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blake 3:17
20th July 2013, 04:03
Yowsers.

Jimmy Carter Defends Edward Snowden, Says NSA Spying Has Compromised Nation's Democracy
The Huffington Post | By Nick Wing
Posted: 07/18/2013 11:00 am EDT | Updated: 07/19/2013 12:31 pm EDT

Former President Jimmy Carter announced support for NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden this week, saying that his uncovering of the agency's massive surveillance programs had proven "beneficial."

Speaking at a closed-door event in Atlanta covered by German newspaper Der Spiegel, Carter also criticized the NSA's domestic spying as damaging to the core of the nation's principles.

"America does not have a functioning democracy at this point in time," Carter said, according to a translation by Inquisitr.

No American outlets covered Carter's speech, given at an Atlantic Bridge meeting, which has reportedly led to some skepticism over Der Spiegel's quotes. But Carter's stance would be in line with remarks he's made on Snowden and the issue of civil liberties in the past.

In June, while Snowden was scrambling to send out asylum requests from an airport in Russia, Carter appeared to back the former NSA contractor's efforts to remain out of U.S. custody.

"He's obviously violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible, but I think the invasion of human rights and American privacy has gone too far," he told CNN, saying that nations were within their right to offer asylum to Snowden. "I think that the secrecy that has been surrounding this invasion of privacy has been excessive, so I think that the bringing of it to the public notice has probably been, in the long term, beneficial."

Snowden has been hard-pressed to find support among U.S. politicians. Lawmakers on both sides of the aisle have declared Snowden a traitor who deserves to be prosecuted for his leaks. The White House has also been persistent in its attempts to bring him into custody. Last week, the administration criticized Russia for facilitating a meeting between Snowden and human rights activists. Snowden has since applied for temporary asylum in the nation, following complications surrounding transit to the Latin American nations that he'd been considering.

Klaatu
20th July 2013, 04:13
In my humble opinion, Carter was the last American president. Every one after that was in the pocket of capitalists and big business. That is, the country started it's decline under Reagan, and that decline is now accelerating into the abyss. Good heavens. :crying:

RadioRaheem84
20th July 2013, 05:06
Actually Carter appointed Paul Volker who issues the "Volker Shock" which was the real start of the neoliberal era. That and Carter fired union public employees too just like Reagan. Under Carter is when deregulation started.

tuwix
20th July 2013, 06:04
In my humble opinion, Carter was the last American president. Every one after that was in the pocket of capitalists and big business.

Really? And who did finance his campaign?

And I can bet that Obama will be similiar. They both are best in talking but they are scared of actions. Everyone knows what has happened to JFK...

Fourth Internationalist
20th July 2013, 06:17
In my humble opinion, Carter was the last American president. Every one after that was in the pocket of capitalists and big business. That is, the country started it's decline under Reagan, and that decline is now accelerating into the abyss. Good heavens. :crying:

Why would being bought by capitalist make a president un"american", whatever that means. Also, all bourgeois states have de facto bought out presidents and leaders. That's their job, to serve capitalism.

Klaatu
21st July 2013, 03:56
Really? And who did finance his campaign?

"When I ran against incumbent President Gerald Ford, you know how much money we raised? None."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/feb/26/jimmy-carter/jimmy-carter-says-when-he-ran-against-gerald-ford-/


Why would being bought by capitalist make a president un"american", whatever that means. Also, all bourgeois states have de facto bought out presidents and leaders. That's their job, to serve capitalism.

No doubt about that.
I guess I am trying to point out how badly-corrupt the "American" system is becoming, relative to the way it was before. Not that it was "great" before Carter, but it is in fact becoming much much worse.

blake 3:17
22nd July 2013, 03:05
@Klaatu and others -- I am less interested in Carter in office, a pretty sleepy dorky Christian peanut farming capitalist, than Carter out of office.

He's been amazing the past few years! Great on the Middle East, great on domestic issues. Just calling it.

RadioRaheem84
22nd July 2013, 03:48
They're always a little better on the issues when they leave office. Clinton is more of humanitarian liberal than the staunch New Democrat middle of the road kinda of guy he was in office. I'm sure when Obama gets out he will talk a little more liberal too.

blake 3:17
22nd July 2013, 04:29
@RR84 -- Carter's different. He's not just being charitable, he's saying that there are things seriously wrong. He has a genuinely moral vision.

