"Color blindness" and your thoughts?

[Fin]

Recently, I was sort of attacked by someone for stating that I don't really see the difference between white (Caucasian) and African Americans.

Not in the sense of differences such as obvious socio-economic factors, but actual race. Meaning, when I see an African american, I look at him or her like I look at everyone else; a person. When I said this I didn't mean the actual economic differences as stated, or that I don't think other races are discriminated against, I meant -i- personally don't see the differences between me and another race. I see them as people, nothing more, nothing less.

The woman that I said this to that I have "internalized racism" and I devalue the culture of African Americans. I didn't really understand this, as I literally meant that I don't think people should try to make African Americans different people, I feel that we should all just be people... not separated by race. I do understand that many African Americans have it much harder off than white Americans, and I believe that is very wrong, and should be stopped. As people though, I see other races just like me. According to her however, I should see African Americans and other races as differently than me, which I didn't understand, as that felt almost racist to me.

She then referred me to a link from "Psychologytoday.com", about a "Colorblind Ideology".

What are your thoughts? I felt slightly bad after she sent me this, but I truly feel that other races should be treated just as people, no different than a Caucasian person. Maybe she didn't understand that I understand and accept hardships of other races, and I believe they should be equal across all boards?

Sorry if this seems like i'm rambling, it's pretty early and I'm tired still.

[consuming negativity]

It sounds like a communication issue, compounded by your use of "color blind" to describe the way you see people, which is often something said by those people who say "oh it isn't racial, it's cultural" when they're called out on their prejudices. She was perhaps a bit over-vigilant and presumptive about you, but it is still possible and maybe even likely that there was a thread of truth to what she was saying, particularly if you don't understand why it is that someone would take offense to your position. Most people are not actually racist in the sense that they think one race should be treated differently from another; instead, they are racist in the sense that they think that "white" is "default" in the same way that "male" is considered "default", with cultural/racial differences being aberrations from this false tabula rasa. Part of treating everyone equally is respecting and embracing diversity and not whitewashing away the different flavors of people that we encounter; being black in America means certain things for a person, and being "color blind" can imply, rightfully or not, that you're unaware of that.

Hope that is helpful.

[BIXX]

The reason she was upset was most likely because that colorblindness thing is a thing a lot of liberals say to act like there is no way they are part of the problem because seeing as they don't see race then how on earth could they be racist? Except its bullshit we all see race despite the fact that it is indeed a bullshit societal construct. What you should have said (IMO) is that you try to treat everyone equally, no matter what race they are.

Don't take it too personally op.

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

Coming to RevLeft for advice is not advised. Which reminds me, see this watch I'm swinging? You want to hail the Red Army in Afghanistan. You want to...

Alright, seriously, the reason this person reacted as she did is probably because claims of being "colour-blind" are associated with the worst sort of liberal bigoted-without-being-openly-so politics, from "affirmative action discriminates against whites" and "why are there no shelters for abused men?" to "sodomy laws are fair because they apply to straight people as well".

[Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages]

Recently, I was sort of attacked by someone for stating that I don't really see the difference between white (Caucasian) and African Americans.

Not in the sense of differences such as obvious socio-economic factors, but actual race. Meaning, when I see an African american, I look at him or her like I look at everyone else; a person. When I said this I didn't mean the actual economic differences as stated, or that I don't think other races are discriminated against, I meant -i- personally don't see the differences between me and another race. I see them as people, nothing more, nothing less.

The woman that I said this to that I have "internalized racism" and I devalue the culture of African Americans. I didn't really understand this, as I literally meant that I don't think people should try to make African Americans different people, I feel that we should all just be people... not separated by race. I do understand that many African Americans have it much harder off than white Americans, and I believe that is very wrong, and should be stopped. As people though, I see other races just like me. According to her however, I should see African Americans and other races as differently than me, which I didn't understand, as that felt almost racist to me.

She then referred me to a link from "Psychologytoday.com", about a "Colorblind Ideology".

What are your thoughts? I felt slightly bad after she sent me this, but I truly feel that other races should be treated just as people, no different than a Caucasian person. Maybe she didn't understand that I understand and accept hardships of other races, and I believe they should be equal across all boards?

Sorry if this seems like i'm rambling, it's pretty early and I'm tired still.

Uhh.. I bolded the problem. Black people really aren't caucasian, its not some illusion that you've managed to rise above. If you used these words i would say this person was justified.

[Quail]

I think the big problem with the notion of "colour blindness" is that it kind of assumes a post-racism society. If you don't see the colour of someone's skin or their ethnicity, then you also don't see or acknowledge the specific oppressions that person might face because of it.

[Comrade Hadrian]

Are the Ainu people "caucasian?"

[Illegalitarian]

I think the big problem with the notion of "colour blindness" is that it kind of assumes a post-racism society. If you don't see the colour of someone's skin or their ethnicity, then you also don't see or acknowledge the specific oppressions that person might face because of it.

It's problematic for several reasons

The biggest reason being that it implies the very liberal notion that just because something is a social structure means that if we as a society can ignore it that it will go away, which assumes racism exists for no reason, as if those who perpetuate or maintain a system of institutionalized racism are not greatly benefiting from it, as if it matters to them whether or not race is a social construct or not.


It also rests on the pillar of hypersensitive white guilt, as if even recognizing that there are people of other ethnicities is in itself racist, which of course means that we as a society can never get to the point where we're tacking race-related issues and solving them.

