HAITI

[Red, Green, and Gold]

I haven't seen any threads about this yet, which is surprising, but correct me if there are any already.

The situation in Haiti has escalated to a dangerous level. This is a critical moment for Latin America and the Caribbean. The outcome of this situation could affect things for years to come.

Upon first reading about the situation, I supported Aristide, the leftist "man of the people." Upon further investigation, though, I discovered Aristide the butcher, who rigs elections and favors "necklacing," in which tires are placed around political opponents' necks and set aflame. I saw a quote somewhere, which I can no longer find, in which Aristide openly said that he loved the smell of burning tires, and loved watching as his enemies went up in flames.

Now, France is considering sending troops (http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=2541273) to quell Haiti's rebellion. What do you all think of this? Who do you support?

I'd like to end this by adding a statistic I saw in a newspaper article yesterday. In the past 200 years, since Toussaint de L'Ouverture led the first Haitian rebellion and won independence from Haiti, there have been 30 full-fledged revolutions in Haiti.

Now that's a country in turmoil... :unsure:

[Iepilei]

Give it a few days and it'll be buisness as usual. Honestly if there has been no real progress in that vast amount of time, what makes you think this little insurrection will bear any weight at all? Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

It has become a bit of a domino effect, though. Cities and towns across Haiti, most notably the city of Gonaives, have been taken by rebel forces, and police stations are being torched left and right. In a fairly good article in the New York Times on Sunday, the author spoke of the lack of authority in Haiti. President Aristide was ousted by the military in 1994, and upon his return he dissolved the military and a large amount of the police force. Now, during this crisis, he has little to fall back on. His military backup is minimal, and there is very little government presence of any kind in Haiti, making this a perfect situation for a popular coup.

[Severian]

There is no army in Haiti - Aristide dissolved it. There are ex-military people involved in the rebellion - and now the exiled leader of FRAPH, a group associated with the old military dictatorship, has come back to join it.

The political opposition in Haiti includes both the traditional elite and working people disillusioned by Aristide's IMF-imposed policies, which have had disastrous effects for workers and peasants. Their only common program is "Down with Aristide".

Neither side in this conflict has any positive program.

[Fidel Castro]

I read an interesting article in the "Independant" today about how Aristide is paying city gangs to fight the rebels for him.

I personally wouldn't be very upset if Aristide was removed (again!) Perhaps this time the rebels will finish him off so the US can't put him back into power.

[Red Flag]

I posted a thread about this 3 or 4 weeks ago.

[Urban Rubble]

It doesn't sound like there is any good on either side of this one.

[Red Flag]

there's not much organization or focus from what I've gathered about the situation.. when the paramilitaries overthrough Aristide the first time a few years back the US deployed somthing like 20,000 troops to reinstate him to power.

[pandora]

Anyone who thinks the IMF has the good of any nation at heart need only look at Haiti. A beautiful country once. One of the first colonies to free herself from France. Haitian Africans were feared as it was thought they would bring revolution against slavery with them in their blood. The history of Haiti makes one think that the colonizers and slave owners have made her pay in blood for her disobedience.

The poverty there is so severe. And as I posted before, rumor has it prisoners are killed rather than paid for room and board. Yet it is still beautiful. I believe one day it's beauty will shine through, for now, it is proof of the sickness of the capitalist system. Perhaps the US fears Haiti, why? Is it because she fears strength?
Just thinking. . .

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by Red [email protected] 18 2004, 12:33 AM
there's not much organization or focus from what I've gathered about the situation.. when the paramilitaries overthrough Aristide the first time a few years back the US deployed somthing like 20,000 troops to reinstate him to power.
There's no organization at all in the rebel movement.
But, since Toussaint L'Ouverture's slave rebellion 200 years ago, Haiti has always been a country lacking in organization. There isn't much of a government in Haiti, no armed forces, and only a loose police force.

[LuZhiming]

Originally posted by [email protected] 17 2004, 11:11 PM
Perhaps this time the rebels will finish him off so the US can't put him back into power.
Hahaha, don't be fooled by that propaganda. The U.S. had little role at all in putting Aristide back in power. All they did was steal Haiti's resources, force Aristide to be more open to the free market, and steal Haitian resources and food. That dictator that overthrew Aristide was actually on the U.S. payroll, and still is today.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by LuZhiming+Feb 18 2004, 10:13 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (LuZhiming @ Feb 18 2004, 10:13 AM)
[email protected] 17 2004, 11:11 PM
Perhaps this time the rebels will finish him off so the US can&#39;t put him back into power.
Hahaha, don&#39;t be fooled by that propaganda. The U.S. had little role at all in putting Aristide back in power. All they did was steal Haiti&#39;s resources, force Aristide to be more open to the free market, and steal Haitian resources and food. That dictator that overthrew Aristide was actually on the U.S. payroll, and still is today. [/b]
Do you have sources for this? I&#39;m pretty sure that he wasn&#39;t a dictator. I believe that it was a supporter of former dictator "Baby Doc" Duvalier. Baby Doc is still alive, and living in Paris.
I don&#39;t believe that he&#39;s on anyone&#39;s payroll, as he&#39;s not doing a whole lot right now other than sitting on his porch and smoking cigars.

