitting) and american fascists, made fascism in Germany possible. In the end, both, social democrats and communists ended in the camps. A united front would have in place back then and urgently is now.

GLF
15th August 2017, 20:22
What a fatal point of view. Learn from history. The KPD's "social fascists" view in the 1920/30ies, which is an equivalent to your equation of liberals (in American political terminology, social democrats would be much more fitting) and american fascists, made fascism in Germany possible. In the end, both, social democrats and communists ended in the camps. A united front would have in place back then and urgently is now.

I can't believe what I just read. A united front with liberals? And you have Marx in your username?

I will never unite with liberals. Any commonality with liberals could only exist in respect to a common foe. But liberals aren't interested in revolution. They have their own ideas and their own cause. They have destroyed society - they stymie class consciousness. This is deliberate. They have actively worked to supplant us, the left, portraying themselves as champions of social justice. But all they do is poison and divide. False shepherds, and the left hand of capital - they work in conjunction with the conservatives to keep the proletariat divided and at each other's throats. They throw bones at the poor...never meat. They don't free the oppressed...just make their shackles a little more comfortable. They're your friend, see.

Ele'ill
15th August 2017, 20:40
What's the rest of the story of the teacher?


Also

http://abc11.com/politics/deputies-arrest-protester-who-helped-pull-down-durham-confederate-statue/2309889/



Takiyah Thompson, 22, was taken into custody shortly after protesters held a news conference Tuesday afternoon at North Carolina Central University. Thompson climbed a ladder to the top of the statue to tie a rope around its neck before the crowd tore it down

Thompson is charged with


disorderly conduct by injury to a statue (Class II Misdemeanor)
damage to real property (statue as a fixture (Class I Misdemeanor)
participation in a riot with property damage in excess of $1,500 (Class H Felony)
inciting others to riot where there is property damage in excess of $1,500 (Class F Felony)




"The people decided to take matters into our own hands and remove the statue," said Thompson, a member of the far-left Workers World Party and a student at N.C. Central University. "We are tired of waiting on politicians who could have voted to remove the white supremacist statues years ago, but they failed to act. So we acted."

GLF
16th August 2017, 00:02
We are in the early throes of total ideological polarization. Civil war is imminent and the enemy is armed.

Arm yourselves. All antifa should begin preparing for the worst.

I don't mean to sound dramatic but I have a gut feeling that what just happened is a harbinger of what's to come. After all, we're only six months into Trump's term and look what's happening. Imagine how it'll be after three or four years.

Trump is radicalizing his base, and the opposition is likewise radicalizing. The shit is about to go down. Believe me. It's gonna happen.

willowtooth
16th August 2017, 01:53
I can't believe what I just read. A united front with liberals? Dude I swear GLF is a fucking stormfront troll lol


What's the rest of the story of the teacher?
He's got a few staples in his head, a couple scars, and a chipped tooth but he'll be alright, gofundme is already up to $132K for him, I'm a little more upset that his medical insurance doesn't cover this, but I'm guessing because he's only an instructional assistant at a special education program he doesn't qualify

http://www.theroot.com/interview-20-year-old-deandre-harris-speaks-out-about-1797796038

https://www.gofundme.com/i-was-beaten-by-white-supremacists

BIXX
16th August 2017, 01:56
I will never unite with liberals.

Except for liberal reforms apparently.

GLF
16th August 2017, 06:08
Dude I swear GLF is a fucking stormfront troll lol

If you really believe me to be a stormfront troll, then lol'ing is hardly the proper response.


Except for liberal reforms apparently.

Which reforms? Are you talking about gay marriage? Not everything liberals do are bad. But to suggest that we should "unite" with people who support capitalism is fucked up on so many levels.

BIXX
16th August 2017, 07:14
Which reforms? Are you talking about gay marriage? Not everything liberals do are bad. But to suggest that we should "unite" with people who support capitalism is fucked up on so many levels.
I agree that uniting with liberals is stupid but so is supporting reforms within capitalism.

GLF
16th August 2017, 12:24
I agree that uniting with liberals is stupid but so is supporting reforms within capitalism.

Fair enough. But please try and keep in mind that while I don't condone ID politics and other liberal methods, it's very easy for privileged people to turn their nose up at reforms for ideological reasons when it's not their lives being negatively affected in the mean time.

Nonetheless, I had what I felt was a dialectically sound reason for supporting the liberal reform of gay marriage. Traditionalism precludes class-consciousness; it's the social institutions that keep the proletariat bound to the service of god and country.

willowtooth
16th August 2017, 13:48
The Daily Stormer is officially offline (or atleast moved to Russia.ru). The afl-cio head Richard Trumka resigned as trumps adviser as did Scott Paul head of the AAM the manufacturer's lobby. Statues are being torn down in Florida, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Maryland. The daughters of the confederacy are apparently snatching up the ones they own and maintain in the middle of the night (taking them who knows where). Most of these statues are in the old southern confederacy but some are in the north, and some are even in states that were founded after the civil war, and even stranger still, some are in Canada like the plaque that was removed yesterday in Montreal. The "holy grail" so to speak, is the statues in Gettysburg, which are likely going nowhere as well as the ones in the US capitol...

