Obama DOJ Asks Court to Grant Immunity to George W. Bush For Iraq War

[Krano]

http://www.globalresearch.ca/obama-doj-asks-court-to-grant-immunity-to-george-w-bush-for-iraq-war/5346637

[jookyle]

Man, if we stuck together as well as these fucks do we'd have a bloody revolution already.

[Le Socialiste]

I'm so tired of people willing to defend this man (Obama, that is - though the same applies to supporters of Bush as well). At the end of the day, nothing about this is surprising. Birds of a feather...

[RebelDog]

“The DOJ claims that in planning and waging the Iraq War, ex-President Bush and key members of his Administration were acting within the legitimate scope of their employment and are thus immune from suit,” chief counsel Inder Comar of Comar Law said.

They are basically admitting that murder and destruction are part of their job description.

[The Intransigent Faction]

I can already hear liberals saying "At least Obama ended the war in Iraq"...Yeah, I'm starting to feel that anyone who pays any attention and yet hasn't come to the conclusion that Obama isn't some savior of the American left is hopeless.

What's it going to take? Obama phoning up Boehner or whoever and formally asking him to join the newly convened "Republicrat Party"?

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

LOL.
When all other defenses fail, paraphrase fucking Eichmann's? That shit's rich.

[Bardo]

I can already hear liberals saying "At least Obama ended the war in Iraq"...

That's when you tell them that it was ending anyway. The timeline was already set, Obama just let it happen. An empty desk chair could have done the same thing.

[Le Socialiste]

I can already hear liberals saying "At least Obama ended the war in Iraq"...

He didn't even do that! The majority of American personnel may have left, but the general conflicts sparked by the war linger on (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/01/iraq-deadliest-month-five-years). And let us not forget the fact that there are presently 15,000 troops stationed in neighboring Kuwait (http://www.presstv.com/detail/2012/06/20/247085/us-has-15000-troops-in-kuwait-senate/).


Yeah, I'm starting to feel that anyone who pays any attention and yet hasn't come to the conclusion that Obama isn't some savior of the American left is hopeless.

I wouldn't say hopeless, as there is a reason for why so many people continue to put their faith in political leaders and the system built around them. One of the issues confronting us is the predominance of ruling-class ideology in all public and private institutions, those which uphold a certain narrative or explanation of events. The question is how do we put forward an alternative that wins people over to our established perspective? How do we make the argument that capitalism is innately contradictory, a system in direct opposition to our overall wellbeing?

Of course, many people acknowledge that - but they have yet to make the necessary connections that many on the revolutionary left have been doing for decades. As the destructive nature of the system becomes self-evident via crises of its own making, people will naturally question the contours and framework of such a thing that thrusts the weight of its contradictions on the shoulders of those who had no hand in causing it. I know I come from a similar political background. I was raised a Democrat, I voted for Democrats. I voted for Obama. When it quickly became evident that he wasn't who I thought I'd voted for, I began questioning things. Now I'm here.

Will everyone arrive at the same conclusions I did? No, and that's why I see my role as a revolutionary socialist as one wherein I attempt to offer up not merely a critique of the system, but an alternative that people can naturally relate to and understand. There's little use in posing abstract generalizations to someone who is relatively unacquainted with the subject matter of my political leanings; what's useful is to link up the everyday bullshit people have to go through as a consequence of living under capitalism with ways in which we can fight back on a collective and united level as a class.

Some people get it (even liberals), others will need a little more convincing. History has shown us the potential of the working-class in periods of intense struggle, however, and I look to these examples as evidence that even the so-called apolitical individual can be motivated and pushed to fight for what they see as their interests when it comes down to it. It's not simply the revolutionaries that enter on the scene, but the workers, the people, as a class. Egypt, Greece, even Occupy, are prime contemporary examples of this.

Edit - I just realized that I'd gone way off-topic with this post. I guess my point is that even those we regard as the most politically insular or backward segments of the population can be pushed into direct action or conflict with the seemingly invincible politicians and the interests that back them. Millions of people support Obama. As obvious as this is, what's equally obvious is that thousands of people like me - who projected all their hopes and aspirations on people like Obama - have been radicalized as a result of the latter's actions. People voted for the next "New Deal," and got a lousy series of austerity, pro-war, anti-working-class, anti-union, pro-imperialism policies instead. And that won't be easily forgotten, no matter how much of a 'humanitarian' spin the Democrats or others try to put on it.

[Goblin]

Republicrats and Democans. Obama and Bush are the same, both war criminals. Of course they´ll stick together.

[Brutus]

I thought Obama wouldn't go this low (after calling whistleblowers heroes, then traitors and saying that whenever bombs are used against civilians it's terrorism, then droning Yemeni kids).

[adipocere]

I read about this lawsuit the other day. One of the angles the plaintiff and her lawyer are using is that there is clear evidence that the planning of the invasion took place before they would have been working in the capacity that immunity could be legally applied.

It may only ultimately be symbolic - but pretty awesome.

Here is the article on the subject (that I read) with a bit more information and background:

Why an Iraqi Single Mom Is Suing George W. Bush for War Crimes (http://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/08/17-7)

If you missed it awhile back;
War Tribunal Finds Bush, Cheney Guilty of War Crimes (https://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/05/13)

[KurtFF8]

Hmm I can't find any other sources for this. Not that I'm calling Globalresearch's credibility into question but it would be good to have some other sources. Can anyone else find anything?