[LuZhiming]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2004, 03:55 PM
Do you have sources for this? I&#39;m pretty sure that he wasn&#39;t a dictator. I believe that it was a supporter of former dictator "Baby Doc" Duvalier. Baby Doc is still alive, and living in Paris.
I don&#39;t believe that he&#39;s on anyone&#39;s payroll, as he&#39;s not doing a whole lot right now other than sitting on his porch and smoking cigars.
He right now has a penthouse in Panama. Cedras is being payed &#036;5,000 a month from the U.S. State Department, apparently in rent for properties in Haiti. You need proof that Cedras is a dictator? What sources doesn&#39;t refer to him as a dictator or a military strongman? In his very short rule over Haiti, he had executed at least 4,000 political prisoners. And it is well known that Cedras regularlly used torture. Any Human Rights report on this fellow isn&#39;t exactly positive.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by LuZhiming+Feb 18 2004, 01:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (LuZhiming @ Feb 18 2004, 01:13 PM)
[email protected] 18 2004, 03:55 PM
Do you have sources for this? I&#39;m pretty sure that he wasn&#39;t a dictator. I believe that it was a supporter of former dictator "Baby Doc" Duvalier. Baby Doc is still alive, and living in Paris.
I don&#39;t believe that he&#39;s on anyone&#39;s payroll, as he&#39;s not doing a whole lot right now other than sitting on his porch and smoking cigars.
He right now has a penthouse in Panama. Cedras is being payed &#036;5,000 a month from the U.S. State Department, apparently in rent for properties in Haiti. You need proof that Cedras is a dictator? What sources doesn&#39;t refer to him as a dictator or a military strongman? In his very short rule over Haiti, he had executed at least 4,000 political prisoners. And it is well known that Cedras regularlly used torture. Any Human Rights report on this fellow isn&#39;t exactly positive. [/b]
I knew nothing about Cedras, I was just suggesting that he may have been confused with Baby Doc. That&#39;s very interesting that he&#39;s on the U.S. payroll, and a terrible thing that he is allowed to live peacefully in a penthouse.

Thanks, Lu.

[STI]

Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.

[VukBZ2005]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 03:10 AM

Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.
we should support the revolutionaries, they want change. We ALL need change in this world.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

But are these really... the right kind of revolutionaries to support? I mean, change is always a very important thing, something I will usually support unconditionally. But from what I&#39;ve heard, the revolutionaries in Haiti are fairly right-wing, some radically so. The President is a left-winger, albeit a failed one.

[VukBZ2005]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 12:31 PM
But are these really... the right kind of revolutionaries to support? I mean, change is always a very important thing, something I will usually support unconditionally. But from what I&#39;ve heard, the revolutionaries in Haiti are fairly right-wing, some radically so. The President is a left-winger, albeit a failed one.
Well Haiti - like Somalia is in a lack of organization. I Wish Haiti would just go
Communist or Socalist at least?

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by LinuxMan86+Feb 19 2004, 08:18 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (LinuxMan86 @ Feb 19 2004, 08:18 AM)
[email protected] 19 2004, 12:31 PM
But are these really... the right kind of revolutionaries to support? I mean, change is always a very important thing, something I will usually support unconditionally. But from what I&#39;ve heard, the revolutionaries in Haiti are fairly right-wing, some radically so. The President is a left-winger, albeit a failed one.
Well Haiti - like Somalia is in a lack of organization. I Wish Haiti would just go
Communist or Socalist at least? [/b]
It&#39;s such an unorganized country, though - I don&#39;t know if a more structured system like Socialism would even work in Haiti. :unsure:

[Solace]

There is no army in Haiti - Aristide dissolved it.

The army was replaced by the National Police of Haiti.

As soon as it started a very large number of ex militaries joined them.

Basically, the army "serves" the country in a new suit.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

I read this morning that Haiti&#39;s police, now afraid for their own lives, have given up on their duties and are barricading themselves inside their own police stations.

This uprising could have potential, good or bad.

[VukBZ2005]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2004, 06:51 PM
I read this morning that Haiti&#39;s police, now afraid for their own lives, have given up on their duties and are barricading themselves inside their own police stations.

This uprising could have potential, good or bad.
Now i heard, just a half-Hour ago that Aristide said that he would die for
Haiti.....

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by LinuxMan86+Feb 19 2004, 02:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (LinuxMan86 @ Feb 19 2004, 02:53 PM)
[email protected] 19 2004, 06:51 PM
I read this morning that Haiti&#39;s police, now afraid for their own lives, have given up on their duties and are barricading themselves inside their own police stations.

This uprising could have potential, good or bad.
Now i heard, just a half-Hour ago that Aristide said that he would die for
Haiti..... [/b]
This uprising has gotten to the point where it may be impossible to control. That is, unless the U&#036; and France step in and "set things right", as they have suggested they may do.

[Severian]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2004, 09:10 PM

Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.
Not all rebellions are revolutions. Some are even counterrevolutions.

Since you&#39;ve quoted Marx, let me just point out that he didn&#39;t support the pro-slavery rebellion by the Confederate States of America.

Change is not always good. Different is not always better. Different can also be worse.

In this case, FRAPH is essentially a death squad, and one of its leaders has now declared that he is the military commander of the rebels in Gonaives. The victory of this rebellion would clearly not create better conditions for Haitian workers to organize themselves. Possibly might do the opposite, in a quite bloody way.

BTW, its not clear what Washington really thinks of this rebellion. Their public statements at first...seemed almost ready to repeat their performance of openly cheering the coup in Venezuela. And we have no data on what covert operations they might be doing.

In any case, you can&#39;t arrive at a revolutionary program just by putting a minus sign everywhere Washington puts a plus sign.

[VukBZ2005]

Originally posted by Severian+Feb 20 2004, 10:00 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Severian @ Feb 20 2004, 10:00 AM)
[email protected] 18 2004, 09:10 PM

Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.
Not all rebellions are revolutions. Some are even counterrevolutions.

Since you&#39;ve quoted Marx, let me just point out that he didn&#39;t support the pro-slavery rebellion by the Confederate States of America.

[/b]
Well you don&#39;t know why the South Actually seceded then. Slavery was only used a tool for Secession - The real reason was to get away from
the north....it was going to happen anyway when the consider the cultural
differences...

It does&#39;nt matter if Marx did&#39;nt supported the CSA. It matters if the real truth of why they seceded comes out.

