Donetsk PR and Luhansk PR

[Comrade Jacob]

What are your thoughts? Are they people's republics? Don't say "muh social-imperialism!!!!"

[Comrade Jacob]

I think they are many communists within their ranks and they are defending their region from fascists.

[Armchair Partisan]

Yes, they are People's Republics, as they are named as such. Whatever that means is another question. They are, by definition, republics, although of course they aren't socialist, nor are they dominated by elements sympathetic to socialism.


I think they are many communists within their ranks and they are defending their region from fascists.

This statement may also be true by itself (as "many" is sufficiently vague), yet it means nothing in the grand scheme of things.

P.S.: muh social-imperialism!!!!

[JayBro47]

We need to support Self-Determination for both the Russified East and the Ukrainian West. I was talking to my friend about how to unite those who dislike the EU/WEST and those who dislike Russia/East. So neither "play into the other hand."

And the key is to find those who historically were anti-Russian and are now angry at the West/their modern situation.

This includes Eastern Europeans. They hate Russia historically for it's Imperialism and for it's Social-Imperialism, but don't like this privatized, post-Cold War situation either. An interesting example would be the Mujaheedin. They were anti-Russia but also anti-West.

Think Communist Romania for one. http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/question-of-the-day-would-you-vote-for-ceausescu

I spoke to an Italian Conservative/Reactionary, saying he'd support NATO against USSR, but now wants it dismantled since Cold War is over and because of the West's Filthy Culture, etc.

the only people who support Russia are the Russians in Eastern Ukraine tbh :laugh:

[Antiochus]

It isn't "social imperialism",because Russia isn't umm even remote "Socialist". Most of the rebels are themselves proto-fascists little different from the nazis in Ukraine (who are small in number, although I don't know how much influence they have in the government).

Also, most Russians who support such an incursion don't do it because they are "fighting fascism" but rather "Western decadence" (a very common media term there) which is:

1) Women's rights
2) Homosexuality
3) Multiculturism

I know one of the leaders of the Republics (or ex-leader) was an openly declared neo-nazi. So yeah...

[Tim Cornelis]

God damn it. I typed a whole thing, and then this fokking laptop had to go back to the previous page. Well then, here we go again.

Many Stalinists mistakenly believe there is strong communist involvement in Novorossiya/New Russia. This belief is rooted in the use of Soviet symbolism by Russian nationalist forces and groups. Soviet symbolism in Russian political culture is associated with Soviet nationalism as much as it is with Soviet socialism. Its use is therefore no indication in and of itself of affinity with socialism. This can't be stressed enough.

The leadership of Novorossiya is virtually entirely made up of Russian nationalists and ultra-nationalists. We can discern three camps: the red camp, the white camp, and the brown camp.

The red camp:


The red involvement refers to those elements basing themselves on Soviet memory and nostalgia. The red elements emphasise opposition to oligarchs and the reassertion of Russia as international powerhouse (similar to palingenetic ultranationalism). This faction includes national-Stalinists such as Alexander Prokhanov as well as National-Bolsheviks such as the first naturalised citizen Aijo Beness.[38]

Prokhanov, known for being the editor of the far-right magazine Zavtra, stated that "all the current military elites of Novorossiya are authors of my newspapers, Den and Zavtra.…These people are like my younger brothers."[39] The most notable members of the Zavtra-connection are Igor Girkin, former defence minister of the DPR, and former head of state Alexander Borodai. Both are or were contributors to the Zavtra magazine. [40]

This camp uses Soviet symbolism but not because they are communists.

The white camp:

"The white element emphasises (ultra)conservative values such as political Orthodoxy, religiosity, and Czarism". This camp uses symbolism of Czarism. Oligarch Maloveef is associated with this camp. His associates include Borodai and Dugin.

The brown camp:

"The brown element is the most overt fascist element. It calls for a totalitarian national rebirth and revolution. Many, although not all, ultra-nationalists of this type are reluctant about New Russia joining Russia to form an empire: they consider Russia to be too corrupt, and under control of a Zionist mafia.

Alexander Dugin is the main representative of this element."