...and this giant in Stone Mountain, Georgia
https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.boomsbeat.com%2F data%2Fimages%2Ffull%2F7613%2F1-jpg.jpg

Airbnb has banned neonazis from using their services, Richard Spencer apparently can't rent a hotel room anywhere in the contiguous united states anymore. A few local politicians have either resigned or been fired for comments supporting neonazis like a judge in georgia and an RNC county chairman in new mexico. Also one of the protestors who tore down the statue in Durham was arrested, but a few more protests are planned for the week.


Nazis themselves are also planning a few more rallies. A holocaust memorial was trashed in boston, and someone ominously sprayed "fuck law" over the Abraham Lincoln memorial in DC. Somebody was also caught trying to do a Timothy McVeigh style copycat attack in Oklahoma.

Rojava sends its love
https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.globalcitizen.or g%2Fe2%2Fe6%2Fe2e61e0f-46b0-4527-b55b-79a111ca99c6%2Fyazidiwomen.jpg

Ele'ill
16th August 2017, 20:48
A coalition and community support effort posted up outside spencer's apartment and got busy in the surrounding neighborhoods.

BIXX
16th August 2017, 21:13
Fair enough. But please try and keep in mind that while I don't condone ID politics and other liberal methods, it's very easy for privileged people to turn their nose up at reforms for ideological reasons when it's not their lives being negatively affected in the mean time.

Stop trying to use identity politics to say that I'm priveledged in areas where you don't know shit about me. Even if I was it doesn't invalidate my argument.


Nonetheless, I had what I felt was a dialectically sound reason for supporting the liberal reform of gay marriage. Traditionalism precludes class-consciousness; it's the social institutions that keep the proletariat bound to the service of god and country.

No, you're just a liberal. It's OK, we have a special forum just for you. It's called opposing ideologies.

GLF
16th August 2017, 23:28
Is this bizarro world? What happened to revleft?

ZombieMarx
17th August 2017, 10:59
I'm not talking about a general alliance with "liberals". I'm talking about limited tactical alliances with social democrats and the left-liberal bourgeoisie against the fascists. In the rise of fascism everything else would be a big strategical mistake. Again, have a look at German history. The rejection of the KPD to fight the fascists thugs alongside with the SPD weakened the opposition to the NSDAP tremendously and was one of the reasons it was so easy for the NSDAP to seize power. And there is even remotely powerful communist force like the KPD back then is present on the US streets. You don't have the luxury to pick your alliance partners against the fascists scum. Take what is there. Especially in the US, where the far Left seems to be even more marginalized than in Europe.


I can't believe what I just read. A united front with liberals? And you have Marx in your username?

I will never unite with liberals. Any commonality with liberals could only exist in respect to a common foe. But liberals aren't interested in revolution. They have their own ideas and their own cause. They have destroyed society - they stymie class consciousness. This is deliberate. They have actively worked to supplant us, the left, portraying themselves as champions of social justice. But all they do is poison and divide. False shepherds, and the left hand of capital - they work in conjunction with the conservatives to keep the proletariat divided and at each other's throats. They throw bones at the poor...never meat. They don't free the oppressed...just make their shackles a little more comfortable. They're your friend, see.

willowtooth
17th August 2017, 14:21
The daily stormer gets booted from its .ru address by the government of russia as well as cloudfare .wang and google. I dont think they will go to the dark web they already have several outlets there. They may shutdown completely or just keep bouncing around like pirate bay.

One of the nazi organizers sent out a tear riddled plea for mercy (managed to squeeze in some gaybashing so don't feel too bad for the mental patient) It's the same guy from the recent Vice documentary, which is also worth a watch if you have the time


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIrcB1sAN8I

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/08/im-terrified-neo-nazi-blubbers-like-a-baby-in-video-reporting-hes-wanted-for-arrest-in-charlottesville/


Huge candlelit vigil in Charlottesville last night
https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.npr.org%2Fassets% 2Fimg%2F2017%2F08%2F17%2Fcandlelight_march_ss_09-096c5cda4a5954d07693e09e9a68ea7693cb7b3d-s800-c85.jpg

GLF
18th August 2017, 13:54
I'm not talking about a general alliance with "liberals". I'm talking about limited tactical alliances with social democrats and the left-liberal bourgeoisie against the fascists. In the rise of fascism everything else would be a big strategical mistake. Again, have a look at German history. The rejection of the KPD to fight the fascists thugs alongside with the SPD weakened the opposition to the NSDAP tremendously and was one of the reasons it was so easy for the NSDAP to seize power. And there is even remotely powerful communist force like the KPD back then is present on the US streets. You don't have the luxury to pick your alliance partners against the fascists scum. Take what is there. Especially in the US, where the far Left seems to be even more marginalized than in Europe.

I actually agree with this. That's why I stated that any commonality with liberals could only exist in respect to a common foe.

But there is a danger in letting them into our movement. If you wanna see what actual leftism looks like after it's been influenced by liberals, look no further than the CPUSA.


The daily stormer gets booted from its .ru address by the government of russia as well as cloudfare .wang and google. I dont think they will go to the dark web they already have several outlets there. They may shutdown completely or just keep bouncing around like pirate bay.