There was a fascinating long article in the New Yorker 6 or 7 years ago where a reporter followed Clinton and his entourage for about a month. It's a fascinating piece, but he was all about brokering deals, and wielding power out of office.

RadioRaheem84
22nd July 2013, 05:06
I don't doubt Carter's moral beliefs and I am sure they're genuine. It's just why didn't he enact this kind of leadership in office? Why support the Shaw? Why start the de-regulation campaign that was then taken up by Reagan full force?

It reminds me of Jeffery Sachs of Columbia University. He was a primary force to de-regulate Russia during the Yeltsin years and now he's a social democrat promoting humanitarian guru of the liberal-left.

blake 3:17
22nd July 2013, 05:27
You might change your mind in 30 years.

Igor
22nd July 2013, 10:13
its always easy to say shit like this when you're out of the game but its just a rich old man speaking now, what carter the potus would've done is a completely different deal altogether

Per Levy
22nd July 2013, 10:22
"When I ran against incumbent President Gerald Ford, you know how much money we raised? None."

well when he says it like that it must be true.


He's been amazing the past few years! Great on the Middle East, great on domestic issues. Just calling it.

so he is a bit like chomsky then. what makes carter so great? that he is a bit social democratic/liberal? seriously i dont get it.

Flying Purple People Eater
22nd July 2013, 10:25
The hypocrite can shove a metal pipe up his ass and turn on the pressure for all I care.

So fucking what? Obama also spoke out on Trayvon Martin. Doesn't mean he isn't a neolib fucker who's continuing the ravaging of central Asia and east Africa of his predecessors in office.

LuĂ­s Henrique
22nd July 2013, 11:49
Actually Carter appointed Paul Volker who issues the "Volker Shock" which was the real start of the neoliberal era. That and Carter fired union public employees too just like Reagan. Under Carter is when deregulation started.

And let's not forget his masterpiece, the Islamisation of Afghanistan!

But it is nevertheless good that he is critical of the persecution of Snowden, and that he realises other nations are not under the obligation to comply with American dictates in what relates to asylum.

Luís Henrique

Klaatu
23rd July 2013, 03:46
Guys. Guys. They all have their faults (as do all of us.) Perhaps Carter just looks good when we compare him to Dick Cheney :glare:

The Intransigent Faction
23rd July 2013, 07:13
IIRC, it just so happens that Snowden has a lot of support among Americans, while most Americans deem Bradley Manning a "traitor". Unless I'm mistaken, Carter hasn't made any condemnations of how Bradley Manning's been treated.

Vague statements like "America does not have a functioning democracy at this point in time," have also been said, though less eloquently, by right-wingers who are convinced that Obama is the modern incarnation of Stalin.

Also, don't forget Carter was a Cold War President. It'd be naďve to think there was no domestic spying going on during his presidency. So not only is this vague populism, it's also hypocrisy.

There's nothing remarkable here.

Rugged Collectivist
23rd July 2013, 07:47
To hell with him! I especially like this gem.

"He's obviously violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible, but I think the invasion of human rights and American privacy has gone too far,"

Really jimmy? It's gone too far and the man who brought this to our attention needs to be punished?


IIRC, it just so happens that Snowden has a lot of support among Americans, while most Americans deem Bradley Manning a "traitor". Unless I'm mistaken, Carter hasn't made any condemnations of how Bradley Manning's been treated.

Of course not. Americans are completely fine with injustice if it's committed against foreigners.

Karlorax
23rd July 2013, 10:12
Broken clock is right twice a day.

piet11111
23rd July 2013, 14:11
Guys. Guys. They all have their faults (as do all of us.) Perhaps Carter just looks good when we compare him to Dick Cheney :glare:

It just goes to show how incredibly far to the right the political middle ground has gone.

Our most right wing politicians look like social democrats compared to your "democrats".

bcbm
24th July 2013, 09:03
I guess I am trying to point out how badly-corrupt the "American" system is becoming, relative to the way it was before.

http://www.nndb.com/people/110/000024038/richard-m-nixon-sized.jpg

Flying Purple People Eater
24th July 2013, 09:59
http://www.biography.com/imported/images/Biography/Images/Profiles/R/Ronald-Reagan-9453198-1-402.jpg

Agathor
25th July 2013, 02:56
Thanks for getting a conscience three decades after you became irrelevant Jimmy.