There's a lot of overlap between these camps, we see people associated with National-Bolshevism (e.g. Motorolla) use Czarist symbolism:

The flag of his battalion:
http://marxistpedia.mwzip.com/w/images/7/71/Flag_of_the_Sparta_Battalion.svg.png

And we see associates of 'white' Maloveef being 'red' and 'brown'.

Remember that fascist academic Alexander Dugin is the intellectual and spiritual founding father of Novorossiya and that the project of Novorossiya is based on nationalism (ultra-nationalism), expansionism, fascism, and imperialism.

There's basically no communist or Stalinist involvement with Novorossiya except for Spanish volunteers whom have mistaken Soviet symbolism for support of the Soviet Union. These foreign volunteers seem to be outnumbered by far-right foreign volunteers that are fighting for Novorossiya.

Also, many far-right observers active in Novorossiya to observe the elections:


On September 2, 2014, Novorossiya held parliamentary and presidential elections. Various parties have been barred from participation due to supposed administrative errors in registering, including the Communist Party of the Donetsk People's Republic and the New Russia Party. Consequently, no opposition party participated in the Donetsk general elections.

Observers from the following right-wing and far-right groups observed the elections and concluded that they were free and fair: Belgian “Parti communautaire national-européen (extreme right/National Bolshevik) / EODE”; Italian “Forza Italia (right-wing)”; Belgian “Vlaams Belang (extreme right)”; “Liberal-Democratic Party of Russia (extreme right)”; “Serbian Progressive Party (rightwing)”; Hungarian “Jobbik (extreme right)”; “Movement for Serbia (extreme right)”; German “Zuerst! (far right journal)”; “Rassemblement bleu Marine (radical right)”; Bulgarian “Ataka (extreme right)”; German “Die Reformkonservativen (right-wing)”; “No to Brussels – Popular Democracy (ultra-nationalist)”; Russian “Motherland (extreme right)”. In addition to these various right-wing and far-right parties, the “Communist Party of Greece (extreme left/Stalinist)” and “Communist Party of the Russian Federation (ultranationalist/ Stalinist)” sent observers. The observation mission itself was headed by the 'Eurasian Observatory of Democracy and Elections (EODE)', chaired by Belgian Luc Michel, and the 'European Centre for Geopolitical Analysis (ECGA)' headed by pan-Slavic right-wing extremist Mateusz Piskorski. Michel was formerly a member of the French neo-Nazi group 'Fédération d'action nationaliste et européenne' and is currently a National-Bolshevik and sympathiser of the social-chauvinist 'Communist Party of the Russian Federation'

http://marxistpedia.mwzip.com/wiki/Novorossiya

Of course, this does not mean we should support Kiev.

[Rurkel]

There's basically no communist or Stalinist involvement with Novorossiya except for Spanish volunteers whom have mistaken Soviet symbolism for support of the Soviet Union. These foreign volunteers seem to be outnumbered by far-right foreign volunteers that are fighting for Novorossiya.

There's also the Borotba organization, who supports the rebellion and is responsible for quite a lot of foreign left-wing support for DNR/LNR. Their publicists' preferred MO on websites other than their own is to (justly, most of the time) bash Kiev, while leaving the rebels alone. The rebels being on the defensive most of the time also made them look better than they are (it ensured that the majority of civilian victims would be killed by their opponents).


Of course, this does not mean we should support Kiev.
As for Kiev, the people in power there are not fascists, but they keep accommodating fascists (fairly classic scenario of tension-and-collaboration between old money technocrats and the far-right, although with the passing of the anti-communist law the collaboration tendency seems to be prevailing).

[Left Voice]

It's crazy how so much of the left is buying into the idea of supporting Novorossiya as a form of 'anti-fascism'. I mentioned this in another topic, but the 'Anarcho-Communism' page on Facebook seems to have a fetish for the separatists. They're currently mourning the death of Aleksey Mozgovoy, who was quoted as saying:


If tomorrow I see in a cafe, in a pub even one young lady, she will be arrested ... А woman should be the guardian of the hearth, the mother. And what kind of mothers do they become after pubs? ... A woman should stay in the house baking pirozhki and only celebrate [meaning "drink" in this context] on the International Women's Day. It is time to remember that you are Russian! It is time to get your spirituality back!

