Norse

[Kori]

I was wanting to know what everyone here thinks about the Norse Religion. I consider myself semi-religious. I am not an extremist but my religion is not a hobby either. What are your thoughts?

[Lord Testicles]

What do we think of it as a mythological story or what do we think of it as a valid belief system?

[Tim Cornelis]

It is mythology, it is false, it is nonsensical superstition that conflicts with a scientific understanding of reality and cause and effect. On top of that, I have a degree of contempt for those that appropriate pagan beliefs as it there is no historical continuity between pagan beliefs as they existed, and those that adopt it today. The reason they adopt it, I can only imagine, is because it is cool and edgy, and I don't believe they really believe in paganism. It's more like Christian atheism. Plus, one of the pillars of fascism, palingenetic ultranationalism, makes it that fascists are attracted to paganism like flies to shit. Maybe a little bit rude, but I've never met or seen a pagan that wasn't either an edgelord or fascist.

[oneday]

Hippies, spiritual types and goths can get into paganism too without necessarily being fascists or edgelords.

[Lord Testicles]

Hippies, spiritual types and goths can get into paganism too without necessarily being fascists or edgelords.

How to demolish your own argument whilst making it, all in one neat sentence.

[oneday]

How to demolish your own argument whilst making it, all in one neat sentence.

Nah there's nothing too edgy about this stuff anymore. It's the 'following your own path' thing, which has become more accepted. Paganism is just another 'personal choice' type thing, in some circles. No one cares or is outraged.

[Lord Testicles]

Nah there's nothing too edgy about this stuff anymore. It's the 'following your own path' thing, which has become more accepted. Paganism is just another 'personal choice' type thing, in some circles.

If you don't sincerely believe that Heimdall or Zeus exist whilst calling yourself a "pagan" then you're just being edgy, & how can anyone wake up one day in this day and age and sincerely believe that the Greek or Norse pantheon is running the show?

[oneday]

If you don't sincerely believe that Heimdall or Zeus exist whilst calling yourself a "pagan" then you're just being edgy, & how can anyone wake up one day in this day and age and sincerely believe that the Greek or Norse pantheon is running the show?

But they do seriously believe it, just like Christians believe their superstition. They believe in deities, spirits, ghosts, communication with spirits and all kinds of miscellaneous crazy shit. Maybe it is incomprehensible how anyone really believes it, but they do, just like people believe the major religions. It's encouraged, even - to find 'the truth that speaks to you'.

[Lord Testicles]

But they do seriously believe it, just like Christians believe their superstition. They believe in deities, spirits, ghosts, communication with spirits and all kinds of miscellaneous crazy shit. Maybe it is incomprehensible how anyone really believes it, but they do, just like people believe the major religions. It's encouraged, even - to find 'the truth that speaks to you'.

Maybe I'm just cynical, but I believe they say that they seriously believe it but I don't think they really do. Where are all of the Norse pagans dying in battle to secure their place in Valhalla?

I can understand someone seriously believing in Christianity or Hinduism because they've most likely been fed and surrounded by that shit from birth. You can't exactly say the same for these "revived" religions.

If anyone out there does seriously believe in one of these revived religions then I'm willing to bet that it's unlikely due to upbringing and definitely not due to some divine revelation but because they've consciously decided to be idiots, probably because (and I'm speculating here) they believe that it gives them some air of mystery.

[Armchair Partisan]

I consider myself semi-religious.

What does it mean to be "semi-religious" for you?

[Kilij]

As a former pagan myself and one that was involved in a few different communities, I think I can help paint a more accurate picture of (non-indigenous) paganism and relevant information to Revleft. Like any faith, pagans stretch the whole political spectrum from leftists to ultra-nationalist scumbags. In beliefs, they range from agnostics to pantheists(believers that everything is divine in character) to soft-polytheists(single divinity, but multiple aspects) to hard-polytheists(each god being distinct and real). These beliefs have different implications for a person's political ideology, like that pantheists generally revere the planet and are among the strongest supporters of environmental politics and equality. Whereas believers in a hard-polytheists-style pantheon, regardless whether they acknowledge gods other than those of their ancestors, often are among communities that believe their own gods specifically favour their own people/race.

I myself once shared in pantheon-specific community with some in the more nationalistic lot, it was the frequent arguments with nationalists both outside and within my pagan community that caused me to quit the pagan community and overtime my active worship. In my experience, pan-pagan communities are pretty good though and tend to lean left, also seem more concerned with magic and superstition than faith, whereas I was the latter. As to why many become pagans, it varies, but many were raised Christian, hated church, but still had some belief in a higher power and were intrigued by the more open and doctrineless spirituality.

My completely subjective socio-political observations on the common brands of paganism are that Wiccans and believers in the Celtic and Greek pantheons tend to be more left-leaning and tolerant, that Slavic pagans and non-U.S./U.K. Norse pagans are more nationalist, homophobic, and confrontational, that Roman pagans are the most moderate and status quo, and Egyptian pagans are a strange but sharp divide between liberals of severe ethnicities and Black liberationists(sometimes even supremacists).

Overall, like any faithful or otherwise, pagans are still among the oppressed. It is important to judge the individual's character, not creed. I am happy to have faithful among us on the far-left as long as they are faithful to our ideals too.