There might be a negative side to that site being forced into the dark web. They were a prime example of what white supremacy looks like when followed through to it's natural conclusion. Other white supremacists have actually pretended to oppose them, believing that they discredit their movement. Some have even posited that they were saboteurs working to undermine white nationalism. There's something to be said for having them out in the open, so the whole world can see the true face of white nationalism. But it's immensely satisfying to see them without a platform.

willowtooth
20th August 2017, 00:52
Tens of thousands marched in Boston as a counter protest to neo nazi march

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fd3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfr ont.net%2Fnewshour%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F08%2FRTS1CGGE-1024x684.jpg


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/08/19/thousands-expected-at-boston-free-speech-rally-and-counter-protest/?utm_term=.34c51b3b2e54



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EWtnKCuejY

here's a link to the live feed if your reading this now https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JWmZ6vfZ9Y

Ele'ill
20th August 2017, 08:18
Estimates at 40k in boston, i can't find a good photo of when that gazebo was surrounded in the boston commons area but the tweets from the fash about 'fighting their way out' was amusingly deluded. For those who didn't catch it there were a literal handful of fascists in a tiny gazebo in the middle of a big park, surrounded by a battle line of at least 40k people. Also not covered as widely, people pushing back against the police shoulder to shoulder.

GiantMonkeyMan
20th August 2017, 12:02
It's really amazing to see that turnout in Boston. It's a shame that it took the murder of a comrade to make people realise that Nazis are bad though.

I was linked to a really interesting article on the Charlottesville events from slate.com that I think folks should spread: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/08/what_the_alt_left_was_actually_doing_in_charlottes ville.html

It's basically a few eye witnesses from local Charlottesville residents who engaged in non-violent protest such as:


Rebekah MenningCharlottesville resident

I stood with a group of interfaith clergy and other people of faith in a nonviolent direct action meant to keep the white nationalists from entering the park to their hate rally. We had far fewer people holding the line than we had hoped for, and frankly, it wasn’t enough. No police officers in sight (that I could see from where I stood), and we were prepared to be beaten to a bloody pulp to show that while the state permitted white nationalists to rally in hate, in the many names of God, we did not. But we didn’t have to because the anarchists and anti-fascists got to them before they could get to us. I’ve never felt more grateful and more ashamed at the same time. The antifa were like angels to me in that moment.

willowtooth
21st August 2017, 04:09
A few thousand showed up to protest in New Orleans, and there was a smaller rally in Quebec, Canada against another far right group. Since they have no statues to defend they chose to focus on immigrants

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia% 2FDHpDF9AVwAE4jdH.jpg

https://www.revleft.space/vb/cache.php?img=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.cleveland.com%2Fh ome%2Fcleve-media%2Fwidth620%2Fimg%2Fplain_dealer_metro%2Fphot o%2F23265788-mmmain.jpg
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-far-right-la-meute-1.4254792
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/protest-white-supremacy-new-orleans_us_5998d800e4b0a2608a6cb6b9

A few more statues have come down in Ohio Kentucky California and Alabama. There's a few more protests scheduled on both sides. The recent ISIS attack in Spain seems to have knocked it out of the headlines for now

ckaihatsu
22nd August 2017, 17:34
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2017/08/22/charlottesville-city-council-votes-to-shroud-confederate-statues-in-black/?utm_term=.4153c803a5d3

https://news.google.com


Local

Charlottesville City Council votes to shroud Confederate statues in black

By Emma Brown August 22 at 11:01 AM

Play Video 1:08

Protesters challenge Charlottesville City Council after ‘Unite the Right’ rally

0:00

Protesters chanted “blood on your hands” during the Charlottesville City Council meeting on Aug. 21. Several attendees were angered over the city council’s decision to allow the “Unite the Right” rally held in Charlottesville on August 12. (Geremia Di Maro/Twitter)

The Charlottesville City Council decided early Tuesday morning to shroud the statues of two Confederate generals in black, capping a long and emotional public meeting that erupted into chaos more than once as residents expressed their anger over a white nationalist rally last weekend.

BIXX
22nd August 2017, 17:52
While I'm not a fan of your formatting I can totally get behind how you posted a news article that is relevant to the thread and actually a little bit interesting. +1

ckaihatsu
22nd August 2017, 18:36
While I'm not a fan of your formatting I can totally get behind how you posted a news article that is relevant to the thread and actually a little bit interesting. +1


Thanks -- that's high praise, coming from you.

GLF
22nd August 2017, 19:25
I hope every civil war statue in this country comes down. As someone born and raised in Texas this is a real sensitive subject for me. People talk about their heritage and shit - I grew up around this. Appeals to heritage, country, people and race are the ways rich fucks get poor people to fight their wars. When I see the confederate flag and shit, I just ancient relics to a social apparatus that fooled hundreds of thousands of poor people into going to their deaths to defend the rich man's "property".

Of course, where I differ from the libtards is that I have the same degree of disgust for the north who never cares about slaves but only in people respecting their authoritah. And going back even futher, I feel the same way about Washington, Jefferson (who I think was a genius but just the same an asshat), Adams...the whole lot. So when Trump says, "Washington and Jefferson next?", I say damn right. This country was always for the rich man. It had radical ideas for the time and place, but throwing poor people a bone is no longer radical enough.

If you want a shrine to the civil war, how about a shrine to the poor deluded dead? Doesn't that make sense rather than a shrine to the generals and politicians that drove the poor to their deaths, and for such a horrible cause at that?

This country is batshit crazy. "My heritage." lol ... You're heritage and $1.50 can buy you a bus ticket to the unemployment office.

willowtooth
22nd August 2017, 21:09
I hope every civil war statue in this country comes down. As someone born and raised in Texas this is a real sensitive subject for me. People talk about their heritage and shit - I grew up around this. Appeals to heritage, country, people and race are the ways rich fucks get poor people to fight their wars. When I see the confederate flag and shit, I just ancient relics to a social apparatus that fooled hundreds of thousands of poor people into going to their deaths to defend the rich man's "property".