Not my comrade, as the saying goes. And I don't think he'd claim to be either. I'm sure there are genuine fascists on the Ukrainian side, but I've not seen any evidence than the ultranationalists on the Novorossiya side are any less reactionary. To portray the conflict in Novorossiya as some kind of anti-fascist campaign is at best delusional.

[Tim Cornelis]

He was being ironic/cynical as far as I know. In a popular trial of a (suspected) rapist, one man in the public arena was victim blaming saying the woman was at fault or something for being in such a [public] space. To which Mozgovoy said, basically, oh well, if that's the case we will arrest all women that are in public, in restaurants, etc. (well the quote above). At least, that's how I understand the quote.

==
As for Borotba, Borotoba now accepts private enterprise as part of socialism. Also, Borotba has zero power. Not one of their members is in any position of influence.

[tuwix]

We need to support Self-Determination for both the Russified East and the Ukrainian West.


And self-determination of Putin's tanks too? :D
To be honest, nobody asked the people where they want to remain. And referendums under Putin's guns are just farce...



Think Communist Romania for one.

First of all, read a little bit of Marx before starting to use a word 'communist' not to write such idiocy and oxymoron as 'communist Romania'...

[Antiochus]

I think these idiots that go around labelling Romania and N.Korea as "Socialist/Communist" are bigger enemies than many of the capitalist media. I mean, if I am an average worker with not a lot of time in my hands and I happen to hear one of these idiots saying "We need to be more like North Korea" I would just be creeped out.

[Asero]

For almost twenty years of Ukraine’s independence, the term “antifascism” used to have very limited currency in the established political discourse in Ukraine. Until 2010, “antifascism” was primarily used as a form of self-identification by an element of Ukraine’s left-wing movement, as well as being employed by the far right groupuscules to refer to their left-wing opponents. Hence, until 2010-2011, “antifascism” remained a notion that largely belonged to the subcultural sphere of the physical and symbolical strife between left-wing and far right activists.
Yet when the notion of antifascism did enter the mainstream political discourse in Ukraine, it immediately became extremely problematic. The problematic nature of the notion had little to do with what “antifascism” essentially implied – that is opposition to fascism – but resulted from the manipulated use of the notion of antifascism in the post-Soviet space in general and Ukraine in particular.

The manipulated use of “antifascism” has been increasingly prominent in Russia since Vladimir Putin’s second presidential term (2004-2008). During the “Orange revolution” in Ukraine, when hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians protested against the fraudulent “victory” of pro-Russian politician Viktor Yanukovych in the 2004 presidential election, pro-Yanukovych media in Ukraine and pro-Kremlin media in Russia slammed the leaders of the largely pro-European “orange” protest movement as “orange fascists”. To oppose the virtual threat of an “orange revolution” in Russia itself, the Presidential Administration launched the Youth Democratic Antifascist Movement “Ours” (Nashi). The imagery of the movement drew extensively on the legacy of the Soviet Union: the prevalence of the red colour, Soviet-style slogans, and even their official website was registered in .su domain (.su was originally assigned to the Soviet Union).

These events reveal the basic argument behind the manipulated use of the notions of both fascism and antifascism in Russia. Since it is the Kremlin’s geopolitical belief that particular sovereign post-Soviet states belong to the Russian sphere of influence, Moscow interprets post-Soviet sovereign countries’ attempts to move away from this sphere as anti-Russian actions. As the Kremlin also adopts the political cult of the “Victory in the Great Patriotic War” seen as the struggle between the Soviets and fascists, as well as drawing on the Soviet legacy of defining fascism as anticommunism and equating it with Anti-Sovietism, Moscow tends to interpret the perceived anti-Russian sentiment as fascist too. Hence, the term “antifascism”, in its manipulated interpretation, implies an opposition to the perceived geopolitical threats that Putin’s regime allegedly faces.

It was in a similarly distorted interpretation that the notion of antifascism entered the mainstream Ukrainian political discourse in 2010-2011. This development was associated with three major events. First, in the beginning of 2010 Viktor Yanukovych was elected president of Ukraine, adopted pro-Russian foreign policy and started suppressing political opponents. Second, the same year, Russian politician and businessman Boris Spiegel, who had close ties to the Kremlin, founded, in Kyiv, the World without Nazism organisation (WWN). Third, in 2011, Vadym Kolesnichenko, Yanukovych’s major ally, launched the International Antifascist Front (IAF).

