I don't understand Kurdistan?

[willowtooth]

What is going on over there, I hear talk of anarchist groups, and national leftist groups. I just don't understand whats happening? What's going on with Kurdistan, the PKK ,the YPG, why did saddam and erdogan oppress them? whats going on over there? Can someone please explain it too me in the simplest language possible:confused:

[ComradeAllende]

Gladly. Basically, the Kurds are an ethnic Middle Eastern group that are looking for an independent nation-state (kinda like the Palestinians, only they're being oppressed by more countries). There are substantial Kurd populations in Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Turkey. Back in the 1970s and 80s, the PKK (Kurdish Worker's Party) engaged in guerilla warfare with the Turkish Army over Kurdish autonomy; eventually they lost, and they abandoned Marxism-Leninism. Now they're fighting back against the Turks, who are attacking their holdouts in neighboring Syria. Ironically, the Kurds are allies of the US in the fight against ISIL, and Turkey recently pledged to help the US defeat ISIL forces in Syria.

In Iraq, there were two wars over the issue of Kurdish sovereignty, one before Saddam and one after him. The first one (1960-1970) ended with the establishment of an autonomous zone where Kurds could manage their affairs while still living under Iraqi rule. The second one erupted when further talks on Kurdish autonomy collapsed, and led to a defeat of Iraqi Kurdish forces. Saddam Hussein later took power and began to crush the Kurdish opposition, especially during the Iran-Iraq War, when he launched the genocidal Al-Anfal Campaign. After the US occupation of Iraq ended in 2011, Iraqi Kurdistan's relations with the Shiite govt in Iraq deteriorated. After ISIL's offensive in Northern Iraq in June 2014, the Kurds seized disputed parts of Northern Iraq and held off ISIL attacks, particularly in the publicized Battle of Kobani. I would argue that the Kurds are the most effective force in the fight against ISIL, as long as the Turks and Shiite Iraqis don't ruin this by sparking internal conflicts with their respective Kurdish populations.

[Sasha]

Its important to note that while the PKK afiliated groups are the most powerfull in turkey and syria (though in turkey they do have competition, many conservative religious kurds voted previously for the ruling AKP and some even support the armed Hudur-Par formaly known as kurdish hezbollah) their affiliates in Iran and especially in Iraq are far less dominant. The autonomous region of the Iraqi kurds is ran by the KDG, better known as the Barzani clan in an uneasy truce with their former arch enemies of the PUK. The latter being more on friendly terms with both the iranian government and the PKK.
Though the PKK, before their heroic performance against IS had little support in iraqi-kurdistan they do have their basecamps there after they retreated from turkey under the beginning of the peace process. So when the news says that the turkish airforce is bombing the kurds in iraq they are not in fact bombing their partners in the ruling KDG but bombing the PKK camps in the mountains.

[The Feral Underclass]

What is going on over there, I hear talk of anarchist groups, and national leftist groups. I just don't understand whats happening? What's going on with Kurdistan, the PKK ,the YPG, why did saddam and erdogan oppress them? whats going on over there? Can someone please explain it too me in the simplest language possible:confused:

A civil war broke out in Syria between the Assad regime and a coalition of anti-Assad rebels. In the course of this war the Assad regime retreated from several areas (Cantons) of the North that are predominantly Kurdish -- This area is now known as Syrian Kurdistan or Rojava. When the Assad regime retreated, it left no civil administration and the Kurdish community declared a revolution in order to try and implement the ideas of Abdullah Ocalan, who years before had established a new PKK line called Democratic Confederalism. This has meant implementing direct democratic processes, a social economy and strengthening rights for women. In defence of these advances the People's Protection Units (YPG/J) were created -- The YPJ being the women's unit. Since then, Daesh have attempted to invade these Cantons and had some success at first. This lead to an international call for volunteers and the establishment of various international brigades. Other anti-Islamist and Kurdish nationalist forces joined with the YPG/J to defend the cantons and the revolution. Over the last year, however, this coalition has opened offensives against Daesh and had a a lot of success in pushing them back. These battles continue.

