Log in

View Full Version : Marx's handwriting



RedWorker
24th October 2014, 03:39
Apparently it was notoriously bad... :lol:

"Much has been made of how these differing characteristics revealed themselves in the handwriting of the two men, with Engels' studious, symmetrical script (decorated here and there by a neat, humorous illustration) offering a marked contrast to Marx's furious, blotch-marked scribbling. Yet, in a neat metaphor for their friendship, it was often only Engels who could decipher Marx's meaning."

"Marx's General: The Revolutionary Life of Friedrich Engels", Tristram Hunt, p. 116


"After Marx's death, Engels had to break off his scientific work to take on the Herculean task of ordering his friend's literary estate. 'Quotations from sources in no kind of order, piles of them jumbled together, collected simply with a view to future selection. Besides that there is the handwriting which certainly cannot be deciphered by anyone but me, and then only with difficulty', he wrote despairingly to August Bebel after wading through the Maitland Park archives."

"Marx's General: The Revolutionary Life of Friedrich Engels", Tristram Hunt, p. 297


"The line-by-line editing of Marx's impenetrable, cramped handwriting was endangering Engels' health. The manuscripts, according to Edward Aveling, were in a terrible state: 'They contain abbreviations which have to be guessed at, crossing-outs and innumerable corrections which have to be deciphered; it is as difficult to read as a Greek palimpsest with ligatures.' By the mid-1880s, Engels' eyes were weakening and he began suffering from conjunctivitis and myopia. To ease the strain, Engels was forced to initiate a new generation, Karl Kautsky and Eduard Bernstein, into the hieroglyphic mysteries of Marx's handwriting and finally to employ a typesetter, Oskar Eisengarten, to take dictation. But even with this help, the final checking of Marx's manuscript was still up to Engels."

"Marx's General: The Revolutionary Life of Friedrich Engels", Tristram Hunt, p. 298


"On January 28, 1899 Engels had written to Kautsky offering to teach him to decipher Marx's handwriting and to pay him 50 pounds per annum expenses for two years to make a fair copy of the manuscript - about 750 pages - of the fourth volume of Das Kapital."

"Friedrich Engels", W. O. Henderson, p. 729


"Engels had not enough energy to arrange Marx's manuscripts of Capital and the handwriting of the remainders of the manuscripts was almost illegible, so Engels was extremely anxious to train his successor, meaning Kautsky. Under Engels' careful training Kautsky basically grasped the characteristics of Marx's handwriting. Under these circumstances Kautsky dared not to act and did not publish Marx's Theories of Surplus Value until near ten years after Engels' death."

"Rethinking Marx", Shipeng Zou, Xuegong Yang, p. 32

The Feral Underclass
26th October 2014, 22:22
I'd quite like to see some of it. Do you think it exists any where?

I wonder how much the original transcript of Capital would go for?

Brandon's Impotent Rage
26th October 2014, 22:37
Apparently Engels wasn't the only person who had to....'interpret' Marx's scratchy writing. Marx's wife Jenny basically re-wrote everything Marx wrote during her lifetime (and on occasion writing down what Marx dictated to her) in a more legible script.

His handwriting is also one of the reasons he had trouble getting work (yes, despite what his detractors claim Marx DID try to find employment, numerous times).

Illegalitarian
26th October 2014, 22:38
a quick google search will bring up some pictures of what appears to be his writing, and yeah it's uh.. pretty horrible haha.


Oh well. I'd trade my good handwriting for the ability to fully grasp some of the concepts and methodological approaches he pioneered, any day.

Brandon's Impotent Rage
26th October 2014, 22:39
I'd quite like to see some of it. Do you think it exists any where?

I wonder how much the original transcript of Capital would go for?

Here you go....

http://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/cw/volume05/05-025.jpg

consuming negativity
26th October 2014, 23:04
I want to try to read some of it. Do you have anything bigger/ in English?

http://38.media.tumblr.com/56fc22ef5ac5e058dec8650670d4397f/tumblr_navndbgTxi1qzgpdoo1_400.gif

Zoroaster
26th October 2014, 23:17
My handwriting is pretty miserable as well, so I can sympathize with him.

