The Coming Battle

[TheCommunistManifestor]

Throughout history, there has been a battle between the Left and the Right in the USA in which the Lefts' victory involves instilling regulations such as abolishing slavery, establishing and improving work environments, improving wages etc.

This holds true for example with rich plantation owners in the South complaining that abolishing slavery will hurt the economy which the bourgeoisie claim but never materializes. In the last fleeting cries of the Bourgeoisie they scream COMMUNISTS from the rooftops, but though their claims cause many liberals and progressives to back down from the duties of the left, the Bourgeoisie will inevitably lose.

Major times where the left was victorious over the right was during Lincoln's presidency where slavery was abolished, Teddy Roosevelt where he destroyed the trusts and ended the Gilded Era, and FDR regulated buisnesses and banks so they couldn't crash the economy again.

We have now come to the point where a major victory of the Left is way overdue. The Bourgeoisie control the media and send out propaganda to the masses. The right has managed to brainwash some the proletariat with righ aing principles which has become the Tea Party. This combined with a Bourgeoisie control over elections because they can donate billions to elect politicians has weakened the Left to the point where there are only a handful of actual leftists in congress and those who are are defeated in elections by Conservatives who use scare words.

This has brought tensions to boil with the Right rather choosing to discriminate against everyone but non-white straight Christian males and complaining on 2 year old issues rather than fixing the country they complain about the Democrats supposedly destroying. Something has to break and when it does i am gonna be hiding in my basement.

[Slavoj Zizek's Balls]

So in other words there is an imaginary Punch and Judy show between a puppet called "The Left" and a puppet called "The Right" which is playing out live in the United States.

How much are the tickets and where do I buy them?

[RedWorker]

there are only a handful of actual leftists in congress

Who? Virtually every single person in the US parliament for the last 100 (or 150? 200?) years or so was a member of either the Democratic or the Republican party.

It is ridiculous, but what can I expect from the state which is the headquarters of reaction?

[exeexe]

Who? Virtually every single person in the US parliament for the last 100 (or 150? 200?) years or so was a member of either the Democratic or the Republican party.

I think the republican party started out as a socialist party. Could be wrong. What do you think?

[Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages]

No they didn't start as a socialist party, they had a semi-radical forerunner party at one point that was opposed to slavery. No socialism though

There isn't a battle coming between conservatives and liberals, they'll be on the same side when a real civil war breaks out. This song and dance is just part of the election cycle, the fact that it involves bloodshed really isn't that new.

[exeexe]

This made me think. Is it possible that we could use the model of the American civil war to project what needs to be done about capitalism? First we split the nation into two. Then some no-brainer-goon (Lincoln) steps into the scene with the ambition to reunite the nation. Then the working class (bourgeoisie) say they will help but in return demand abolition of capitalism (slavery)?

[Brutus]

FDR regulated the banks to stop his precious capitalism from collapsing in on itself- it was hardly a victory for the working class.

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

So in other words there is an imaginary Punch and Judy show between a puppet called "The Left" and a puppet called "The Right" which is playing out live in the United States.

How much are the tickets and where do I buy them?

actually I believe ballot papers are still free

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

Major times where the left was victorious over the right was during Lincoln's presidency where slavery was abolished, Teddy Roosevelt where he destroyed the trusts and ended the Gilded Era, and FDR regulated buisnesses and banks so they couldn't crash the economy again.

Right, a jingoist warmonger who fought for small business and someone desperately trying to save capitalism from itself with the full support of Dixiecrat racists are shining beacons of the left.


We have now come to the point where a major victory of the Left is way overdue. The Bourgeoisie control the media and send out propaganda to the masses. The right has managed to brainwash some the proletariat with righ aing principles which has become the Tea Party. This combined with a Bourgeoisie control over elections because they can donate billions to elect politicians has weakened the Left to the point where there are only a handful of actual leftists in congress and those who are are defeated in elections by Conservatives who use scare words.

There are no leftists in the socialist sense in Congress. If you think you have something in common with Congressional "leftists", you should think hard about what you're doing with your life.

[Slavoj Zizek's Balls]

actually I believe ballot papers are still free

I think we've uncovered a conspiracy! They're working to get us to use ballots as currency for the cyclical combat between the "Left" and the "Right", all the while creating a new spectacle for us to get immersed in!

