How marginal are the AWL?

[The Idler]

The AWL don't seem to get discussed here so if like to ask how marginal they are?

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

I wouldn't say the AWL are marginal, at least not any more than other ostensibly socialist groups in Britain. They have, from what I understand, more than twice the membership of the Seepy Geeby, are about as active as SPEW in various campaigns, and so on.

The reason they aren't discussed much, I imagine, is because no one on this site is a member or sympathiser, and they aren't currently embroiled in a scandal (although O'Mahoney-Matgamna has some pretty creepy ideas about Israel and Iran).

[The Idler]

I wouldn't say the AWL are marginal, at least not any more than other ostensibly socialist groups in Britain. They have, from what I understand, more than twice the membership of the Seepy Geeby, are about as active as SPEW in various campaigns, and so on.

The reason they aren't discussed much, I imagine, is because no one on this site is a member or sympathiser, and they aren't currently embroiled in a scandal (although O'Mahoney-Matgamna has some pretty creepy ideas about Israel and Iran).

SPGB have about 350-360 members and from what I understand AWL have around 80-100. Not sure where you got the idea the AWL have twice the members.

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

SPGB have about 350-360 members and from what I understand AWL have around 80-100. Not sure where you got the idea the AWL have twice the members.

I was talking about the CPGB, which has around 40 members on a good day from what I know, yet is discussed on this site all the time.

(SPGB would be Espie Geebie, no?)

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

SPGB have about 350-360 members and from what I understand AWL have around 80-100. Not sure where you got the idea the AWL have twice the members.
Well, it's not like 350-360 is that much more impressive.

[Asero]

The SPGB only have around 360 members? It is really that small?

[Rudolf]

The whole numbers game annoys me tbh. It's not 360 members or a 100 members that's the problem, you can build from that, it's what you do with those numbers that matters. I'd rather be in an organisation of 100 people engaging in class struggle than an organisation of 1000 engaging in navel gazing. The former can punch above its weight, the latter can rot.

As for the owlies, i've met a couple of members here and there no real issues but a good comrade of mine has very negative experiences with some of their members.

[poppleton]

I've had a quite a few discussions with workers' liberty active members and also read their paper sporadically. I don't like their ideas in relation to imperialism, particularly the US/Israel Palestinian conflict.
One member seemed to have some pretty strange ideas regarding New Labour but I don't know if that's AWL policy.

They are not active where I currently live . It's mainly trots and the pseudo left like the p.a. and of course some trade union activists. You have to choose between whether to do something concrete and work tactically in concert with other leftists or build a branch on your own (ouch) or abstain from all class struggle and hope things get so unbearable that a crisis forces the working class into having to fight back through desperation and necessity.

I prefer working with other activists in my area. I have ideological differences with the SWP, SPEW, the INS, Left Unity and the People's Assembly (reasons should be obvious on an internet forum called RevLeft) but I will attend their meetings and there are many people I would call comrades who hold similar views to myself. Private capital and corporate interests are dismantling civilisation up here. You have to have some solidarity in resisting these viscous attacks or we're fucked and they have crushed us.

(I do have to concede that from my late teens to mid twenties I was active with an anarchist group and used to define myself as a Libertarian Socialist. Rudolf Rocker, Chomsky, Bakunin (anti-semite), etc. We were heavily infiltrated by the state as I expect this forum is. A brief and highly inaccurate account of us is detailed in a book by some fuck-wit Gaurdian journos but who reads that capitalist rag on here. The business press and alt-media is where we get our info from. All people I've come across who describe themselves as anarchos these days are just kids who dress in black and don't seem to have any understanding of anarchist theory (and all the different schools of thought within it). I mean A-Fed, how active are they? Fashion victims, who are all missing from any class struggle. We were mis-guided but at least we pulled some class actions. Unfortunately I now have a criminal record which is difficult to explain in my line of work. I'm old now and I don't care who knows. If your an effective activist your being monitored and your group will have a mole. Don't do anything stupid. Democratic socialism is what they really fear. Keep it legal.)

Anyway AWL, Yawn. Sorry if your a member. SWP leadership are more annoying. Never had any dealings with Socialist Part of Great Britain. Is Idler with Chomsky avatar a member? Chomsky claims he's an anarchist - still got lots of his political books - In 'Anarchism 101' he states this quite clearly. Always had the impression that SPGB were ex-public scholl boy socialists. No offence intended, that could just be smears by some SPEWS I know. CPGB I have engaged with on demos but they seemed quite aloof however that could be my lack of interpersonal skills and foul language. That pisses the trots off to but who gives a shit.

[bricolage]

AWL are only really active in London. They are quite involved with on-the-ground organising and like the SPEW have some relatively prominent members in union positions.

They have some pretty shit foreign policy positions that I have no time for. However, the rest of the left always seemed to have a weird obsession with them beyond their importance. In any case it always seemed like two sides of the same coin; the AWL and their concessions to imperialism as just the flip side of SWP etc and their concessions to Islamism and 'enemy of my enemy...' politics.

[Asero]

The whole numbers game annoys me tbh. It's not 360 members or a 100 members that's the problem, you can build from that, it's what you do with those numbers that matters. I'd rather be in an organisation of 100 people engaging in class struggle than an organisation of 1000 engaging in navel gazing. The former can punch above its weight, the latter can rot.

That's an increadibly Leninist thing to say to excuse an anti-Leninist party who completely reject any form of leadership, who believe the only way to revolution is "through force of numbers."

[The Feral Underclass]

I know a few AWL members and those I know are pretty decent people. They have made fairly decent inroads into the RMT, but I think their union strategy (which is essentially their entire strategy) is pretty much doomed to failure.