Os Cangaceiros
25th July 2013, 03:11
I would actually argue that the American political system of the past was a lot more corrupt than it is today (corrupt in the sense that people knowingly took illegal action in pursuit of political or financial gain, not corrupt in the sense of people doing things that, while technically legal, offend the left)

Klaatu
25th July 2013, 03:19
http://www.nndb.com/people/110/000024038/richard-m-nixon-sized.jpg

I have mixed feelings about Nixon. While he will always be remembered (badly) for Watergate and his so-called "Southern Stragety," I have a lot of praise for his (A) ending of the gold standard (B) ending of the Vietnam War (C) 'breaking the ice' with China and USSR over nukes (thus greatly lowering the threat of atomic war, and his best work, (D) the establishment of Environmental Protection Agency (anti-air pollution is my own personal crusade)

Say what you will about Nixon, he was not like the average 21st-Century Republican, not even close.

bcbm
25th July 2013, 10:20
(B) ending of the Vietnam War

he didn't end the war he pushed a program of 'vietnamization' to push the south vietnamese to fight a losing war that should not have happened instead of american troops.

Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages
25th July 2013, 11:48
I really wonder what Obama is going to look like through rose colored glasses in 30 years. Amongst all the other shit listed in this thread, Carter funded the fucking Khmer Rouge to get back at the Vietnamese for kicking the US out of their country. Who gives a fuck what he has to say, hes just after anther book deal.

piet11111
25th July 2013, 17:57
Honestly i would not be surprised if its all going to be down hill from here.

Open dictatorship in the western world within 30 years would not be a surprise if the working class fails to take over.

ckaihatsu
18th September 2016, 13:40
Pardon Snowden

Time is running out for Edward Snowden.

Tell President Obama: Pardon Edward Snowden now!

SIGN THE PETITION (https://act.demandprogress.org/sign/tell-president-obama-pardon-edward-snowden-now/?source=demandprogress&t=2&akid=4628.610737.4SBg3F)

Chris,

As the movie launching this week reminds us, Edward Snowden’s whistleblowing revealed the NSA’s massive, secret – and unconstitutional – surveillance programs.

He took a huge personal risk to bring these programs to light. And his actions launched a vital national debate on whether the NSA should be spying on innocent Americans.

But three years later, Snowden is still being forced to live in exile and threatened with likely spending the rest of his life in prison if he ever comes back to the country he loves.

We have less than 125 days to push President Obama to officially pardon this important American whistleblower.

Tell President Obama: Pardon Edward Snowden now! (https://act.demandprogress.org/sign/tell-president-obama-pardon-edward-snowden-now/?source=demandprogress&t=3&akid=4628.610737.4SBg3F)

Presidential pardons are about justice. They are for when the legal system has failed, or the laws are unjust or when our consciences demand it.

Snowden made his sacrifice not for personal gain, but because he knew it was the only real way to expose the unconstitutional spying programs he witnessed.

So when the White House tries to claim Snowden “is not a whistleblower”1 because he didn’t follow the "proper" whistleblower process, they’re just playing cynical word games.

Intelligence contractors, like Edward Snowden, are NOT protected by the Intelligence Community’s whistleblower protections. The Intelligence Community’s own lawyer, even admits it.2

Even had Edward Snowden followed the “proper” process, his whistleblowing wouldn’t have been protected.

Presidential pardons exist for exactly this kind of extraordinary situation. It’s time that President Obama uses that power to recognize Snowden’s public service.

Sign and share the petition to President Obama: Pardon Edward Snowden now and let him come home! (https://act.demandprogress.org/sign/tell-president-obama-pardon-edward-snowden-now/?source=demandprogress&t=4&akid=4628.610737.4SBg3F)

Snowden acted out of desperation and patriotism to inform Americans of the unconstitutional mass surveillance the NSA was conducting.

Even former Attorney General Eric Holder agrees: “I think that he actually performed a public service by raising the debate that we engaged in and by the changes that we made.”3

Snowden stood up for our rights. Now it’s time we stand up for his.