Sabot Cat
27th October 2014, 01:54
Here you go....
[image snip]

Well, that confirms it for me: Marx wrote the Voynich Manuscript.

Zoroaster
27th October 2014, 01:58
Well, that confirms it for me: Marx wrote the Voynich Manuscript.

Lol

Sewer Socialist
27th October 2014, 02:06
gutov.ru/works/rembr/FIG/German-ideol.jpg

Just... wow.

As an aside, is the posting of images newly forbidden to us with fewer than 100 posts? I was able to do it last week.

consuming negativity
27th October 2014, 02:23
gutov.ru/works/rembr/FIG/German-ideol.jpg

Just... wow.

As an aside, is the posting of images newly forbidden to us with fewer than 100 posts? I was able to do it last week.

am i the only one who sees the right half of this paper and it looks like he was trying to draw a bunch of faces?

lmfao

they're everywhere!

e: in regards to the restriction on posting images i dunno, but it was annoying as shit and caused me to get a little bit spammy in my posts until i broke the limit

second e: the sig on the bottom isn't marx is it?

RedWorker
27th October 2014, 02:45
Here's the image. Apparently a manuscript of "The German Ideology"?

http://gutov.ru/works/rembr/FIG/German-ideol.jpg

Futility Personified
27th October 2014, 02:55
If I was still in formal education I would 100% turn one of these into a stencil for unwanted assignments. It's done! But can you read it?

Seriously though, they wanted to get me a scribe for my exams as my handwriting was so piss poor. It's a point of pride that i'm just as incomprehensible on paper as I am verbally.

Sewer Socialist
27th October 2014, 03:49
i'm just as incomprehensible on paper as I am verbally.

I feel the same way about me. Including the things I write. I have the hardest time getting a complex point across which makes 100% sense in my head. I don't even know how I can improve.

BIXX
27th October 2014, 04:23
I feel the same way about me. Including the things I write. I have the hardest time getting a complex point across which makes 100% sense in my head. I don't even know how I can improve.
practice

Sabot Cat
27th October 2014, 07:09
Here's the image. Apparently a manuscript of "The German Ideology"?

[snip]

This is actually a 2007 painting titled "Marx. German Ideology" by Dmitry Gutov: http://www.triumph-gallery.ru/en/events/udivlyatsya-nechemu.html

The real manuscript looks pretty similar, though:

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/cw/volume05/05-034.jpg

More:

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/cw/volume05/05-035.jpg

Creative Destruction
27th October 2014, 08:31
This is actually a 2007 painting titled "Marx. German Ideology" by Dmitry Gutov: http://www.triumph-gallery.ru/en/events/udivlyatsya-nechemu.html

The real manuscript looks pretty similar, though:

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/cw/volume05/05-034.jpg

it's like a precursor to Ralph Steadman.

http://www.ralphsteadmanartcollection.com/images/collections/Small%20Warts%20and%20All%20-%20Nixon_edited-1.jpg

Creative Destruction
27th October 2014, 08:33
His handwriting is also one of the reasons he had trouble getting work (yes, despite what his detractors claim Marx DID try to find employment, numerous times).

as a journalist, no less. his poor editors...

Sasha
27th October 2014, 09:43
I'd quite like to see some of it. Do you think it exists any where?

I wonder how much the original transcript of Capital would go for?

I have held an original draft of the communist manifesto (with gloves on obviously), quite magical even for an non-marxist.

The Feral Underclass
27th October 2014, 11:00
I have held an original draft of the communist manifesto (with gloves on obviously), quite magical even for an non-marxist.

That's pretty damn awesome.

PhoenixAsh
27th October 2014, 11:15
There are original manuscripts in the IISG in Amsterdam.

The entire archive of the CPN and its predecessor CPH are in those archives. You need permission from the "owners" to get access. Which means you have to say why you want to read them.

I did a paper on the CPN. There was some pretty awesome stuff in there about my families political life including heavilly editted BVD files.