[ChuTeh]

FDR regulated the banks to stop his precious capitalism from collapsing in on itself- it was hardly a victory for the working class.
It was a period, now long past, when a still-rising U.S. capitalist system and class was prepared for a class compromise with the working class, a compromise which came only because of a semi-collapsed economy, the threat of working class revolution, and the struggles of the U.S. working class such as the great flint sitdown strike in the auto industry. This ear is over, and the U.S. state and capitalist class have launched a social counter revolution to remove all of the financial controls, workers state pensions, and workers rights which apppeared in the New Deal and to some extent were added to during the Johnson years.

[StreetsRunRed]

We need to separate from those who don't believe as us. I hope this can be a peaceful process but I have my doubts.

[Zoroaster]

Throughout history, there has been a battle between the Left and the Right in the USA in which the Lefts' victory involves instilling regulations such as abolishing slavery, establishing and improving work environments, improving wages etc.

This holds true for example with rich plantation owners in the South complaining that abolishing slavery will hurt the economy which the bourgeoisie claim but never materializes. In the last fleeting cries of the Bourgeoisie they scream COMMUNISTS from the rooftops, but though their claims cause many liberals and progressives to back down from the duties of the left, the Bourgeoisie will inevitably lose.

Major times where the left was victorious over the right was during Lincoln's presidency where slavery was abolished, Teddy Roosevelt where he destroyed the trusts and ended the Gilded Era, and FDR regulated buisnesses and banks so they couldn't crash the economy again.

We have now come to the point where a major victory of the Left is way overdue. The Bourgeoisie control the media and send out propaganda to the masses. The right has managed to brainwash some the proletariat with righ aing principles which has become the Tea Party. This combined with a Bourgeoisie control over elections because they can donate billions to elect politicians has weakened the Left to the point where there are only a handful of actual leftists in congress and those who are are defeated in elections by Conservatives who use scare words.

This has brought tensions to boil with the Right rather choosing to discriminate against everyone but non-white straight Christian males and complaining on 2 year old issues rather than fixing the country they complain about the Democrats supposedly destroying. Something has to break and when it does i am gonna be hiding in my basement.

Oh great, communists defending reformists and liberals. Exactly what this movement needs. Fuck.

[The Red Star Rising]

In America your choices are "garden variety right, probably farther right than most in Europe" in the Democrats and "holy shit these guys are actually crazy" in the Republicans (more specifically the teabaggers, dominionists, and randroids) finding anyone who's much farther than centre-left in the American political sphere is an epic challenge. For all the United States likes to talk up about being the first liberal democracy (because Iceland and non-European derived cultures don't exist apparently), it's always had the political class most resistant to change.

It's telling that whereas most countries more or less peacefully abolished Slavery after a long legal struggle, the United States had to fight a war with itself that killed 600,000 people because Johnny Reb can't stand the thought of having to talk to a black person as an actual human being.

I mean, this is a nation where anti-science (both new age woo espoused by garden variety liberals allowed to think they matter and fundamentalist madness espoused by the bible-belt), selfishness, blind worship of the rich, government small enough to fit in your bedroom, and "swarthy perilism" are all things still spoken aloud without immediately drawing ridicule and political suicide.

[Orange Juche]

No they didn't start as a socialist party, they had a semi-radical forerunner party at one point that was opposed to slavery. No socialism though

Well they talked about wage slavery... and Karl Marx exchanged letters with President Lincoln (a Republican) leading up to, and during, the Civil War - and penned a letter written to Lincoln to congratulate him on his 1864 Presidential Election victory (the Address of the International Working Men's Association to Abraham Lincoln). Though, Lincoln was definitely no Marxist.

And, they definitely weren't socialists. But they were certainly different.

[Red Economist]

For the record there is a 'self-proclaimed' socialist (as in european social democracy) in the US Congress standing as an Independent that is counted as Democrat in the results, but I'm not sure how serious he is or anything about him besides that. just that he 'exists'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders

The polarisation in the US is largely a fictious (but potentially very dangerous) product of media hype (or as Rocinante put it a 'punch and judy show'). According to opinion polls (I don't have them handy) most americans are left of congress but the label 'socialism' carries such bad connotations that depending how policies are dressed up that a policy they would normally support, they will run away from if they think it's "socialist".

[hatzel]

For all the United States likes to talk up about being the first liberal democracy (because Iceland and non-European derived cultures don't exist apparently)

I'm not sure you quite understand what liberalism is...

[Psycho P and the Freight Train]

Oh, no no no no no.

So much is wrong with this. But let me just at least point out that Teddy Roosevelt was the living spirit of imperialism. The Philipines and Cuba were not too happy with him.

[Hrafn]

This thread makes my head hurt.