AND WASHIGTON NEVER PUTS A PLUS - IT PUTS A MINUS&#33;

[STI]

Originally posted by Severian+Feb 20 2004, 10:00 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Severian @ Feb 20 2004, 10:00 AM)
[email protected] 18 2004, 09:10 PM

Unless, by some chance, this becomes a workers-revolution that somehow causes an international domino effect, I see no shining jewel in Haiti.

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.
Not all rebellions are revolutions. Some are even counterrevolutions.

Since you&#39;ve quoted Marx, let me just point out that he didn&#39;t support the pro-slavery rebellion by the Confederate States of America.

Change is not always good. Different is not always better. Different can also be worse.

In this case, FRAPH is essentially a death squad, and one of its leaders has now declared that he is the military commander of the rebels in Gonaives. The victory of this rebellion would clearly not create better conditions for Haitian workers to organize themselves. Possibly might do the opposite, in a quite bloody way.

BTW, its not clear what Washington really thinks of this rebellion. Their public statements at first...seemed almost ready to repeat their performance of openly cheering the coup in Venezuela. And we have no data on what covert operations they might be doing.

In any case, you can&#39;t arrive at a revolutionary program just by putting a minus sign everywhere Washington puts a plus sign. [/b]
The rebellion in the south did not "oppose the current order of things", it sought to preserve it. It wasn&#39;t the type of rebellion/revolution Marx talked about, and as such was not the type of rebellion to which I was referring.

[revoevo]

Shouldn&#39;t we at least offer our moral support to the revolutionaries? After all, didn&#39;t Marx say (roughly), that "communists support all revolutions which oppose the current order of things, because the question of property may come to the forefront"? I think that&#39;s a pretty accurate quote, but feel free to correct me if I took it out of context.

So communists support right-wing revolutions against communism, if it is the current order of things? :huh:

But really, I agree with Severian that change is not always good. It seems to me that neither side in this conflict is positive, both are at opposite ends of the political spectrum, but both lack compassion and favor brutal torture, especially by necklacing. I suppose it will be interesting to see how this works out. But if I&#39;m offering my moral support to anyone, it&#39;s to the innocent, starving people who will ultimately be affected by the rebellion.

[bunk]

with 20 guerrillas we could start a guerrilla campaign. preferably people who have shot a rifle before and have read up on guerrilla tactics. I think that weapons would be fairly accessible there

[revoevo]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2004, 10:44 AM
with 20 guerrillas we could start a guerrilla campaign. preferably people who have shot a rifle before and have read up on guerrilla tactics. I think that weapons would be fairly accessible there
Um... for what? To aid the rebels? To defend Aristide? Or, more realistically, to get our asses kicked as soon as we set foot on Haiti? I&#39;m unclear as to why we would rally up a group of only 20 people to fight... what exactly? Where? Why? :blink: :huh: :unsure:

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by [email protected] 22 2004, 05:44 AM
with 20 guerrillas we could start a guerrilla campaign. preferably people who have shot a rifle before and have read up on guerrilla tactics. I think that weapons would be fairly accessible there
There is no "good side" in Haiti deserving of support. The rebels are bad, Aristide is bad, and the leaders of both groups are a little bit wrong in the head.

Personally, if I had to pick a side, I would support Aristide. It&#39;s a decision of whether or not you want brutal policies and insanity from the left-wing or the right-wing.

I&#39;d choose the left-wing.

[Red Flag]

Rebels Took Cape Haitien..

Read The Full Story http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4244322/

Times like this established left wing organizations should send people to haiti and educate the masses, also incorporating propaganda to incourage the people to liberate them selves from both regiemes and fight the people&#39;s revolution.. the only revolution worth fighting for..

[bunk]

Edit: On the news they said that the rebels murdered 200 people in a refugee camp

[Retro]

The US has already stated they are not going to get involved.

France is pissing it&#39;s pants, waiting for the UN to say it approves and/or will help.

They are wasting time, if they won&#39;t a solution, they better move fast. If i beleived correctly, The rebel leader Guy Phillipe(?) was at one point a military dictator. Either way these people are in trouble. Something is bound to happen, i can&#39;t wait to see.

[Red, Green, and Gold]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2004, 12:45 PM
The US has already stated they are not going to get involved.
The U&#036; gets involved (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4244322/) (link). ;)

[bunk]

They sent 50 marines to protect the embassy, there supposed to be neutral. But if there there when the battle begins i think they would get caught up in it ( on no particular side but i think the Embassy would take damage in street battles in the capital)

[STI]

Originally posted by revoevo+Feb 22 2004, 07:40 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (revoevo @ Feb 22 2004, 07:40 PM)
[email protected] 22 2004, 10:44 AM
with 20 guerrillas we could start a guerrilla campaign. preferably people who have shot a rifle before and have read up on guerrilla tactics. I think that weapons would be fairly accessible there
Um... for what? To aid the rebels? To defend Aristide? Or, more realistically, to get our asses kicked as soon as we set foot on Haiti? I&#39;m unclear as to why we would rally up a group of only 20 people to fight... what exactly? Where? Why? :blink: :huh: :unsure: [/b]
That would be a counter- revolution, not a revolution. It would be seeking to restore the old way of things, not oppose the current way of things ("current" meaning "the way they were during Marx&#39;s time: capitalist").

[pandora]

"Well Haiti - like Somalia is in a lack of organization. I Wish Haiti would just go Communist or Socalist at least? [/QUOTE]
It&#39;s such an unorganized country, though - I don&#39;t know if a more structured system like Socialism would even work in Haiti. :unsure:[/QUOTE]

I find the last comment a bit disruptive, it devaluates the ability of the people of Haiti to think for themselves. I believe Haitian people are very intelligent but they have had little options in the last thirty years, remember they were the first slave colony to fight back against their colonizer. Also socialist organizers are often the first slated for death and imprisonment so such organisation has been nearly impossible. To say it wouldn&#39;t work when many socialist activists in Haiti have no doubt given their lives to institute it is foolish. I&#39;m sure their have been more intelligent and brave activists than you are I in Haiti, whether any are still alive is the question. To wish to help one&#39;s brother in such a political climate is true bravery.

