Categorizing the Left [Archive]

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Guardia Rossa

19th April 2015, 08:04

Has anyone ever done a serious attempt at categorizing the socialist ideologies? Is there any site with a political spectrum solely of the left?

Tim Cornelis

19th April 2015, 11:07

I made an attempt with a spectrum, but that loses some of the nuance in the simplification:

http://marxistpedia.mwzip.com/wiki/Political_spectrum

Also this:
http://marxistpedia.mwzip.com/wiki/List_of_internal_debates

Cliff Paul

19th April 2015, 14:05

I lol'd at Juche just appearing out of nowhere

ckaihatsu

19th April 2015, 23:34

[3] Ideologies & Operations -- Fundamentals

http://s6.postimg.org/6omx9zh81/3_Ideologies_Operations_Fundamentals.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/cpkm723u5/full/)

Comrade Jacob

12th June 2015, 19:35

As much as Juche should be more grounded in Marxism-Leninism it should not just be carelessly thrown into the far-right, that lacks all serious analysis and goes "Oh no! Not those scary Kims with their statues and their portraits and shit, we aren't like them, infact we are the opposite!!!1!!!!!!!!!!!1111!1!"

Tim Cornelis

12th June 2015, 20:27

And on what basis do you judge that no serious analysis has went into that categorisation? I have elaborated on this elsewhere, and as I recall you ignored it. The left-right spectrum is based around social equality. The more to the left, the more social equality, the more to the right, the less social equality - roughly. On this basis Stalinism is on the left, as was the USSR, since, despite a privileged stratum existing, it encouraged women to do the same work as men, and had a large degree of wage- and income equality. This is not true for North Korea at all. And North Korea's relation to Stalinism is quite opportunistic, using the Stalinist form instrumentally for its ethnic chauvinist politics. Not surprisingly, and not coincidentally, emphasis on Stalinism has decreased significantly ever since it could not exploit geopolitical competition between the USA and USSR.

The far-right is when the state, or any such authoritative body, promotes and cements social inequality to an extreme extent. Fascism, for this reason, is on the far-right because it promotes inequality between men and women, they have to conform to traditional gender roles, it promotes inequality in that it historically slashed workers' wages, and it promotes traditional hierarchies and obedience to authority.

North Korea also falls in the far-right category. In North Korea, social inequality is actively promoted by the state. For instance,

social inequality in the class system:

"North Korea, aside from conventional class structures, has a supplementary system of social stratification named 'songbun'. Songbun determines the social position and status of an individual based on ancestry, socio-economic, and political (family) background. The Songbun system has been likened to a caste system fusing Confucianism and Stalinism.[2]

The songbun system tried to invert the former class system, placing religious people, alleged spies and Japanese collaborators and such in lowest category among three. The system follows a three generation rule, which also applies for criminals sentenced to labour camps. Classification is recorded in a comprehensive resident registration system, despite the songbun system not existing legally.[3]

The songbun system categorises people into three groups with 51 sub-classifications. The top (category in the pyramid, including the North Korean elite, is permitted to live in the capital Pyongyang. Lower categories are barred from entry, and entering Pyongyang unauthorised will result in deportation. It is estimated that roughly 28% of the population is in the top classification (within which there is en elite sub-classification that dominate politically and economically); 45% in the basic or middle classification; and 27% in the lowest classification.[4]

The social position in the songbun hierarchy determines the degree of career opportunities (especially military and party careers) enjoyed, as well as access to commodities such as food rations. It is also used by security forces and police, using colour-coded files based on the social status in the songbun system. The sentencing for crimes is informed by the social position in the sungbun of the (alleged) perpetrator."

Social inequality between genders:

"The North Korean government claims that the emancipation of women has been completed.

Korean culture is "deeply embedded with Confucian values. Traditional Confucian ideology ties a women’s ‘virtue’ to how well she obeys her father in her youth, her husband in marriage and her son upon her husband’s death." Traditional moral values such as this regarding women persist. Unequal income in favour of men and extreme militarisation have helped cement these traditional values. Militarisation "encouraged such themes as the protection of Korean women’s virtue and the defence of Korean purity against hostile outside forces thereby contributing to ongoing gender discrimination" [6]

Women are discriminated on a number of bases. Such as laws prohibiting anyone other than women over forty years of age from trading; being targeted for bribes and fines at rates much higher than men.[7] It is also alleged that women were banned from riding bicycles, and the ban was reportedly briefly lifted in 2012. Sources diverge on this issue, whether it's true or not.

The North Korean regime enforces gender roles by dictating dress codes. Women are stipulated to wear skirts. This is enforced by the Moral Discipline Corps. These regulations may have recently been relaxed.[8]

Women make up a mere five percent of the the party elite of the Workers' Party of Korea.[9]

Domestic violence and public violence against women is reportedly rampant, and no adequate protection is offered by the state.[10]

Sexual assault against women in the military is relatively common. Rapes are not reported upward in the military hierarchy consequently no repercussions are in place, while they can be openly talked and bragged about.[11]

Repatriated women are commonly subjugated to forced abortions over suspicions of interracial children."

And:

"North Korea pursues political policies of ethnic nationalism and chauvinism.

Racism[edit]
Education in North Korea involves teaching hatred, violence, and racist values.[13]

Repatriated women are commonly subjugated to forced abortions over suspicions of carrying interracial children.[14] Foreign citizens in North Korea are virtually exclusively paired up to other foreign citizens.

State propaganda directed at the Japanese and United States make no distinction between workers and capitalists."

http://marxistpedia.mwzip.com/wiki/North_Korea

So by all standards, North Korea is far-right. It promotes social inequality in matters of race, ethnicity, gender, and socio-economics. And this is far-right by the definition I provided.

Guardia Rossa

12th June 2015, 22:46

I find it funny to see people thinking of jacobins as "decentralized, class conscious and anti-capitalists"

You could say sans-cullotes were near that, but yet they were centralized and not exactly anti-capitalists, more like a form of "anarco"-capitalism mixed with fascism

ckaihatsu

15th June 2015, 00:17

Leftism -- Want, Get

http://s6.postimg.org/ck1nuep69/2270260350046342459jii_Kc_V_fs.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/kpjpskdf1/full/)

Ideologies & Operations -- Left Centrifugalism

http://s6.postimg.org/3si9so4xd/110211_Ideologies_Operations_Left_Centrifug.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/zc8b2rb3h/full/)

Political Spectrum, Simplified

http://s6.postimg.org/eeeic5c6p/2373845980046342459jv_Mrd_G_fs.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/c9u5b2ajx/full/)

mushroompizza

17th June 2015, 18:00

Tim Redd

8th July 2015, 03:24

There are lots of categories in the left. Google them if you want to.

-The Anti-Stalinist Left
-The New Left
-The Left
-The Ultra Left
-The Jewish Left
-The Far Left
-The Christian Left
-The Centre-Left
-The Post Left
-Left Wing Fascism (An insult, not really a category)
-Nationalist Left
-Anti Nationalist Left

Gee, do you really have intellectual honestly if despite the fact that you may dislike them, you don't mention these well-known schools of thought/belief systems generally taken as being on the left when responding to the question?

Marxism
Maoism (Mao Zedong Thought)
Leninism
Stalinism
Trotskyism

BIXX

8th July 2015, 05:16