Communist parties with the largest presence in the USA?

[Zanters]

So, I am looking for Marxist parties that have the largest following in the USA. Parties like the liberal CPUSA do not count...


From what I have found, it seems to be Party for Socialism and Liberation(ML), and Socialist Appeal(Trot).


Why are the Marxists so divided in the States?

[G4b3n]

Marxism never took root in the USA because of the poison that is our political culture, workers are groomed to see themselves as temporarily displaced bourgeois and told that a working class ought to exist composed of only our youth.

And there are no genuine revolutionary Marxist parties in the USA. You have a few cults and an a few liberal coalitions with lone Marxists in them.
The IWW is the only working class anti-capitalist organization worthy of support in the USA in my opinion, and very critical support at that.

[Zanters]

I was apart of the IWW. What a joke it is. It is a shadow of its former self. It is full of cringe worthy anarchists, and a bunch of pseudo-revolutionaries that know no theory and all they want to do is throw Molotov cocktails at some petit bourgeoisie's car.

I shit you not, every single person I met from my local branch was obese. Now, I don't really care if people are over weight, but I can't see anyone taking the IWW seriously with a bunch of over weight unknowledgeable people representing the working class. It just doesn't have a good vibe. Not that they represent some kind of vanguard. And they were all really nice people, just not my clique. I'd rather hang out with a bunch of tankies.


Edit: I'm an asshole, I know this.

[lutraphile]

Socialist Alternative (Trotskyist, mine)
Workers World (M-L, but also pro-North Korean)
Socialist Equality Party (Trotskyist)
Three other fairly big ones


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Communist_parties_in_the_United_States

[#FF0000]

I was apart of the IWW. What a joke it is. It is a shadow of its former self. It is full of cringe worthy anarchists, and a bunch of pseudo-revolutionaries that know no theory and all they want to do is throw Molotov cocktails at some petit bourgeoisie's car.

Huh, that hasn't been my experience in the northeast US. I also think the lack of theory is gonna be common in most of the larger Communist organizations you find because the rank-and-file are just seen as hands to hold signs and hand out papers.

Either way there really isn't a single "party" in the US that I'm a fan of. ymmv with the IWW since the culture in each branch varies pretty wildly. There's other interesting organizations like Philly Socialists out there but they're pretty much just regional things (though maybe it's worth reaching out to them and finding out how to organize something like it in your area?)


I shit you not, every single person I met from my local branch was obese. Now, I don't really care if people are over weight, but I can't see anyone taking the IWW seriously with a bunch of over weight unknowledgeable people representing the working class.

Nah, Fuck off with that, dude.

[PhoenixAsh]

Can we put large into context? The CPUSA has 20.000 members. The IWW in the US has 3400 (?!).

So large is relative.

[#FF0000]

Can we put large into context? The CPUSA has 20.000 members. The IWW in the US has 3400 (?!).

So large is relative.

I think the US is more like ~2000. Our UK branches have 1000 members.

[Os Cangaceiros]

The local IWW here that I'm a part of has a pretty diverse membership. A few wildland firefighters, a couple theater people, a couple fishermen, a chemist, a couple students, trade folks...an eclectic mixture for sure. We haven't really done much except organize a couple cultural events at the local university, though.

I'd look at what organization has the biggest presence regionally. Back when I lived in south Texas it was the ISO, for example. I would never join the ISO, though. There are also regional projects that are not parties, like Seattle Solidarity in Seattle or Worker's Defense Project in Austin, for example.

[Os Cangaceiros]

There's no communist party or "party nuclei" or whatever with any sort of real power or influence in the USA, so you're really better off just joining an organization that you share an ideological affiliation with. Most parties expect you to agree with their principles before joining (although how anal retentive they are about this varies from party to party) so basing your choice on strength in numbers is weird, especially since bragging about being the largest communist party in the USA is like bragging about being the tallest dwarf.

[Counterculturalist]

I shit you not, every single person I met from my local branch was obese.

What a trenchant, insightful analysis.

[Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages]

The size of your party also dictates the number of asinine conference calls you have to participate in, so keep that in mind. Posting on revleft might actually be more productive than being in an american communist party at this point.

Edit: Isn't the IWW is officially apolitical anyhow?

[lutraphile]

Can we put large into context? The CPUSA has 20.000 members. The IWW in the US has 3400 (?!).

So large is relative.
No question CPUSA is the best known. Just also utterly useless.

[mushroompizza]

The biggest leftist party in the U.S. is the Democratic Socialists of America, they have the attitudes of Social Democrats but at least are socialists, they also support the writings of Karl Marx.

[Broosk]

That's a good question why Marxists are divided in the US. During the Great Depression and post-World War I, left-wing activities were arguably at their peak. FDR is one factor to the left's decline, as the New Deal saved capitalism and prevented a revolution from unfolding. Because of McCarthyism, the left continued to dwindle. I suppose the left has always been divided in the US, as in many other nations, but the fact that so few people identify as radical left-wingers and are scattered across the entire US makes the differences appear larger. The left really needs to stop compromising with Democrats and unite under one party. Until then, joining a political party or voting for a socialist doesn't make much of a difference.

[#FF0000]

The biggest leftist party in the U.S. is the Democratic Socialists of America, they have the attitudes of Social Democrats but at least are socialists, they also support the writings of Karl Marx.

Don't know what you mean by "attitudes" here but they're absolutely social democrats, and not communists.


Edit: Isn't the IWW is officially apolitical anyhow?

"Apolitical" in the sense that they don't support any parties or electoral politics in general. I kind of hate the "apolitical" posturing since it strikes me as disingenuous, but yeah.

[Sewer Socialist]

sn't the IWW is officially apolitical anyhow?

Well, the membership is mostly anarchists and communists, and are syndicalists; "apolitical" in the IWW means, as far as I can tell, not taking a stance on the Russian Revolution, Rojava, elections, etc.


I was apart of the IWW. What a joke it is. It is a shadow of its former self. It is full of cringe worthy anarchists, and a bunch of pseudo-revolutionaries that know no theory and all they want to do is throw Molotov cocktails at some petit bourgeoisie's car.

I shit you not, every single person I met from my local branch was obese. Now, I don't really care if people are over weight, but I can't see anyone taking the IWW seriously with a bunch of over weight unknowledgeable people representing the working class. It just doesn't have a good vibe. Not that they represent some kind of vanguard. And they were all really nice people, just not my clique. I'd rather hang out with a bunch of tankies.


Some branches are more active than others; a good gauge of this would be to see how much of the membership belongs to locals. However, the people often denounced as "historical re-enactors" also contribute experience, knowledge, and guidance to newer membership - the people who join from a specific campaign, and your "cringe-worthy anarchists". I think the biggest source of membership is the latter two, who come and go quite a bit.

I haven't been a Wob in a few years, but I joined from a campaign in my industry at the time, and probably a "cringe-worthy anarchist" and left with much more knowledge and experience. People aren't born with good politics, you know.

As far as obesity, they seem pretty proportionate to the working class they are part of, and please do fuck off with your shitty anti-fat politics.


Huh, that hasn't been my experience in the northeast US. I also think the lack of theory is gonna be common in most of the larger Communist organizations you find because the rank-and-file are just seen as hands to hold signs and hand out papers.

This is unfortunately true. How can communist parties do a better job of bringing their rank-and-file into the fold and passing on their knowledge experience?

I am not currently part of any group, because they don't seem to do much. I went to an ISO discussion on the Russian Civil War, and they were mostly there to listen, and not ask questions. When I had specific questions, no one really answered them, and eventually went on with what was more or less a lecture.

[Mr. Piccolo]

I'd rather work with traditional unions than most of the "Left" groups in the United States. Even if they are business unions they do sometimes score some concrete victories for their members (although it is rare these days) and some of them are cognizant of the need to be more than just trade unions for their members, which means fighting for larger causes that will benefit all workers like a higher minimum wage and universal healthcare.