On the contrary I think the United States is very afraid of the Haitian people, they can not be forced to work as in the Dominican Republic so it is my belief however misguided that the United States engages in policies which support suppression of the Haitian people through violence, terror, and starvation not only to steal their resources but to break their will.

There seems to be three groups revolting, the Northern Rebel Militias, most likely bought ex-military officers allied with wealthy land owners [a guess based on the paramilitary troops of Chiapas, perhaps similar?], the Opposition to Aristide in the capital, who do not seem to be able to contact the Rebel leaders in the North as well as they pretend, and are trying now to bargin with Colin Powell for control of the government, or to share power with Aristide, but can they control the rebels?
Also they don&#39;t want to share power with Aristide but the US had a contract all drawn up and ready for Aristide to share with a council of 12 elders [most likely landowners] interesting they had the plan so quickly. The Opposition has 24 hours to make their decision.

Sadly there is the third group, and this is the group we all wish would gain power. The actual people who have been starved, beaten, and enslaved for the past 30 years and can not take it any longer. Their aims have been small arrest or disposing of local warlords [the police] and stealing food from STORAGE&#33; More IMF crap the people starve while the food sits in warehouses, no wonder there is rebellion.

When I see worried women in the streets with wheelbarrows, praying not to be shot for stealing a bag of rice I cannot go completely against this revolution, because if nothing else it has created a gap in time, a break from the stress in which people can steal things they need before the wealthy land owners take over again. Unfortunately the UN is not quick to resupply the warehouses taken by starving people, and so Haiti will starve yet again.

No one is helping Aristide, because he didn&#39;t help anybody.
Perhaps he was going to change some social policies, people say he was a follower of liberation theory, Cuba has been helping in Haiti, perhaps this is why the State Dept. decided he could not rule alone and allowed arms onto the island?

Where did the guns come from? Who sold them to the landowners? And why is the contract already drawn up? Of course they already Guantanamo Bay set up for the suffering Haitians who try to escape by sea. .. .I am sickened.

[netw0rk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 23 2004, 06:20 PM
They sent 50 marines to protect the embassy, there supposed to be neutral. But if there there when the battle begins i think they would get caught up in it ( on no particular side but i think the Embassy would take damage in street battles in the capital)
If anything happens to any of the marines, or the embassy Im sure the US will jump right in.

The rebels have about half of Haiti now, from what I understand.

[bunk]

yeh and soon to march on the capital where some gangs are still loyal to Aritside. Fear bloody street battles.

[MiniOswald]

oh yeah 50 U.S marine to &#39;protect&#39; the embassy, nowant normal country would evacuate their embassy, but 50 heavily armed marines againt rebels with garands, I&#39;m afraid the street battles will be messy and the yanks might do another somalia (was it around 850 civis to 18 yanks or something), and crossfire what are we gonna do start a guerrilla war with L98&#39;s? c&#39;mon man, and also may I bring people attention to Tupac Amaru a communist group in peru who might intrest some of you

[Osman Ghazi]

If there is one thing that I know it is that Aristide is better than the rebels.
It&#39;s not like he is all bad. At the very least he disbanded the Haitian Army and put an end to their influence in Haitian politics.

By the by, I&#39;m listening to CBC NewsWorld as I&#39;m writing this and I heard that barricades are being thrown up around Port-au-Prince so there is definately going to be a fight. Half the population lives in Port-au-Prince anyway.

Also, can anyone actually tell me what Aristide did that was so bad? I&#39;ve heard &#39;huyman rights violations&#39; but that&#39;s decisively vague.

[Commandante Che Guevara]

I think Aristide is not liked and he would probably go in exil if the revolution work or he will be killed

[Scottish_Militant]

Haiti – There can be no solution under capitalism


By Rob Lyon

Former death squad and military leaders from the darkest periods of Haiti&#39;s past have been leading an armed struggle against the government of Jean-Bertrand Aristide for the past two weeks. The paramilitary groups, formerly called the Cannibals, have taken over a dozen cities in northern Haiti and control several key supply routes. Although the paramilitaries are few in number, they are well armed and are controlling the north through the use of terror. The &#39;mainstream&#39; bourgeois opposition had previously been encouraging these groups, as they saw them as means to overthrow Aristide and take power. In response to the crisis, Aristide&#39;s government has asked for international assistance to prevent a coup.

Aristide agreed this past Saturday to a peace plan brokered by diplomats from the US, Canada, France and CARICOM. It is not clear whether the &#39;mainstream&#39; bourgeois opposition in the capital, Port-au-Prince, will agree to the deal by the late Monday afternoon deadline. It in fact appears quite unlikely, as the only thing they are demanding is the resignation of Aristide.

The Opposition

Former military leaders from the disbanded Haitian army and former death squad leaders continued their armed campaign against the Aristide government on Sunday by taking Cap-Haïtien, the country&#39;s second largest city. These armed groups, formerly called "the Cannibals" and now renamed the Gonaïves Resistance Front (GRF), had taken the city of Gonaïves on Thursday and declared an independent country of &#39;l&#39;Arbonite&#39;. The new so-called government is headed by Buter Métayer, who was a former Aristide supporter. Guy Philippe, former police chief of Cap-Haïtien and Duvalier death squad leader in the 1980s, was named l&#39;Arbonite&#39;s chief of armed forces. Philippe fled Haiti in 2002 to the Dominican Republic after it was discovered that he was plotting a coup. Philippe returned to Haiti with former death squad leader Louis Jodel Chamblain, and had up to 50 armed supporters with him. Jean Pierre Baptiste, who calls himself General Tatoune, lead the march into the city. He was one of the leaders of the uprising that overthrew Jean-Claude (Baby Doc) Duvalier in 1986. Under the military regime of the early 1990&#39;s, he joined the paramilitary outfit FRAPH (Front for the Advancement and Progress of Haiti) and was serving life in prison in Gonaïves for his role in a 1994 massacre. A close associate of Chamblain, Emmanueal &#39;Toto&#39; Constant, who lead the coup against Aristide in 1991, has admitted CIA financing for the movement. It has also been claimed that these paramilitaries received "some form" of training while in the Dominican Republic. These paramilitary thugs now control most of Haiti&#39;s north, and the rebels are today threatening an attempt to take Port-au-Prince.