While both organisations, i.e. the WWN and IAF, officially aimed at fighting against xenophobia, racism and glorification of Nazi crimes, their real objectives were different. The WWN promoted the Russian version of history of the twentieth century, advanced Russian foreign policy and tried to influence public opinion in former Soviet republics. The IAF, in its turn, organised protests against the political opposition to Yanukovych. Originally, the IAF attacked the far right Svoboda party that was critical of Yanukovych, but since Svoboda strategically sided with the democratic opposition, the latter was attacked too. Therefore, the protests held by the “antifascist” organisation against the entire political opposition to Yanukovych aimed at discrediting it as “fascist”. The IAFG adopted this tactic from the Russian Nashi movement that attacked, from the “antifascist” positions, all the opponents of Putin.

The activities of the WWN and IAF resulted in a conceptual conflict between the original definition of antifascism as a struggle against racism and right-wing extremism practiced by Ukrainian left-wing activists and the implicitly manipulated interpretation that implied promotion of Russian interests in Ukraine. The Ukrainian anti-authoritarian left-wing movement, due to its political weakness, failed to defend their interpretation of the notion. Especially after pro-Russian media and commentators started describing the “People’s Republics” in separatist-held areas of Eastern Ukraine as antifascist “states” fighting against the “Kyiv fascist junta”, the term “antifascism” became completely discredited. Today, Ukrainian left-wing activists have almost abandoned the use of the term in the public discourse and tend to talk about the struggle against racism, intolerance and political terror.
http://anton-shekhovtsov.blogspot.com/2015/03/the-uneasy-reality-of-antifascism-in.html

The author is a Ukrainian-EU apologist, but the statement still stands.

[willowtooth]

I think it is an anti fascist movement at its core

[Atsumari]

I think it is an anti fascist movement at its core
The irony here is that there are more fascists on the pro-Russia side than the Ukrainian side. In Ukraine, the far-right parties, both Right Sector and Svoboda are fringed whereas the Whites, Russian nationalists, and Dugin's Eurasianists are all representative of the current Novorossiya government. Persecution of religious minorities, homophobia, anti-Ziganism, anti-Semitism, and ethnic persecution is something fascists are known for.
Anti-Imperialist Action is certainly naive in thinking that they are engaged in national liberation against Russia and is ultimately aiding the EU/NATO, but at least most of their enemies are fascists and nationalists whereas the enemy of Novorossiya is a ideologically corrupt liberal government.
Timmy made a pretty good argument explaining why Novorossiya can be categorized as the latest fascist state.
http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=19169

And before people ask why we do not criticize the Ukrainian government, it's because there is very little disagreement on how we should feel towards them whereas many of the left have the unfortunate tendency to fall into the trap of supporting a movement that is certainly not leftist in its very nature.

[willowtooth]

The irony here is that there are more fascists on the pro-Russia side than the Ukrainian side. In Ukraine, the far-right parties, both Right Sector and Svoboda are fringed whereas the Whites, Russian nationalists, and Dugin's Eurasianists are all representative of the current Novorossiya government. Persecution of religious minorities, homophobia, anti-Ziganism, anti-Semitism, and ethnic persecution is something fascists are known for.
Anti-Imperialist Action is certainly naive in thinking that they are engaged in national liberation against Russia and is ultimately aiding the EU/NATO, but at least most of their enemies are fascists and nationalists whereas the enemy of Novorossiya is a ideologically corrupt liberal government.
Timmy made a pretty good argument explaining why Novorossiya can be categorized as the latest fascist state.
http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=19169

And before people ask why we do not criticize the Ukrainian government, it's because there is very little disagreement on how we should feel towards them whereas many of the left have the unfortunate tendency to fall into the trap of supporting a movement that is certainly not leftist in its very nature.

I apologize if I have offended your ideology, but I cant help but think of the teenager picking up a RPG and shooting a nazi in the face in the battle fields of slovyansk, before i think about the bickerings of old men in the office buildings in the capital city of donetsk, I am sorry maybe that's just me?:ohmy:

[Atsumari]

What?

