Just for Fun, Let's Nationalize

[TheMaroon]

With a temporary solution finally found for the Federal Shutdown, we are back to business, for now. Unfortunately though many expect another shut down in January or at least early next year. Between that and the fact that our debt is at an all time high, not to mention people are saying they want to raise the debt ceiling another trillion dollars. Our federal government is headed ass first into disaster, but what if we were to Nationalize the remaining industry, and some how managed to bring our nation out of despair, and of the path of destruction. Would we then return to private control of industry, or would the people and the government demand that the industry remain in control of the feds? And if we did return back to private industry, would you advocate that states who do not rely entirely on the fed, secede from the union? If a state did secede, would you help fight for it's independence if it also meant that it would be ruled by a leftist party (which ever you rep.)

[Q]

Lots of stuff happening here:


With a temporary solution finally found for the Federal Shutdown, we are back to business, for now. Unfortunately though many expect another shut down in January or at least early next year. Between that and the fact that our debt is at an all time high, not to mention people are saying they want to raise the debt ceiling another trillion dollars. Our federal government is headed ass first into disaster...
This, understandably, seems to stay in tune with the myth that the state needs a "balanced checkbook". This is however a nonsense. The state (or, in the case of the US, a semi-private institution closely linked to the state) creates money at will.

But what about inflation? Well, this isn't necessarily a given and depends on more factors than just money creation. At the moment we see quite a few deflationary factors in the economy, despite the amount of money pumped into it over the last few years.

What is primarily important is the position of the state economy in the hierarchy of states. The US is currently the top dog state. This is why we see investment of capital in the US; not because it is so profitable, but because it is safe, protected by a huge Pentagon budget, a nuclear aresenal, aircraft carriers, etc.


... but what if we were to Nationalize the remaining industry, and some how managed to bring our nation out of despair, and of the path of destruction.
Nationalisation is not by definition a socialist measure. This is important to mark as many nationalisations over the last period have been done in the interest of capital. Furthermore, a socialist form of nationalisation (or simply against the interests of capital) would mean that you cut firms, that often work globally, along national borders, which would render then crippled if not completely useless.


Would we then return to private control of industry, or would the people and the government demand that the industry remain in control of the feds?
Communists would demand to manage the economy (and society at large) on a democratic basis, internationally and in the interests of our class.


And if we did return back to private industry, would you advocate that states who do not rely entirely on the fed, secede from the union? If a state did secede, would you help fight for it's independence if it also meant that it would be ruled by a leftist party (which ever you rep.)
Some people here would support an independence movement, but in my opinion this would be utterly stupid: A divided working class is a weakened class against globally operating capital. So, we need greater unification, not less.

[TheMaroon]

Lots of stuff happening here:


This, understandably, seems to stay in tune with the myth that the state needs a "balanced checkbook". This is however a nonsense. The state (or, in the case of the US, a semi-private institution closely linked to the state) creates money at will.

But what about inflation? Well, this isn't necessarily a given and depends on more factors than just money creation. At the moment we see quite a few deflationary factors in the economy, despite the amount of money pumped into it over the last few years.

What is primarily important is the position of the state economy in the hierarchy of states. The US is currently the top dog state. This is why we see investment of capital in the US; not because it is so profitable, but because it is safe, protected by a huge Pentagon budget, a nuclear aresenal, aircraft carriers, etc.


Nationalisation is not by definition a socialist measure. This is important to mark as many nationalisations over the last period have been done in the interest of capital. Furthermore, a socialist form of nationalisation (or simply against the interests of capital) would mean that you cut firms, that often work globally, along national borders, which would render then crippled if not completely useless.


Communists would demand to manage the economy (and society at large) on a democratic basis, internationally and in the interests of our class.


Some people here would support an independence movement, but in my opinion this would be utterly stupid: A divided working class is a weakened class against globally operating capital. So, we need greater unification, not less.
Sir, u are awsome, you are like a geyser of infinite knowledge if I may say so

[Brotto Rühle]

Nationalisation does not protect from crises of capitalism.