View Full Version : Subtle ways in which socialists had an effect on society....
Creative Destruction
11th November 2014, 01:15
There've been some subtle ways that I've noticed socialists having a positive effect on the United States. There's kind of a whitewashing that goes on with regards to some of our cultural artifacts, where the radical roots of a particular thing has been deleted from itself.
One way in which I've found this subtle influence:
With architecture, interior design and what not: the American Craftsman style is extremely popular in many parts of the country (one thing I've loved about Portland is the immense amount of Craftsman-style homes.) This was, at its root, intended to be a movement of radical socialist craftspeople and artisans, where production would be aimed toward high quality products at low prices for the working class. Obviously, that didn't work out because it kind of flies in the face of capitalist logic: the longer you work on a piece of furniture or a house, the more value, the more expensive it is, so it was bought by the rich, rather than the working class. But the design principles were meant to be socialist. Gustav Stickley was the main person in this movement, and it was inspired by the UK Arts and Crafts folks, like William Morris.
Anyone else have any other of these kinds of stories?
Illegalitarian
11th November 2014, 04:45
Plenty of influential Americans were socialists: Charlie Chaplin, Einstein (not technically American I guess), Helen Keller, I'm sure the list goes on. Their contributions had nothing to do with socialism, mind you, and I'm not sure if they were marxists, anarchists, or just radical socdems, but it's something I guess!
I know that Louisiana had a communist governor back in the day. Had his own cult of personality and everything, not sure if he did anything in Louisiana that was actually communist though, such as any sort of buildings or policies or what have you.
Sabot Cat
11th November 2014, 04:52
Plenty of influential Americans were socialists: Charlie Chaplin, Einstein (not technically American I guess), Helen Keller, I'm sure the list goes on. Their contributions had nothing to do with socialism, mind you, and I'm not sure if they were marxists, anarchists, or just radical socdems, but it's something I guess!
I know that Louisiana had a communist governor back in the day. Had his own cult of personality and everything, not sure if he did anything in Louisiana that was actually communist though, such as any sort of buildings or policies or what have you.
Er, Huey Long wasn't a socialist or a communist. He was a liberal populist, maybe better than his competition at the time, but certainly not a revolutionary leftist of any stripe.
Illegalitarian
11th November 2014, 06:30
Er, Huey Long wasn't a socialist or a communist. He was a liberal populist, maybe better than his competition at the time, but certainly not a revolutionary leftist of any stripe.
Indeed, it seems as if he was a radical social democrat who foresaw that America could possibly be on the brink of revolution, and thus advocated grand social and policies as a means of fending off such a threat.
Brandon's Impotent Rage
11th November 2014, 06:36
Well, there's the famous case of novelist and socialist activist Upton Sinclair, whose novel The Jungle was basically responsible for the creation of the FDA.
('course, he was really trying to show the horrifying working conditions for workers at meat packing plants.)
Creative Destruction
11th November 2014, 06:42
Indeed, it seems as if he was a radical social democrat who foresaw that America could possibly be on the brink of revolution, and thus advocated grand social and policies as a means of fending off such a threat.
He wasn't really a radical.
Chomskyan
11th November 2014, 07:20
Plenty of influential Americans were socialists: Charlie Chaplin, Einstein (not technically American I guess), Helen Keller, I'm sure the list goes on. Their contributions had nothing to do with socialism, mind you, and I'm not sure if they were marxists, anarchists, or just radical socdems, but it's something I guess!
I know that Louisiana had a communist governor back in the day. Had his own cult of personality and everything, not sure if he did anything in Louisiana that was actually communist though, such as any sort of buildings or policies or what have you.
I've heavily contributed to the Wikipedia series on Socialism in the United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_socialist_movement_in_the_United_St ates) on this very topic.
Arm and Hammer was a Communist inspired logo. As was previously mentioned, all of the major civil rights and women's rights leaders were either Socialists or connected to Socialism.
The Socialist publication Appeal to Reason was the 3rd most popular publication in the country, near the end of it's run. A Social Democrat, Michael Harrington's book The Other America inspired much of the welfare programs the US government has instated over the years. My state had Floyd B. Olson, who was a Socialist and card-carrying Wobbly as governor. I just learned that recently editing the Wikipedia page on American Socialism.
