Why don't we have a section on how to live in a capitalist society?

[RadioRaheem84]

I am surprised we do not have a comprehensive guide on how to survive under capitalism. A how to, faq, etc on ways to deal with bosses, and so on.These things should be listed as universal ways to deal with alienation.

And not just silly stuff like how to beat the clock or ways to sleep off some time behind the unstocked merchandise (even thought that's helpful too :lol:) but real stuff like how to effecitively deal with bosses, their needs and wants out of you. I've learned that the worse way is to act like a union organizer and start demanding stuff right away or act like "fuck you" you can't talk to me like that on the onset of your rights being violated. You need to literally learn your workplace, move up and take some punches, know when the time to take advantage of opportunities to improve your lot rather than start off thinking your Big Bill Haywood. I think a mistake a lot of workers make is thinking that the boss cannot talk to you in a certain manner and that they have rights that far exceed the reality of the rights we have left in this country as wage workers. They mouth off to the boss or conduct some sabotage and get fired or worse jailed. They don't percieve the country they're living as ruled by capitalists and corporations, and instead just see a world in which the people rule and the boss is bending the rules. Basically that the way they're being treated is the result of a few bad apples not the norm of how workers are treated under capitalism.

Has there ever been a sociological book or study done about how workers deals with alienation and wage work? Has there been a leftist book written on ways to sort of be the most "productive" worker while actively campaigining for workers rights, looking to unionize and such?

[tuwix]

I agree. But plan to survive depends on country. In each country there are different conditions. But first of all, you have to know your rights and where to put complaints.

[Os Cangaceiros]

I kind of get what you're saying. But at the same time I don't feel that it's appropriate for the left to encourage workers to be more productive or anything like that...people get enough of that in their lives to begin with.

It depends on the individuals wants and needs, really; personally if someone really needed their current employment, I'd recommend doing what they needed to do to keep the job, but not really any more than that. But that's just me. I don't like work. But at the same time I realize that I have to do it to survive, and also that work is probably going to remain necessary in order for a society with the standard of living & services that I want to exist (although obviously in not necessarily the same form that it exists today). Stuff like sabotage and theft are not necessarily appropriate actions for everybody to undertake...individuals need to make that value judgement for themselves, I don't condemn those activities but I don't necessarily endorse them either.

I'm lucky enough to have a job I find somewhat tolerable and which I feel contributes a little bit to society. I'm lucky in that regard, though, and I've experienced a bit of the soul-crushing service industry, moreso than I'd like to have...I don't blame people for feeling that sucking up to their hated boss is intolerable

[d3crypt]

I kind of get what you're saying. But at the same time I don't feel that it's appropriate for the left to encourage workers to be more productive or anything like that...people get enough of that in their lives to begin with.

It depends on the individuals wants and needs, really; personally if someone really needed their current employment, I'd recommend doing what they needed to do to keep the job, but not really any more than that. But that's just me. I don't like work. But at the same time I realize that I have to do it to survive, and also that work is probably going to remain necessary in order for a society with the standard of living & services that I want to exist (although obviously in not necessarily the same form that it exists today). Stuff like sabotage and theft are not necessarily appropriate actions for everybody to undertake...individuals need to make that value judgement for themselves, I don't condemn those activities but I don't necessarily endorse them either.

I'm lucky enough to have a job I find somewhat tolerable and which I feel contributes a little bit to society. I'm lucky in that regard, though, and I've experienced a bit of the soul-crushing service industry, moreso than I'd like to have...I don't blame people for feeling that sucking up to their hated boss is intolerable

Theft doest hurt the bourgeoisie anyway. They just increase the weight on us.

[Sentinel]

Well, we do have this forum:



Mutual Aid & DIY (http://www.revleft.com/vb/mutual-aid-diy-f55/index.html) (3 Viewing)
Forum to ask comrades for advice, instructions, and/or material aid to deal with the practical problems that arise while living under a capitalist system -- as well as to offer it to others, and to organise joint efforts such as strike funds etc. Also a practical forum for community advice, activist tips, and information on how to improve your life outside of capitalism (DIY). No explosives, weapons, or drugs.

Forum Led by: Takayuki (http://www.revleft.com/vb/member.php?u=28765)


You, or any member, is welcome to create FAQs, guides etc - and contact the local moderator, in this case Takauyki, with a request to get them stickied.

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

I'd like to see a guide like this too. I think it would be useful to know how to survive in a system that's fundamentally hostile to us, and to have pointers on spreading our "disruptive" ideas in the existing workforce without, y'know, getting reported and fired

[RadioRaheem84]

Well essentially, having several jobs in life really helped me understand how to cope and deal with all sorts of bosses and aspects of capitalist life. I've learned that taking the hostile way was dumbfounded and not in any way productive to my life. That anger came mostly out of a naive belief that I have rights, and I do per se but Americans walk around with a set of rights that far outstretch the reality of the rights they actually have. In America, the boss rules. The enterprise wins every time. The small gains we earn are more rare than the norm.
Americans especially have this David and Goliath mentality where they think that they can really tackle on any major thing with the power of positive thinking and hard grit. I think a lot of them cannot cope with the fact that as an individual they rarely have the chance to really win anything more than an extra dollar raise every year if they're lucky.