[161TRD]

As one who was born, grew up, and still live in Norway, I have learned about the Norse mythology in school, and I even have friends who are active in the Åsatru community. One of my friends is even a Gode, or a priestess if you like.

The Norse myhtology is an interesting world view that was used to make sense of it all way back when, but now it's nothing but stories, myths and legends, and I quite frankly find it strange that modern people adopt this belief system. (I find it equally strange that Hollywood needs to spice it up and change it for their movies, but that's a different story!) My friend who is a Gode once told me that she joined Bifrost (the name of the Åsatru community here in Norway) mostly because she wants to keep it safe. She knows, as we all do, that nazis and facists are drawn to this mythology, and she wants to keep them away from taking over the organisation.

I do find it strange that people in the US claim to be "Odinists", that neo nazis use the fuÞark (the rune alphabeth), that people all over the world read the Thor comics and watch the movies, and nobody really knows what the mythology is about or how long it existed. The last hov (norse "church" to use a stupid explanation) was demolished in the 17th century, and even after that some farms and families in Norway worshipped the Norse gods way into the 18th century. Some even drove the Christian missionaries and evangelists off their land with weapons as late as the 1850s, but it's not certain that they were really worshipping the Norse pantheon, or just said so to scare off the Christians.

The Norse mythology is a facinating tale, with a lot of good and sound advice on how to behave. But it's outdated, and obsolete.

[LionofTepelenë]

If it isn't harming or exploiting anyone, go worship Odin all you want! Besides, Norse mythology is cool, especially their storys.

[Antiochus]

Its absolutely mind-boggling how someone can actively declare themselves an idiot, out of their own volition. Don't get me wrong, it isn't that Odinism is "dumber" than Islam or Christianity. Its just that the vast majority of the people in the latter two were inducted into them and there is such a strong ideological construct in Capitalism today surrounding both of them (in their respective spheres of influence) you can't really "escape" them. But Odinism? Seriously???

[regrettiquete]

This seems to be an old thread but I really ~love~ entering a space and being called an idiot and an insincere edgelord for beliefs that have shaped--and in fact saved, over and over--my life, and that I've had enough genuine experiences with to be unshakeable in believing. /sarcasm

I'm a Lokean for what it's worth. Norse recon-derived but with a focus on Loki and His family. And genuinely serious about it. 9 years of practice despite being abused for it for a good 5 years of that practice. If I didn't really believe this shit, it would've made my life a lot easier and I'd have suffered a lot less abuse if I had just given it up. But here I am. 9 years later. You'd better damn well know I believe what I practice. Even IF its all in my head and exists to make my suffering, mentally ill ass able to survive the hellscape of Earth.

I mean, you all don't think we LITERALLY believe the Eddas, right? Most of us are scholars to some extent or else know enough to know that they were written down thousands of years after the Christianization of Scandinavia and are biased, not literal, often allegorical, and even the gods Themselves have this whole...to reference Tia Dalma in Pirates of the Caribbean "Same story, different versions. And all are true." thing going whenever people question Them about it, in most cases I've heard. There's truth and story in every tale and the gods just seem to roll with it, honestly. And in the communities Im part of, we actively work to take out the trash and keep an alert list of Nazis, fascists, and other scum who claim to be Heathens/Norse Pagans/what have you so that they can be reported, blocked, whatever. Some might doxx them but the blog isn't promoting it exactly.

And in all honestly my religion and gods push me along my revolutionary path and WANT me to work with others to make change in this shit-hole world and destroy all systems of oppression and the things that uphold, continue, and exploit them. So I would hardly say its in any opposition to being a revolutionary. In fact, it was Gods and Radicals, and their Pagan Anti-Capitalist Primer zine, that helped me to really understand capitalism and its evils in the first place.

Beyond that, let's not forget that it's the Western ideology of "Our science and/or religion is infallible reasoning and therefor we must eradicate the beliefs of those superstitious savages" is part of what fed into the complete eradication of native and indigenous cultures and religious beliefs due to imperialism and racism. :) Do you know how many friends I have who are people of color trying to connect to their cultural and spiritual roots that struggle because of how much was destroyed in the name of "our way of thinking is superior to your savage and backwards one, and so we're going to force you to give up your religion and culture and believe what we tell you because we're right and everyone else is wrong and should follow our way?"

That's not just Christians doing that. :)

And if you call me "crazy," "idiotic," or "delusional," for any of that, just remember that you're only perpetuating the same slurs thrown at mentally ill people like me that oppressive institutions that dehumanized and tortured us for ages did. Institutions that actually CONTINUE to oppress, dehumanize, and torture us. Just. To keep in mind. :) Since no one here seems to actually give a shit about the liberation of disabled people enough to bother remembering that sort of thing.

[Blake's Baby]

...

I mean, you all don't think we LITERALLY believe the Eddas, right? Most of us are scholars to some extent or else know enough to know that they were written down thousands of years after the Christianization of Scandinavia ...

Not enough of a scholar to know that Scandinavia was Christianised mainly between the 8th (missions to Denmark) and 12th (when Sweden officially adopted Christianity). As the Eddas were most likely written down in the 13th century, you're claiming that Scandinavia was Christiansed 1000 or more years before there was a Christian religion.