How can the unemployed and underemployed organize?

[Full Metal Bolshevik]

Nowadays, having stable full time job with ok pay is actually a good deal. Youth unemployment is sky high, 20% for EU, some countries even up to 40% (Spain, Greece)
These people can not even be called lupenproletariat, many have degree's and skills, others are totally unemployable, it's hard to say they are exploited in the traditional marxist sense but they are also severely affected by the system. There's a lot of stigma around being unproductive, but the fact is as technology improves so does production up to a point where it's excessive and the need for workers diminishes, a "useless class" is forming, totally disposable by capitalist standards. I think there is a huge potential here, but I don't know how. Many have low income, but some free time, I don't know if unions are the most appropriate for these cases, but there has to be a way to connect these people.

And can there be antagonism between those with stable skilled jobs and unemployed/underemployed? How can these 2 groups (if you agree with such separation) connect?

[GiantMonkeyMan]

Historically, communists during periods of high unemployment, for example during the Great Depression, organised unemployed workers councils to fight for their right to decent jobs or decent welfare support. In the UK, unemployed workers would organise 'hunger marches' where they would travel from their local area to London to petition parliament and bring more attention to their plight.

I think that conditions are very different today. Instead of having a group of factories shut down, or a coal mine close or whatever, leading to a large group of workers suddenly on the dole, instead you have a segment of the population emerging from their education system without a chance of getting decent jobs. The working class is far more atomised and unemployed people even more so. I still think it's vital to try and organise these segments, as you said. When I was more politically active a few years ago, my comrades and I would give benefits claimants advice on how to avoid sanctions and I even turned up to one unemployed workers' tribunal pretending to be his union representative which essentially made the people trying to sanction him immediately back off. But such tactics are entirely time consuming and not always useful or successful.

At this stage, I feel communists should be connecting to all layers of the working class, both employed or otherwise, and just introducing the ideas to these communities. I also think arguing for a three/four day work week without loss of pay could be a good argument to organise around as it would benefit employed workers by giving them more leisure time as well as unemployed workers by giving them employment opportunities.

[Full Metal Bolshevik]

Historically, communists during periods of high unemployment, for example during the Great Depression, organised unemployed workers councils to fight for their right to decent jobs or decent welfare support. In the UK, unemployed workers would organise 'hunger marches' where they would travel from their local area to London to petition parliament and bring more attention to their plight.

I think that conditions are very different today. Instead of having a group of factories shut down, or a coal mine close or whatever, leading to a large group of workers suddenly on the dole, instead you have a segment of the population emerging from their education system without a chance of getting decent jobs. The working class is far more atomised and unemployed people even more so. I still think it's vital to try and organise these segments, as you said. When I was more politically active a few years ago, my comrades and I would give benefits claimants advice on how to avoid sanctions and I even turned up to one unemployed workers' tribunal pretending to be his union representative which essentially made the people trying to sanction him immediately back off. But such tactics are entirely time consuming and not always useful or successful.

At this stage, I feel communists should be connecting to all layers of the working class, both employed or otherwise, and just introducing the ideas to these communities. I also think arguing for a three/four day work week without loss of pay could be a good argument to organise around as it would benefit employed workers by giving them more leisure time as well as unemployed workers by giving them employment opportunities.
Zizek said in some of his talks that we ought to demand changes that would be reasonable for most but unacceptable for the ruling class (his example was healthcare in USA, which he considers a big feat), perhaps such demand should really be reducing by an incredible amount the working hours per week? not just 1 to 5 hours as it's usually what's on the table in Europe, but a cut to 20-25 hours a week. Many in the past calculated the working hours necessary and how much it would be reduced in the future but that never happened since the fight for 40 long ago. Here's an example from 1991:
19730

We live with promises from a future that never comes.

[Fellow_Human]

Many in the past calculated the working hours necessary and how much it would be reduced in the future but that never happened since the fight for 40 long ago. . .We live with promises from a future that never comes.