[adipocere]

Hmm I can't find any other sources for this. Not that I'm calling Globalresearch's credibility into question but it would be good to have some other sources. Can anyone else find anything?
See the first link I posted above.

[KurtFF8]

See the first link I posted above.

The first link is what I was asking for alternatives to.

[Ocean Seal]

Such a clever scheme. Pretend to hate each other, and then excuse each others war crimes, and it's as if they objectively never happened.

[adipocere]

The first link is what I was asking for alternatives to.

Ok...you said GlobalResearch, so I thought you meant the OP.

I can't find a whole lot about it either, however - variations of the original Yes Magazine article, and the one that seems to be making more headway, the GlobalResearch/RT article. It is being picked up by a few smaller sites, focus/interest sites and blogs.

Common Dreams is a solid source, but it doesn't appear to have been picked up by many mainstream news agencies. Here is the article on RT (http://rt.com/usa/bush-amnesty-iraq-war-847/).

Searching google with different combinations of key words pulls up some stuff on it. Personally I would be surprised if this story were being shouted form the rooftops.

[The Intransigent Faction]

He didn't even do that! The majority of American personnel may have left, but the general conflicts sparked by the war linger on (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/01/iraq-deadliest-month-five-years). And let us not forget the fact that there are presently 15,000 troops stationed in neighboring Kuwait (http://www.presstv.com/detail/2012/06/20/247085/us-has-15000-troops-in-kuwait-senate/).



I wouldn't say hopeless, as there is a reason for why so many people continue to put their faith in political leaders and the system built around them. One of the issues confronting us is the predominance of ruling-class ideology in all public and private institutions, those which uphold a certain narrative or explanation of events. The question is how do we put forward an alternative that wins people over to our established perspective? How do we make the argument that capitalism is innately contradictory, a system in direct opposition to our overall wellbeing?

Of course, many people acknowledge that - but they have yet to make the necessary connections that many on the revolutionary left have been doing for decades. As the destructive nature of the system becomes self-evident via crises of its own making, people will naturally question the contours and framework of such a thing that thrusts the weight of its contradictions on the shoulders of those who had no hand in causing it. I know I come from a similar political background. I was raised a Democrat, I voted for Democrats. I voted for Obama. When it quickly became evident that he wasn't who I thought I'd voted for, I began questioning things. Now I'm here.

Will everyone arrive at the same conclusions I did? No, and that's why I see my role as a revolutionary socialist as one wherein I attempt to offer up not merely a critique of the system, but an alternative that people can naturally relate to and understand. There's little use in posing abstract generalizations to someone who is relatively unacquainted with the subject matter of my political leanings; what's useful is to link up the everyday bullshit people have to go through as a consequence of living under capitalism with ways in which we can fight back on a collective and united level as a class.

Some people get it (even liberals), others will need a little more convincing. History has shown us the potential of the working-class in periods of intense struggle, however, and I look to these examples as evidence that even the so-called apolitical individual can be motivated and pushed to fight for what they see as their interests when it comes down to it. It's not simply the revolutionaries that enter on the scene, but the workers, the people, as a class. Egypt, Greece, even Occupy, are prime contemporary examples of this.

Edit - I just realized that I'd gone way off-topic with this post. I guess my point is that even those we regard as the most politically insular or backward segments of the population can be pushed into direct action or conflict with the seemingly invincible politicians and the interests that back them. Millions of people support Obama. As obvious as this is, what's equally obvious is that thousands of people like me - who projected all their hopes and aspirations on people like Obama - have been radicalized as a result of the latter's actions. People voted for the next "New Deal," and got a lousy series of austerity, pro-war, anti-working-class, anti-union, pro-imperialism policies instead. And that won't be easily forgotten, no matter how much of a 'humanitarian' spin the Democrats or others try to put on it.

Well said. I apologize if I came across in that post as "prolier-than-thou". I was raised as a Liberal (Canadian), so I was using hyperbole and never meant to say I expect people to just instantly shrug off hegemonic ideology.

I do hope that the mismatch between actual conditions and capitalist ideology will turn more people gradually towards socialism/communism, but what worries me is how many crises it could take, and how many lives destroyed by these wars.

[Orange Juche]

What's it going to take? Obama phoning up Boehner or whoever and formally asking him to join the newly convened "Republicrat Party"?

"Well, he had no other option, the opposition forced him to convene the Republicrat Party".

[Hexen]

http://www.globalresearch.ca/obama-doj-asks-court-to-grant-immunity-to-george-w-bush-for-iraq-war/5346637

"Global Research" is a conspiracy site and it's not a reliable source.

[Sasha]

I can already hear liberals saying "At least Obama ended the war in Iraq"...Yeah, I'm starting to feel that anyone who pays any attention and yet hasn't come to the conclusion that Obama isn't some savior of the American left is hopeless.

What's it going to take? Obama phoning up Boehner or whoever and formally asking him to join the newly convened "Republicrat Party"?

Its the problem of parliamentary democratic options, either you have a 2 maybe 3 party system like the UK or US where the terrible is the slightly better option than the disastrous or you get a totally fractured a dozen parties coalition like here or Israel where almost acceptable parties are guaranteed taken hostage by no fucking way ones..
In the end it can't remain to keep the people in check, if you have the right to vote for shit, people will start to demand better stuff soner or later and they can't deliver..