The mainstream opposition, including groups such as the Group of 184 and the Convergence Democratique have distanced themselves from the (GRF) as of late, but were previously encouraging them as they felt they could come to power on the back of a coup against Aristide. There are also rumours that the GRF is in fact the armed wing of the US funded and backed Convergence Democratique. Tensions are high between the Creole-speaking black majority, most of whom live in absolute poverty and the minority French-speaking mullattos, one percent of whom own approximately 45% of the country&#39;s wealth. One Haitian claimed "the dominant class speaks French, but all Haitians speak Kreyol. When the dominant class doesn&#39;t want the people to know what it&#39;s doing, it speaks French." US congresswoman Maxine Waters, upon returning from a visit to Haiti exposed opposition leader Andre Apaid Jr. as a &#39;Duvalier supporter&#39;, and that he along with his Group of 184, is "attempting to instigate a bloodbath in Haiti and the blame the government for the resulting disaster in the belief that the US will aid the so-called protestors against President Aristide".

Clearly reflecting the bourgeois, pro-imperialist and reactionary nature of these "democratic" opposition leaders, Apaid himself never renounced his US citizenship, and he is a major factory owner.

Aristide&#39;s government is in serious danger of being overthrown by a bloody coup. His government only has a police force of about 4,000, and there are reports that the police are demoralized and out-gunned. A successful coup would obviously be a nightmare for the Haitian people, as the old paramilitaries, who instated a murderous regime in the early 1990s would exact a terrible revenge upon Aristide, his supporters, and the Haitian workers and urban poor. In response to the threats of a coup and assassination attempts, Aristide claimed last week that he would stay and fight, saying he would die for his country. In desperation, Haitian Prime Minister Yvon Neptune issued a plea for international troops to be sent to Haiti to quell the &#39;uprising&#39; and aid the fledgling national police.

US Imperialism

Members of the Haitian opposition have claimed that if the US, under Clinton, was responsible for re-instating Aristide, then it is the Bush administration&#39;s responsibility to correct the mistake and overthrow him. Many in the US State Department see Aristide as a &#39;beardless Castro&#39;, and he is well hated by Jesse Helms, and his clique of extreme right wing allies Roger Noriega and Otto Reich in the State Department (all involved in previous US interventions in countries like Nicaragua in the 1980s and more recently in Venezuela).

After Aristide was overthrown, his re-instatement as President on the back of a US invasion of the island in 1994 was only made possible when he embraced the Haitian ruling class and the dictates of Washington and the IMF. In order to maintain US support and receive aid, Aristide needed to maintain the standard &#39;structural adjustment&#39; package, with foreign funds going to debt repayment and the needs of the bourgeois, as well as maintaining and open foreign investment policy.

This was a recipe for disaster for Haiti. Of course many state owned and subsidized industries were privatized and lead to a further concentration of wealth – 1 percent of the population controls about 45 percent of the wealth. By the end of the 1990s Haiti&#39;s local rice production had been reduced by half and rice imports from the US accounted for over half of local rice sales. The local farming population was devastated, and the price of rice rose drastically.

On the other hand, in order to appease the masses the Haitian government has invested heavily in agriculture, public transport and infrastructure. The minimum wage was doubled recently from 36 to 70 gourdes per day. Health care and education have also become major priorities. More schools were built in Haiti between 1994 and 2000 than between 1804 and 1994. The government subsidizes meals and public transport for school children and has maintained the controversial fuel subsidy. Perhaps this is why we see such a determined opposition from the bourgeois and imperialist forces in Haiti?

These social policies, which were really minor concessions, were intolerable for US imperialism. This shows the current situation of crisis of capitalism where they cannot accept reforms of any kind, even minor ones. When Aristide won the election in February 2000, the US froze hundreds of millions of dollars in aid claiming that the elections had been flawed. Out of 7,500 positions filled nation wide, election observers recommended that seven senate seats go to a run off. Haiti&#39;s electoral commission disagreed. This was the only international concern surrounding the election. In the end, in order to avoid &#39;the wrath of the mighty&#39;, these senators resigned

Although it seems clear that the US has been involved in some way in the armed conflict, the Bush administration has been reluctant to get openly involved because as US National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice said a few years ago the US administration will only intervene militarily when there is a clear and compelling interest for the US ruling class. The Bush administration also doesn&#39;t need any more foreign policy risks in an election year. There is also the issue of cost. The US defence budget has ballooned over the past few years with the &#39;War on Terror&#39; and the invasion of Iraq.

The US has had to draw a distinction between the &#39;mainstream&#39; bourgeois political opposition and the armed gangs that have taken over the north. In order to avoid a foreign policy disaster around the policy of &#39;regime change&#39;, much like the one brewing around Iraq, Colin Powell claimed that the US political plan for Haiti does not include Aristide&#39;s stepping down, although he added that the US would not object if, as part of the negotiations with the opposition Aristide would agree to leave before the end of his term in 2006. And now along with the diplomatic initiative from the US this weekend, the administration is planning on sending a military inspection team to investigate the safety of the embassy. This is only an excuse to send a military team in to Haiti to check out conditions for a military intervention.

One of the major concerns of the US government is the threat of a mass exodus of Haitians similar to that in 1991. People have begun to flee to the neighbouring Dominican Republic and to Jamaica. The US has opened more space at Guantanamo Bay to deal with refugees, but doesn&#39;t want a mass exodus to the US. There is a great deal of pressure now coming from the state of Florida, where governor Bush is concerned about a mass of refugees coming over. This has also prompted the US government to act.