Of course, where I differ from the libtards is that I have the same degree of disgust for the north who never cares about slaves but only in people respecting their authoritah. And going back even futher, I feel the same way about Washington, Jefferson (who I think was a genius but just the same an asshat), Adams...the whole lot. So when Trump says, "Washington and Jefferson next?", I say damn right. This country was always for the rich man. It had radical ideas for the time and place, but throwing poor people a bone is no longer radical enough.

If you want a shrine to the civil war, how about a shrine to the poor deluded dead? Doesn't that make sense rather than a shrine to the generals and politicians that drove the poor to their deaths, and for such a horrible cause at that?

This country is batshit crazy. "My heritage." lol ... You're heritage and $1.50 can buy you a bus ticket to the unemployment office.
libtards? seriously are you Rush Limbaugh now?

There's a huge difference between a statue of Washington, and a statue of a confederate general. For one thing Washington was the founder of the country, i'm sure Genghis khan and king Arthur owned slaves too but their lives weren't dedicated to preserving slavery and racism, Washington supported ending slavery and even proposed a separate state just for black people. If you see someone with a portrait of washington in their house, your not automatically going to think he's a racist who supports slavery, anymore than you would think he supported pot legalization because Washington smoked pot everyday.

"liberals" is used as slur in the USA by republicans to describe people who believe in gay rights, drug legalization, abortion rights etc. It doesn't mean that everywhere else in the world. Its not the proper definition. Liberals means people who believe laissez faire economics. Republicans are liberals you dumbfuck. You've said before you dont care if your weird opinions make you a communist/leninist/socialist etc so why don't you just join the republicans? you'd fit in fine there

GLF
23rd August 2017, 01:42
libtards? seriously are you Rush Limbaugh now?

There's a huge difference between a statue of Washington, and a statue of a confederate general. For one thing Washington was the founder of the country, i'm sure Genghis khan and king Arthur owned slaves too but their lives weren't dedicated to preserving slavery and racism, Washington supported ending slavery and even proposed a separate state just for black people.

So in addition to defending libtards, you're also a patriot and segregationist. Good to know.

As for fitting in with GOP types, I think my Marxist/Leninist dialectic might cause a few problems there.

You might do okay though, based on the shared admiration of George Washington and rounding up of blacks.

willowtooth
23rd August 2017, 01:46
So in addition to defending libtards, you're also a patriot and segregationist. Good to know.
Oh my god you gotta be fucking kidding me. You cannot be a real person. Are you on medication?

Ele'ill
23rd August 2017, 02:14
'Liberal' is often used as a slur by radicals referring to people who put the brakes on situations of autonomous self organization and action for any number of reasons (they see the current order as being confused, they see themselves as capable of being a better management, photo-ops and social reward, democracy, etc) and that tension arises when situations get co-opted by such people or organizations. Like when liberals attend a radical demo and then assault people while screaming peaceful protest while pointing people out to the police, when liberal progressive organizations collude with the state behind closed doors to get rid of undesirable elements (us) so that what they see as a movement can basically echo back the image of the existent society, that they're under control and not a threat, or when union leadership shills out against the wishes of the rank and file to preserve order which preserves their positions paid or otherwise.

GLF
23rd August 2017, 03:31
Oh my god you gotta be fucking kidding me. You cannot be a real person. Are you on medication?

So that's literally the best ya got after literally defending George Washington and being an apologist for segregation?

At least people here know where I stand on the issues. That's more than I can say for you (aside from being a liberal sympathizer, that is).

willowtooth
23rd August 2017, 06:30
So that's literally the best ya got after literally defending George Washington and being an apologist for segregation?

At least people here know where I stand on the issues. That's more than I can say for you (aside from being a liberal sympathizer, that is).
Nobody has any clue where you stand on anything, its clear you dont even know the definitions of half the words you're using. Your rambling incoherent statements sound like a combination of all the bad parts of Bob Avakian and Milo yiannpoulous. Whenever anyone calls you on your ridiculous bullshit, and glaring contradictions, you get pissy and throw a fit, or you just stop posting in the thread entirely.

Who are these liberals? Are they the people marching in photos? Antifa? Are you talking about the girl who was killed? Do you mean the mayor of charlottesville? What the fuck are you even talking about?

ckaihatsu
23rd August 2017, 18:57
Charlottesville and the Unfinished Work of the Civil Rights Movement -- Statement by Socialist Organizer National Committee


Charlottesville and the Unfinished Work of the Civil Rights Movement

Statement by Socialist Organizer National Committee

(1) The killing of Heather Heyer, a young counter-demonstrator in Charlottesville, Virginia, and the political crisis that has swept the country in its aftermath began with the decision by the city’s mayor to remove the statue of Robert E. Lee. This action brought to light the unresolved legacy of the Civil War and of the period of Radical Reconstruction that followed immediately thereafter.

Let us not forget that Radical Reconstruction went very far in establishing real equality between the white working poor and the recently freed Black slaves, with the adoption of progressive social measures that began to call into question capitalist rule. Land began to be redistributed to recently freed Black slaves. Black politicians were elected to state governments. The promise of “Forty Acres and a Mule” for every Black family was in the air.