[lutraphile]

I have difficulty believing that the Donestk PR is not backed by most Communists in the region- indeed, there are videos of them rising the Soviet flag and (far more encouragingly in my opinion) singing The Internationale (https://youtu.be/RJLnoeVUqKA?t=43s) after their victories.

Having said that, I agree that the republics' main purpose seems to be puppet states of Putin, who has far from a left-wing agenda. Still, the fight against the EU and the nostalgia for the goal of socialism is very encouraging.

[Sasha]

New labour here in the netherlands still sings the internationale... Ugh, what is it with people on this board and their inability to look for one moment beyong imagery and sloganism to the actual politics?!? Oh, but Assad says, look the Kims have, internationale! Red flag! Hammer! Sickle!
No one here would for one second believe the democratic party is democratic or that labour has any care about the workers yet slap on some soviet nostalgia and a few anti-imp slogans out of a bit of geo-political posturing and half the board gets confused...

[Antiochus]

Tell me, do you people (idiots) malfunction when you see, GASP: National SOCIALISM as the official name of the Nazi party? Do your circuits immediately launch themselves into a vitriolic and spirited defense of them from the real Allied fascists?

Even if we argue that the USSR was socialist, the most popular symbols of the DPR besides your average hammer and sickle are fucking Russian IMPERIAL FLAGS and portraits of the TSARS. Let me guess, the Tsars were socialist?

[lutraphile]

New labour here in the netherlands still sings the internationale... Ugh, what is it with people on this board and their inability to look for one moment beyong imagery and sloganism to the actual politics?!? Oh, but Assad says, look the Kims have, internationale! Red flag! Hammer! Sickle!
No one here would for one second believe the democratic party is democratic or that labour has any care about the workers yet slap on some soviet nostalgia and a few anti-imp slogans out of a bit of geo-political posturing and half the board gets confused...
I am not backing them, I get that they are reactionary in nature. But at the same time, I do think they have the backing of the left, mostly due to Soviet nostalgia (if not for the economics, for the political power). They could hardly not, with Ukraine effectively banning the Communist party.

[willowtooth]

What?

I read timmy's writings about the rightwing in novorussia, and it is a great read, but he is also attempting to define fascism (something many have pointed out before cannot be done) in an uncommon way as seperate from nazism and white nationalism, which he says

"Some key individuals in the leadership of 'Novorossiya', including elected Prime Minister … , cannot be identified as ultra-nationalists and have not made known statements from which such sympathies can be inferred. The situation in 'Novorossiya' is unclear in many regards, and the internal distribution of power is … . This makes it difficult to make definite statements about the nature of 'Novorossiya', and indeed we should be careful to. It should be clear that it is an expansionist nationalist project, regardless of the precise specifications of its nationalism. ".

their are many people involved in the war in ukraine on both sides, but as you said it would be very unlikely too see a kiev supporter on this forum for good reason.

I hope nobody is suggesting that because DPR aren't communist than they can't fight the nazis in the ukraine, the USA, the British fought the nazis in ww2, and they had "imperial insignia's" as well.

you should support novorussia in the same sense you support those that defeated the nazis in WW2.

it is antifascist at its core, yet there are ultranationalist and even russian nazis running around in east ukraine. I view that fact, in the same sense that OWS had a whole lot of neo nazis, ultra nationalists, right wing libertarians, running around.

OWS was anti-capitalist at its core, some people simply tried to turn it into something it wasn't


Lets imagine OWS evolved to the point that maidan protests did, if a bunch of nazis who showed up at an OWS rally, and started beating up jews, people would scream "OWS anti semitic", if a bunch of people tried to kick out the homosexuals from the movement people would scream homophobia and so on and so forth.

most of the accusations of bigotry and anti semitism, are from small crowds and individual small groups. they dont represent novorussia anymore than neo nazis represented OWS. There is alot of arguments about what novorussia stands for, and I imagine all the folks who picked up machine guns to fight all had their own little idea of what the movement would be.

There is very little known about whats going on in east ukraine, with both western and Russian media outlets stretching the truth when their not outright lying. For example kiev government started a hoax about jews in east ukraine being forced to "register" with the police

That said it seems they are highly nationalistic towards russia, they have declared the russian orthodox church a state religion, and seem to be national bolsheviks at the very best

while the kiev junta is tearing down statue of lenin, kidnapping jews and minorities and carving them up, and banning communism.