The US is ultimately concerned that Aristide cannot maintain control of the situation. Revolutionary events and processes have opened all across the Caribbean and Latin America and the US is attempting to shut the floodgates. They would like to see Aristide gone and put someone more reliable in place. They would prefer the bourgeois opposition to come to power, but this doesn&#39;t seem very likely. Now that the paramilitaries appear to winning the US is thinking twice. Its seems obvious that the US doesn&#39;t want to see the armed gangs attain power in Haiti, as this would undoubtedly lead to a civil war and would not be well received at home, and could cause problems in an election year. What the US would prefer is to broker a deal with the opposition and Aristide. The best deal for US interests would be if Aristide compromises and/or steps down. The problem with this though is that the bourgeois opposition is digging in its heels, believing that they can come to power on the backs of a coup by the paramilitaries. The bourgeois opposition will find though, that if these criminal gangsters are allowed to return to power, that they will be crushed just the same as everyone else; the paramilitaries are out of control and will not take orders from anyone.

France

It was not until the French expressed an interest in sending troops to Haiti that the US government responded. In an absolute diplomatic manoeuvre, French foreign minister Mr. De Villepin said last week that they were considering sending troops to Haiti, although he hadn&#39;t mentioned this in his visit with Colin Powell just a few days before. This has taken the US by surprise and embarrassed the administration, adding to the already high tensions between the two nations as a result of the invasion of Iraq. Naturally, the US does not want the French to begin military operations in its backyard. This is yet a further reflection of the deep crisis of the world economy and the contradictions between the imperialist powers. The world economy is edging ever closer to a crisis and there is a monstrous struggle for markets, and French military operations in Haiti would be a good way for the French to encroach upon US interests in the Caribbean and Latin America, perhaps as a retaliation for the loss of French interests in Iraq.

The French claim they have 2,000 citizens living in Haiti and that the must send a &#39;rescue mission&#39; to protect them from the violence. This is a familiar story. The French have used this pretext in Congo, Ivory Coast, Chad and elsewhere whenever they need to install friendlier dictators and protect French interests.

France, Haiti&#39;s former colonizer, has about 3,000 troops in the Antilles as well as transport aircraft, helicopters and warships that they could send in.

In order to head off a collision between the two countries the US agreed to a diplomatic intervention including France, Canada, and CARICOM. Many are commenting that this is a way of healing the rifts caused by the invasion in Iraq and re-affirming the US&#39;s commitment to the UN. It is however a cynical self-interested move to prevent unilateral French action. Canada has been invited because of its &#39;long record&#39; of &#39;assistance&#39; to Haiti, and because there is an attitude in the US government that Canada appears more neutral, and less imperialistic than the US. It is also an attempt at "outsourcing" the costs and risks of military intervention abroad to complying allies. This could prevent an anti-US backlash in Haiti, and make negotiations with Aristide easier, whose relations with the US have obviously been strained as of late. This gives the US the suitable diplomatic cover to move in, undercut its competitors and protect its own interests in Haiti.

The Dominican Republic and the threat of war

Tensions have also been running high on the border between the Dominican Republic and Haiti. The Haitian government has been demanding that the Dominican government explain how their troops allowed armed Haitian gangs and criminals to cross in Haiti. It is obvious that they could not have crossed without the complicity of the Dominican army. The Dominican army said it had no information about how the exiles crossed over the 362 km border that is barely patrolled. In the meantime, the Dominican army is still trying to find out who ambushed and killed two Dominican soldiers at a remote area of the border. The killing of the border guards is an obvious provocation, and could prove to be a pretext for war.

The Dominican government has also stepped up its complaints about illegal Haitian immigrants. It is estimated that more than 1 million Haitians, mainly workers, are living in the Dominican Republic.

Another serious point of contention is the fact that the exiled paramilitary leaders who just returned to Haiti from the Dominican Republic were armed with new M16s. Is it just a coincidence that, as is well known, the Dominican Republic had recently received a shipment of 20,000 US made M16s?

There is a danger that the US, if it fails to diplomatically secure its interests may rely on its Dominican colonial ally to enforce &#39;regime change&#39; in Haiti. This would provide a smokescreen for the US&#39;s role and involvement in the affair, because once again it is an election year, and could also be seen by the Dominican Republic as a useful tool to quell its own growing social unrest. As we reported at the end of January, there was a two day general strike in the Dominican Republic against privatization, low wages, rising fuel costs, and unemployment, which now stands at 17 percent. This came after another general strike on November 11 last year. Given the pretext of instability in Haiti and a flood of refugees, it could be the excuse the Dominican government needs to invade Haiti and use the army to crush the working class opposition and quell the developing revolutionary situation in its own country.

The so-called Peace Plan

Aristide agreed on Saturday to the peace plan proposed by the US, Canada, France and CARICOM nations. The rebels are to be disarmed and a new government will be formed with a new prime minister. The peace plan requires that the government and the opposition agree to a tripartite commission, including an international representative by Tuesday to move ahead with forming a new government and electing parliament, which has not functioned since January. The Canadian government has also offered to send police to reinforce the small out-gunned Haitian police force. The real meaning of this peace plan is to keep Aristide at the top as a way of containing his supporters amongst the masses, but at the same time give real power to the representatives of the bourgeois opposition, and win time to disarm the armed thugs who are out of control. But if this "deal" went ahead it would mean political suicide for Aristide, who would have compromised with the hated imperialists and local elite for the second time.

