Gnostic Christian Mystery School Secret Truth #1.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Gnostic Christian Mystery School Secret Truth #1.

All that can and is said of all Gods is speculative by nature as none of it is provable. To state that God exists cannot be a true statement unless one has a God to show. This is irrefutable as it can be shown that all Gods are based on ancient myths and stories. They are always to remain mysterious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwkgGPvClF4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwkgGPvClF4)

All religions are based on myths, legends and hope in an afterlife that unfortunately turned to literal belief, --- and this one issue created the war against free thought that led to the purge of many cults that did not want to read literally and to the Inquisition and the Dark Ages. It ended the Mystery Schools.

Literalists cannot help but be wrong unless they rely on blind faith and that faith of fools has pushed Christians and Muslims to kill many due to this blind faith mind set. Christians will kill again, --- just like Islam is doing today thanks to literal reading, --- given the chance.

Cristian literalist won against free thinking religions thanks to Constantine’s support --- but they cannot win today thanks to an intelligent population who are not superstitious nor as gullible as in past times and do not believe in fantasy, miracles and magic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ1PDxeUynA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ1PDxeUynA)

Is literal reading of any scripture or holy book mentally good, or mentally evil?

Has literal reading done the damage I alluded to or has it been a good influence for mankind?

Regards
DL

P.S.
This thinking is the Gnostic Christian’s goal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded)

This method and mind set is how you become I am and brethren to Jesus.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdSVl_HOo8Y (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdSVl_HOo8Y)

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Apologies to all. I cannot edit.

Regards
DL

[The Jay]

What the hell happened here?

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

What the hell happened here?

I have asked the mod to help.

Regards
DL

[The Jay]

I have asked the mod to help.

Regards
DL

Why are you "signing" your initials when your username shows up with your post?

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Off topic.

Regards
DL

[Dave B]

As I have said before I think one of the central tenets of Gnosticism and non-Pauline early Christianity was the basic idea that the economic system and status quo of ruling class-oppressed class was Satanic.

In fact you could say the Luke gospel document opens with this statement after what can be considered as a prologue.

Thus, as the story goes, we have JC, son of a carpenter and a carpenter himself

(who had hired himself out as a wage slave/economic migrant in Egypt according to Celsum)

And whose mother, as someone who span yarn for a living (also Celsum) was no better.

Reporting that;

Luke 4:4-5


Then the devil led him up to a high place and showed him in a flash all the kingdoms of the world. 6 And he said to him, “To you I will grant this whole realm—and the glory that goes along with it, for it has been relinquished to me, and I can give it to anyone I wish…”

A theme that continues through the gospel pamplets; I would be prepared to argue.

And even into the 1st letter of John, which for some was written by his working class friend.

1 John 5:19


……, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one.

But it is not very impressive is it?

I mean, to quote the philosopher Mandy Rice-Davies; as a member of the oppressed class;





"Well he would say that, wouldn't he?"

But the question is.

What would an ex gestapo “early christian” who was also a member of the imperial ruling class say?

Do we really need to guess?


Romans 13:1-3


13 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except by God’s appointment, and the authorities that exist have been instituted by God. 2 So the person who resists such authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will incur judgment 3 (for rulers cause no fear for good conduct but for bad). Do you desire not to fear authority? Do good and you will receive its commendation..



Which is a pretty dumbass thing to say for someone whose supposed ‘leader’ was crucified for speaking ‘truth to power’; and who himself later allegedly received the state ‘commendation’, and privilege for the ruling class, of decapitation.

The idea of the literal versus allegorical interpretion(s) of Judiac/Christian texts actually broke out first in the 2nd century with Marcionism.

Marcionism (a fairly well documented early christian heresy) said that the God in the old testament was a complete sado-maschotic bastard and had more in common with the witches in Macbeth than ‘Jesus’.

Whilst Origen, in opposition and representing late 2nd and early 3rd century early Christianity that didn’t want to abandon the old testament tradition, preferred to interpret all that shitty stuff ‘allegorically’.

Origen was later posthumously excommunicated, a rare privilege, as modern Christianity reabsorbed back the egregious literal interpretation of the old testament.

Origen, and the other early Christian intellectual Justin Martyr, were also both crypto Platonists with the 'kind of idea' that the perceived material world wasn’t the ‘real’ thing.

The closest modern ‘allegory’ to this Platonist idea is probably the Matrix film based on a talk by the self described Marxist and pulp sci fi author Philip K Dick.


The idea persisted into Hegelism with the notion that the material world was a phenomena (of albeit ‘a logic’) or an effect of ‘something’ else; going back to Plato’s shadows on a cave wall thing etc.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Dave

Thanks for reading my horrendous post.

Josephus is said to have had a hand in turning Jesus from a freedom fighting Jew to a Roman ass kisser. That plus what Constantine forced down the Churches throat when he bought them clinched any notions of free thinking or freedom loving. From then on, through the Dark Ages and Inquisitions, it was to think as literally as Christians did, in terms of only four main gospels, or die.

The Noble Lie has yet to be repealed. That is why people in Christianity are so ignorant of their own theology.

"for it has been relinquished to me,"


Dominion was given to A & E in Eden. Do you know when and where God is shown as an Indian giver, clawing back dominion from A & E, and giving it to Satan?

Regards
DL

[Dave B]

As I remember it Josephus was a Fidel Castro style freedom fighting Jew as part of the AD70 rebellion got caught and got turned into a propagandist for roman imperialism and Vespasian’s poodle.

Arguing that it was Roman imperialists multi cultural ‘white man’s’ burden to bring order to the ungrateful world.

[ I think that the Josephus material is viewed far too uncritically with some clinging to what they want to believe is veritable surviving and rare gem of a historical narrative in an otherwise dark ages desert .

