Socialist Parties

[Remus Bleys]

How exactly should an active Socialist Party act?
What does it do exactly?
How is it organized?

[BIXX]

Well, this is based on the assumption that you accept the party as a revolutionary tool.

Other than that, you should just answer these questions for yourself. There is no "one size fits all". I'm not saying you should ask for help clarifying your ideals, but as long as the party is trying to achieve socialism, and they fit your ideals, I'd say the party is for you.

[Remus Bleys]

I guess my question then is how is a party a revolutionary tool?
What does it do?

[Remus Bleys]

I live in the States. All the parties here suck.

[d3crypt]

I'm wondering this myself. It seems they don't do anything at all.

[BIXX]

To be honest, I don't believe there are any parties in our times that are revolutionary. A bunch of reformist ones, but not revolutionary.

Even though I don't agree with parties, I do believe there can be revolutionary ones. But I don't believe there are any revolutionary ones currently.

[d3crypt]

To be honest, I don't believe there are any parties in our times that are revolutionary. A bunch of reformist ones, but not revolutionary.

Even though I don't agree with parties, I do believe there can be revolutionary ones. But I don't believe there are any revolutionary ones currently.

I think maybe question is whether or not they are needed for a revolution.

[BIXX]

Well, as far as I understand them, the people who believe they are needed believe they are simply the voice of the working class. They basically are meant to carry out actions the working class wants them to carry out.

I believe they are not necessary cause I think they make it harder to organize along working class lines rather than "party lines", which is to say I believe they would just separate themselves from the working class.

[d3crypt]

Well, as far as I understand them, the people who believe they are needed believe they are simply the voice of the working class. They basically are meant to carry out actions the working class wants them to carry out.

I believe they are not necessary cause I think they make it harder to organize along working class lines rather than "party lines", which is to say I believe they would just separate themselves from the working class.

Some sort of an organization would be needed. It would still act like a political party.

[BIXX]

Some sort of an organization would be needed. It would still act like a political party.

That depends on what definition of party you are using. Would you mind telling me how you are defining a party?

[Brutus]

A party is required to push for concessions in parliament, therefore strengthening the political power of the proletariat and weakening the bourgeoisie. The abolition of the standing army and it's replacement with workers militias will probably mean that victory is all but assured.

But what is required first is unification into one proletarian party, and then for that party to begin building itself into a mass party and building an alternative culture.

A good article (with helpful pictures and diagrams) on how to build a revolutionary party. (http://struggle.net/ben/2008/HowTo.htm)

By DNZ on an alternative culture and how to build a mass party. (http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=1217)

[BIXX]

A party is required to push for concessions in parliament, therefore strengthening the political power of the proletariat and weakening the bourgeoisie. The abolition of the standing army and it's replacement with workers militias will probably mean that victory is all but assured.

But what is required first is unification into one proletarian party, and then for that party to begin building itself into a mass party and building an alternative culture.

A good article (with helpful pictures and diagrams) on how to build a revolutionary party. (http://struggle.net/ben/2008/HowTo.htm)

By DNZ on an alternative culture and how to build a mass party. (http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=1217)

While I disagree that the party is necessary to gain concessions (as these reforms only serve to de-revolutionize people in my opinion, despite their ability to do good things), thank you for posting that.

I'll reply more thoroughly when I have time.

[d3crypt]

A party is required to push for concessions in parliament, therefore strengthening the political power of the proletariat and weakening the bourgeoisie. The abolition of the standing army and it's replacement with workers militias will probably mean that victory is all but assured.

But what is required first is unification into one proletarian party, and then for that party to begin building itself into a mass party and building an alternative culture.

A good article (with helpful pictures and diagrams) on how to build a revolutionary party. (http://struggle.net/ben/2008/HowTo.htm)

By DNZ on an alternative culture and how to build a mass party. (http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=1217)
Thanks for the link but i'd rather just have workers councils instead.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Thanks for the link but i'd rather just have workers councils instead.

Minutes ago, I read an interesting take from the International Communist Current arguing, rather interestingly I thought, for a role for the party within workers' councils - for the party, but against the "vanguard party" as conceptualized by Lenin or Social Democracy. Like a lot of writings from the "Communist Left" it's a little long-winded, but managed without stimulant drugs, so . . .
On the Party and its relationship to the class (http://en.internationalism.org/node/3131)

[d3crypt]

A party is required to push for concessions in parliament, therefore strengthening the political power of the proletariat and weakening the bourgeoisie. The abolition of the standing army and it's replacement with workers militias will probably mean that victory is all but assured.

But what is required first is unification into one proletarian party, and then for that party to begin building itself into a mass party and building an alternative culture.

A good article (with helpful pictures and diagrams) on how to build a revolutionary party. (http://struggle.net/ben/2008/HowTo.htm)

By DNZ on an alternative culture and how to build a mass party. (http://www.revleft.com/vb/blog.php?b=1217)
The charts are pretty awesome though.

[d3crypt]

Minutes ago, I read an interesting take from the International Communist Current arguing, rather interestingly I thought, for a role for the party within workers' councils - for the party, but against the "vanguard party" as conceptualized by Lenin or Social Democracy. Like a lot of writings from the "Communist Left" it's a little long-winded, but managed without stimulant drugs, so . . .
On the Party and its relationship to the class (http://en.internationalism.org/node/3131)

This is basically what i believe. The party has no power at all and only serves to educate people. Whats the link to the article?

[Brotto Rühle]

It's fairly pointless for socialist parties to exist outside of revolutionary situations and times. They achieve nothing, they bicker incessently, and just make for a bunch of party patriot dickwads around. The only reason I'm a member of the ICC, not a party, is strictly because it isn't a party, and it's taught me quite a bit.

[Brutus]

Thanks for the link but i'd rather just have workers councils instead.

They're not mutually exclusive.

[The Jay]

How exactly should an active Socialist Party act?
What does it do exactly?
How is it organized?

The party should be controlled by the workers and subservient to the larger workers' movement. Proletarian organization should be focused on replacing the tasks associated with the welfare state via mutual aid organizations and financial assistance via that mutual aid. What comes after that mobilization would have to be concocted after the reaction of the ruling class.

[d3crypt]

They're not mutually exclusive.

True, but the party should take a back seat to workers councils.