Meanwhile the armed gangs have continued their offensive. Cap-Haïtien fell on Sunday and there is talk that an attack on Port-au-Prince is imminent. It as yet unclear, but the police force, the bulk of which is located in Port-au-Prince may be demoralized. Before Cap-Haïtien fell, police made it very clear that they were too afraid to patrol the streets. They barricaded themselves in their station but could not hold off the assault. The police have been the targets of attacks by paramilitaries for quite some time, and seem unable and possibly unwilling to defend themselves. The one thing that Aristide has going for him is his popularity with the urban poor and the working class. Pierre Frandley, a carpenter, told the Associated Press 02/20/2004 that "we have machetes and guns, and we will resist. The police might have been scared, but the people got together and organized…We blocked the streets."

It was also noted in the Observer that "in the sprawling slums of Port-au-Prince, Aristide continues to be widely seen as a hero fighting against a powerful and tiny elite and its international backers". The bourgeois media has reporting major demonstrations of the opposition against Aristide for some time, but continually neglect to mention that these protests are met with mass counter-demonstrations of workers who support Aristide. As the rumours of the armed thugs and gangs approaching Port-au-Prince grow, workers from the slums and working-class neighbourhoods, the &#39;bastion&#39; of Aristide&#39;s support in Port-au-Prince are arming themselves and throwing up barricades in order to support the government. It seems that the masses of the workers and the urban poor who had probably been disillusioned by Aristide, are now rallying to defend him faced with the threat of return of the cutthroat gangs of criminals who ruled the country under the Duvaliers. In this they are showing a very clear class instinct. As Marx commented, sometimes the revolution needs the whip of counter-revolution.

In the event that there is an attack on Port-au-Prince, Aristide&#39;s only defence would be to arm the working class and call on their support to defeat the coup. The problem with this, as far as Aristide is concerned, is that if he were to arm the workers it would mean revolution – power would pass onto the hands of the working people and it will put the socialist transformation of Haitian society on the order of the day.

The crisis in the world economy has led to revolutionary developments across the Caribbean and Latin America. Revolutionary situations are developing in the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Argentina and Brazil. The US is trying to stem the tide of the revolutionary awakening of the masses. The US has been forced to respond in order to stop the spread of the revolution. In some cases, like in Venezuela and in Georgia US has not intervened militarily to overthrow "uncooperative" regimes but has done so in an indirect way by whipping up a "popular" uprising, in reality a counter-revolution. In fact the situation in Haiti reminds us very much of that which led to the April 2002 coup against Chavez in Venezuela, where a coalition between the ruling elite and US imperialism, used the masses of the middle class as cannon fodder, and tried to overthrow the government. In the case of Venezuela, the masses responded immediately and defeated the coup. Whether this will be the case in Haiti, where Aristide&#39;s image has already been tarnished in the eyes of the masses by his collaboration with the US after he was reinstated in 1994, remains to be seen.

Now, the US doesn&#39;t necessarily want to remove Aristide, but rather, use him to prevent the development of a revolutionary situation. They are not sure that Aristide can control the situation. They might sit back and watch the developments and the battles, and when the time is right they may rely on the Dominican army, under the pretext of &#39;stopping bloodshed&#39; and an &#39;international humanitarian mission&#39; in order to crush the movement of the masses. Given the fact that it is an election year, and given the loss of American life in Iraq, the US will be reluctant to send in their own troops and risks the lives of more US soldiers.

This crisis in the world economy and politics into which the world has entered is such that there can be no solution to the problems in Haiti, or elsewhere such as in Venezuela or Argentina on a capitalist or reformist basis. The contradictions are too great and too many, and the divisions in society are too deep. That is precisely why Aristide and his government are in such a mess. The only solution would have been to expropriate the imperialist interests and the bourgeois in Haiti. It seems unlikely however, that a reformist politician like Aristide would carry out such a programme.

Contrary to the opinion of the US administration, Aristide is no communist or socialist, in fact he can hardly pass as a reformist and the working class will find him to be a barrier to genuine socialism and liberation from imperialism and poverty. The workers and urban poor, along with the poor peasants must organize themselves into defence committees, democratically organized and linked across the country, in order to defend themselves against the return of the hated macoutistes and take the future into their own hands. The arming of the workers and the people and the defeat of the coup would effectively put power in the hands of the workers. They must use this to push the socialist transformation of society. This however, will not be enough on its own. Haiti is a small, poor, and isolated country that could never survive on its own. A socialist revolution in Haiti could be the catalyst that sparks off a socialist revolution in the Dominican Republic, which is the only way out of the current crisis for the workers of both countries. The Haitian workers must appeal to and link up in struggle with the working class of the Dominican Republic, and appeal to all of the workers of the Caribbean and Latin America to join them in solidarity and struggle for socialism.


February 23, 2004

[bunk]

Aristide: Under pressure from within and outside Haiti
Haiti&#39;s President Jean-Bertrand Aristide has gone into exile after a three-week rebellion against his rule, the US and French governments say.
Mr Aristide was said to be on his way to neighbouring Dominican Republic from where he will seek asylum.

His departure came as rebels, who control much of the country, neared the capital, Port-au-Prince.

The US and France had called on him to step down for the good of the Haitian people.


&#39;Right decision&#39;

Reports from Port-au-Prince said an unmarked jet carrying Mr Aristide and his security chief had been seen leaving the city&#39;s airport at dawn.

No-one saw Mr Aristide on board, but both American and French officials confirmed the president was no longer in Haiti.

Conflicting reports suggested Mr Aristide would seek asylum in Morocco, Taiwan, Panama or South Africa.

The BBC&#39;s Stephen Gibbs, in Haiti, says it is believed the White House helped to make the final arrangements for his departure.


The Bush administration said Mr Aristide had made the right decision for the Haitian people by resigning.

Just hours earlier, the White House had delivered its sharpest criticism of him to date, blaming him for the crisis in his country and questioning his fitness to govern amid looting and anarchy in the capital.

"His failure to adhere to democratic principles has contributed to the deep polarisation and violent unrest that we are witnessing in Haiti today," a US statement said.

