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View Full Version : Journeyman in the Late Guild System



Guardia Rossa
28th December 2015, 18:23
In late guild system I remember that as the Guilds became more and more closed and the Master position was now inherited, Journeyman became workers without perspective to become Masters, organized in Unions, went on strike, etc..., although the few Masters had way more power as they practically controlled the city's politics. (Which at that time were either autonomous or independent, HRE-style)

Does anyone know any books, political positions or anything from them? Were they/could they be a revolutionary class, alike the proletariat, or their position was more akin to the petit-bourgeoisie or labour aristocracy comparing to today's system?

I don't believe they could actually do a global socialist revolution or something, but a different form of urban society and some interesting ideas.

I won't mention the Hussites and neither the Dithmarschen because reasons, but you can Google Dithmarschen as it's an interesting story (Because Frisians)

Guardia Rossa
11th January 2016, 21:16
Bumped.

Os Cangaceiros
11th January 2016, 22:21
They formed some organizations in which they unified with other journeymen and went on strike. Kind of like proto-unions. It was disturbing enough that there was an Edict issued around 1530 (too lazy to look up the exact date) which forbade the practice.

I'm not sure that it was "progressive" from a Marxist standpoint, even though it was definitely class struggle. As far as I know the sole concern of such organizations of journeymen was the retention of their promised place within the economic order. It definitely has not been the subject of socialist/communist interest the way other social movements that predated Marxism have been, like the Anabaptists or the Luddites etc.

The free flow of capital is essential for the development of capitalism, and therefore the development of socialism/communism (according to Marxism). The guild system wasn't conducive to this at all. So someone's political position supporting the continued maintenance of the system probably wouldn't be a progressive one...

Aslan
12th January 2016, 00:24
Guild socialism was around before Marx. Did he ever write about it? What about Engels?

Guardia Rossa
12th January 2016, 00:58
Guild socialism was around before Marx. Did he ever write about it? What about Engels?

I don't really know, and I'm not sure if it is even proto-socialism.