[willowtooth]

So why do the NATO and EU countries consider the PKK terrorists but nobody else does? And why did they abandon Marxist Leninism? and replace it with this "democratic confederacy" and can you explain what that is?

[ComradeAllende]

So why do the NATO and EU countries consider the PKK terrorists but nobody else does? And why did they abandon Marxist Leninism? and replace it with this "democratic confederacy" and can you explain what that is?

The PKK is considered a "terrorist" organization (a militant separatist movement is more accurate, in my opinion) by NATO primarily because of Turkey's key role in the Alliance dating back to the early 50s. The same would probably go for the EU (close ties to Turkey), even though a court under EU jurisdiction refuted that decision. The UN only deals with terrorist organizations like al-Qaeda and other like-minded associates, probably because a majority of its members are more favorable to the Kurdish plight (as opposed to the EU and NATO).

I believe they abandoned Marxism-Leninism for the same reasons as most revolutionary left-wing parties did; the collapse of the Soviet Union (the chief proponent of Marxist-Leninist ideology) and a desire to remain politically relevant in an atmosphere that had grown hostile to revolutionary leftist tendencies (especially when those tendencies were associated with the totalitarianism of Stalin and his successors). Plus they probably abandoned the notion of a worldwide communist revolution and focused on gaining a nation for their Kurdish constituents.

As far as I can tell, democratic confederalism is a form of left-wing libertarianism where society is organized on a decentralized basis.

[The Feral Underclass]

So why do the NATO and EU countries consider the PKK terrorists but nobody else does?

I would assume because Turkey is an ally and they need Turkey on side because of the strategic geopolitical importance of the country.


And why did they abandon Marxist Leninism? and replace it with this "democratic confederacy" and can you explain what that is?

The pamphlet called Democratic Confederalism by Ocalan is on line. It's pretty accessible and easy to read.

[Marinaleda]

simplest way,I can tell that we have a revolution there (it is going to spread turkey) and revolution that is built by ordinary people(social masses away from rulling elites).Revolution of women,youth,labourer,indigenous people ...

[Sasha]

Decent article on the situation in Kurdish turkey and their play in Syria; http://roarmag.org/2015/08/erdogan-sacrifices-peace-to-entrench-his-own-power/

[oneday]

After ISIL's offensive in Northern Iraq in June 2014, the Kurds seized disputed parts of Northern Iraq and held off ISIL attacks, particularly in the publicized Battle of Kobani.

Kobani is in northern Syria, not Iraq, and the Syrian Kurdish area (Rojava) has the democratic confederalism movement, I don't think it is happening much in Iraqi Kurdistan.

[Sasha]

Kobani is in northern Syria, not Iraq, and the Syrian Kurdish area (Rojava) has the democratic confederalism movement, I don't think it is happening much in Iraqi Kurdistan.

no, though like said, the PKK base camps are in Iraq, but they where never really popular there outside the rather small part of the mountains they control military (in the 90's there was even a small civil war with the Barzani's who have the power in the rest of iraqi kurdistan) but their heroic stand and tactical expertise against ISIS, also in iraq (esp in the rescue operation of the yezidi's where many of the regular kurdish pershmerga militia ran in massive numbers) made them a lot more popular recently. this translates not only in a growing number of military recruits from iraqi kurdistan for the PKK and an increased amount of support for their (still small) political front but also a strengthening of the far bigger PUK who has been growing closer to the PKK and their ideas of democratic confederalism. and they are an actual threat to the corrupt regime of the barzani's.
so it seems that erdoghan and the barzani's have yet again got a tactical alliance against an common enemy, because if the PUK would affiliated with the KCK (the PKK congress that runs the affiliates in turkey, syria, iraq and iran) the barzani's could be in serious trouble which could lead to connected autonomous kurdish regions in both syria and iraq, the later of which is relatively stable and has significant oil wealth, which is a nightmare scenario for turkey