Stand up for Edward Snowden and tell President Obama: Three years is enough. Pardon Snowden and bring him home! (https://act.demandprogress.org/sign/tell-president-obama-pardon-edward-snowden-now/?source=demandprogress&t=5&akid=4628.610737.4SBg3F)

Thanks for standing with us,

Kate Kizer
Campaigner
Demand Progress



DONATE (https://act.demandprogress.org/go/2593?t=7&akid=4628.610737.4SBg3F)


Sources:
1. Politico, “White House: Snowden 'is not a whistleblower',” September 14, 2016.
2. The Intercept, “Giving Intelligence Contractors Whistleblower Protections Doesn’t Have to Be “Complicated”,” November 6, 2015.
3. The Guardian, “Eric Holder says Edward Snowden performed 'public service' with NSA leak,” May 30, 2016.


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ckaihatsu
3rd December 2016, 14:15
[LaborTech] ‘Fear of testimony’: Ruling parties try to block Snowden’s questioning on German soil – media


‘Fear of testimony’: Ruling parties try to block Snowden’s questioning on German soil – media

https://www.rt.com/news/369056-germany-snowden-bnd-nsa/

Published time: 2 Dec, 2016 21:03

https://cdn.rt.com/files/2016.12/original/5841d2acc46188c72c8b463c.jpg
Edward Snowden © Berit Roald
Edward Snowden © Berit Roald / AFP

50

Germany’s ruling CDU and SPD parties have filed an appeal to the Federal Supreme Court to revise its earlier decision that allowed the US whistleblower Edward Snowden to testify before the German parliament on the NSA scandal and Berlin’s ties to it.

The respective document was sent by the Christian Democratic Party (CDU) and the Social Democrats (SPD) to the Supreme Court on Thursday, Berliner Zeitung reports. Martina Renner from the opposition Left Party (Die Linke) has slammed the move, saying the government has “fear of the witness testimony,” the outlet notes.

Read more

https://cdn.rt.com/files/2016.12/thumbnail/584086b0c361887e768b45a8.jpg
© Toru Hanai
WikiLeaks releases new batch of leaked documents on US-German intel cooperation (https://www.rt.com/news/368921-us-germany-secret-intel/)

In 2013 the former US National Security Agency (NSA) contractor Snowden, revealed that the agency widely spied on own citizens as well as international leaders and officials, while getting significant help from German intelligence agency, the Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND).

In 2014 the German parliament launched a parliamentary inquiry and set up a special committee to investigate the matter. Snowden, who is currently living in exile in Moscow, is wanted by the US on espionage charges following his disclosures.

The CDU and SPD have staunchly opposed the questioning of the whistleblower in Germany, fearing that might lead to tensions with Washington. In order to avoid any “adverse” publicity for Merkel, the government simply “violated the rights of the minority,” the Green MP and parliamentary chief in the Bundestag, Konstantin von Notz reacted to Thursday’s BGH appeal, as quoted by the BZ.

In November the Supreme Court ruled that the German Parliament (the Bundestag) had to “establish the preconditions”for Snowden’s testimony before a parliamentary committee investigating NSA surveillance in Germany.

The ruling followed a request by Die Linke and the Green Party (Bundnis 90/Die Grunen), who wanted to initiate a vote in the Bundestag on whether to invite Snowden for the testimony. Among the conditions demanded by the opposition for his questioning was that he would not be extradited to the US.

Read more

https://cdn.rt.com/files/2016.11/thumbnail/58344c06c46188b7788b463e.jpg
Edward Snowden © Marcos Brindicci
Snowden can testify in Berlin, govt must provide ‘effective protection’ – court (https://www.rt.com/news/367808-snowden-testify-germany-court/)

A CDU MP and a chairman of the parliamentary NSA committee, Patrick Sensburg, is now mulling an appeal to the Germany’s Highest Constitutional Court, should his party’s appeal be rejected by the Supreme Court.

According to Berliner Zeitung, the Supreme Court is expected to rule on the CDU and SPD appeal in March next year. Yet the NSA parliamentary committee is expected to be done with the witness hearings already in February, in order to present its final report. However, a potential extension of the time frame for the witness hearings till April is also possible.

Berliner Zeitung notes that any potential decision on the constitutional appeal would be made only after the legislation period of the current government and also the end of the current NSA parliamentary committee’s inquiry in September 2017. To invite Snowden to give later testimony before the German lawmakers would require the Bundestag to set up a new committee.

On December 1, the whistleblowing website WikiLeaks released a fresh batch of secret documents regarding the work of the German NSA parliamentary committee and the ties between the BND and US intelligence. The 2,420 documents also contained information regarding other key ministries and facilities linked to the investigation.
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