Sanders has raised $15 million in the past two months, thoughts?

[RedSeppoku]

So according to the Huffington Post, Bernie Sanders has raised quite a bit of money, a fund to the tune of $15 million. What are your thoughts on this? What do you think this is implicit of? Wish I could post the link, but I haven't posted enough yet (which I plan on changing soon :o). If someone down below would be kind enough to post the link, I would be eternally grateful.

[Sea]

shove money ------> ass

(or give it to me)

[Luís Henrique]

So according to the Huffington Post, Bernie Sanders has raised quite a bit of money, a fund to the tune of $15 million. What are your thoughts on this? What do you think this is implicit of? Wish I could post the link, but I haven't posted enough yet (which I plan on changing soon :o). If someone down below would be kind enough to post the link, I would be eternally grateful.

Well, it depends of how are those contributions distributed. If a single person or company has contributed 15 million dollars, it has a very different meaning than if 150,000 people have contributed ten dollars each.

I am also far from sure that 15 million dollars is a lot of money in the context of American Democratic primaries. Is it? How much would have Hillary Clinton raised during the same period?

Luís Henrique

[GiantMonkeyMan]

Well, it depends of how are those contributions distributed. If a single person or company has contributed 15 million dollars, it has a very different meaning than if 150,000 people have contributed ten dollars each.

I am also far from sure that 15 million dollars is a lot of money in the context of American Democratic primaries. Is it? How much would have Hillary Clinton raised during the same period?

Luís Henrique
I think I remember seeing an article online about the sources of the campaign funds for Sanders and Clinton and a lot of Sanders' money came from trade union branches whilst the majority of Clinton's was lobbying organisations but you'e right to point out that, in the grander scheme of things, $15 million isn't much. The quality of those trade unions etc I couldn't comment on.

[Luís Henrique]

Some info in CNN (http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/02/politics/bernie-sanders-fundraising/):


The aides added that the 400,000 donations came from about 250,000 individual donors. The average donation was $33.51 and 99% of donations were under $250.

We don't know how much the 1% of donations above $ 250 represent, though.

ETA: The Huffington Post (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/07/01/hillary-clinton-fundraising_n_7705636.html) says Hillary has raised 45 million dollars in roughly the same period, and that that is an all-time record, so yes, it seems that Sanders' 15 millions are not completely insignificant at all.

Luís Henrique

[VivalaCuarta]

Oxi! Good god, will this imperialist politician drop out of the race already so that we can go back to discussing serious revolutionary politics like vegan coops and cultural appropriation again?

[Comrade Jacob]

Although Bernie is just a social-democrat I would crack open a can of cider if he wins. Hopefully is will make Americans a bit more class-conscious. Here's to hoping.

[Sinister Intents]

Although Bernie is just a social-democrat I would crack open a can of cider if he wins. Hopefully is will make Americans a bit more class-conscious. Here's to hoping.

I think we're pretty doomed even if he wins. Most likely the bourgeoisie has already picked which candidate will be our head puppet in chief. Corporate interests will continue to be kept in mind and against the repressed classes. I'm sure they'll put Hillary in office because she's a part of the same corporate owned administration that dominates this country.

[Rafiq]

Bernie will not win, and cannot win. Formally, in a bourgeois democracy - he could, but so degenerate has American politics become that this is not even a slight possibility.

What sanders "aims" to do at face value, is not even possible within the confines of our existing political order, a huge political transformation would be necessary that extends beyond a new presidency. And here we are not even speaking of socialism - but strictly the modest measures he is seeking to implement. The difference with countries as Greece and Spain is the lack of a primary concentration of global (finance) capital. Hence, only the radical parties in the "oppressed" Southern European states could ever succeed at electoral politics in pertinence to holding executive power, this would not even be slightly possible in Germany or the United Kingdom.

In the United States, the United Kingdom and Germany, mass-spoilage as an expression, propagation of political independence would be the desirable aim of a militant proletariat, while tactical engagement in policy-based struggles and the direct prerogatives mediated through the bourgeois state (like the minimum wage being raised) would be a necessary reality. Spoilage, however, is only politically useful if it can be coordinated on a mass scale to the point where it would send a message, encapsulating a definite political polarization that has already taken hold. Spoilage stands as the only effective resistance to the degenerate, corrupt spectacle that is the electoral process - by abstaining from it, you express political weakness, you present yourself as being "outside" the political all together in public eyes.

But through spoilage, one invokes fear insofar as they demonstrate the ability to AFFIRMATIVELY proclaim a solid position on the matter, that of opposition, and demonstrate the political prowess of an independent proletariat. It is therefore forgivable to support Sanders as a matter of a private reservation, but in the midst of a possibility of an independent and organized working class, support for Sanders would be an unforgivable crime, not simply out of "principle" but because Sanders holistically represents a false alternative for the working people by mystifying the problem. Why? Because what Sanders proposes in the short term is, again not possible within the confines of our existing political order, Sanders is therefore purely a negative figure who even if elected would never succeed in seeing through ANY of the policies he aims at, because to vote for Sanders is not to vote for the implementation of direct measures, it is to proclaim disatisfaction with the system. The same goes for the reactionary Ron Paul - do you really think he could do half the things he claims he wants to do? No! CONTRARY to Syriza in Greece, whose emergence to power STRENGTHENS the possibility of a pan-European offensive on the austerity measures, dividing politics on class lines while AVOIDING the reactionary temptation of opposing the EU all together. For this reason there is no American Syriza, and there can never be one, for Sanders will never be able to polarize politics and mobilize enough people - the whole basis of Syriza, and Podemos' success is the avowed rejection of the austerity measures while retaining the desire to stay in the EU - but what equivalency exists in the United States? In the practical sense, not some banal aggrandizement of platitudes as the "unfairness" of the system or such vague, ambiguous concerns as "growing inequality". What does Sanders seek to do in the practical sense, and how could he - practically do it?

That being said - again, as purely a matter of strategy, support for the election of PROVINCIAL or local representatives of the working people would be desirable, because it is an excellent way of mobilizing local people in an immediate sense by appealing to issues which directly concern them.

[Sewer Socialist]

I think that having Sanders running as a reform candidate whose role is to make the Democratic Party seem exciting, welcoming, and open to reform seems to be working quite well for the party.

He's the mirror image of Ron Paul, who is doing the same thing in the Republican Party.

[Working Class Hero]

I've been campaigning for him. I'd rather have a social democrat in office than a corporate whore like Hillary. He's by no means a radical in global terms, but for the US, he's a maverick.

And then there all the people saying that he's just another capitalist politician, but you have to remember that we're not in a revolutionary situation in the US, and the working class needs to fight for every piecemeal gain we can get, whether it's a $15 minimum wage or Black Lives Matter. The worst thing his run can do is increase general knowledge of socialism and push people to the left.