But at the end of the day, Radical Reconstruction was crushed brutally by the alliance between the Northern capitalist class, which had emerged victorious from the Civil War, and a significant sector of the slave-owning class in the South. It was an alliance against freed Black slaves and against the unity between Blacks and the white working poor that was challenging the existing order. It was an alliance against democracy as such. “Forty Acres and a Mule” was betrayed.

To forge this counter-revolutionary alliance, it was necessary for the Northern capitalists to make a "deal" with its Southern allies, and to grant a whole series of concessions that allowed greater autonomy to the Southern states to impose segregation, enact all the heinous Jim Crow laws, and enable the Ku Klux Klan to lynch thousands upon thousands of Black people who dared to rise up against Jim Crow.

The hundreds of symbols (statues, flags, memorials) of the vanquished Confederacy that are still visible across the South today, glorifying the slave-owners and their legacy, are among those concessions granted to the Southern states by the representatives of the Northern capitalists. Tearing down those symbols has galvanized every wing of the white-supremacy movement, including the president of the United States, into action today. But it has done far more than this: It has posed the question of extirpating institutionalized racism at its core once and for all.

As Glen Ford, executive director of Black Agenda Report, wrote in his column on August 21: “If the legacy of slavery is to be excised root and branch, then nothing less than the most profound social transformation is in order. Why stop with statues of long dead men?” What is needed, Ford continued, is to purge the nation “of the poisoned fruit of their racist perversion.”

But who will carry out this unfinished work? Russian revolutionist V.I. Lenin answered this question more than 100 years ago, when he explained that it was the task of the working classes around the world to take up the fight to complete revolutions that had come to a halt along the way — and that, for example, it was up to the French working class to champion the unfinished work of the bourgeois-democratic revolutions of 1848 and 1871. So too must the Black working class in the United States, in alliance with progressive sectors of white workers, complete the unfinished work of the Civil War.

(2) The issues that arise and reappear today around Charlottesville also evoke, as Sister Colia Clark rightly points out, the unfinished work of the Civil Rights Movement of the late 1950s and ’60s.

In an interview with The Organizer newspaper in April 2015, Sister Clark, an organizer with the Student Non-Violent Coordinating Committee (SNCC) in Alabama and Mississippi in the early 1960s, noted the following:

“Our powerful and determined struggle as Black people won the Civil Right Bill and the Voting Rights Act; we smashed key pillars of Jim Crow. But these victories are merely a piece of our legacy. The March on Washington in 1963 had two pieces, and the Black Power piece has not been completed.

“Black Power opens up the whole issue of finishing the unfinished work of the March on Washington in 1963. This is what will give Blacks our humanity back. We can then call ourselves Black for the first time in hundreds of years and feel pride. We can call ourselves Black and not have our insides turn and twist and feel that we are nothing.”

It took the courage and determination of young Black militants like Sister Clark to impose desegregation in universities, schools, and public restrooms — and to win the right to vote. The U.S. ruling class, fearing a widespread social explosion that could challenge its class domination (given the convergence of the Civil Rights Movement and the massive movement of youth against the war in Vietnam) chose to cut its losses and heed the demands of the March on Washington.

But, as Sister Clark pointed out, institutionalized racism was not excised. Black Power — that is Black self-determination — was not won. Today, more than 50 years after the victories of the Civil Rights Movement, the pendulum has swung back in a reactionary direction with the advent of the “New Jim Crow” — that is, the prison-industrial complex in which more Blacks are incarcerated, many of them performing slave labor for some of the main U.S. transnational corporations, than there were Blacks working as slaves on the plantations at the time of the Civil War.

(3) Capitalist rule in the United States, from the very beginning, has used, developed, and promoted institutional racism as a major element of its domination. Institutional racism pitted the upper sectors of the working class — the white workers' aristocracy — against the Black working class. This privileged white layer was made to feel threatened whenever Black workers made gains. Institutional racism divided the working class in the interests of the bosses and their hired hands.

The capitalist system in decay has now targeted the gains and working conditions of the white skilled working class, closing factories throughout the Rust Belt and laying off millions of workers. Institutionalized racism has been wielded yet again with fraudulent arguments to scapegoat Black “welfare cheats” and undocumented immigrants (deemed “illegal”) for the ills of a capitalist economy that is incapable of addressing the basic needs of the working class majority, including skilled white workers.

Capitalist politicians in both major parties would like to reduce the issue of racism to one of individual prejudice. The vast majority of them have jumped on the “anti-Neo-Nazi” bandwagon while continuing to defend police killings of Blacks, fueling the schools-to-prison pipeline, and upholding the countless means through which institutionalized racism, at all levels, carries out its dirty work.

The fact is that U.S. capitalism is threatened at its core when the myriad mechanisms of the institutional racist division are threatened, because they are a key component of its particular mode of domination, linked to the particular history of the United States.

This gives its full revolutionary content to the slogan of “Black Lives Matter”—whatever the political limitations of the leadership of this movement. To say that Black lives matter is an act of accusation against the U.S. capitalist class and against a system that cultivates the most backward and reactionary prejudices based on the idea that only white lives matter — which happens to be one of the main slogans of the white supremacists today.

Without a doubt, there are large profoundly reactionary and conservative sectors in the United States that provide a possible social basis for the development of a fascist movement in the United States. But it is a fact today, confirmed by numerous surveys, that a large majority of Americans, including workers, reject the divisive schemes borne from institutionalized racism.