Rebel advance

The unrest which has gathered pace in recent weeks stems from disputed elections in 2000, which the opposition says were rigged in Mr Aristide&#39;s favour.

But anger has turned to mounting violence. In the past three weeks rebels have taken control of much of the country; law and order has broken down; and armed gangs loyal to Mr Aristide have been roaming the streets of Port-au-Prince.

On Saturday, Haitian rebel leader Guy Philippe said he had decided to hold off an attack on the besieged Haitian capital for "a day or two".

The rebels were demanding Mr Aristide&#39;s resignation - which he had continually insisted was out of the question.

Haiti&#39;s constitution stipulates that the chief judge of the Haitian Supreme Court, currently Boniface Alexandre, would take over the presidency, if Mr Aristide has resigned.

Reports from rebel-held Cap Haiten said people were dancing on the streets at the news of Mr Aristide&#39;s departure.

But in the capital, angry crowds converged on the presidential palace, AP reported.

It is the second time Mr Aristide has been forced into exile. He was ousted in 1991 in a coup within months of becoming Haiti&#39;s first democratically elected leader

He was restored to power three years later by a US-led military intervention.

minioswald: i wouldn&#39;t start any war with those rubish L98&#39;s

[Ortega]

Precisely.

To condense that article, Aristide has officially left the country with his wife as of 6:30 this morning. He is suspected to have gone to the Dominican Republic, but there&#39;s no official word on that yet.

[celtopunk]

Originally posted by [email protected] 18 2004, 03:55 PM
Do you have sources for this? I&#39;m pretty sure that he wasn&#39;t a dictator. I believe that it was a supporter of former dictator "Baby Doc" Duvalier. Baby Doc is still alive, and living in Paris.
I don&#39;t believe that he&#39;s on anyone&#39;s payroll, as he&#39;s not doing a whole lot right now other than sitting on his porch and smoking cigars.
Who the hell were you thinking of?

And the reason Baby Doc isn&#39;t on any payroll is because he and his family stole so much money over the years they were in power while on the US payroll.

Aristide being forced out is bad hopefully something good can come out of it. This was just another coup financed and largely supported by the US and the rich people in Haiti.

I don&#39;t know what people&#39;s feelings are of Aristide right now but he was twice elected in fair elections by a majority of the people.

These "rebels" are mostly former soldiers, FRAPHs and Macoutes, they are killers and their last concerns are those of the poor people of Haiti.

I&#39;m not saying there is no valid criticism of Aristide but it isn&#39;t coming from the people with the guns.

[Solace]

Embattled Aristide quits Haiti

Haiti&#39;s President Jean-Bertrand Aristide has gone into exile after a three-week rebellion against him, saying he wanted to avoid bloodshed.

Celebrations broke out in rebel-held areas, but angry supporters set fires in the capital, and gunfire rang out.

International military forces would be rapidly deployed to restore security in Haiti, said the US ambassador.

The head of Haiti&#39;s Supreme Court says he is assuming power as stipulated by the constitution.

Mr Aristide&#39;s plane reportedly landed for a refuelling stop on the island of Antigua, but his final destination is not known.

Fury and joy

Hundreds of people have converged on the presidential palace in the capital, Port-au-Prince and a pall of smoke is hanging over the city after at least one petrol station was set on fire.

US ambassador to Haiti James Foley said an international forces, including US soldiers, would arrive in Haiti shortly.

On Friday, three US navy vessels - which could carry 2,000 marines - were placed on standby to go to Haiti.

Both the US and France had called on the president to step down.

Mr Foley said Mr Aristide had "made a decision for the good of the Haitian people".

(...)

Rebel advance

The unrest which has gathered pace in recent weeks stems from disputed elections in 2000, which the opposition says were rigged in Mr Aristide&#39;s favour.

But anger has turned to mounting violence.

In the past three weeks rebels have taken control of much of the country; and recently law and order broke down completely in the capital.

On Saturday, Haitian rebel leader Guy Philippe said he had decided to hold off an attack on the besieged Haitian capital for "a day or two".

It is the second time Mr Aristide has been forced into exile. He was ousted in 1991 in a coup within months of becoming Haiti&#39;s first democratically elected leader

He was restored to power three years later by a US-led military intervention.

Aight (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3519821.stm)

[LuZhiming]

I fear this is going to be another very sad day for Haiti.....

[demonio comunista]

yeah, they are trying to say the US government made him get on the plane, that they held a gun to his head. colin powell denies it...of course. but who knows, i sure wish i did

[Severian]

It appears that the U.S. Marines did in fact remove Haiti&#39;s elected president from the country and from office. Not only is Aristide saying so, but a caretaker at his home said so in an earlier news report. (http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,8833298%5E1702,00.html) Most of all, it fits the known facts: the U.S. was calling on Aristide to resign, Aristide had up til then said he was going to serve out his term no matter what, and Aristide made no public appearance to announce he was leaving or resigning.

&#39;Course, Aristide put himself in a situation where this could happen: from relying on the U.S. to put him back in office after the last coup, to policies that served the IMF rather than Haitian workers and peasants. And finally appealing for the U.S. - not Haitian workers and peasants - to save him from the current rebellion.

Effectively, veterans of past military dictatorships and death squads like FRAPH (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/29/international/29REBE.html?ex=1079077940&ei=1&en=4d0d02f24be48474) are now in control of most of Haiti&#39;s streets. Guy Phillipe, (http://www.sunherald.com/mld/sunherald/8059886.htm) the main leader of the rebellion, is a former death-squad-style police chief and admirer of Pinochet and Reagan. He&#39;s has enough confidence to threaten to arrest the prime minister, so I doubt he&#39;s showing much mercy to working-class militants in the shantytowns of Port-au-Prince.

A little symptom of what kind of people are now in charge: Baby Doc says he intends to return to Haiti. (http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsPackageArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=468502&section=news) From France, where he&#39;s been given sanctuary by the one of the governments now sending troops to Haiti.