Welcome brothers and sisters

[Righteous Prophet]

I would like to hear reactions to the democratic socialist movement (criticisms, approval, etc.) and also begin the conversation for building a broader radical leftist movement

[Righteous Prophet]

I am a revolutionary democratic socialist. I am excited to be hear among comrades of all leftist tendencies and seek to build a broad anti-capitalist leftist alliance like the inspirational First International (without the infighting of course)

[Q]

Welcome :)

If you have political questions, you can ask them in the Learning forum. That's why it's there after all!

If you have questions about your account, don't hesitate to send me a PM or ask her.

Not to discourage you, but Revleft has lots of infighting ;) What do you understand to be "revolutionary democratic socialism"?

[Per Levy]

hello, the DSA mmh? just took a look at the website, how do you want to build a anticapitalist movement when you endorse pro-capitalists like bernie sanders?


Sign DSA's petition (http://www.dsausa.org/sanders_petition) urging openly democratic socialist Bernie Sanders (Independent-Vermont) to run for President in 2016 to further a desperately needed political revolution in the United States.

first of all, bernie sanders is not a socialist, at best a social-democrat(and yes there is quite the difference). also "political revolution"? not social, not a economic one? only political? and what exactly would change with sanders at president? do you belive that one man will change the framework of how an entire society and state runs?

[Righteous Prophet]

I understand to revolutionary democratic socialism to be a descendant of Debsian socialism. I also believe it to be the answer to the Marxist dilemma of plan vs. market or rather a "free association of producers" vs "eliminating the anarchy and inefficiency of the capitalist market. It is not social democracy. Many democratic socialists are revolutionaries; we reject any notion that we can have a "nice capitalism"

[Righteous Prophet]

I agree with you 100% comrade. At a recent YDS meeting (DSA youth branch) this was brought up. There was a radical shift in politics at that meeting. Many of the younger DSA members do not believe in social democracy (me included). We are beginning to change our outlook and there was frequent chatter about leaving the decadent Socialist International.That progressive phase is over for DSA. Many of us do not see Sanders as a socialist, nor openly support him, but do realize an opportunity for the word "socialist" to be out there even though it is incorrectly labeled. So we are going to capitalize on that opportunity to discuss what actual socialism is to the masses and most importantly, workers.

[Trap Queen Voxxy]

It's pretty much revolutionary cannibalism for me or nothing.

[Habermas]

discuss what actual socialism is to the masses and most importantly, workers.

"To the masses"? :unsure: That sounds very elitist, I'm aware that you meant it some other way, but it does still sound dangerously elitist.

[Righteous Prophet]

Is that Maoism? I do not view it the most favorably, but the priority is capitalism's overthrow.

[Црвена]

I understand to revolutionary democratic socialism to be a descendant of Debsian socialism. I also believe it to be the answer to the Marxist dilemma of plan vs. market or rather a "free association of producers" vs "eliminating the anarchy and inefficiency of the capitalist market. It is not social democracy. Many democratic socialists are revolutionaries; we reject any notion that we can have a "nice capitalism"

Do you think capitalism can be destroyed by voting a socialist party which gradually implements reforms to socialise the means of production into government, rather than the smashing of the bourgeois state through a revolution?

[#FF0000]

What exactly is this revolutionary democratic socialism? What does the "democratic" refer to?

[Righteous Prophet]

No I do not believe in the reformist route, not in the US anyway. I do believe in worker's seizing production, and the bourgeois state being dismantled and being replaced by a democratic, decentralized, worker's government.

[Righteous Prophet]

Revolutionary democratic socialism is the democratic socialism of the Debsian era continued today with revolutionary tendencies. I, along with others, say revolutionary because it distinguishes us from other "democratic socialists" (Sanders) who are really social democrats using our name. The democratic refers to the belief in a true genuine democracy that is political, economic and decentralized. We belief in "socialism from below" and are anti-authoritarian.

[Righteous Prophet]

Do you think capitalism can be destroyed by voting a socialist party which gradually implements reforms to socialise the means of production into government, rather than the smashing of the bourgeois state through a revolution?
However, I think it is beneficial if an actual socialist party conducts a campaign to promote its revolutionary message, not necessarily to win seats in a Bourgeois Congress. The campaigns of Debs and Harriman and others of past accomplished this. It spreads the message among workers.

[Righteous Prophet]

"To the masses"? :unsure: That sounds very elitist, I'm aware that you meant it some other way, but it does still sound dangerously elitist.
I don't see how it is elitist. The "masses" means the masses of people. We need to facilitate the revolution by educating workers to lead the revolution. I hope that people learn from self-education, but we all gain when we share our experiences and learn from others.

[The Idler]

Many of the comments you make about democratic socialism are good ones. I can accept that democratic socialism is distinct from social democracy and dictatorships of the proletariat. Although there may be some overlap, democratic socialism is not the tendency I am in any longer.

[Righteous Prophet]

Yeah I agree with your first point. Unfortunately the meaning is often confused by the center (Democrats and liberals) who view it favorably as social democracy, and the other leftists who denounce it as traitorous social democracy (like Bernstein.

[Mississippi]

"To the masses"? :unsure: That sounds very elitist, I'm aware that you meant it some other way, but it does still sound dangerously elitist.
No, it just sounds like textbook vanguard activity to me. Whether you agree with him or not, it was a perfectly reasonable thing to say.

[The Idler]

No, it just sounds like textbook vanguard activity to me. Whether you agree with him or not, it was a perfectly reasonable thing to say.
The vast majority of workers do not support socialism. Those that do support socialism trying to persuade those that don't isn't vanguardist. It doesn't mean current socialists are better or more advanced than non-socialists. I know a lot of parties pretend they or their policies have more support than they actually do especially through the use of non-socialist front activities, but it's a dead end as has been proven time and again.