(4) This current situation would not exist were it not for the historical bankruptcy of the misleaders of the workers' movement on the question of the struggle against racism and segregation. The roots of this bankruptcy can be found in the AFL-CIO leadership’s allegiance to the Democratic Party, the party of racism and the Southern Dixiecrats. The leaders of the trade unions have traditionally cultivated the most reactionary prejudices of the working-class aristocracy.

It follows that the slogans of Black Party and Labor Party, which raise the question of breaking with the twin parties of the bosses, are more than ever at the heart of the entire political situation.

Socialist Organizer stands in continuity with the political positions on the Black question developed by the SWP in close collaboration with Leon Trotsky — particularly the SWP’s 1963 “Freedom Now” resolution.

Basing itself on what Trotsky described as the “dialectical development of the Black struggle for self-determination,” the SWP’s 1963 resolution stated that Blacks as such would have to “divide” from the white workers and form their own independent political party in order to then “unite with the white working class in the overall struggle against capitalism.”

The resolution noted that “while the Black population is predominantly proletarian, the Black people are more than just another heavily exploited section of the working class, and the Black movement is more than just a part of the general working class movement. As an oppressed nationality … their position in society is special, their consciousness is influenced by racial and national, as well as class factors.”

The 1963 resolution goes on to note that “the labor and Black movements march along their own paths,” but it went on to underline the fact that they [the Black and labor movements] march to a common destination, and the freedom of the Blacks from oppression and of the workers from exploitation can be achieved only through the victory of their common struggle against capitalism. … Blacks cannot win their goal of equality without an alliance with the working class.”

Noting further on that the “tempos of development of the two movements are uneven,” the SWP resolution stressed the need for “Blacks to … first unite in their own party” in order that they could be able to “bring about an alliance of equals, where they [the Blacks] can be reasonably sure that their demands and needs cannot be neglected or betrayed by their allies.”

Finally, the resolution pointed out that there is no contradiction between advocating a Black Party and advocating a Labor Party: “Our support of such a Black Party in no way conflicts with our … continued advocacy of a Labor Party. On the contrary, we believe that a Black Party and a Labor Party would find much in common from the very beginning, would work closely together for common ends, and would tend in the course of common activity to establish close organizational ties or even merge into a single or federated party.”

In fact, the SWP resolution states elsewhere, if a Black Party were to be formed first, it would be a major spur for the development of a Labor Party: “The creation of a Black Party running its own candidates would rock the whole political structure to its foundation. … Advocates of a labor break with the old parties would get a bigger and better hearing from the ranks. Thus the creation of a Black Party would benefit not only the Blacks but also their present and potential allies.”

This strategic orientation is as valid today as it was in 1963.


(5) The fallout of the Charlottesville counter-protest and killing has reached the highest levels of government and could be the nail in the coffin of Donald Trump’s presidency — a presidency that can only be understood as the expression of the impasse of a capitalist system in its death agony and of a two-party system that is more and more repudiated by the working-class majority.

Trump not only revealed his true colors (supporting the white supremacists responsible for the death of the young woman), he also highlighted with his numerous flip-flops his mental instability and total incompetence in leading the ship of State.

This was the reason given by the CEOs of the major corporations to explain why they bolted from Trump’s many advisory councils. All had supported Trump and financed his presidential campaign — just as they financed the campaign of Hillary Clinton. Their resignations from Trump’s councils expressed the growing sentiment that Trump must go to preserve the system as a whole.

An opinion piece published in the August 21 Washington Post quotes Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.), who said that Trump “has not yet been able to demonstrate the stability nor some of the competence” needed in a president. This indictment was significant because Corker, a Trump ally, chairs the Foreign Relations Committee. Corker said he feared that “our nation is going to go through great peril” and called for “radical change” at the White House.


(6) Today, the working class is facing a very grave situation. Gains wrested through bitter struggle are on the chopping block. The right of Black people to vote is under assault in state after state through redistricting and countless other ploys. Privatization of public services is expelling millions of workers, especially Black workers, from the organized workforce. Immigrant workers are being rounded up and deported in greater numbers than ever, and a massive Wall of Shame to span the entire U.S.-Mexican border is being planned. And the list goes on.

This is why action-oriented labor-community coalitions are needed to enjoin the struggle to preserve and expand workers’ rights with the struggle to preserve and expand democratic rights. The 13-million-strong labor movement needs to champion these struggles by raising and fighting for demands such as these:

- A $15 minimum wage and a union,

- The right to a trade union without conditions; Stop the federal “Right to Work” law,

- Single-payer healthcare now,

- Defend and expand public education,

- A massive public works program, at union scale and under union contracts,

- Tear down the Wall of Shame, Not one more deportation,

- Down with the racists and the Klux Klux Klan,

- Stop the police killings of Blacks and Latinos,

- Stop the endless wars! Money for jobs and public services!

This would open the way for a genuine independent labor movement, a leverage point for the youth, for Blacks, for immigrants, and for all the oppressed sectors of the working class.

Though heavily weakened by its subordination to the Democratic Party, the labor movement still has the potential to turn things around in the interests of the working class and all the oppressed.


(7) Across the country, white supremacists — with the support of police departments, politicians, and the president of the United States himself — are organizing public rallies to promote their racist and reactionary agenda. In some cases these actions are “protected” by their own armed militias.