[Sasha]

I am not backing them, I get that they are reactionary in nature. But at the same time, I do think they have the backing of the left, mostly due to Soviet nostalgia (if not for the economics, for the political power). They could hardly not, with Ukraine effectively banning the Communist party.

But the points we are trying to get across is; what makes you think that the communist party of ukraine (or any other hamer and sickle waver in that country) has anything to do with "the left"? The CPU (like all CP's in the former soviet states) is a through and through reactionary chauvenist and corrupt waste of existence. And the only person falling for cheap appeal on Ostalgia is you and other usefull idiots.

[Rurkel]

it is antifascist at its core, yet there are ultranationalist and even russian nazis running around in east ukraine. I view that fact, in the same sense that OWS had a whole lot of neo nazis, ultra nationalists, right wing libertarians, running around.
The various winguts in the rebellious republics, however, are in the leadership positions, with the local leftists being their tail. Not really comparable to the OWS.



while the kiev junta is tearing down statue of lenin, kidnapping jews and minorities and carving them up, and banning communism.
As much as I despise Kiev, they haven't been in the business of carving up Jews for now.

[lutraphile]

But the points we are trying to get across is; what makes you think that the communist party of ukraine (or any other hamer and sickle waver in that country) has anything to do with "the left"? The CPU (like all CP's in the former soviet states) is a through and through reactionary chauvenist and corrupt waste of existence. And the only person falling for cheap appeal on Ostalgia is you and other usefull idiots.

I am no fan of the UPC–CPSU, and know they are both socially conservative and filled with lots of nationalist rhetoric, but I still think that the left in those countries almost entirely supports them.

[Sasha]

I think you have an entirely different concept of what "the left" is than me, al leftist i know from russia and other east-block countries consider all official communist parties as irrelevant historical reenactment societies at best and one tier below the ultra orthodox and neo nazis at worst.

[Mr. Piccolo]

The mixture of Soviet symbols and traditional Russian nationalism has been around for a long time. In the 1990s communists and nationalists opposed Yeltsin's liberal capitalist government. You can see people waving the Soviet flag and the Imperial tricolor in this video from a 1993 anti-Yeltsin protest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Qvvbj7L-gJU

Russian leftists tend to be more patriotic than their Western counterparts so I do not have a problem with some combinations of Soviet nostalgia, Russian patriotism, and socialism. I think it certainly has its place.

What disturbs me about the eastern Ukrainian rebels is that there seems to be a reactionary element that goes beyond mere patriotism.

Czarists, Duginists, and radical Orthodox Christians seem to have some presence among the rebels. As bad as some of the western Ukrainian groups are (and some are really awful fascists) I was dismayed by some eastern Ukrainians who have used terms like "Papists" and "Uniates" to describe western Ukrainians. These are pejorative terms for Ukrainian Catholics.

[lutraphile]

I think you have an entirely different concept of what "the left" is than me, al leftist i know from russia and other east-block countries consider all official communist parties as irrelevant historical reenactment societies at best and one tier below the ultra orthodox and neo nazis at worst.
I don't like them at all. But the average socialist is not posting on forums on socialist theory. They are, in name even if you don't think in ideology (I'd call them vaguely left-wing but with several problematic stances) a socialist party in a country that has been forced incredibly far right, and for that reason I think those most sympathetic to leftist politics support them. We should defend them while still pointing out their numerous shortcomings.

[renalenin]

Those who criticise the Peoples' Republics are too fast to write off groups of people in the midst of a horrible civil war. In recent interviews just before his murder Alexei Mozgovoi spoke of the corruption there but also of the hope of good comrades.

In Kirovsk the relationship of Ghost with the local mayor, as they say, is not optimum.

Yes, he does not like us: we exposed his illegal financial transactions. And besides, most of the work in the city was led by our battalion – determining assistance to refugees, helping people. The mayor only wrote reports. And every day he also demanded money from us.


That is from an interview uploaded on Russia Insider, May 1, 2015.


