SPGB Banner

[The Idler]

The SPGB has a new banner
http://xa.yimg.com/kq/groups/2708368/sn/3729903/name/Banner3.jpg

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

V. pretty.

*Sigh*
I feel in this funny position where I am sympathetic to Impossibilism esp. given it's peculiar role the history of the Canadian left. I really want the Socialist Party of Canada to be a present, active group. On the other hand, my politics aren't quite close enough to take it on as a personal project in good faith.

[ed miliband]

V. pretty.

*Sigh*
I feel in this funny position where I am sympathetic to Impossibilism esp. given it's peculiar role the history of the Canadian left. I really want the Socialist Party of Canada to be a present, active group. On the other hand, my politics aren't quite close enough to take it on as a personal project in good faith.

i getcha, i think the spgb are quite sweet, i just don't understand how they can be so right on some things and so wrong on others.

e: lololol just clocked the ballot box. omg.

[The Idler]

Just remember its the ballot not a picture of the Houses of Parliament.

[The Idler]

A close up of the top left corner illustrates the SPGB history of outdoor speaking and publishing our journal
http://xa.yimg.com/kq/groups/2708368/sn/1313588812/name/Banner4.jpg

[TheIrrationalist]

That looks like something straight out of the 19th century. Seriously, I cracked up when I saw that. Couldn't they make it something... well.. little bit more modern, if they really have to have those silly banners?

[whichfinder]

i just don't understand how they can be so right on some things and so wrong on others.

e: lololol just clocked the ballot box. omg.


What's particularly remarkable about the SPGB is that it probably hasn't been wrong about anything......yet

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

I dunno, I like it. I guess it does look dated to some, but it's colourful and attractively made (although the bloke looks like he's wearing a rather bad hairpiece.)

Then again, I'd wager I'm more sympathetic to the SPGB than most of revleft so perhaps I'm biased. In any case, I think it's a perfectly waveable banner.

idk why you'd criticise the ballot box - even if you disagree/are dubious about the SPGB's ideas about using parliament, democracy is nontheless central to socialism, no?

[Fourth Internationalist]

I like it, now just to change the party it represents! :D

[BIXX]

democracy is nontheless central to socialism, no?

Yes, but not bourgeoisie "democracy".

I admit I know not much about the SPGB, but I still am pretty anti-election as I don't think it will lead to a correction of the problems we are facing as working class members.

[Sasha]

pretty, but more solemn museum/graveyard pretty than "this a meaningful revolutionary voice today " pretty....

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

I suppose it's worth clarifying that I doubt very much that anyone in the SPGB is a big fan of what passes for democracy under bourgeois rule either. Their reasoning is that, well, for now we have to play by the rules that have been set out by the ruling class.

Yes, that reasoning is not immune to criticism - but bear in mind this - has violent action been any more successful - and no, I don't mean successful in merely taking the reins from the old regime, I mean successful in terms of fostering socialism. I am aware, by the way, that many of these revolutions have bumped nations along the route to the real deal by stamping out an industrialised nation-state from an economic backwater, but I'd personally halt at calling that a success.

In any case, even if you disagree with the SPGB on fairly big issues I'd say it was worth reading some of their articles and so on, there's over a century's worth of well-written stuff, usually in refreshingly plain language compared to some other organisations I've read stuff from.

[whichfinder]

Yes, but not bourgeoisie "democracy".

I admit I know not much about the SPGB, but I still am pretty anti-election as I don't think it will lead to a correction of the problems we are facing as working class members.

Of course voting per se won't lead to a correction of the problems faced by members of the working class. What is needed is a corresponding rise in class consciousness so that workers understand why they face these problems and why socialism is the only alternative.

For those who want to know more about the SPGB and why it advocates the use of the ballot box as a means of achieving power see here:

http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/how-spgb-different

http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/pamphlets/whats-wrong-using-parliament

[Anglo-Saxon Philistine]

"Pray devotedly, hammer stoutly" - that is the impression one gets from the banner. It's unnecessarily complicated, and the ballot box is just... well, it does represent the SPGB correctly.

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

Believe it or not, it turns out that the SPGB have a regularly updated facebook page

[Brutus]

Believe it or not, it turns out that the SPGB have a regularly updated facebook page

Isn't the average age of the SPGB member 60?

[Sam_b]

To be fair to the SPGB, their banner is the same style as those of the trade union tradition.

[whichfinder]

Believe it or not, it turns out that the SPGB have a regularly updated facebook page

And a regularly updated website with extensive archives and active forum:-

http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/

Also a Meetup group:-

http://www.meetup.com/The-Socialist-Party-of-Great-Britain/

:D

[whichfinder]

Isn't the average age of the SPGB member 60?

Actually no, but even if that was the case, so what?

[The Idler]

What's particularly remarkable about the SPGB is that it probably hasn't been wrong about anything......yet
Sorry but I don't agree with this at all. For a number of years, the party argued an overproduction explanation for economic crises before changing this to an explanation of disequilibrium. There were arguments over the nature of the Spanish Civil War where certain members were wrong. There are still misconceptions about no compromise. To err is human and party members are no different. Any parties claiming infallibility are merely concealing real ideas and history. Trotsky once said none can be correct against the party, if this is what you're looking for, a secular religion, please stay away from the SPGB. The strength of the SPGB is putting socialism and rejecting reforms, and this it does better than any other organisation.

[whichfinder]

Sorry but I don't agree with this at all. For a number of years, the party argued an overproduction explanation for economic crises before changing this to an explanation of disequilibrium. There were arguments over the nature of the Spanish Civil War where certain members were wrong. There are still misconceptions about no compromise. To err is human and party members are no different. Any parties claiming infallibility are merely concealing real ideas and history. Trotsky once said none can be correct against the party, if this is what you're looking for, a secular religion, please stay away from the SPGB. The strength of the SPGB is putting socialism and rejecting reforms, and this it does better than any other organisation.


That remark about the SPGB's 'infallibility' was intended as a light-hearted remark; otherwise known as a joke. It clearly went over your head. :laugh:

[Sam_b]

How would it? It didn't appear to be a joke at all.

[whichfinder]

How would it? It didn't appear to be a joke at all.

Appearances can be so deceptive, don't you think? ;)1

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

I am actually considering joining, if only so I can ruin people's perceptions when they say spgbers are pensionable

[Sam_b]

Appearances can be so deceptive, don't you think?

They can be when you make a rash one-liner and then get called out on it.