One such neo-Nazi assembly will take place August 26 in San Francisco. An important union in the history of this city, ILWU Local 10, has called for a mass demonstration and assembly at Crissy Field, where the white supremacists will be gathering. The union’s call reads as follows:

“Whereas, the fascists, the KKK, Nazis and other white supremacists rallied and marched by torchlight in Charlottesville, whipping up lynch mob terror with racist, anti-immigrant and anti-Semitic slogans, and

“Whereas, that attack resulted in one anti-racist counter-demonstrator murdered and many others injured when one of the fascist bullies ran them down with a car, and

“Whereas, President Trump’s whitewashing this violent, deadly fascist and racist attack saying ‘both sides are to blame’, and his attacking anti-racists for opposing Confederate statues that honor slavery adds fuel to the fire of racist violence, and

“Whereas, the Klan, Nazis and other racist terrorists represent a deadly threat to African Americans, Latinos and immigrants, as well as Muslims, Jews, LGBTQ people among many others, and directly to members of our union and the labor movement as a whole, and

“Whereas, the fascist ‘Patriot Prayer’ group that staged violent racist provocations in Portland, Oregon and elsewhere, attracting Nazi and other violent white supremacists, has announced it will rally on Crissy Field on Saturday August 26, and

“Whereas, far from a matter of ‘free speech’, the racist and fascist provocations are a deadly menace as shown in Portland on May 26 when a Nazi murdered two men and almost killed a third for defending two young African American women he was menacing; and our sisters and brothers in the Portland labor movement answered racist terror with the power of workers solidarity, mobilizing members of 14 unions against the fascist/racist rally there on June 4, and

“Whereas, ILWU Local 10 has a long and proud history of standing up against racism, fascism and bigotry and using our union power to do so; on May Day 2015 we shut down Bay Area ports and marched followed by thousands to Oscar Grant Plaza demanding an end to police terror against African Americans and others; the San Francisco Bay Area is a union stronghold and we will not allow labor-hating white supremacists to bring their lynch mob terror here,

“Therefore, ILWU Local 10 in the best tradition of our union that fought these right-wingers in the Big Strike of 1934, will not work on that day and instead march to Crissy Field to stop the racist, fascist intimidation in our hometown and invite all unions and antiracist and antifascist organizations to join us defending unions, racial minorities, immigrants, LGBTQ people, women and all the oppressed.”

In our view, this statement by ILWU Local 10 points the way forward!

— August 22, 2017

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Ele'ill
26th August 2017, 23:03
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/25/us/charlottesville-protest-police.html


Video shows a situation in charlottesville, where a fascist draws a handgun and shoots in the direction of antifa folks, while the police stood there and did absolutely nothing. This isn't a call for the police to protect people, it's a demonstration in how they don't- That they will side with fascist organizing, and that it is up to anti fascists to confront fascists and defend each other and themselves acab

GiantMonkeyMan
27th August 2017, 13:51
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/25/us/charlottesville-protest-police.html


Video shows a situation in charlottesville, where a fascist draws a handgun and shoots in the direction of antifa folks, while the police stood there and did absolutely nothing. This isn't a call for the police to protect people, it's a demonstration in how they don't- That they will side with fascist organizing, and that it is up to anti fascists to confront fascists and defend each other and themselves acab
From what I understand (can't find the link at the moment) but that took place at that now famous picture of the black dude using an aerosol and lighter to shoot some flame at the fascists - you can see the flame briefly in the video. Basically the fascists were attacking protesters and this old man was trying to escape but was frightened by the situation so the black dude and his mates got in the way of the fascists to let the old man and other protesters escape. Didn't know the fascists then shot at them. The only people protecting the peaceful demonstrators were antifascists, as acknowledged by Cornell West and his group of multi-faith protesters.

Ele'ill
27th August 2017, 21:15
I'm not gonna post much solidarity related stuff at this point because so many of the twitter feeds are doing a great job of that. and there's a lot happening, but here's Berkeley right now, apparently about to take the park. That's a small portion of the overall effort happening right now to remove the fash from their rally points and stuff. Also an update, that the pigs are guarding the fash, not searching them, etc.. and making arrests of people who have masks. The pigs are now putting on their gas masks.

19774


-Antifa jumping the barricades and entering the park



The cops are now attacking antifa. Fuck the police.

Cops attacked people on side streets and stuff, celebrity fash getting surrounded and either escorted out or arrested by police. The park afaik has been taken and the fash have been chased out. <3

GLF
28th August 2017, 04:19
The cops are now attacking antifa. Fuck the police.

Have you been living under a rock for the past thousand years?

GiantMonkeyMan
28th August 2017, 12:36
Have you been living under a rock for the past thousand years?
Considering Ele'ill made many edits, they were likely responding live to the events as they were unfolding.

Ele'ill
28th August 2017, 13:41
Have you been living under a rock for the past thousand years?

There were reports of police deploying gas on side streets to stop people from getting to the park, which they later took. If the police had engaged the counter protest past that it would have been a pretty big clash that's why it's significant. What do you think about all the fascists getting run out of town yesterday?

GLF
28th August 2017, 23:27
Oops. I am a big dumbass. I see what you meant now lol. You were giving a play by play of what was going down. I apologize.

What do I think about the fascists being run out of town? Good? I wish they never would've showed up in the first place.

I also don't like the self-righteousness of the bourgeois class who act like they're all virtuous and shit for opposing fascists when they're over-privileged rich fucks. Fascism must be stamped out but it's not going away as long as we tolerate these people, too. The occupy movement really needs to get going again.

ckaihatsu
29th August 2017, 12:26
Here's a topically relevant article:


Why is the media promoting Antifa?