A week later in another interview is this:



Alexei Mozgovoi: I think we should use this opportunity to talk about what’s happening in our region and receive support from like-minded people. We understand that the media — and not only Ukrainian — distorts everything. We know that Ukrainian channels never tell the truth about what is happening in Donbass. In Europe, I think, it’s the same thing. This meeting, this congress, opens up the opportunity to the people who came here by themselves — on their own, I emphasize, of their own free will, because we did not know them before, and didn’t invite them — to see firsthand how we live here, what we’re doing, what’s actually happening, both in Alchevsk and the Donbass. Journalists, too.
Yes, there was pressure on us. But we held the meeting, nevertheless. I want our guests to have the opportunity to talk to local people, to see how we live, our problems and our work. This is how we can learn from each other. That’s why I supported the event. We are all free and live on liberated land. The monuments to Lenin are not being demolished here, and no one prohibits red flags or the hammer and sickle.
We are sharing our experiences, learning many new things. We were just talking about the civil war in Greece and what really happened.


And also:




LIVA: What did you think of Banda Bassotti’s concert? Did you like it?

AM: I heard songs that were familiar to me from the Soviet era. I heard songs of the Italian partisans. And you’ve probably seen how many residents of Alchevsk came to the concert, and how they cheered the songs. It was a real holiday for the city.


Surely in the ruins of the war we can see sparks of communist life.


:hammersickle::hammersickle::hammersickle:

[Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages]

The sparks of communist life are seen in any crisis. In a moment of crisis, ideology can be pierced and we can see things as they really are for a short time. but its just a moment and it holds no inherent significance. The "disaster communism" here in the US following hurricane sandy has not produced a revolutionary movement or spirit. We can assume that a bitter ethnic struggle tied up with competing empires will not fare any better.

[rufus magister]

Glad to see someone mentioning the late, lamented Mozgovoi. I find the coverage over at Red Star over Donbass very useful for keeping up to date with leftist activities in Novorossiya.

Given the bad odor imputed to socialism after the fall of the Union, one should not be surprised that other tendencies, more appropriate to a restored capitalist economy, should be more popular. Mozgovoi hoped that dethroning the Ukrainian oligarchy could be extended to the whole of the Russian Federation.

[rufus magister]

Here in the United States, the left-liberal nation had an article that discussed that notorious incident. Your understanding of it is correct. I likely bookmarked it, and can dig it up if you like.

[Tim Cornelis]

I've attached a PDF to this post which goes into detail to show the various fascist forces in action in Novorossiya. The pillar of support of Novorossiya is fascist. The author recognises three types of ultranationalism: red or soviet ultranationalism (most prominent thread and representative is the Zavtra-connection, a far-right, anti-semitic 'Stalinist' magazine), which is basically national-Bolshevism. She recognises a white current, they promote orthodox religion, are ultra-conservative, or rather, reactionaries. And a brown current, the most overt fascists, among them neo-nazis such as Kolovrat division, and the neo-nazi Russian National Unity, which recently retreated -- which may be a sign that they don't have the manpower. They have a common goal: the restoration of a Russian Empire, based on the 'Soviet Empire' or Czarist Empire.

If support for ISIS gets you banned for fascism, less controversially even, you should be banned for supporting Novorossiya.

Alexander Khodakovsky is the only leftist commander that I know of. And he incidentally denies that Kiev is a fascist junta, and says Kiev uses fascists but isn't fascist itself -- which is correct. He also isn't too popular for this.

Oh by the way, the leader of Lugansk People's Republic:

"n June 2015, Plotnitsky told an audience at a Russian university that Ukraine's Euromaidan revolution was masterminded by a cabal of Jews, and that the name "Euromaidan" was really "Evreimaidan", which translates from Russian to 'Jewmaidan'. He also referred to President Poroshenko as "Valtzman", which was his father's surname. He also said: "I have nothing against the Jews as a people". Jewish leaders commenting on his remarks agreed they were anti-Semitic. The Anti-Defamation League also condemned Plotnitsky"

You will also frequently encounter talk of the 'Zionist-backed nazi regime' and 'Zionazis' to refer to the Ukrainian nationalists. This isn't an antifascist struggle, it's a struggle between imperialist camps, with fascists used as battering rams on both sides.

[Rudolf]

If support for ISIS gets you banned for fascism, less controversially even, you should be banned for supporting Novorossiya.



Omg yes! Interestingly i think this could result in more bannings as from what i've seen is lefties are more prone to support Novorossiya than ISIS.