I think people don’t appreciate how little material there is covering that period. I suspect for what matters that it is not one consistent document and was probably a continuous roman imperial propaganda work in progress. Origen in places seems to have read or have access to a slightly different version of it.]

I think when it comes to the four canonical gospels it looks like from Origen circa 240AD that they were all in place as the mainstream ‘histories’.

Although in Origen’s ‘Contra Celsum’*; Celsum takes the piss out of Christianity for having fractured into multiple sects, interpretations, variations and ‘heresies’ with their own associated material.

I think there is a valid analogy of the relationship of the centralised church to the Gnostics sects (and the relationship of the Gnostics sects to themselves) to the third international/Commitern and all its opponents and dissidents etc.

And almost without doubt the multiple Gnostic sects could be just as antagonistic towards each other as towards the centralised orthodoxy of post early Christianity.

I think the Adam and Eve story is OK as an ‘Animal Farm’ like allegory.

As; humanity was originally living a primitive communist hunter gatherer existence in paradise.

That must have that much more obvious when the story was written than it is now where it still sort of exists in some places.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/tribe/tribes/anuta/index.shtml

And I guess you could if you wanted to interpret it as humanity choosing the technological agricultural revolution from the tree of knowledge.

[In this case the woman is the free thinking intellectual progressive and Adam the dull witted reactionary.]

And that led to ‘sin’.

The issue is actually dealt with ‘almost’ rationally by Celsum of the 2nd century AD, so with Origen quoting Celsum;


"The Jews, then, leading a grovelling life in some comer of Palestine, and being a wholly uneducated people, who had not heard that these matters had been committed to verse long ago by Hesiod and innumerable other inspired men, wove together some most incredible and insipid stories, viz., that a certain man was formed by the hands of God, and had breathed into him the breath of life, and that a woman was taken from his side, and that God issued certain commands, and that a serpent opposed these, and gained a victory over the commandments of God; thus relating certain old wives' fables, and most impiously representing God as weak at the very beginning (of things), and unable to convince even a single human being whom He Himself had formed."




The context here was Celsum attacking Christianities ‘adherence’ to Old Testament material; thus by default attacking Christianity itself.

And saying basically that ‘Judaism’ had robbed and plagiarised older, and ‘better’, Greek material eg Hesiod (although other Greek material is dragged into the debate)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesiod

Origen, for what it matters, claims that that the Greeks plagiarised this story and in fact other the Old Testament material which, as it goes, Origen claims predates Greek material.

In fact in a way ‘part’ of Celsum’s attack on Christianity predates by almost 2000 years the ‘mythist’ analysis of Christianity started by the likes of Bauer and Strauss in the 19th century and still kicking with the likes of Richard Carrier versus Bart D. Ehrman (atheist) as the modern champions on both sides of the extremely abusive and flaming debate.

Origen’s Contra Celsum is a much overlooked I think as a veritable treasure trove of ‘data’ on this kind of material.

[ Celsum, as Origen repeatedly notes, attacks Christianity from multiple and seemingly contradicting positions so much so that Origen often wonders if he is after all a Epicurean and Democritusean (ie an atheist) who were the dingbats of that era.

But generally Celsum appears to accept so kind of, then contemporary and popular, ‘Neo-Platonist’ notion of a supreme ineffable being, ie God ]

I do actually think that the early Christianity version and ideology was ‘revolutionary’ in the sense that it attributed shit to the fact that the ruling class were the spawn of Satan.

As opposed to the old testament idea that shit happened when you pissed off a vindictive and vainglorious god.

And stick your brown nose up my arse and I might be nice to you; which is after all the managerial philosophy and ideology of modern capitalism and its general power structure.

And also ‘reflected’ as a ‘mirror image’ in the religious systems of pre capitalist society of and from its own ‘intelligentsia’.

I incidentally actually think that the gospel material can be quite deep.

It counterpoises power and lies on one side, versus ‘humility’ and truth on the other.

You might want to debate philosophically whether power and ‘humility’ are antonyms, or ‘negations’; to drop into ‘dialectics’.

However as with just about the only useful thing that came out of Stirner in his ‘Ego And His Own’.

Power, and a minority elite, had to lie in order to suppress the egotistical or ‘material’ interests of the majority of the oppressed.

Until at least the ruling class can personally control for themselves the direct means of oppression.

* I also think that in places Origen’s Contra Celsum has been tampered with by Christian copysists as you might expect; but it looks crude and obvious otherwise I wouldn’t notice it I suppose, but it is work in progress as far as I am concerned and I am still learning in what I think is an open field.


I also suspect that Celsum’s ‘True Doctrine’ or whatever might not be the work of one author but a stitched together and rewritten pastiche of anti Christian material.

Celsum’s ‘True Doctrine’ is dated at circa AD 180 because in a passage quoted by Origen it seems to imply that there were two roman emperors. That has been hauled over by the Greek readers as unambiguous rather than a slip of the pen with an extra ‘s’ etc.

Although Origen himself seems to have missed it as internal dating evidence.

Origen seemed to think that it may have dated from Hadrian or Nero, but he didn’t seem bothered to much about it one way or the other.

I think that is enough for now and will sign out before I start on the theology of the of the ‘vampire like’ origin of evil.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Dave

I agree that the bible, although a plagiarized and consolidated work of many older traditions can be read with a lot of depth. But not if it is read literally. Then it is garbage.

Said of Gnostic Christian versus Christian reading practices.

“Both read the Bible day and night; but you read black where I read white.”


For the morality to shine through, you basically have to reverse the Christian interpretation of much of the scriptures. They call evil good.

That is how they end loving a genocidal son murdering God.

Regards
DL