I probably could tell you more, but it's really late here. So my brain won't work at this hour.
Redistribute the Rep
11th November 2014, 07:31
I've always noticed that class seems to be a common theme in American literature, and many authors were socialists (or at the very least affiliated with socialist organizations) : Upton Sinclair, Mark Twain, Ernst hemmingway, John Steinbeck, Scott Fitzgerald, William Faulkner (not sure of his politics, but class is definitely a theme in his work), etc. Actually it's pretty much the reason I got interested in literature.
Chomskyan
11th November 2014, 07:38
Er, Huey Long wasn't a socialist or a communist. He was a liberal populist, maybe better than his competition at the time, but certainly not a revolutionary leftist of any stripe.
He debated Norman Thomas, and opposed Marxism and Communism. So, I think it's likely that he wasn't a Leftist.
Illegalitarian
11th November 2014, 07:50
He wasn't really a radical.
I'm speaking contextually about American politics in the early 20th century
Don't be coy :P
Sabot Cat
11th November 2014, 08:19
I've always noticed that class seems to be a common theme in American literature, and many authors were socialists (or at the very least affiliated with socialist organizations) : Upton Sinclair, Mark Twain, Ernst hemmingway, John Steinbeck, Scott Fitzgerald, William Faulkner (not sure of his politics, but class is definitely a theme in his work), etc. Actually it's pretty much the reason I got interested in literature.
It extends beyond the United States as well; Oscar Wilde was a socialist too, as I understand it.
Chomskyan
11th November 2014, 08:21
I've always noticed that class seems to be a common theme in American literature, and many authors were socialists (or at the very least affiliated with socialist organizations) : Upton Sinclair, Mark Twain, Ernst hemmingway, John Steinbeck, Scott Fitzgerald, William Faulkner (not sure of his politics, but class is definitely a theme in his work), etc. Actually it's pretty much the reason I got interested in literature.
It was Socialism that got me interested in US history. Before then I was only interested in world history, I thought US history was so lame until I learned about Socialism in the United States. Now, I want to learn all I can about US history.
Redistribute the Rep
11th November 2014, 08:27
It extends beyond the United States as well; Oscar Wilde was a socialist too, as I understand it.
Yea, I can definitely see it in English literature: Wilde, orwell, HG wells, Dickens. But to me it seems like class is more central and defining in American literature compared to other countries. I could be wrong though as admittedly I'm much more familiar with American literature than anything else.
Regicollis
11th November 2014, 08:37
The revolutionary leftist movement has had a profound effect on all developed industrial societies. The bourgeoisie saw the vocal and growing revolutionary movements and remembered what had happened in Russia. That made the so terrified that that they accepted social reforms for the benefit of the working class in order to bribe it to support the capitalist system.
Anglo-Saxon Philistine
11th November 2014, 10:52
Yea, I can definitely see it in English literature: Wilde, orwell, HG wells, Dickens. But to me it seems like class is more central and defining in American literature compared to other countries. I could be wrong though as admittedly I'm much more familiar with American literature than anything else.
I don't really remember Wells writing much about class, except for one segment of "The Time Machine", and that is far from favourable to the working class. Generally, Wells's Fabianism was closer to what would later be called fascism (including the blatant murderous racism) than anything we would call socialism.
Don't get me wrong, Wells was a good writer with some really neat ideas when it comes to technology, but his politics was more or less "if we, the middle classes don't get our act together, those upper-class buffoons are going to ruin everything and then the masses are going to take power; then we won't be able to have a rational dictatorship and exterminate the yellow and red races".
The sad thing is that when it comes to Fabians, Wells was a moderate dreamer. Shaw outright supported fascism.
If you want a good, sort-of-Marxist (he was really too much of a spiritual man to be a 'full' Marxist) socialist SF author, you could go worse than Stapledon.
Rad
12th November 2014, 02:19
Education, healthcare are two that come to mind. Labor reforms also. It is only because of Marxist works/activism that the bourgeois govts. were forced to concede these to the workers.
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