That is not entirely true. The number of annual hours worked per worker is declining, in most years, according to the official OECD statistics. (https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=ANHRS)

[Full Metal Bolshevik]

That is not entirely true. The number of annual hours worked per worker is declining, in most years, according to the official OECD statistics. (https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=ANHRS)
Not a lot, it's what to be expected.
Japan is famous for long working hours, but its average is not that high compared to some European countries.

But this doesn't put into question what I'm arguing for.

[Jimmie Higgins]

Unemployed workers are still part of the general working class. Precarious employment is the default condition for workers, it was only the results of movements and struggles that changed this for some workers.

Unemployment is a class issue and concern, but it's hard to counter competition and interclass resentment without class movements and struggle.

Now the US, at least, the economic-political divide in the labor movement means that class issues such as health, unemployment, racism, etc are seen as "social issues" not class issues. Unions might approach other issues with concern in a general liberal way, but only organize around "bread and butter" issues.

The trick for radicals is how to put some class into social struggles while putting the social into labor struggles.

[Full Metal Bolshevik]

No one is addressing the question itself.


At this stage, I feel communists should be connecting to all layers of the working class, both employed or otherwise, and just introducing the ideas to these communities.
How?

[mr perfidy]

Tie a blunt to a leaflet and hand them out/hang w people as they leave unemployment claims offices w frustrated expressions.

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Free music shows w beer and gambling

[willowtooth]

Tie a blunt to a leaflet and hand them out/hang w people as they leave unemployment claims offices w frustrated expressions.

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Free music shows w beer and gamblingDespite what youve heard, communists dont have the most liberal stance towards drugs, narco traffickers have routinely slaughtered communists, many socialist states have some of the harshest penalties for drug use, dope slavery is a real thing. Despite a lack of hard evidence, most of us believe the CIA actively participates in drug trafficking some still say they invented drugs like crack and LSD. Some even say the rock group The Beatles was sponsored as a psychological project of MI6. Can you think of why they would do such a thing? Suffice it to say handing out blunts, liquor, and tickets to music concerts at a casino might send mixed messages to say the least

Although I'll still smoke weed and get drunk at a concert with ya comrade... I dont gamble though too addictive

[Zanthorus]

These people can not even be called lupenproletariat


Mar always refers to the 'industrial reserve army' as part of the working-class proper. For example, in Volume I, he refers to the fact that the "overwork of the employed part of the working class swells the rank of its reserve" (pp. 789, emphasis added). Here the 'reserve' is a part of the working-class. And he goes on to speak of "the condemnation of one part of the working class to enforced idleness". Again it is clear that the unemployed is for Marx a part and parcel of the working-class. Of course they are strictly speaking 'unproductive' from the standpoint of capitalist production, they aren't wage-labourers (at least not for the moment), they don't produce surplus-value, and hence as you say they aren't 'exploited in the traditional Marxist sense'. But they are still proletarians, free workers, in the double sense that they are 'free' from the means of realising their labour, and 'free' to sell themselves as commodities, although they have the misfortune in this instance of being unable to find a buyer.

[mr perfidy]

I hear you willowtooth but I thought the question is, "what does the underclass like," and not what the communists do. Hah you maybe noticed they're losing badly right now. I have this book "building the party" that's compiled notes and strategy from lenin and there's stuff in there about recruiting and training the right people for the right struggle. He used banned literature smuggling, distribution, and production and I thought that weed would serve the same function. Since there's like no literature consumers except special interest kids for more focused propaganda

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And by gambling I mean like 50/50s. Though I think they should be 33/3s with the last third goin to either the ticket sellers themselves in an underground scene, or toward rent or medicine for someone on the block.

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Minus a terror tension trauma strategy that convinces the masses that you are scarier than the state, the only other path to mass involvement is through festival. Literally build an actual party engine. People at parties are like atavistic communists that organically negotiate resources, protect members and recognize intellectual and moral authority