What's helped me cope with life in capitalism has been the understanding of it. Marxism and leftist class analysis social critiques have been critical in helping me understand how to deal with work. Americans especially live under the contradictions of capitalism, not understanding that there is no democracy in the workplace while there is supposed democracy in politics. This schism takes a toll on the mental health of a lot of workers and makes them feel worthless, stressed and as though they've lost all dignity. The dialectical method and the left class analysis is a powerful tool for not only helping the working class collectively struggle against capitalism but also individually struggle against the mental strain of work and their bosses. I still get stressed out at work but I cope with it better I understand the boss better and I know how to meet needs and wants better while still retaining a sense of understanding that the entire workplace is full of shit and I am getting ripped off.

[Forward Union]

Because you currently are alive. So presumably you know how to do it already.

[RadioRaheem84]

But others don't.

[Forward Union]

But others don't.

then they fall into the other category of people who are dead.

[Forward Union]

What I mean is, confronting bosses or how to unionise ought to be in practice though sadly (presumably because of the demographic of the forum) you're more likely to find a thread on "how to tell my parents I'm a communist" or some other bizarre early teen issue. Some other "tips" might fit into DIY.

Other than that, having a job and buying food and water and constantly breathing seem to do the trick for staying alive under capitalism. I do understand where you are coming from though, I just couldn't resist the opportunity to be incredibly sarcastic and witty.:blushing:

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

Overall I would agree it's a bad idea to be antagonistic and it really is most sensible to knuckle down a bit (to some extent). You are, after all, completely dispensible to your bosses. On the other hand, I'd quit a job if it really clashed with my principles - indeed, I have done this once because I disagreed with the incredibly bad way a company treated staff and customers.

Unionise if possible and prudent and go about it carefully. Be polite to others, even if they are utter goitres because people are more likely to listen to you if you calmly and clearly explain what you think. They are, after all, our fellows in oppression.

[LOLseph Stalin]

Maybe a guide on how to actually get and keep a job? I haven't worked in years and have only managed to keep jobs for a few months at a time.

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

Maybe a guide on how to actually get and keep a job? I haven't worked in years and have only managed to keep jobs for a few months at a time.

ah, unfortunately that's a bit more difficult :(

On that front, I think the only thing you can really do is keep sending out applications and try not to feel too distraught about thre rejection.

[RadioRaheem84]

Maybe a guide on how to actually get and keep a job? I haven't worked in years and have only managed to keep jobs for a few months at a time.

A few key pointers: Just know that you are judged before you even walk into the interviewer’s seat. The boss checks your shirt, your tie, and especially your shoes. If it's an office scenario it’s all about if you fit the office environment, hands down. If you can work well with the team and if you aren't a shy awkward bastard that works out more in your favor.

So many different things effect your eligibility; college degree, work experience, how far you live from the workplace, how long you've kept jobs in the past, gap between employment, can you speak well enough to hold down a conversation, are you just smart enough to hold down this job without being too smart to undermine anyone else's position. For instance we were reluctant to hire a college grad with the relevant skills because we felt she could be a bit too combatitive. We gather this because she was being too critical in her questions of the company.

I took over some of the hiring for the lower level workers when I became a lead at my job and while I try to be lenient and compassionate, the bosses compel me to be stern and choose the right fit. I can tell right off the bat if you're college educated or not, if you care about your appearance, if you're sociable, etc.

Also, and this is the biggest double standard. They want you to already have experience in the same field you're applying for. Loads of it. They do not want to train, so even if you've had experience in something close or relevant to the job, do not expect a call back if the next person has you beat in that department.

Understanding the dynamics of the professional class, how they act, behave, speak to each other, their interests, their goals for their company and their own aspirations, you see that we do live in a class hierarchy. Depending on the firm, but most of the time employers see themselves as accomplished and are very very judgmental on people who haven’t yet done anything deemed worthwhile in their lives, thus they’re picky as hell. You have everything going against you I am sorry to say. The more society sinks further into economic disarray the worse it becomes for people to find a job.

The faster I move up the more I see a change from the position I left behind. It’s still a rat race in my opinion but the more I climb the more I see that it’s not an income bracket I am moving into, it’s an entirely different class; a professional/managerial class. This class in my opinion is the most reactionary, most defensive and most susceptible to libertarian, right wing or center politics.

Above all, I am convinced that business and employers are the primary reason for the unemployment problem. Their standards, wages being offered and prejudices keep so many from acquiring work.

[Ceallach_the_Witch]

It's in their interests, of course, to have a large pool of desparate unemployed. A "buyer's market" so to speak makes it easier to keep wages low, workers dispensible and therefore, profits high.

It also makes it easier to appeal to their chums in the bourgeois government to lower wages and remove restrictions so they can "help" lower unemployment and become more competetive internationally.

From their perspective, situations like this are an absolute boon - sure, whilst the economy sucks it'll hurt, but they'll come out the other side with fewer inroads into their beloved profit margins - and we suffer for it