[Comrade Hadrian]

It also rests on the pillar of hypersensitive white guilt, as if even recognizing that there are people of other ethnicities is in itself racist

I often think this isn't anything even as benign as "white guilt." It's often nefarious, in that it wants to erase the independent identity of New Afrikans. To quote Omali Yeshitela's attack on Tim Wise:



We determined long ago that characterizing our movement as a struggle against racism was a self-defeating waste of time. What is called racism is simply the ideological foundation of capitalist imperialism. Rather than defining the system of our oppression, racism is a concept that denies Africans our national identity and dignity. It relegates us to the Sisyphean task of winning acceptance from, and often of becoming one with, our oppressors.

[PhoenixAsh]

Colour blindness is a form of racial privilege only white people can afford. And while I do not like privilege theory and this is not an endorsement of it...the term itself can only be invented by white people when they are all too aware of race but simply do not want to deal with it...or worse...used to actually white wash their racial prejudice.

[Fin]

All good thoughts!

I suppose in the end it was probably more of a spoken communication error than anything. I believe what I should've said could've been found further up in the thread about just trying to treat everyone no matter whom equally.

I understand that African Americans aren't Caucasians, but I just never really thought I needed to see anyone as anything more than just "people", all races alike. Either way, thanks for the replies!

[NickBorg]

I understand that I'm a bit late to the party, but I've actually been writing an essay on the subject so I've got some things I'd like to add.

The main issue, as has been stated by others, is that "colorblindness" or the idea of a "post-racial" society is use to obscure and justify ongoing discrimination. Illegalitarian put it well:


It's problematic for several reasons
The biggest reason being that it implies the very liberal notion that just because something is a social structure means that if we as a society can ignore it that it will go away, which assumes racism exists for no reason, as if those who perpetuate or maintain a system of institutionalized racism are not greatly benefiting from it, as if it matters to them whether or not race is a social construct or not.


In a recent book David Theo Goldberg (important guy in critical race theory, suggested read) argues that actually these ideas drive the "privatization of racism". So basically the state isn't as overtly racist as in the Jim Crow era or apartheid, but it uses these ideas as ideological tools to remove the mechanisms through which we can fight racism. Essentially it is the state saying "we're not racist (not strictly true but there you go), but if people and companies want to exercise racism privately then that's their prerogative".

For examples have a look at California Proposition 54, which interestingly sought to ban the use of racial categories, excluding their use in medicine and law enforcement (profilling and sus laws, protecting targeting of blacks through stop and search policies and subsequent over representation of blacks in prison on drug charges). Or France's removal of the word "race" from the law books and the infamous "Burqa Ban". The arguments made specifically in opposition to these types of legislation gives you a good idea of issues with the "colorblindness" generally.

If anyone's really interested in this have a read of the newer David Theo Goldberg books, there's also some good stuff by Edouardo Bonilla-Silva on the topic.

[TC]

I think the big problem with the notion of "colour blindness" is that it kind of assumes a post-racism society. If you don't see the colour of someone's skin or their ethnicity, then you also don't see or acknowledge the specific oppressions that person might face because of it.

The fact that race matters in society, doesn't mean it *should* matter. Likewise the fact that the NYPD or TSA or most corporate employers predictably treat race as relevant to their treatment of people doesn't mean you *must* or *ought to*.

We don't live in a post-racial society. The question is should we strive to? As individuals, should we entrench race or dissipate race? Race is socially constructed, not inherent, and we can choose how we participate in its construction.

When someone says "race doesn't matter" they're being naive, but when someone says "your race doesn't matter to me" they're taking the attitude we should all adopt. Objection to the second attitude either comes from mistakenly thinking that "your race doesn't matter to me" implies race never matters (it implies no such thing) or, more disturbingly, from an identity-politic focused belief that race really ought to matter.

[Lenin_Was_Right]

I recognize the cultural differences of all peoples and they should all be protected and preserved and not subjected to oppression. I see only humans and cannot simply judge someone through stereotypes like the modern racist does. The racist is an idiot, judging someone because of their racial background is simply moronic. I choose to help people based on their values and willingness to help others in this struggle against the capitalist system.

[contracycle]

Today, in modern South Africa, you have to look fairly hard to find white people who will admit to having supported apartheid. But newly reformed "non-racist" whites preaching "colour-blindness" are ten a penny. What they mean by this of course, as has been admirably laid out above, is that they oppose and seek to delegitimise any effort to undo the historic wrongs of apartheid that threaten to intrude upon their privilege.

So yeah, this term is heavily loaded that if I'd heard the OP use it, I'd probably have leaped to the same conclusion.

[G4b3n]

I do understand that many African Americans have it much harder off than white Americans, and I believe that is very wrong, and should be stopped.

Well it doesn't get stopped with the attitude of "Like, were all just people man, race doesn't need to be a thing. #ALLlivesmatter"

That silences the voice of the oppressed and shows a complete failure of analysis, an expression of liberalism, nothing of value.

[mushroompizza]

(Remembering all of Colbert's jokes on Color Blindness now)

Socially- You should treat everyone equally, choose your friends and loves by how much happiness they give you.

Politically- You must view the experience of the races differently, it is sad but true. I'm white and I can realize this, even I have experienced racism, I can only imagine someone not white.

In General-It is good to life your social life color blind, but it is ignorant to think racial experience is the same for all (denying racism in the police, college, housing).

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

It's kind of like saying "I don't want to see wealth inequality, therefore I won't."

Racism exists on an international level and in many countries is habitual and entrenched. Colour blindness is a liberal (and even conservative) excuse to wash one's hands of responsibility for being part of a solution. It does nothing but maintain and entrench the status quo.