If there were any serious left-wing organizations in the U.S., it would probably be dangerous to join them for two reasons. First, if your membership was discovered, it would perhaps prevent you from finding or keeping gainful employment (employers now regularly look at your "online footprint"). Second is the reality that the U.S. government spies on its citizens and any serious left-wing group would likely arouse government suspicion.

I don't think too many American workers really want to be part of a movement that seems to be going nowhere and has no chance of success while putting their livelihood in jeopardy. This is why any serious change is likely to come out of Europe where there is still some spirit of rebellion, a stronger identity as workers as opposed to temporarily embarrassed millionaires, and some powerful organizational structure on the ground, at least compared to the United States.

[#FF0000]

I'd rather work with traditional unions than most of the "Left" groups in the United States

Have you actually worked with traditional unions, though?

[Zanters]

I apologize for the anti-fat logic. Not really much I can do to protect myself, I know it is pretty ignorant.


And the IWW branch was very new in my area, so that might make a difference too. And yes, they are a pan-leftist organization, so expecting them to all be communist is faulty logic.

For example, they had an advertisement for my local branch, and it was for railroad workers. Cool, huh? Except they edited the workers out with a furries. Now, if furries are your thing, that is cool, but shouldn't that be left behind when you are representing an entire group of people?

[#FF0000]

For example, they had an advertisement for my local branch, and it was for railroad workers. Cool, huh? Except they edited the workers out with a furries. Now, if furries are your thing, that is cool, but shouldn't that be left behind when you are representing an entire group of people?

Hahaha I know the one you're talking about. To be fair I think they were just going for a mascot. I don't think most folks would see that and immediately think "furry".

[Mr. Piccolo]

Have you actually worked with traditional unions, though?

Yes. I used to work as a teacher. I feel that teacher's unions tend to be a little more radical than some of the more traditional blue-collar unions. None of them are revolutionary but they do some good work on the ground. The Chicago Teachers Union is a good example.

[Zanters]

I am giving the IWW another go. Maybe I can stop being a cock.

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

Most parties expect you to agree with their principles before joining (although how anal retentive they are about this varies from party to party) so basing your choice on strength in numbers is weird, especially since bragging about being the largest communist party in the USA is like bragging about being the tallest dwarf.

This isn't really a criticism of you personally, but I never understood why people object to this (groups expecting you to agree with their principles before joining). But yeah, playing the numbers game makes no sense. The biggest "parties", in the US and everywhere else, are those that publish a paper full of revolutionary bluster and otherwise quietly support liberal or social-democratic politicians.

From what I understand (I don't live in the US), the IWW is at this point divided between a reenactment society and a "red" union that sometimes organises workers other unions don't want to organise. So there is a lot to criticise, but its members being fat is not one of those things, I mean have you seen what workers look like? They're (sometimes) fat, old, disabled, sick, etc. etc., if you want finely-sculpted Apolonian Stakhanovites look at a porno site, not a factory.

[SonofRage]

I shit you not, every single person I met from my local branch was obese. Now, I don't really care if people are over weight, but I can't see anyone taking the IWW seriously with a bunch of over weight unknowledgeable people representing the working class.

Edit: I'm an asshole, I know this.

Umm...have you seen the working class? In the U.S., a lot of us are obese (https://www.yahoo.com/health/most-u-s-adults-are-now-overweight-or-obese-122256997338.html). Also, the IWW certainly isn't looking to "represent" the working class. I do agree though that it's a mixed bag. There is no perfect organization though and you can certainly do a lot worse than the IWW. The only reason I'm no longer a member is that I have some say in hiring and firing at my workplace so I'm no longer eligible for membership.



The biggest leftist party in the U.S. is the Democratic Socialists of America, they have the attitudes of Social Democrats but at least are socialists, they also support the writings of Karl Marx.

They are not a "party" actually. Some are definitely social democrats, some of further left. If you look at the folks at the Jacobin for example, there is definitely a "left wing" of the DSA.