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/28/antif-a28.html

BIXX
29th August 2017, 17:40
Here's a topically relevant article:


Why is the media promoting Antifa?

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/28/antif-a28.html

Holy shit what a whiny babyish article.

For one, the complaining about how Antifa is getting good coverage (ignoring that it is about how they've literally saved lives) while sites of "genuine opposition" (by which they mean themselves, they say as much in the article) are "respressed" (clearly ignoring the repression Antifa and anarchists have been facing lately, and in fact, forever). Furthermore this is a clear attempt by wsws to smear anarchist opposition, probably due to their masturbatory obsession with "Leon Trotsky, the greatest strategist of revolutionary socialism in the twentieth century..." Of course, we all know the history with Trotsky and anarchists.

They even begin to parrot right wing talking points, saying, "Indeed, many of the groups involved in Antifa are essentially factions of the Democratic Party." Sure, and I collect my Soros checks every weekend before I go out partying with my acting buddies. Sound about right wsws? Furthermore, they claim that antifa "Ignored ... the role of the Democrats and the social and political conditions that create fascism." Now, I will say that I can only speak for my experiences with antifa and anarchists, but I find these groups consistently critical of the democrats, of their role in capital, and as of recent, their role in protecting and ensuring the birth of the fascist movement in the US.

Their final paragraph reads, "A principled struggle against the threat of fascism and the Trump administration’s attacks on immigrants, democratic rights, health care, and living standards requires a fight against the entire political establishment and the capitalist system upon which it is based. It is not punch-ups with Nazis, but the independent political organization and mobilization of the working class, on a socialist program, that is the urgent task." In their effort to smear anarchists, they forget that most anarchists wouldn't take issue with this statement, other than pointing out that those "punch-ups with Nazis" aren't just getting your jollies off, they're literally protecting lives. If wsws wants to stand aside and build a "workers" party while people are being murdered, so be it. And as for the anarchists that disagree with that statement, perhaps they aren't so interested in the roleplay involved in the wsws and are more interested in organizing themselves now to begin the fight- now.


Basically, ckaihatsu, I took the time to read one of your articles, and it's just as shit as I'd have guessed. It does pose a question that I think does need to be asked, regarding media coverage and antifa, but it uses that question to smear their opposition and fails to truly answer that question.

ckaihatsu
29th August 2017, 18:26
It does pose a question that I think does need to be asked, regarding media coverage and antifa,


Well, the strength of the WSWS (I'm not affiliated with it) is their timeliness on current events, and analysis.





but it uses that question to smear their opposition and fails to truly answer that question.


I think it's just left-positioning, to say that fighting fascists isn't the be-all and end-all of what revolutionary socialism is, and that ultimately there has to be rank-and-file organizing to realize workers power, for revolution.

BIXX
29th August 2017, 18:43
(I'm not affiliated with it)
Then why do you post so many of their articles? If it's because

... the strength of the WSWS is their timeliness on current events, and analysis.
Why not it's going down, or their Twitter?


I think it's just left-positioning, to say that fighting fascists isn't the be-all and end-all of what revolutionary socialism is, and that ultimately there has to be rank-and-file organizing to realize workers power, for revolution.

Of course that's why they say, "Antifa attracts disoriented layers particularly among the middle class..." They're not trying to smear the people who fight fascists, who risk their lives doing so, they're just saying that they have a "program compatible with the aims of the Democratic Party and the ruling elite". It's just political positioning! It can't possibly be a smear campaign.

That article is an example of statist-communist nuerosis and nothing more- their obsession with being the only true communists requires that they smear and (as their beloved founder, Lean Trotsky shows us) kill anyone who delegitimizes their claim to authority.

How much money do you owe them ckaihatsu? I'm sure revleft could use some of the donation funds to help pay off your debts.

A question that isn't a joke though: do you work for them?

Ele'ill
29th August 2017, 18:57
big edit- similar to this article, do the likes of chris hedges and his followers feel that they can defend communities from fascists, who are openly organizing for violence? What about from the police presence that was already mobilized to engage in violence against communities?

ckaihatsu
29th August 2017, 19:09
Then why do you post so many of their articles? If it's because

Why not it's going down, or their Twitter?


This isn't clear -- you may want to rephrase. I already said why WSWS articles are worthwhile.





I think it's just left-positioning, to say that fighting fascists isn't the be-all and end-all of what revolutionary socialism is, and that ultimately there has to be rank-and-file organizing to realize workers power, for revolution.





Of course that's why they say, "Antifa attracts disoriented layers particularly among the middle class..." They're not trying to smear the people who fight fascists, who risk their lives doing so, they're just saying that they have a "program compatible with the aims of the Democratic Party and the ruling elite". It's just political positioning! It can't possibly be a smear campaign.


It's not so much a 'smear campaign' as it's sectarianism and left-positioning for broader struggles, meaning labor.

Also the crux of the article has to do with the corporate *media*'s co-opting of this recent mass-eye-opening event.





That article is an example of statist-communist nuerosis and nothing more- their obsession with being the only true communists requires that they smear and (as their beloved founder, Lean Trotsky shows us) kill anyone who delegitimizes their claim to authority.


You're sounding pretty neurotic yourself, there, BIXX.





How much money do you owe them ckaihatsu? I'm sure revleft could use some of the donation funds to help pay off your debts.

A question that isn't a joke though: do you work for them?


I already said that:





I'm not affiliated with it